Speck - Marylebone High St., W1

See my previous posting of the same name for details.

Can yo tell me more about Speck. What is a typical menu? Thanks.

They have daily specials, try www.speck-deli.co.uk to see the sort of pastas that they sell, and indeed serve to you. They do not have a menu as such, the eat-in table seats around ten people only. It is not smart, not fancy, just plain and simple Italian basics.

RUDE, RUDE, RUDE. I have been reading Fodors for a few weeks now so that when I do get to London I will know a little about what to expect. I have asked a few questions and gotten some good answers but it really dissapoints me the way people attack each other for no reason. And beleive me it relly does'nt make you more worldly when you act this way, if that is what you are trying to acheive. I know that I will not be asking any more questions on this board.

I haven't read one rude post on this thread. Do you think it rude to defend one's country against bigotry????? I call that patriotism. Americans aren't the only patriots.

I can't believe in this day and age, with the Internet, news media, and television, that people don't realize that London is an international city. I really, really can't believe that there are people who think that we either eat fish $ chips out of a newspaper or tea and crumpets. How 1957 of you.

Buy the latest edition of "Great Eats in London" (formerly "Cheap Eats in London") and ignore the verbal sparring. It describes the London equivalents to what you would recommend if someone asked you about New York what you are asking about London.

No-one has bothered to say what sort of a restaurant "The Ivy" is!

GLMDesigns is looking for somewhere that can offer good, well prepared, simple food and whilst I'm sure The Ivy's food is well prepared it would be just about the last restaurant in London I would recommend to someone looking for basic dining. Just this week several of the world's best chefs, restaurateurs, and critics voted it the 24th best restaurant on the planet for god's sake!!

I live just off Marylebone High Street myself and I'd recommend "The Providores". It serves excellent fusion food given the relatively low prices, and yes you can order a good steak.

Regarding Sophie's Steakhouse (located halfway down the Fulham Road):
I think this is a good basic restaurant and as such is just the sort of place GLMDesigns is probably looking for. It's deocorated in a simple modern style, it's always busy and 'mains' cost £8-£15. You can't go wrong. Whether I would travel all the way from Marylebone to go there is another matter.

Keep in mind that London is huge, and many of these recs are spread all over the place. We ate at a couple of Italian chains that were decent, Bella Italia and Spaghetti House. In So. Kensington (where we stayed), we enjoyed the Zetland Arms and Hereford pubs. Both these pubs had 'basic' fare and non-smoking sections. The Fish and CHips at Zetland was very fresh and good.

The Ivy isn't particularly smart, people who wear ties to go there stand out as "once in a lifetime customers". I have no idea why it received the rating of 24th in the world. The menu is too classic for it to deserve this positioning - it still serves baked Alaska, albeit an excellent one. It is a quintessential British eatery - how restaurants used to be.

If you can get a table there, the food is reasonably priced - under twenty pounds for main courses, the service good, but the people on weekend - i.e. Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights are the "once in a lifetime" clientele. This type of person rarely ventures out on weeknights so I advise going anywhere worth going to on a Monday-Thursday evening, weekends are vulgar.

Historically, the aristocracy has not acknowledged a weekend, after all how can the week end for one who does not work? They used to refer to it as a Friday to Sunday party if indeed they held shooting parties over a "weekend" period.

But, back to The Ivy, the location itself is dumpy - lots of tramps, users and abusers on the streets nearby, It has all become terribly nouveau "Vicki and Dave" patronise it far too often. If you are an American after something "so English" and wish to don a jacket and tie, dine at The Ritz - fancier French inspired dishes in a beautiful dining room - the "Dave" you get here is Sir David Frost, far classy than some footballer (incidentally why does he buy his wife a suite of jewellery for a reported 1 million pounds? All so she can wear it shopping in Romford Market).

