Thank you everybody.

my plan will be as follows :

London 4 nights
Night train to Venice 3 nights
Train Florence 3 nights ( day trip to Siena/Pisa/CT )
Train Rome 3 nights
Fly to Amsterdam 3 nights

welcome any other alternatives. Many Thanks.

you will have to get of a train in Paris to catch the night train to Venice.

CT, you have been warned. I'd spend a bit of time in the Tuscan countryside rather than pack those tiny villages. If you want to do the walks this might help https://www.coastalwalking.com/Cinqu...nque_Terre.php

If you have lots of energy & can handle a long day of sightseeing, I would suggest that you combine Pisa & le Cinque Terre in the same day trip. See the monuments of Pisa in the morning and then head to le Cinque Terre afterwards. Have a nice lunch in le Cinque Terre when you arrive. If you've got swimsuits bring them, and take a dip in the water (Monterosso al Mare is easiest). I think it is likely to be much too hot for hiking, but towards the end of the day you can take a ferry to see all 5 towns from the water, from Monterosso al Mare to Riomaggiore. Buy some food to eat on the train back to Florence. Be sure you know when the last trains leave le Cinque Terre that will get you back to Florence.

There is no night train from London to Venice. You not only have to change trains in Paris, you have to change stations . . .

You would have to leave London in the afternoon in time to arrive at Gare de Nord by about 6PM. Then Once you get to Gare de Lyon to catch the 7:15PM train, you will be on that train for the next 15 hours. So all in all it will be about a 20 hour travel day/night.

The VAST majority of night trains have been eliminated/discontinued -- for good reasons.>

What reasons -folks can't sleep - they did for years and years -the only good reasons they have been eliminated are -cheap airfares and bullet day trains.

How many night trains have you taken?

”They sleep on overnight trains, put their luggage in train stations while they sightsee for a day. They have a lots of fun. Most people know this. A great many older travelers did it themselves when they were young and haven't forgotten.”

Ah yes, those were the days. A first class one month Eurailpass cost me $210 in 1977. Haven't forgotten a thing from that first trip.

But my body can't take that abuse now.

Never try over night train before.

My plan will be as follows :

5-9th Aug London 4D3N
9th Aug Night Train London to Paris to Venice 3D2N 14hours @ EUR55, sleeping Cabin EUR120
10-12th Aug Morning Train Venice to Florence 3D2N 2 hours @ EUR25
12-16th Aug Morning Train Florence to Rome 4D3N 1.5hours @ EUR30
16-18th Aug Morning Train Rome to Milan 2D1N 3 hours @ EUR40.00
18-22th Aug Morning Flight from Milan to Amsterdam 3D2N SGD104.00

Welcome any other best alternatives. Many thanks.

London to Venice in one day? You don't like to fly? Are you figuring in the cost of London to Paris?

I can see doing this if staying in Paris but to do from London and changing in Paris is tough - you have to get from Paris Nord station to Bercy (or Gare du Lyon?) station. Leave plenty of time.

Again why not fly London to Venice?

>>5-9th Aug London 4D3N
9th Aug Night Train London to Paris to Venice 3D2N 14hours @ EUR55, sleeping Cabin EUR120
10-12th Aug Morning Train Venice to Florence 3D2N 2 hours @ EUR25
12-16th Aug Morning Train Florence to Rome 4D3N 1.5hours @ EUR30
16-18th Aug Morning Train Rome to Milan 2D1N 3 hours @ EUR40.00
18-22th Aug Morning Flight from Milan to Amsterdam 3D2N SGD104.00<<

AWFULLY rushed.

What you actually have is 3 full and 2 half days in London, 2 days in Venice, 3.5 days in Florence with two full day trips from there, 1.5 days in Rome, 3.5 days in Milan . . . and <u>you REALLY should not be flying to Amsterdam the same day you fly home!!!</u>

>>9th Aug Night Train London to Paris to Venice 3D2N 14hours @ EUR55, sleeping Cabin EUR120<<

The train from Paris to Venice is about 14.5 hours . . . But that does not include the time it takes to get to Kings Cross, the 45 minutes advance check in for the Eurostar, the train ride to Paris, or the travel from Gare du Nord to Gare du Lyon. So your '14 hours' is quite a bit longer than that.

Are all four of you game for this hectic plan?

Delete Amsterdam and stay in Paris 3-4 days and take night train and you have a more workable easier a bit itinerary. Fly into London and out of Rome.

Have you already been to Paris?

and you REALLY should not be flying to Amsterdam the same day you fly home!!!>

jan I think OP means fly to Amsterdam and spend 4N/3D? I hope anyway.

