AnthonyDeAlba

Hi
I'm almost done with my itinerary for 3 weeks in Europe. I have booked my tickets, hotels, and passes for museums. I am in dilemma now, I have 3 days to spare from Paris to go to Bellagio, Lake Como.
* Either I can travel from Paris to Basel, to Interlaken to Grindewald, for 3 days and take a train from Inerlaken to Milan for my last leg of the journey to Bellagio.
*Or I can travel from Paris to Nice, (3days) to ventimiglia to Milan to Bellagio.
My wife prefers beaches, and hot weather, I prefer to see Swiss mountains. I know its personal, but what are the pros and cons, since we both are foodies too
I'll appreciate your advise. thanks.

StuDudley

You didn't state WHEN you will take this trip, Makes a HUGE difference.

We were in the Grindelwald area for 4 nights about 12 years ago in mid/early Sept. it was cold, foggy, and it even snowed one day. We never saw any of the Junfrau peaks.

If "foodie" is a big issue - you should already have an idea of which area has the best food.

Stu Dudley

AnthonyDeAlba

Hi
We will be traveling from June 9th-11th to either on of the destination.

Mimar

You will like Grindelwald, and your wife will like Nice. Though the beaches there are pebbly (big pebbles) rather than sandy. Maybe Google images these two locations or read about them?
.

StuDudley

We've spent 20 weeks vacationing along the Cote d'Azur. Most of those days were in & around Nice. We were there for 15 nights in early June last year.

The beach is flat/smooth rocks. But you really won't walk on the rocks if you "sun" at one of the many private concessions. You'll either walk on a wood deck or on a thick grass mat. I actually prefer rocks to sand - less dust. Quite decadent.

I would hate to travel all that distance & consume that much time, then get to Grindelwald and find out it was "socked in" with clouds or fog. When we travel in the Alps, we huddle around interesting cities and only head into the high Alps on nice/clear days.

Stu Dudley

dugi_otok

Nice is a large city which lives off a glittering reputation, its former glamour now gently faded. Far too large (5th largest city in France) to be considered simply a beach resort . Nice has all the advantages and disadvantages of a major city: superb culture, wonderful street life, eating and drinking, excellent shopping, but also a high crime rate, graffiti, and horrendous traffic. Nice has blue skies, sparkling sea, and sub-tropical greenery.

Grindelwald, the glacier village, is a small town (pop 3,700)considered to be a great mountain resort in the Bernese Oberland. It combines a foreground full of country charm - fields planted with fruit trees or maples and dotted with pretty dwellings - surrounded by the spectacular mountain trio "Eiger, Mönch & Jungfrau". Waking up in Grindelwald is a real "High". Even higher is the train up to Jungfraujoch.

My first trip to Grindelwald was in 1965. I have taken my children there. I have taken my grandchildren there. My first trip to Nice was in 1965. I pulled up to a hotel on a rainy summer night, sent my wife in to secure a room. Within 2 minutes a prostitute knocked on my car window trying to solicit some business. On my last visit 5 years ago I enjoyed the open air market and a walk on the beach. I attempted to visit the Russian church, but could not get near it due to traffic.

Grindelwald is world class. Nice is nice but not world class.

Mrs DeAlba should yield to Mr DeAlba.

AnthonyDeAlba

@ dugi_otok
Thank you very much for your valuable comments and so glad that you enjoyed your time @ both the places.
How are the food & price for sight seeing in Nice as compare to Grindewald?
I have booked 3 three nights in Hotel Gletschergarten and 3 nights in Hôtel West End in Nice.
My wife and I have decided that if weather in Grindewald is clear & sunny on our traveling day, its my way otherwise its Nice...
thanks.

dugi_otok

How are the food & price for sight seeing in Nice as compare to Grindewald?

It cost more to visit paradise!

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living...ountry2=France



http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living...=United+States

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living...=United+States

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living...=United+States

Sight seeing is difficult to compare.
You would have to look up prices for things you want to do.

StuDudley

We're major foodies.

It's been about 12 years since we dined in the Junfrau region - but as I recall, the food was very bland, ordinary, & expensive. We've dined elsewhere in the Swiss Alps within the last 5 years, and the food was again very bland, ordinary, and expensive. We dined in Nice last year about 8-9 times. All but 1 of the 5 Michelin one star restaurants was we dined were superb. They were expensive, however, because we splurged. We also dined on the Cours Saleya and had fresh fish, soupe de Poisson, Accras de Morue. And it was quite reasonably priced. There are some "rip-offs" on the Cours, so you have to be careful. We dined at Safari there.

