JUST GOT BACK FROM PARIS
 

Hey Folks: <BR> <BR>I just got back from Paris last night. <BR> <BR>Since it is still so fresh in my mind, I decided to let you know my experiences there. <BR> <BR>1) Go to the Louvre EARLY as soon as it opens. You can walk right up to things like Mona Lisa, Winged Victory without having to worry about waves and waves of tour groups coming through. I feel sorry for Parisians because their wonderful city is so wrought with tourists. How do the Parisians get to enjoy their own city whn everything is so crowded and perverted by this madness? <BR> <BR>2) Bring COMFORTABLE walking shoes. I made the mistake of looking "chic" with leather casuals and my feet are killing me. You will end up walking around the whole damn city and don't worry about looking like a tourist. A lot of Parisians wore gym shoes, too. Just don't look like a slob is all. <BR> <BR>3) Get the museum pass. You save money and time. Period. <BR> <BR>4) The Bastille and the Montmartre were the most fun areas that we saw in Paris. Lots of stuff happening. Cool little neighborhoods to see and tons of shops. <BR> <BR>5) A restaurant called Le Tire-Bouchon on the north end of Rue Mouffetard. The owner, Antoine, is very American-friendly and is a great guy. His prices are way too cheap for the high quality food that he gives you. I'm talking GOOD food. You get a 3-course meal for 55 francs or less. That is an absolute STEAL. <BR> <BR>6) Learn how to say "I'm just looking", which will come in handy in small shops. i'm still not sure what the best way to say it is..."seulement regarder"? <BR> <BR>7) Always be polite and friendly and watch those silly stereotypes of rude and haughty Parisians dissipate into nothing. <BR> <BR>8) The Pantheon can be missed. Versailles was a disappoinment but DO check out Marie Antoinette's hamlet behind Le Petit Trianon. It is absolutely enchanting. <BR> <BR>9) Check out every patisserie, confiserie, and boulangerie you can. Great stuff. <BR> <BR>10) If you need cheap eats, there are creperies all over that will give you a delicious crepe or panini sandwich for like 15 francs. <BR> <BR>11) Check out the catacombs by the Metro stop Denfert-Rochereau. Awesome and gives you a rich sense of history. <BR> <BR>12) Check out the Maiden and Unicorn tapestry exhibit in Musee de Cluny. Makes you think. <BR> <BR>13) Hotel Pascal, which is right next to the wonderful market street of Rue Mouffetard, is a great bargain for only 250 francs for a double WITh shower and bathroom. A little small, but you won't spend a lot of time in your room, trust me. <BR> <BR>14) KEEP your ticket stubs when you ride the RER lines. You need them to get out again. <BR> <BR>15) More later when I think about it. If you have any questions, please e-mail me directly! <BR> <BR>Daniel

Daniel, this is not good enough ! <BR>Sorry but there is all this information,but what did you think.Did you love it? Were you glad you went? Will you go again? I would like to hear some emotion Please. <BR>However the restraunt information was music to my ears.

Hi, Daniel, welcome back! I enjoyed reading your pre-trip postings, with their mix of curiousity, anticipation, apprehension, and a petit soupcon of paranoia. Now that it's over, your elation, and the sense that the trip was rewarding, come through loud & clear. Apparently neither you nor your fiancee (nor your wallets) were spirited off by gypsies, thank goodness. Thank you for the interesting discussions your postings stimulated. I got a lot out of them. Now I'm counting down -- two weeks & two days to takeoff! Glad you enjoyed your trip. Helen

Not so fast, Daniel. Like Helen, I'm on the countdown to holiday (6 weeks), and want to pick, pick, pick your brain. <BR> <BR>Several questions come to my mind right away. What about: <BR> <BR>Transportation to/from CDG? <BR>Day trips; did you take any as planned? <BR>What was the weather like; rainy, gloomy, or just as great as the trip! <BR>Did you stumble on to anything you weren't expecting to find; I'm looking for un-touristy things to see/do. <BR>What didn't you like about Versailles? <BR> <BR>The food tips sound g-r-e-a-t! mmmmmmm can't wait for May 6 to come! When you shake jet-lag, hope you continue with your updates. Welcome home! <BR> <BR>I'm glad the gypsies didn't get your wallet too.

