CWT

Hello everyone, we are planning a trip in France for 2 weeks, flying in and out from Paris. Here is our plan: from Paris to Loire Valley then to Lyon by train. From Lyon, we want to go to Burgundy before going to Nice. Should we rent a car ? or all the way by train? We're afraid there is no easy traffic going to the vineyards and will miss all the beautiful towns etc on the way if we go by train. Any suggestion please? If we drive, what should be the best itinerary and stopover please? Thanks!!

StuDudley

I'm confused - are you traveling from Lyon to Nice or from Burgundy to Nice??? Will you have a car in Burgundy??? Where in Burgundy - Beaune area or Auxerre area???

In any event, If you plan to drive, there really are not many convenient places to get off the freeway & explore the countryside and small villages - unless you take the better part of an entire day to make this trip. The scenery from the train will probably be better than the scenery from the windshield of your car if you plan to try to get to Nice somewhat quickly (we've driven this section & done trains many times).

Stu Dudley

sap

CWT: Stu has a lot of experience in these areas, so if he's confused, something might be wrong with your plan.

I'm confused, too. Burgundy is north of Lyon. Your route seems to be zigzagging and backtracking quite a bit, especially if you only have two weeks.

I would think it would make more sense to skip the Loire and take TGV straight to Burgundy (Auxerre or Dijon), then rent a car for Burgundy; go to Lyon; then on to Nice before dropping off the car and taking the TGV back to Paris (& spending one night there before flying out). That might be feasible for a two-week timeframe. The car rental, however, really depends on what you plan to do while you're there. If you want countryside and small villages, it would be a better bet.

I assume your two weeks does not include Paris itself, other than the last night before you fly home.

If you post a few more details about the estimated number of nights you plan to spend in each spot, Stu and others will be able to help you flesh it out a bit more.

sap

You did mean that your trip is for a two-week timeframe, not that you're leaving in two weeks, right? When are you planning to do this?

Christina

I agree sap's plan. I'd forget the Loire. Look at a map to find out where Burgundy is. I think you are doing to much for two weeks as it seems clear to mean you include Paris in that 2 weeks. If you don't, it's better. I have flown out of France that way, also (staying in Nice, flew out, which goes through Paris, always).

StCirq

From north to south: Paris, Loire, Burgundy, Lyon, Provence...makes no sense to take a train from the Loire to Lyon, then head north again to Burgundy.

You should also consider flying home from Nice instead of trekking all the way back to Paris. Personally, I'd cut back on the number of destinations assuming the full trip is only 2 weeks.

CWT

Sorry for the confusion. Here is a preliminary itinerary that we have in mind. We have planned the trip around 4 base cities to avoid switching hotels too often. We think doing day trips is more relaxing than carrying our luggage around every other day.

1) 3 days in Paris. We have been to Paris before, want to revisit the city again.
2) 2 days in Amboise to visit Chateau Chambord and Chenonceau
3) 5 days with Lyon as the base to visit Lyon, Annecy, and Burgundy. We have chosen Lyon as the base because we have read that Lyon is a gastronomical center.
4) 4 days with Nice as the base to visit Nice, St Tropez, and see the lavender field in Provence. We are planning to skip the historic cities such as Arles and Avignon.

Originally, we were planning to travel by trains only. We now think we may need a car to visit / experience the Route des Grans Crus (Burgundy) and the lavender field in the South.

Do you think a car is necessary? We are keen to see the country side of France. Pls let us know if you have any suggestions for our itinerary.

We have already bought our ticket to fly back to Asian from Paris. We are thinking of traveling from Nice to Paris by the TGV train or flight. Any recommendation?

Tulips

CWT, visiting St Tropez without a car is tricky. You can get a boat from Nice or Cannes, but the trip will take a few hours over often choppy waters. With just four days I would concentrate on Nice and the many beautiful places to visit in that area.

Personally I would want a car for 5 days in Lyon. So much easier to get around. For Nice, it's easy to take the train along the coast to visit other places, and parking is a pain in Nice (unless your hotel has parking). For traffic, it depends a lot on when you are there. July and August it gets very busy on the roads. Any other month would be fine.

Maybe travel down to Nice from Lyon by train, or by car if you have one in Lyon and can hand it in in Nice. It's an easy drive and if you have time you can get off the motorway to explore the countryside. Then use trains while in Nice.
On the other hand, unless you are there in the summer months, there are some wonderful drives in the Nice area; the Corniche to Monaco, the Esteral towards St Raphael. So maybe keep the car in Nice as well.

Then fly back to Paris from Nice to connect with your flight home. Nice airport is very convenient, easy to get to.

Tulips

That's Esterel. It runs between Cannes and St Raphael.

Thinking about it again, if I were doing this I would rent the car in Lyon, drive to Nice, keep the car; drive the Corniche to Eze, visit St Paul de Vence or another village;
Mougins has great restaurants,
Valbonne especially the market on Friday,
tiny Haut de Cagnes; have dinner on the small square and enjoy the view
If you're set on St Tropez drive there (leave very early in the morning. Market on Tuesday and Saturdays I think, attracts crowds. Or if it's not high season take the Corniche de l'Esterel)

Then return the car at Nice airport before your flight; it's a short walk to the terminal from the rental car offices.