As I recall from our trip to the Junfrau region 25 years ago, the cost of the trip to the station on the "top of the world" was outrageously expensive. We've been there twice, and both times the views were quite often hidden by fog/clouds for about 50% of the hours we were there. I don't know if it has come down in price since then, because we didn't go up 12 year ago because of the weather. On our trip 5 years ago we went to the top of about 5 other famous peaks in the Bearner Oberland, and it was outrageously expensive - but I had more money in my pockets then, than I did 25 years ago so we "went up". However - BE AWARE - you can't judge the weather "in general". When we were there 5 years ago, we always took lifts to the mountain tops in the morning. Usually by mid-day it was too cloudy to see anything at all. We were there for 5 nights and had to time our trips on the "spur of the moment" - when the weather was clear. One one trip up the Sex (really!) peak, it was beautiful when we went up, but by the time we left we could not see anything. This happened on 2 other trips to famous peak lookouts also.

On our first two trips to the Junfrau, we stayed at Interlaken and then Lauterbrunnen. On our trip 12 years ago, I considered staying in Grindelwald, Wengen, or Murren. We stayed in Murren, and then took railway trips to the other villages and I'm glad we didn't choose Wengen & really glad we didn't stay in Grindelwald. Too many huge tour buses and tacky shops in Grindelwald. We were glad we were "up" into the mountains (although we could not see much because of the fog/clouds). I love the Alps (we've spent 6 weeks in the French Alps too), but you really have to time your trips to the peaks in the Alps carefully - because of the ever changing weather.

Stu Dudley

StuDudley

>> restaurants was we dined were superb<<

Jeeze!
restaurants where we dined was superb

Stu Dudley

lynnalan

I have only spent 2 weeks in Switzerland (one week in Wengen and a week in Chateau D'Oex) and during that time I had one truly memorable meal (some good food, certainly, but not great).

I agree with Grindewald being filled with tourist shops. We loved car-free Wengen, found it charming and easy to navigate (though we were there in March to ski, not the summer). Have not been to Murren.

I have not been to Nice but to many other places in France - and it is for me the country with the most consistently excellent food. But maybe I just love French food.

So for food - I would say France. But the scenery in Switzerland is hard to beat. And the train ride from Switzerland to Lake Como is beautiful.

swandav2000

Hi AnthonyDeAlba,

If you're foodies, head to Gstaad in Switzerland, where there are more Gault Mileau restaurants than the small town warrants. There are great hikes in the mountains and the valleys (between the towns, etc), and you can make great excursions to Gruyeres for cheese & the castle, to Broc for the chocolate factory, or to Montreux to see the lake.

You haven't said when you're going, though. If you're going in July or August, you likely won't get a room since the Menuhin Music Fest is on then.

If you're going in August, I also wouldn't stay in Grindelwald -- which gets unappealingly full of tour busses then.

www.gstaad.ch

Have fun as you plan!

s

Mimar

Dugi_otok underrates the lazy, sensual charm of Nice, the curvy Belle Époque architecture, the Italian influence. Nor does the city seem faded and worn. In fact it's quite vibrant.

And there are a lot of sights to see within easy reach by public transportation from Nice: Monaco, Cannes, Antibes, Menton, the valentine-sweet villa Ephrussi-Rothschild and its beautiful garden, the view from the town of Eze, St. Paul de Vence, the hinterlands on the little Train des Pignes.

Good luck.

traveller1959

>>>Nice is nice but not world class.<<<

A harsh judgement and a narrow-minded one too. The destination is not Nice but the Côte d'Azur. Nice is just the largest city in the region. For me, the Côte d'Azur is not only world class - it is perhaps the world's most fascinating travelling region because it has a little bit of everything:

- a very pleasant climate,
- an incredibly scenic coastline - the best section is the red rock coast between St. Raphael and Cannes and the second best between Nice and Menton, with Monaco in the middle,
- beautiful beaches - the beach of Nice is pebbly and ugly, but there are many sandy beaches in the area,
- history: Roman ruins, medieval towns, 19th century charm,
- art: nowhere in the world, you find such a density of world class art museums (the reason is that many painters chose to live there),
- picturesque villages: there are at least 20 picture-postcard perched villages,
- food: a high density of restaurants of all ranks.

