rj007

Now that I have your attention, someone once told me that you should go with the flow. Having seen other posters who had their messages deleted, and, realizing there is a lot more good than bad in this world I have returned to the message boards that have given me a wealth of information.

Yes, the exchange rate is terrible and many hotels and restaurants are expensive, but there are ways to get around that. I stay in a B&B in the suburbs for half the price I paid in Central London. I love to wander around the neighborhoods (free) and the major museums are free.

I actually enjoy London's weather. Coming from a warm climate I prefer cool weather. I have been in London all 4 seasons and I think fall is my favorite season. I have been there the last 2 Novembers and the weather was great! And I was there in Feb - again no problem with the weather.

HeatherH

I was there in March - it was wonderful! Weather was mild, little rain (ok - it rained often, but showers were short and not hard!), but it was VERY windy!

Also, we didn't find it all that expensive - not as bad as I had imagined!

wills

We-ell, I have to say that I find London really expensive, but I am used to Italy which tends to be less so. I was there last week and I blanched a bit, but there's a difference in being there for business and being there on a vacation. I think that forewarned etc. is true. At the same time, I went to the National Gallery and for a small donation I saw (in my largely uneducated art loving opinion) more famous incredible works in one place than I ever have in my life! I need to go to the Louvre again, but the National Gallery blew me away. Then I was very pleasantly assisted by no less than 5 policeman as I got myself lost repeatedly. The tube confused me a bit (kind of a labyrinth to the untutored) but I left with a wish that I a. had more money and b. that I could return more often. The thing is I wondered, is it that they make more money than Americans? Because an 10$ hamburger is kind of expensive to me. And the hamburger in question was 8 pounds, and it wasn't a grand place, it was a pub. No grousing, just wondering.

MelissaHI

I think the difference between your post and the others who <b>supposedly</b> &quot;did not go with the flow&quot; is that you've turned a potentially negative situation (hey, the exchange rate is what it is) into a very positive one, and if people follow your lead they can enjoy it, too...as opposed to criticism of the place. Bravo!

rj007

One way I use to reduce costs in expensive places that I have been such as Iceland and Norway is go to the grocery store. When you are at home you shop at the grocery store. It is interesting to try to figure out what you are looking at (especially if you don;t speak the language!) And, of course, London has plenty of grocery stores.

m_kingdom2

&quot;Grocery stores&quot; are always fun to visit. I always make a point of looking around a supermarket wherever I travel to as part of the cultural experience, I never purchase anything, but merely browse, and think how much cheaper than London everything is.

I live in London, it's expensive, the weather pretty awful at times too, I think if I were a tourist I'd much rather see Italy and Spain at a fraction of the cost. Perhaps living somewhere all one's life can put one off of things, that said, I do love the bars, the nightclubs and restaurants that London offers, Mayfair is simply darling.

Scarlett

On the other hand, I lived somewhere with similar weather to London, so it was not the worst thing to be in weather just like home (wet,chilly,raw).
I lived in a city that had a terribly high cost of living, London was similar.
My husband and I rarely travel these days FOR the weather, we did when the children were small, in the winter, we went to a warm place. But these days, it is for the Place, regardless of the weather.
And I too love the fall in Europe!

Scarlett

*ps*
I love your title

vmcenroe

Usually, I'm posting a question, not responding. And I did post a question recently about the expensive hotels in London. It's probably one of the posts that compelled rj to come to London's defense.

Let me just say this. Facts are facts. London is almost always in the top 10 list for the most expensive cities in the world. I think this year it may have dropped to no. 11. Wow, what's going on over there in London?

The truth is that most, granted not all, people want to have at minimum the same level of ammenities and such when they are on vacation as they do at home. Yes, anyone can go anywhere and live cheaply if they are willing to give up certain things.

As for London, I plan to visit for my first time ever in June, and after all of my research I think London is the greatest city in the world. In fact, I'm already making plans to move there. Well, not really. But maybe someday when I retire.

I agree, this message board is one of the best places in cyberspace.

WillTravel

I agree, London does not have to be that expensive:

Accommodation: Priceline hotel, a hostel dorm, or as the original poster suggested, a suburban B&amp;B

Food: Grocery stores and delis and the odd cafe or pub

Entertainment: Free museums (although I always donate), just simply walking around

Theatre: Many excellent options for 10 pounds or so or less

Transportation: Accept the cost of a transit pass, or buy a bus pass (about 2 pounds/day). Or stay centrally so you can walk everywhere. I also recommend a 2-day Thames River cruise pass (8 pounds or so with your TravelCard discount)

Paid attractions: Whatever you want or feel is important (guided tours of Westminster Abbey and the Houses of Parliament are worth the price)

What not to spend money on if you are trying to economize: mediocre restaurants, shopping, alcohol, cabs, bus tours

But all rules are made to be broken, so if you really want one of those, work it into your budget.

There's no food in London that I can't get at home for a cheaper price so personally I try to economize there.

vcl

We spent the month of April in London in an apartment that cost us about $100 a night for living room/kitchen, small bedroom and bath in an elevator building around the corner from a supermarket a laundry and less than a quarter mile from the Tube station.
We determined to buy new umbrellas the first day we needed them; we bought them in the duty free shop on the way home.
I cooked most meals, more from convenience than anything else. We did take the train to Cornwall for a few days in a hotel; that took care of my eating-out desires and gave me palm trees too.
I've spent plenty of cool, damp days in London on trips past, but this spring was truly delightful.