Catherine: <BR> <BR>Sorry about the lack of emotion about my trip. I still feel a little drained from a 4-hour delay last night and getting home at midnight. <BR> <BR>YES, I loved the city. I absolutely loved how much attention and passion is devoted to artistic flair and style. Simple things like street lamps, fences, signs--all done so intricately and, as an artist myself, it was very good to see that commercialism didn't rack the city sterile. Art and culture and still the strongest themes. <BR>I loved how friendly the people were. They actually seemed wanting to speak some English when my French just didn't cut it. Antoine, the owner of Le Tire-Bouchon, is fantastic, and I will recommend him until the day I die. We went back to his restaurant 4 times and we became his "regulars". <BR> <BR>I also feel very artistically inspired. So many people that are so creative. I guess I'm a little overwhelmed by all that I saw, with Notre Dame's windows, the wonderful food, the street artists, the architecture, the museums, the street performers (we were lucky to catch Printemps Des Rues in the Bastille area, where we saw some fantastic bands and street performers). <BR> <BR>As an artist and musician myself, I feel like I have a long way to go. Paris showed me to just get out and do it, and have no fears. There is good art, and there is bad art--but they are all art nonetheless. <BR> <BR>As far as the whole pickpocket/gypsy thing, don't even worry about it. I would just be cautious on a crowded Metro. Only once did someone come up to us and ask for money--but it was just a street beggar. Just put your hand up and say firmly "non". <BR> <BR>Just keep your eyes open. Paris is an intricate tapestry woven from creativity, the old and the new, and cosmopolitan wealth. <BR> <BR>Sincerely, <BR> <BR>Daniel

Kathy: <BR> <BR>To get from CDG to the city, we tok the RER. From the airport you need to take a free bus shuttle to the RER station. It costs 46 Francs one way. KEEP your ticket stub so you can get out. <BR>However, try to pack light. Dragging luggage around is a pain in the ass. Good thing we just brough backpacks. I will never ever pack luggage as long as I live. I don't ever want to be one of those people that lose luggage on a flight or have to lug it around. Backpacks reign supreme. <BR> <BR>We did not go to Chartres as Paris beckoned us too much. We did got to Versailles and the reason it was a disappointment was because the fountains were truned off, the chateau is not completely accessible without being in a tour group, and the Hall of Mirrors was eh just OK. But call me fickle. But the HAMLET behind Le Petit Trianon was terrific. So endearing. <BR> <BR>Cool little neighborhoods I found were in Montmartre, the Marais, and around the Bastille area. Just walk and walk and you will find stuff, I guarantee you. Ile de St. Louis was nice--we found Berthillon and got our socks knocked off by their ice cream. <BR> <BR>Jardin du Luxembourg was also really nice. Great for people watching. I have never seen people so content with sitting around and watching and being watched. It was very nice to see such a busy city able to kick back and relax. It was kinda funny actually. <BR> <BR>Rue Mouffetard--kinda touristy, but a full-blown street market nonetheless. Great area. <BR> <BR>Champs-Elysees was also a disappointment. Not much going on there except crazy crowds and large commercial shopping. <BR> <BR>Pigalle was neat to see because of all the sex shops. More "risque" than the states...but still classier in an odd way. <BR> <BR>NOTRE DAME is the most amazing and formidable cathedral I have ever seen. Scary, foreboding, ominous, and gorgeous. Makes the history of Paris kind of all come together. Makes the new humble and the old proud. Makes the Seine a joy to cross each and every time. <BR> <BR>more later...i'm getting excited again... <BR> <BR>daniel

Thankyou Daniel, Thats much more like it.Sometimes after a trip it takes a while to get your thoughts and ideas in order.I think that you will be thinking and dreaming of Paris for a long time to come.I hope that I will be reading of further impressions as they solidify in your mind. <BR>I like the Panthenon because there is a lot of history connected with it.Clovis king of the Franks was buried there at that site before the Panthenon was ever dreamed of.I am sensitive to atmosphere.The past does leave an energy behind it.Some of the great men of France are buried in the crypt.I love the sense of place more than the actual building. <BR>Daniel I am glad you loved Paris Obviously you are a man with a soul.

