coloradoteen

My counsin and I, both 18 years old, have found a company that leases cars to teens for extended stays in Europe. Do you have any suggestions or comments?

elina

No suggestions but a comment. I would be very suspicious of such a company. What does the company's insurance cover? This is the first time I have heard of any company in Europe (or US for that matter) that rents cars to people under 24.

And what does extended stay mean? Does it mean studying in the country? A temporary residence permit?

Alec

Most leasing deals like Renault Eurodrive program has a minimum age of 18. It's quite legit and above board. But I wouldn't be too happy about 18 year-olds with little driving experience on a freewheeling tour of Europe. It's stressful enough for experienced drivers to cope with different driving habit and foreign signs, and in some countries locals drive more aggressively than what your cousins are used to. Speeds of over 100-120 mph are quite common on autoroutes or autobahn, legal or not, and it's so tempting for them to push their car, with disastrous consequences. With liberal drinking laws compared to US, it can be a lethal cocktail. I'd be much happier with a rail pass.

rex

And its-cars-hotels.com will rent to 21 year olds (not all models) in many countriers - - not 24.

I think it is wrong to think that 18 year olds can be enlisted to drive in much more dangerous conditionsin Iraq - - but should be discouraged from learning to drive, responsibly, in Europe.

Best wishes,

Rex

Patrick

What a great point, Rex! Yea, an 18 year old can drive a tank through mine fields, but shouldn't be allowed on the byways of Provence?

StCirq

I think those 18-year-olds driving tanks in Iraq have been through some fairly rigorous training - not so an American 18-year-old who finds himself on the Autobahn. I agree with Alec. For a first trip to Europe, I'd buy a Railpass.

jelzie

Hello,

I'm a travel agent, have lived in Europe as a child, a teenager and adult and go back as often as I can. Personally, I use the train, whether it is going into town from the suburbs or going between countries. The trains work very well, affordable and are generally on-time. The Europeans prefer them over cars. If bikes aren't possible, trains are a very good option. The driving in Europe is different than in the U.S., and even though I drive in rush hour in Seattle, I wouldn't drive in Europe if I absolutely don't have to drive. Go with the Railpass!

Please feel free to e-mail me if you have any questions!

Best Regards,
Julia

rex

<<those 18-year-olds driving tanks in Iraq have been through some fairly rigorous training - not so an American 18-year-old who finds himself on the Autobahn>>

First - - how do you know that these 18 yar olds have not been rigorously trained to drive responsibly?

Second - - what rigorous training have 35 year olds had - - other than self-training - - that an 18 year old cannot give him/herself, if s/he wants to acquire these skills?

The question was about the _company_ - - the questioner presumably _wants_ to do this. We should encourage the best way a person _wants_ to travel, not assume that "we" know what is best for that traveler.

See Neal Sanders' essay today.

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34484365

StCirq

Well, Rex, didn't "we" just this very morning practically insist that someone fly rather than take a train trip - hmmmmm??

No 18-year-old I've ever met has been rigorously trained to drive into Rome or drive 100mph on the Autobahn.

Are you suggesting that these two go out and get special driving lessons? No, I think you're just expressing your dislike of train travel again.

Patrick

Methinks, St. Cirq is right. And while I was amused by the startling reality of Rex's initial comment, I really do agree that a train pass is much more sensible for a couple of 18 year olds in Europe.

And yes, St. Cirq, it is always VERY clear that Rex simply does not like train travel.

rex

<<No, I think you're just expressing your dislike of train travel again.>>

No. I am supporting what they want to do. I consistently DO support the use of train travel - - including from Rome to Venice - - when the circumstances so indicate (which is most of the time, unless you are already AT the airport).

<<No 18-year-old I've ever met has been rigorously trained to drive into Rome or drive 100mph on the Autobahn.>>

There well could be, and there are... 18 year olds who have driven in traffic in New York, Boston and Philadelphia and can LEARN to drive in Rome. It's like implying that a 35 year old can learn to speak a second language, but an 18 year old cannot? Quite the opposite, actually.

And how does ANYone learn to drive correctly on the autobahn? I have consistently recommended - - it takes you several hours, and preferably several days before you drive over 140 kph. Work up to it.

I really and sincerely cannot understand why these young people are to be discouraged. 18 year olds drive bulldozers and forklifts. Are we to encourage then not to operate anything more complicated than an ice cream scoop at Baskin Robbins if they choose to be gainfully employed? Until what age?

I still have my "Let's Go Europe" from 1969; it is filled with ads stuck between pages all throughout the book for "Lease a car for a dollar a day!" - - this was no joke (four people in a car for 90 days for $360). Was Bill Clinton's generation somehow more responsible than today's 18 year olds?

Did a whole city full of baby boomers die on Europe's autobahns that I don't know about?

Mamma_Love

I noticed on your original post that you will be in Europe for 12-15 days. Leases tend to be for extended periods of time. Will you be extending the length of your trip so that you are able to take advantage of the lease option?

I noticed on Autoeurope.com that there is a Peugot (I'm sure I spelled that wrong) buy back program and that you are indeed eligible (minimum age is 18 years old), but that the term is for at least 17 days.

Also, and I don't know which post now, you will not be wanting the car in Paris, you will have to extend your trip even longer to meet the 17 day minimum. Unless of course, the company you are thinking of has different terms.

Just some food for thought.

StCirq

I can think of a dozen reasons off the top of my head why these two would be better off taking trains rather than leasing a car besides the one involving their driving skills. Just a couple:

1. Do they speak/read other languages? Do you think they'll hit the books before the trip so they know what Ausfahrt or Chaussée Déformé means?