You can even have mountains: Nice is located in the foothills of the Sea Alps, and within an hour you are even in a skiing resort.

neckervd

Nobody knows how will be the weather along the Riviera, in the Alps and along Lake Como in early June. Heavy rainfall and rather deep temperatures cannot be excluded at all 3 places. If you are chancy, you may have nothing but sun, however. Nobody knows.
Seawater temperature at Nice will be around 65 degrees Fahrenheit resp. 18 degrees centigrade in early June.

I suppose you know that the Swiss Alps are not really far away from Bellagio. A train and gondola ride from Varenna to Diavolezza, just in front of Piz Bernina (13,300ft/4050m) and tons of glaciers lasts just 3 3/4 hrs OW. Add about 20 min for the ferry ride from Bellagio to Varenna.
http://www.diavolezza.ch/en/
http://www.pontresina.ch/en/summer/h...iavolezza.html
BTW: Riederalp/Aletsch Glacier, the longest glacier of Europe, would be just 1 1/2 hrs by train and gondola from Stresa on Lake Maggiore. Stresa is beautiful, BTW. But I know that for Americans, there exists nothing but Lake Como.
http://www.stresa.com/
http://www.aletscharena.ch/sites/en/...tage_site.html

traveller1959

Seawater temperature will be more like 20° C in June and higher in coves with shallow water.

eblenwife

Stu,
We were interested in you recent post about restaurants you described as superb during your visit to Nice last year. We are also planning to splurge on food while in Nice and the surrounding area in September. Like you, we consider ourselves "foodies." We have researched Chow Hound but
would appreciate having some updated recommendations of wonderful restaurants in the area from you. We follow your posts regularly and have your Nice report. Would you kindly share your restaurant recommendations so that we can make our reservations soon?

neckervd

traveller:
in which statistics did you find these temperatures?

StuDudley

You must not have my 35 page Provence/Cote d'Azur itinerary, because the restaurants are in it. If you would like a copy, e-mail me at [email protected] & I'll attach one to the reply e-mail. I've sent it to over 3,000 people on Fodors.

Here is the Nice restaurant section

Restaurants in Nice
We spend 2 months in France most years (that’s 40 or so restaurant dinners per year) and the worst restaurants we’ve dined at in France, are in Nice – stinky mussels, soggy fries, thin soupe de poisson, overcooked fish, etc. You can probably find a good meal if you want to pay top dollar, but when we visit Nice we want to dine outside in Old Nice and watch the “scene” on the Cours Saleya. One exception is Safari on the Cours. We’ve dined there 5 times and the food was better than the other places on the Cours, and the people-watching was superb. It’s quite popular, so reserve ahead – last time we were there they were turning away walk-ins at 9PM.

In '14 we decided to "upgrade" our dining a bit, so we reserved at 5 Michelin "starred" restaurants, plus 2 other "white tablecloth" restaurants. Of the 5 Michelin starred restaurants, we would return to 3 of them without hesitation. All three presented dishes that were unique, varied textures & flavors, and ingredients that we have never experienced before. This is compared to the standard Dourade, Soupe de Poisson, & accras de Morue that is frequently seen elsewhere (no criticism intended - we love these menu items). However, our average tab (2 people) for these three Michelin starred restaurants (with aperitif, bottle of nice wine, & 3-4 course dinners) was 227E. Our 2 dinners at Safari (pink wine, appetizer, fish/soupe de Poisson, no dessert) averaged 95E. The three restaurants we would return to are Flaveur, l'Aromate, and Keisuke Matsushima (French food - not Japanese). The latter restaurant is in a touristy area - so the dinner tab was higher than the other two).

Another dining option while staying in Nice is to have dinner in Villefranche. There are frequent trains there (8 min trip). We dined outside at La Mere Germaine and had an excellent meal while we looked out over the port from their outside dining terrace. Reserve ahead if you want an outside table with the best views. When we dined at Villefranche at night, there was only a late return train to Nice on Saturdays – other days you will need to take a taxi to return to Nice.

Stu Dudley

jtpj777

I would recommend Nice:if you need mountain scenery, get the "Randobus" from Nice into the Mercantour National Park - mountains up to 3000m. Not quite as spectacular as the Swiss Alps but much less frequented and therefore, to me at least, more attractive.