Unless you are there from July 14 to end of August, in which case the Cote d'Azur turns into a giant traffic jam.

StuDudley

Lyon is the second largest city in France, and getting in & out for day trips to Burgundy & elsewhere in the region is tough. It is 1 3/4 hrs from Lyon to Beaune - which is at the southern end of Burgundy. If this was my trip, I would take the TGV from Paris to Dijon and stay in either Dijon or Beaune. After Paris - you might welcome a smaller city - so Beaune would be a good choice. Getting in & out by car is easy.

You could then take the TGV from Dijon to Nice - or you could drive there. Train from Beaune to Lyon then to Nice is a possibility also.

Lavender season is from late June through July - so the Cote d'Azur will be crowded. If you plan on going this year, you need to make reservations for hotels ASAP.

St Tropez will be difficult to get to in late June or July - as Tulips mentioned. It is a 2 hr drive with no traffic - perhaps 2 1/2 to 3 if your timing is bad.

The closest lavender fields to Nice are 3 hrs away - too far for me to drive. Consider stopping in Vaison La Romaine on the way down from Burgundy (by car), stay overnight, and visit the Lavender fields around Sault from there.

Stu Dudley

StCirq

I was just about to say the same thing as Stu regarding Lyon. I still don't understand why you'd go to Lyon, then tour Burgundy, but I guess you're trying to cut down on the number of stops. Logistically, overall I think you'd save time taking the train to Dijon or Beaune first, then continue south after touring Burgundy, either by car or by train.

CWT

Thank you very much for everyone's comment! They are all very valuable.

We have decided to drop Beaune / Dijon from our itinerary. Here is what we are thinking now: pick a car in Lyon and spend two days on the road to Nice. We are hoping to see the lavender and the country side in the south. Here are some questions:

1) Any suggestion for a scenic drive from Lyon to Nice? (We are looking into a stop over at Vaison La Romaine per Stu Dudely's suggestion)

2) Do you know if lavender will be in blossom in the last week of June? (Yes, we have booked most of our accommodation)

3) Our drive from Lyon to Nice will probably happen on a Saturday and Sunday. Do most stores / restaurants close on Sunday? If they do, does that mean it is not a good time to visit the small towns located between Lyon and Nice?

Thank you so much for everyone's comment again!

StuDudley

It is late here - I will attempt to answer your questions tomorrow.... We've spent 16 weeks in Provence & 16 weeks vacationing on the Cote d'Azur. Send me an e-mail at [email protected] & I'll send you my 27 page itinerary for Provence & the Cote d'Azur.

I don't live in Provence - but I think they are having an usually chilly spring - so the lavender may be late in blooming. We'll be there from June 18 to July 4 this year - so I hope there will be lots of lavender blooming the last week we are there. One previous trips, it was blooming in mid June in really hot times, and late June when we were last there in '07 & the temps were quite cool..

Stu Dudley

StuDudley

>>1) Any suggestion for a scenic drive from Lyon to Nice? (We are looking into a stop over at Vaison La Romaine per Stu Dudely's suggestion)<<

I assume you already have your TGV tickets to get you to Lyon. If not, take the TGV to the Avignon TGV station & start there. There are not many scenic areas close to the freeway from Lyon till you get to Provence - so get to Provence as quickly as possible. In fact, even if you already have your TGV tickets, consider taking the TGV from Lyon to the Avignon TGV station.

I have a 27 page itinerary for Provence & the Cote d'Azur. I've sent it to over 1,000 peole on Fodors. E-mail me at [email protected] & I'll attach a copy to the reply e-mail. There are several scenic drives into the Lavender Fields described in it. Also sections about markets, our favorite villages, & Provence Fabric,

>>2) Do you know if lavender will be in blossom in the last week of June? (Yes, we have booked most of our accommodation)<<

Should be - but this spring has been rathar cold, I understand.

>3) Our drive from Lyon to Nice will probably happen on a Saturday and Sunday. Do most stores / restaurants close on Sunday? If they do, does that mean it is not a good time to visit the small towns located between Lyon and Nice?<<

That's why you need to get to Provence ASAP. Most villages and cities will not have shops open. However, both Gordes & Roussillon in the Luberon will have shops open. St Remy & Les Baux will also have shops open. Shops in the medieval section of Vaison will be closed - and so will many in the section near the Roman ruins. There is a huge farmers, crafts, and Antiques market in l'Isle sur la Sorgue on Sunday morning - and along with the market, shops will be open. However, get there by 8:30 at the latest in late June or else you'll have difficulty parking & the crowds of people may be overwhealming.

Consider stayng in the Luberon (near Gordes & Roussillon). From the Luberon it is an easy & scenic drive to the Lavender fields near Sault. The scenic drive is actually described in detail in my itinerary. There are actually several lavender fields in the Luberon - and my itinerary has a scenic drive of the Luberon.

Stu Dudley

StCirq

I wouldn't drive from Lyon to Nice. I'd get right back on the TGV after your visit to Lyon and go to Avignon, pick up a car there, spend the night in Vaison-la-Romaine, or wherever you decide, and then continue to Nice by car.