Daniel: Welcome back! Really cool to share your travel notes! All of them great pointers, except for.... <BR> <BR>I have to dissent on #8 RE: Pantheon. It is the site of the Foucalt's Pendulum experiment, a fact that a lot of people (with science or engineering background) can find very interesting. Also, it is the final resting place of a lot of France's great minds (Victor Hugo, Pasteur, Braille, The Curie's, etc..) Be honest with you, I see more of a point to go there than to the grave of that Morrison guy. <BR> <BR>

Hey Maira: <BR> <BR>Speaking of the grave of "that Morrison guy", for any of you planning on going to Pere-Lachaise cemetary simply to see Jim's grave, you will be VERY VERY disappointed. It is all cleaned up and there was NO graffiti or even flowers on it. People couldn't even find it because it was so plain. But the cemetary is very neat to see. <BR> <BR>The Pantheon was neat to see the pendulum. But honestly, it should be low on the itinerary's totem pole. Good thing it's on the Carte-Musee. Definitely things like the Louvre, Eiffel, and Montmartre should be given higher priority. But to each his own. <BR> <BR>More about the city: <BR> <BR>Jesus there is a lot of automobile pollution. I couldn't breathe at times. I saw some guys walking around with masks on. <BR> <BR>Yes, I am a man with soul, and Paris definitely woke it up. I was so inspired that I have to run home and grab a paintbrush, pencil, whatever, and unleash all this creative energy. I went to the bookstore during my lunch break today and checked out a book with Picasso's works. He seemed to me to be a man that just did his art and let himself free in it. I wish to follow suit. <BR> <BR>daniel <BR> <BR>

one thing that was cool about versailles was walking down a hallway where you get a chronological sculpture history of french kings and men of power. <BR> <BR>the weather was nice. 50s and 60s. the sun didn't rise until 7-7:30, but didn't set until 19:00. it only rained one afternoon but i think it was freak mishap. you should be ready for rain. we were just lucky. <BR> <BR>boulevard st. germain is kind of a main street parallel to the river and there is lots of activity there. that street is the only place where i was accosted by a "gypsy"--she was a strange lady in gypsy-like garb and tatoos on her FACE. she walked up to me and started to say "s'il vous plait, monsieur, un franc" but i just put my hand up, said "non" firmly, and kept walking. no problemo. it was still weird nonetheless. <BR> <BR>public restrooms are usually pay-to-get-in. my advice is go to some busy restaurants (Berthillon is an easy one) and walk in like you own the place and find the bathroom. especially for women, a lot of the public restrooms were filthy and i'm glad that, as a male, i can just stand. but for women it would suck. <BR> <BR>walk around notre dame and absorb all of its glory. <BR> <BR>see it from up close, from far away, on a sunset, sunrise, and in the night. it is incredible. i hope i took enough pictures. <BR> <BR>try a FOUGASSE sandwich (more like a pocket bread). TASTY. <BR> <BR>and a crepe with Nutella. YUM YUM. <BR> <BR>tried frog legs for the first time. it really does taste JUST like chicken. little tiny chicken legs. <BR> <BR>cuisses a la provencale. tasty but too little meat. <BR> <BR>go to the supermarket and check out the stuff there. you can find crazy snacks and food items for dirt cheap. <BR> <BR>sainte-chapelle and conciergerie were very somber. very rich sense of history and well worth the visit. almost spooky. makes you wonder how life really was back then. <BR> <BR>daniel

Daniel et al, <BR> <BR>What fantastic postings! More than any other discussions on this site, you have all created so much excited for me(esp. Daniel). <BR> <BR>My partner and I are spending May in England with his sister and her family, but for five nights, we're heading for Paris. It's our first trip to Paris, and I if I was excited before (friends are ready to throttle me already) I am completely worked up now. <BR> <BR>I've been using this site to find information about hotels, places to see, blah blah blah, and I'm thrilled to have found these postings. You've captured that extraordinary sensation of being surrounded by art and a culture that values art, and now I don't think I'll be able to sleep for my excitement! (And we don't leave for the UK until May 1, and don't arrive in Paris until May 17!) <BR> <BR>Thank you. I can't wait to read more. <BR> <BR>Dave

Daniel, just like Dave very well pointed out, your postings offer a refreshing perspective; after-trips reflections of a traveller rather than from a tourist. <BR>Oftentimes, people who get advice from this forum let those who offered it wondering how did it go. Thanks for your very kind gesture of sharing in your post-trip excitement. <BR> <BR>So, where are you going next? Want a suggestion?...Prague.