My plan :
5-8th Aug London 4D3N
9-11th Aug Morning Flight London to Venice 3D2N 2.5 hours @ SGD77 British Airway
12-14th Aug Morning Train Venice to Florence 3D2N 2 hours @ EUR25
15-17th Aug Morning Train Florence to Rome 3D2N 1.5hours @ EUR30
18-19th Aug Morning Train Rome to Milan 2D1N 3 hours @ EUR40
20-22th Aug Morning Flight Milan to Amsterdam 3D2N SGD104.00

Is Florence a must?

Welcome any other best alternatives. Many thanks.

My other plan :

5-8th Aug London
9-11th Aug Morning Flight London to Rome @ SGD148 British Airway
12-14th Aug Morning Train Rome to Florence
15-16th Morning Train Florence to Milan
17-18th Morning Train Milan to Venice
19th Afternoon Flight Venice to Amsterdam @ SGD163 KLM

>>jan I think OP means fly to Amsterdam and spend 4N/3D? I hope anyway<<

Can't be if they are spending several days in Milan with a side trip to Lake Como.

But the whole itinerary has become very confusing - what does >>12-14th Aug Morning Train Venice to Florence 3D2N 2 hours @ EUR25<< mean? Is the train from Venice to Florence on the 12th or the 14th?

The latest plan is better but soooooo rushed - I sure wouldn't do it.

London Aug 5-8
Fly to Rome Aug 9
Train to Florence Aug 12
Train to Milan Aug 15
Train to Venice Aug 17
Flight to A'dam Aug 19
Fly home Aug 22.

Florence is not "a must" but if you want, you can take a morning train from Venice to Florence, or from Rome to Florence, put your luggage in the train station, and walk around for several hours before returning to the train station to continue on your journey.

Do you need time in Milan to go shopping or sightseeing inside museums? If you do, be sure that the day you pick to be in Milan is a day when what you want to do is open.

12-14 Aug, travel day on 12 Aug and stay till 14 Aug so is 4D3N

We have already booked for ticket to fly from Amsterdam back home.

We have never been to Paris.

I knew most museums not open on Monday? We want to shop in Milan.

Did you buy tickets for trains already at those prices? If not do so ASAP - those fares are lowest fares possible but not nearly always available.

We have yet to purchase train tickets. Yes those are the lowest price. We will buy asap

You have 7 flights/long/semi long distance train rides in 18 days. So basically you are traveling on nearly 40% of your limited days in Europe.

Are you more interested in trains and airports than actually <i>being</i> anywhere? Just asking? A huge % of your time and money will be spent just moving from point to point. Me -- I'd rather spend my resources seeing and doing things . . .

The latest itinerary is better but still rushed, especially for Rome. Its otherwise not bad if you cut out all the side trips to CT, Como etc.
You can however decide when you arrive in your main destinations as to whether you have time for excursions. Would not recommend a one day trip to Florence on your way elsewhere. We did that once by leaving Venice on the earliest train, tour guide at the Florence train station for a full day tour before heading off to Rome. Two years later none of us remembered much about Florence and we had to return later for more time to explore the city and some of the rest of Tuscany.
When I was young I did three 2 month Euraill pass holidays in Europe and there were times we did just as described above, which is to spend one day in a city before moving on. This however was not the norm but necessary due to cost constraints. Once spent a night on the train from Munich to Hamburg and back since we could not afford a place to stay during the Octoberfest. Do not have the most memories of these abbreviated visits and missed many things. The norm during my youth was to move when you wanted to move and where you wanted to move as you had a student 2 month Eurail or Interrail pass. Although everybody had a sense of where they wanted to go, (using Lets go Europe as our guide) plans would adjust day by day. You met a lot of fellow travelers from all over so there was new information or ideas all of the time.
The above itinerary as I understand it gives one 3 1/2 days in London (day of arrival plus 3 days), 2 1/2 days in Rome, 2 1/2 days in Florence, 1/1/2 days in Milan, 1 1/2 days in Venice and 1 1/2 days in Amsterdam. I would drop Milan and add a night to Rome. You are losing almost a day of your trip moving just for a short time in Milan. This still gives you a very rushed trip. It takes time to get from place to place within a city and there are lines at many tourist spots and quite possibly summer heat In Italy. I think you will have a good time but will leave all of your destinations feeling rushed and with the thought that just an extra day or so in each place would have allowed you to accomplish most of what you wanted to do.

My plan :

London Aug 5-9
Fly to Venice Aug 10-11
Train to Milan Aug 12-13
Train to Rome Aug 14-18
Fly to Amsterdam Aug 19-21
Fly home Aug 22.