However, back to the original question, once again I've digressed, for "basic fare" The Ivy would be at the top of that category - they do steaks, they do chips, they do chicken, they do shepherd's pie etc.... You could try a chain of Italian restauants - Strada, they have branches all over London, Marylebone High St being the newest one - Italian cuisine, generally excellent for little money. Shepherd's Mrkt in Mayfair has lots of little restaurants that are all inexpensive and offer a relaxed dinner with no pretensions.

Be wary of the Italian restaurants, or so-called Italian restaurants off of Oxford St. the majority of these are for tourists only, and as such the food is of a poor standard.

summersquash - you are so sensitive. You should have visited this board before registration was required if you wanted to see the true meaning of rude - even though I enjoyed it.

Aberdeen Steak Houses - stay FAR FAR AWAY!

ThinGorjus is entertaining as usual - love those posts.

GLMDesigns - Just Go. You WILL find dinner options to please you.

Goddard's Pie House in Greenwich is awesome. Inexpensive, authentic pies in beautiful Greenwich. It gives you a hearty start to the day or a great way to fill your famished stomach. They also have delicious dessert pies, my favorite, rhubarb pie with custard, yum.

www.blurrytravel.com

I like to read www.london-eating.co.uk for restaurant recommendations. You can search on American restaurants,Sophie's Steakhouse was opened not so long ago, allegedly modelled on a Chicago steakhouse. Reviews seem to be OK. Alternatively how about Argentinian restaurants, there are a few of those mentioned in the website.

The Rib Room & Oyster Bar at the Carlton Tower Hotel, Cadogan Place, London SW1. Would fit the bill except for price maybe. Some of our London hotels have superb restaurants.

Guldklump, I am fascinated by that advice, the Rib Room at The Carlton Tower is so dreadfully old fashioned, perhaps classic, but I don't care for that hotel in the slightest. If you are going to dine at hotels, The Ritz, Claridge's, The Connaught.

The Carlton is a little staid, and was never one of the foremost grand London hotels, I wouldn't advise dining there!

The advice isn't compulsory, if you don't like it don't go. There's no need to be fascinated. People's opinion and experiences at all these places vary.

I am the original poster to this question. We got back a week ago. Just as I thought the food options are rather different than here ie I could not find a good salad and was told salads are very scimpy here. Also most sandwiches are pre-made and kind of scimpy and,again things here in NY are just different. The Europeans eat less than Americans. We found a decent restaurant, Christophers, that was quite good, patterned after American steakhouses. I thought the staff was just trying too hard to mimic. We ate at Benihana which was fine, and came upon a Cafe Uno which was actually quite good. A really nice place for lunch, (salads, sandwiches, pizza) is an outdoor place at the square at Convent Garden, I can't remember the name. We ate at the Hard Rock cafe which was a lot of fun, mediocre food. Basically food in London is probably adequate at most and I'm sure if you're there long enough you will find some really good places, but I think mediocre is the word for most London restaurants. New Yorkers are spoiled. London is awesome and that makes up for their lack of great food.

I like Richoux restaurants. There are several of them. They have the type of food you are requesting. (They also serve a basic Tea.) Not too expensive, not too daunting.

My mom and a good friend are going to London in May and we are going the ecomomy route this time. We can't wait to get there and eat the fish and chips, and all the neat English food. We can eat American food expensive or inexpensive all the time at home! An we can't wait to have tea and crumpets!! We are so excited!!! So give us the good hints of where to eat. We don't want to spend big money on food-we would rather eat cheap and spend our money on theater, shopping, and all the neat things to do in London. Any suggestions from ya'll for 3 Texans who can't wait to get there?

GLMDesigns

Some comments on your comments...

"Just as I thought the food options are rather different than here - ie I could not find a good salad and was told salads are very scimpy here."

You could not find a good salad! Well that is not surprising given the list of restaurants you chose to visit! But weill come to that in time...

"Also most sandwiches are pre-made and kind of scimpy and, again things here in NY are just different."