Lovejoy

Actually according to the &quot;Economist Intelliegence Unit&quot;, London is now ranked as the most expensive city in the world for the average businees traveller to visit.This includes such things as the cost of hotels, meals and taxi journey with a cost of 636.00USD per day.
London is followed by:
2]Geneva
3]Mexico city
4]Frankfurt
5]Oslo

francophile03

I'll be negative and say that I always do find London to be very expensive, more so than Paris and Rome for example. But I do not find the weather awful-maybe cos last time we went in June and it was sunny and warm.

WillTravel

$636 USD per day! That would last me for a week or 10 days - quite seriously. But I can see that if you have to pay full price for everything and can't take time to look for bargains, as would be typical for a business traveler, then that figure could be correct. Still, if I were traveling at a business level in London I know I could come in well under $200/day easily, based on what I know of the city.

janis

If you know what/how to do things, London can be done very well on a decent budget. Rent a flat for less than a tiny hotel room, use the TKTS 1/2 price booth, free museums/galleries, free platform programs at the National Theatre, inexpensive or free concerts in medieval churches, tapas/chinese/greek late night suppers. Great British Heritage Passes for sightseeing and excursions out of town.

And I live in N. California where we get no rain (and practically no clouds) from May through September - I actually DO go to London for the weather. Summer showers and balmy days are very welcome compared to the warm/hot/dry summers I get at home.

Most of my British friends think I'm nuts - they all want to got to CA or FL for their hols, whereas I want to spend mine in London or Scotland or some such place . . . .

rj007

Well said Janis. And like WillTravel $636 would cover several days for me as well.

I am a native S.Californian who also spent several years in N.California while in the military. I work outdoors so I am acutely aware of the weather. Like Janis said and I mentioned in my title I, also, really DO go to London for the weather.

A walk through St.James Park while a nice cool breeze rustling and blowing leaves or walking through Regent's Park after an early morning rain. I will take a cool London day over a hot, humid S.Cal.day anytime. And, if the weather is too much - pop into a pub or museum!

PatrickLondon

To take Wills's point - it's hard to generalise about incomes, because it's hard to identify the points of comparison. We now have a minimum wage of just over &pound;4 an hour, but you'd have to be claiming additional tax credits and other benefits to be anywhere near survival on that. The most recent overall national average pay was &pound;10 per hour (average weekly earnings in London in April 2002 for men - manual workers &pound;409, non-manual &pound;806; women - manual &pound;293, non-manual &pound;524. There is a real problem for people like policemen, teachers, nurses and firemen to find affordable housing anywhere within a commuting distance that isn't either exhausting or counter-productively expensive: and (nurses apart) their salaries are not, overall, that ungenerous.

But little of that overlaps with the kinds of things visitors (especially business visitors) spend their money on. Most of us don't go out to eat that often: you're probably concentrating into a couple of weeks items of expenditure we might not accumulate in several months or even a year.

I don't have all the income statistics to hand, but what I glean from the papers is that we are perhaps midway between continental Europe and the US in terms of the longterm trend towards holding down ordinary people's wages and salaries (by casualisation, outsourcing and similar means) and letting the fat cats at the top get away with just about anything: and there could be backlash brewing on that point (a secretary in a big finance company who was paid about &pound;35k a year, more than most teachers or policemen, has just been sent to prison for stealing millions from her bosses' personal accounts - and what really caught the public attention was that they didn't notice the money going missing for nearly a year).

wills

Thank you Patrick London, I really was curious. I guess that it is kind of like New York City, really. Prohibitive to live in Manhattan but there are a lot of people in Brooklyn etc. Salaries do tend to be higher, to match the cost of living but still nothing anyone would call generous. I just seemed to notice a lot of locals out and about in the evenings while I was there, having dinner and going to films, hanging at pubs, and one was a Mon evening, so I pondered whether the standard of living, and salaries were higher.

I guess what I really envy is the strength of the pound! I have been traveling pretty frequently for the last 12 years and I have never seen the pound anything but strong. It really explains one reason why the British are so widely traveled, I would guess. Thanks for the explanation!

Kate

Hi Wills, you're certainly right that Londoners (some!) do indeed go out a lot during the week - in many ways it's a part of the work culture to go straight out after work. But you should also remember that these are mostly &quot;bright young things&quot; who, beyond their rent, have nothing else to spend their money on (no kids, mortgages, cars, life insurance etc etc). I know, I've been there!

I'm now (a little) older and slightly more encumbered by mortgage, car etc, but I still reckon a 3rd of my income is spent on food, socialising and travel. After all, what's the point of living in London if you're going to stay home and watch the telly? Once you've got to that point, then most (sensible) people move out of London to where houses are bigger and life is cheaper.

mikemo

This is a joke, yes?
London is about an order of magnitude more expensive than Dallas and 10 orders more than the wonderful vil of San Miguel de Allende, MX!
M
Dallas and SMdA