2. I had a minor accident in Germany when I was about 26. The other driver insisted it was my fault, which it was not, and I got hauled to a police station and questioned extensively before having to pay a small fine and fill out a LOT of forms in German. Thankfully, I'd studied German for quite a few years, but it was a very scary experience.

3. Whether or not you've been "rigorously trained" for those European driving experiences, they are really different from American driving, and NOT relaxing. Trains, on the other hand, are very relaxing - leave the driving to someone else.

4. You don't meet people in a car. If you're 18, you do on trains.

5. It's probably cheaper.

6. The parental anxiety factor will drop considerably - unless of course the parent is Rex.

I can't figure out how long this trip is - one post mentions "extended stay," and another says 12-15 days, but no one can lease a car for fewer than 17 days as far as I know.

rex

Okay, so now I have all three threads (I just read the one with itinerary info, last unfortunately) - - so I may have to eat my words plenty.

But before any of us goes any further - - what company did you find - - and what is their miinimum lease period?

We might ALL learn something.

Even so, the plan might need some advice that runs contrary to what you want to hear - - depending on the itinerary and your proposed timetable.

jamikins

I cant really understand why you would want to drive in Europe. The trains are so much more convenient, Europe is not like North America. The pain in the butt factor, not to mention cost of the car would completely deter me from renting one when I was 18 when I could take the train:

Reasons not to drive:
Cost of rental, toll hwys, petrol, insurance
Age factor
Crazy CRAZY European drivers
Not being able to read signs in another language
Parking

Reasons to take the train
Easy, someone else drives
Most trains go from city centre to city centre
Meet people
See scenary
No parking
No extra costs, just the ticket

These are just off the top of my head.

AAFrequentFlyer

Rex,

I agree with you on many issues, but you are way off on this one. Why do you think 18 year old's insurance is soooo high regardless wHere s/he drives?

Experience.....

It's a proven fact that 18 year olds will have more accidents than let's say a 40 year old dad or mom. It's just a fact of life. I'm not an insurance man but I bet if we had one on this forum the statistics posted woukd be overwhelming in favor of 18 year olds to not drive at all, ANYWHERE.

The argument that we put an 18 year old in the driver seat of a multi million dollar tank in a very dangerous situation is way off base. First, I doubt very much that an 18 year old is driving a tank. I don't know for a fact, so I may be wrong, but I would assume that by the time a tank driver is certified and combat ready, he is probably closer to 20. I was never a military person, but I know some people that were and as a matter of fact one was a tank driver in Germany. Judging from his experience, and again somebody could prove me wrong, but the training was constant and rigorous. Their lives became all about driving that tank and everything that went with it. Army also insisted on maturity, responsibility to your unit and art of survival.
Show me one driving school in US or for that matter any western or any country country where a teenager has to go through 2 years of driving lessons, learning discipline, resposibility training before s/he gets a license?
I hope you don't pull any statistic about teenagers dying behind a wheel of a Chevy or a tank, because even if we threw in WW1 and WW2 and Korea and Vietnam and both Gulf wars and every other conflict in the 20th century, the car is a proven performer in taking more of our young lives than any tank or war.

Patrick

Now I'm really confused. This original post used the term "extended stays in Paris". Now someone mentions 12 to 15 days. Are we now to assume that by extended stay they meant more than a week? I can't imagine an "extended stay" being anything less than at least a month -- probably more.

nytraveler

europe is no place for anyone to learn to drive - especailly an 18-year old. On the ohter hand, I do agree that 18-year ols shouldn;t be penalized just for their age. It;s really experience that makes the ability to cope with new driving situations. So perhaps the 18 year-olds could take a lenghty, intensive driving course - to learn to really drive properly (not just manage to maneuver down empty superhighways and suburban malls without hitting anything) in all sorts of conditions before heading out to Europe. (After I had had my license for several years and could "drive" I had a boyfriend who had been trained as a race driver teach me to "really drive" - it's amazing how much difference the proper techniques and instrucitons can make.)

rex

For what it's worth, I just said "drive in Iraq"... I didn't say anything about a tank. Patrick took my examplwe that one step further.

I agree that statistically, 18 year olds have more accidents than 40 year olds. But that doesn't mean that 18 year olds who WANT to try to acquire these skills, and want to step up to the plate of responsibility cannot or should not.

I can tell you with complete and utter seriousness that if circumstances were appropriate for an 18 year old daughter of mine to travel with a cousin, and be gone to Europe for a month (our youngest just now turned 20 - - and the circumstances to be gone for a month were NOT appropriate for any of our daughters when they were 18) - - I would have been tickled pink if they had gone to Europe, mastered manual transmission driving and made good use of that time extending their horizons.

If memory serves me correctly, our oldest daughter totally burned up the (manual) transmission of an Acura 5-speed I got for her at age 19, in the first month she was home that summer.

Live and learn.

Four years later, I actually drive that same 5-speed (with five cars to support, and a wedding coming up, I am far from a wealthy Mercedes owner, just in case anyone was wondering!)

She drives an automatic now.

flanneruk

Coloradoteen


"Do you have any suggestions or comments?"

Yes. Ignore all the negative comments above. "Europe is no place to learn to drive" "Europeans prefer trains over cars". Claptrap, every single one. What the **** do they think we do with all those cars we make over here?

Assuming it's legal for you to lease this car, get out and drive.

How on earth do these people think Germans get to drive in Italy? Or Brits drive in countries where they don't always use Roman letters?

Go and do what our youngsters do. Get into a car, drive somewhere you're likely to have a good time. Enjoy yourself. And ignore the old farts.