Well things are nmot that different. There are plenty of sandwich bars which will make you a large tasty sandwich for not a lot of cash but you have to know what you want so you can order it. Yes tere are hundredes of shocking places like Pret a Manger (you have them in NYC too now so watch out!) where you do get fowl, srimpy, overpriced garbage. I worked in Midtown for a year and can tell you that the delis that made sandwiches in NY were no better than selecting an Italin deli in London.

"The Europeans eat less than Americans."

Yes well we aren't fat/overweight like most Americans. Perhaps you shuld say "Europeans aren't fat like Americans?"

"We found a decent restaurant, Christophers, that was quite good, patterned after American steakhouses. I thought the staff was just trying too hard to mimic."

This is an American restaurant in London. If you go to a place in NYC and order shepherd's pie (a traditional English meal) it is shite. So you should not expect a huge amount from a place like this. I understand that this place is a tourist trap caterinmg to American executives and wealthy americans on holiday.

"We ate at Benihana which was fine"

Benihana is a tourist trap - probably the worst Japanese food in London. I used to work for a Japanese bank and Benihana is the laughing sytock of Jaoanese restaurants in LOndon. You are a sucker if you went there.

"Came upon a Cafe Uno which was actually quite good."

A shite chain - but you enjoyed it - shows what you view as quality food!

"A really nice place for lunch, (salads, sandwiches, pizza) is an outdoor place at the square at Convent Garden, I can't remember the name."

That is helpful! There aree many places to eat in Covent Garden

"We ate at the Hard Rock cafe which was a lot of fun, mediocre food."

Well that is American and not good. Do you really expect to eat well there?

"Basically food in London is probably adequate at most and I'm sure if you're there long enough you will find some really good places, but I think mediocre is the word for most London restaurants. New Yorkers are spoiled. London is awesome and that makes up for their lack of great food."

To sum up you visited a selctionb of tourist traps. You must be an incredibly thick, stupid or uncultured person.

If I went to NYC and ate at Hard Rock Cafe, a couple of delis, a diner and some of NYC's tourist trap restaurants I would leave disappointed. But I fdo a bit of research and take recommendatioons. Whatr did you achieve by going on this board? I told you to look at a website that reviews London restaurants - www.london-eating.co.uk - you clearly didn;t look it or listen to a lot of advioce given by fodorites. so well done - i think you thouroiughly desevre tro have eaten so badly for choosing the worst restaurnats when offered assistance!

I'm afraid I'm with wealthy backpacker here. You had every opportunity to do some decent research on this board and it seems you didn't follow any of the advice (save Christopher's, which I recommended because you clearly wanted a taste of home). The Hard Rock Cafe, jeez. Surprised you didn't fit MacDonald's in while you were here.

The thing that annoys me is that you're the sort of person that makes bad choices and then goes home spreading the myth that British food is crap. I have eaten crap food in New York, and when I've actually done some decent research I've eaten well. That's life, in any country you care to name.

latham - you should try some ethnic restaurants if you're on a budget - 100s of great Indian, Chinese, Thai, Vietnamese, Malaysian, Japanese, you name it. It's the best way to get quality at a budget price.

You should get a good guide book - I think the best (ie most honest!) is Harden's London Restaurants 2004 (buy it on Amazon or look up hardens.com) - something that GLMDesigns would have done well to do.

I'm also a fussy new yorker who lived in London for many years and visit frequently, and I agree the outcome of this thread is pretty sad--GLMD could have done a lot better than the places she ended up at! It almost sounds like a wind-up. It's easier to find a good or decent restuarant in London than it used to be, but it still requires either a lot of money, advice (which GLMD got here) or luck. I find that the general standard of food in NYC is still much higher--obviously there are exceptions, but you can wander into an average place and have a pretty good meal for not a lot of money. Whereas I have had more truly disgusting meals in London than I care to mention wandering around that way. And though I would avoid chain restaurants in NY, as an american in London I am comforted by the uniform decency of places like Pret a Manger and Ask Pizza (though I agree Eco in Clapham is much much better).

The places you are were all basically "tourist" places and not where the good food is. I go to London visiting friends for weekends(been a while) and we ate great for good money. For snacks we would go to small restaurants and cafe's in Soho, Covent Garden, Kensington etc. I had grat Nachos, salad plates and fresh sandwiches and pizza's as well as reasonable meals in restaurants. If you eat in the centre of any tourist place its always pricier and usually crummy in my opinion.

P.S no one makes the huge NY deli sandwiches. There is too much meat and cheese and it would not appeal over here the same way.

I meant to say no one in europe (Ok maybe there is an exception out there)

Yes, GLMD has GOT to be a wind up - who would come to London and eat at Hard Rock??? I can't believe anyone could do that! He's clearly barking.
Latham - if you are staying at a place with cooking facilities (even just a microwave) then I suggest going to any branch of Marks and Spencers and looking at their huge range of chilled food. Not the cheapest you can buy but a good way of eating on a budget.
Kate has given you some excellent advice. The Hardens Restaurant guide is my bible (I am English and take it with me whenever I travel about). It has NEVER let me down, and has a huge London section sorted into areas, cuisines and cost. I have just looked on Amazon and seen "Harden's Good Cheap Eats in London" - buy this and you're sorted!

Siobahm P

You can easily get your made sandwich as big as they are in NYC when in London. It is just that meat, cheese and food in general is more expensive (and for the most part better quality!) in the UK and Europe than it is the USA. So in order for a sandwich bar not to be too expensive it often will economise - normally by not putting much filling in.

But you know you can always ask for extra filling if you want more.

And anyway I think it is a good thing they don't make sandwiches as large as they do in the US.

Not only are Americans hugely wasteful when it comes to throwing away food, they are hugely obese as a nation (in a world where many more are very poor).

I ate in a tourist trap in NYC - it was a deli near Carnegie Hall - maybe the Carnegie deli between 56th and 57th?. That sums it up - poor quality ingredients, disgusting amounts of food and shocking waste by patrons.

Morgana,
This book seems to be out of stock at Amazon and Barnes and Nobles. Advice. Also, I was hoping to find salads on most menus as this is a mainstay of my diet.(No longer a fat American) We are stoppng by Hard Rock for t-shirts only as this is the original site. We promise not to eat there.

Wealthy_backpacker...I live in Dublin and have never seen sandwiches filled up like the American ones even if I ask for extra. I find the overstuffed sandwiches inedible and people where shocked when I would basically throw out most of the filling in order to eat it in NY (where I lived).

I honestly do not think they are better quality in the UK or NY just different.

As for all Americans being obese...there are 2 sides to this.

1. Yes Americans seem to have more choice and more overall food available to them and many people are larger but I also notice far more younger women looking anorexic.

2.No one ever takes into account that Americans are made up of many different ethnic groups which accounts for various shapes and sizes. Some people/ethnic groups are more pre-determined to put on weight than others so saying all American are fat is a bit silly.

P.S. Carnegie Deli is not poor ingredients just probably different from what you are used to.

>As for all Americans being obese...there are 2 sides to this.

The BBC has run several recent segments talking about how much heavier the English are getting.

Keith

Siobahm

I take your point about different races - but British and even German citizens now come from many races so I don't think you can apply this just to America.

I am afraid I completely disagree about Carnegie Deli - the bread is far from fresh - or at least it was when I visited. It wasn't much better than the bread you would get from Gregg's in the UK.

Same in Ireland. Irish children for the first time are showing signs of obesity and this was never prevalent in previous generations. We are not the skinniest nor the fattest just in the middle but people are getting bigger over here as well.

SueBee
Apologies - I was looking at the English Amazon site and it's in stock there. I assume you can't order from it as the shipping would be prohibitive? Shame as Hardens really are excellent and I know if they recommend something then I stand a good chance of it being well above average. Stuff doesn't get into their book unless it has been thoroughly road tested.
I'll let you off about the Hard Rock! Have to admit my kids dragged me in their when I was visiting the States and I did enjoy my visit!
M

Maybe I was just lucky but I recently spent 4 nights in London and thought the food was very good. I ate mostly at mid-priced places in and around SoHo - my most expensive meal was 70 pounds for two, my least expensive was 40 pounds. I did a lot of research ahead of time looking at restaurant review sites, came up with a list of about 10 possible restaurant choices and was not disappointed. I used two off the list and one additional restaurant that wasn't on my list. I found the pre and post theatre menus a particularly good value.

SueBee, for Hardens online, go to:

http://www.hardens.com/

You'll need to register to search the database but it's free. I also like:

http://www.london-eating.co.uk/

Good luck!

Tom42, I'm proud of you, I only wish other tourists followed your method.

As for getting hold of Hardens, if you don't get round to ordering a copy of Hardens before you arrive, then it's available in many good book shops in London, particularly Stamfords on Lond Acre, Covent Garden (a truly excellent travel bookshop).

Don't see why people have to be so nasty, I'm just letting you know where I ate, and I didn't complain, I said the dinners were decent. I did months of research and it's very difficult, since what some people may think is good, others may dislike. I settled on Christophers, which was good, Benihana because my family likes it (not suckers, we go there all the time) and we were going to go to Chez Gerard, but didn't want to go back to Covent Garden so stumbled upon a Cafe Uno, which I said was pretty decent and had a nice casual atmosphere. Besides, many of the suggestions were chains, so I don't think my choice makes me stupid or "uncultered".The hard rock was for lunch, we knew the food would be mediocre, but is was fun and predictable. Yes, I agree Americans are fat - noone's gonna argue with that, so chill out.Yes, there is good and bad food in NY but I am just saying and MANY folks will agree, London is not known for it's great food. You CANhave a good meal, but I think you have to really know where to go. Just my opinion. I think everyone's opinion helps. BTW, Pret ane Manger, which I wanted to try was closed.

Gosh, we had some wonderful meals in London two years ago. I had a couple of guide books. (and actually, met up with Kavey twice -- once at Indigo and once in a neighborhood Italian place). It was no more difficult to find restaurants we liked than it is in New York City (where I once lived, and my daughter now lives) or Washington, DC (where we live) or San Francisco, LA or San Diego, for that matter. Of course we like to try different ethnic cuisine -- the BEST meal we had in London was at Le Pellicano (in Chelsea) which is actually Sicilian, not just Italian. A friend of my Mom's used to say: If you can read you can cook. I think it holds true of finding a restaurant that suits you, as well. GLM was satisfied (and did I catch mention that more family was involved? nothing cuts your options more than a picky, pouty teen), so that's her/his opinion. We were extremely pleased with the food we found in London -- and while it was expensive (not unlike NYC) the wine was an amazing value.

There are a few good restaurants around the Marylebone area. for Italian food:
Bertorelli's in Charlotte street
Caldesi in Marylebone lane
Rosmarino in Blenheim Terrace
Other than Italian restaurants Mash in Grt Portland st is very good as is The Providores in Marylebone high st & if you want some really good up market food Orrery in Marylebone High st is the best restaurant in that area.

Interesting post... at least I have some ideas where NOT to go.
~k

We weren't impressed with Cafe Uno (however it is spelled), but we did enjoy Balans in Kensington not too far from Holland Park. The food was good for the price (inexpensive for London). We ate there twice and enjoyed both meals.

The little cafe in the basement of St. Martin in the Fields is a lot of fun for lunch, and the Orangery at Kensington Palace is an inexpensive tea that is casual enough for most Americans.

There's a neat cafe in the basement of the Courtauld Gallery. It looks pretty chintzy but the food is very good and it is very reasonable. It's fun to watch kids play in the fountain on warm days too.
((@))