Maira, Dave, et al.: <BR> <BR>Oh ho ho I'm not done yet. Dave, try to contain your excitement because you will undermine the subtle beauty and harmony that exists deep within the soul of Paris. It is a very quiet one and one that can't readily be seen while running around with high energy. it's kind of odd...you almost have to just sit there and let it come to you. Especially in a place like Le Jardin du Luxembourg. <BR> <BR>Or around Notre Dame. <BR> <BR>Maira, my next visit is back to Brazil. I was there in 1997 and it still burns a vivid memory of passion and rythym in my mind, and I need to go back. After that is my fiancee and my honeymoon, which is planned for Spain & Portugal (although Australia still screams out to us...). <BR> <BR>I guess the thing I like most about traveling is learning about ways of life that kind of put things in perspective, and when I get home, some petty things like jobs and cars and whatever don't seem to matter anymore. I mean there are more important things like friends, family, love, art, etc. ya know? <BR> <BR>Dave, I think that you will love the Marais district then. We found a good cheap restaurant there and the activity is definitely at a fun level. Lots of little shope and cool people walking around. Just get lost in it. <BR> <BR>It's still hard to believe that just a week ago I was in Paris. I'm back in Illinois now and it seems so damn bland. But now I have an artistic inspiration and I hope to proliferate more of my creativity in any way I can. <BR> <BR>Paris has shown me that doing things well is the only way to do anything. There was such a flair to service, food presentation...even the pharmacies were tres chic. Unbelievable. <BR> <BR>Daniel <BR> <BR>PS Maira tell me more about Prague.

Daniel ~ Yes, you win Forum honors for the month. What a wonderful trip, and you have made it come alive for all of us who will soon be arriving in Paris. I am taking my mother there for her 80th birthday (her first trip to Europe). I am taking a print-out of your trip and will keep my eyes open for your favorite restaurants. Thanks! <BR>

Daniel, <BR>It sounds like you managed to see everything.I have spent a total of 2 weeks in Paris and have yet to see Napoleons tomb and the Rodin museum.They are the prorities for my trip in May. <BR>What did you not get to see that you wish you had ? <BR>I am guessing that Your favourite sites were Notre Dame and the Picasso museum ? <BR>Did you spend more money than you thought ? <BR>Did you buy any souvineers ? <BR>Did you ever use one of the street toilets ? I never did.They are supposed to be self cleaning.I was thinking about trying to use one this time,Because last time my bladder nearly burst trying to find loo's. <BR>Looking forward to your replys.You are allowed to be unemotinal this time ha ha.

Catherine: <BR> <BR>In an unemotional repsonse to your questions: <BR> <BR>1) I wish that I had gone to some night clubs or bars, but by the end of the day we were so exhausted from walking the whole city that we just cashed in our chips. <BR> <BR>2) I, too, went to the Rodin museum and I saw the thinking man and the gates of hell. very cool. Those are in the outside garden. Inside are smaller works by Rodin. <BR> <BR>3) We spent very little money. I was expecting to go broke from this trip but it was surprisingly inexpensive. There is so much outdoor activity going on. Again, the restaurant Le Tire-Bouchon on north Rue Mouffetard is one of the greatest deals for good food I have ever seen. Three-course meal, with appetizer options such as escargot, and dessert, for at MOST 64 francs for lunch. That's a 3-course meal for only $10-11 USD. But you can always find a good crepe salee or a Panini or whatever, or any number of great restaurants. <BR> <BR>I used one pay toilet in a shopping mall and it was very clean. But every time I walked close to one on the street, it smelled so foul that there was no way I would walk into it. Best bet is going to a crowded restaurant or museum and using it there. <BR> <BR>No souvenirs except wine and food. And a jar of Nutella, a delicious chocolate cream. One little Eiffel Tower for my friend. <BR> <BR>My favorite sites? <BR> <BR>- Jardin du Luxembourg <BR>- the Seine river by Notre Dame <BR>- Montmartre (all over) <BR>- catacombs <BR>- the Louvre (no question this is the best museum ever made--it is in a PALACE for god's sake) <BR>- Rue Mouffetard <BR>- Bastille area (lots of funk) <BR>- can't think any more...too much sensory overload... <BR> <BR>daniel

Without wanting to detract from the ongoing thread, I believe you would particularly enjoy Prague's passionate creativity at all levels; musical, literary, and artistic. During a typical afternoon at the (pedestrian) Charles Bridge, you can witness performances by artists, some of them absolutely outstanding. Prague is a city of stunning and almost magical physical beauty (it survived WWII relatively intact, so it is filled with medieval structures, Gothic spires, baroque facades, etc...). <BR> <BR>Sally started a thread back in September("What took your breath away?") in which she related a very special memory of Charles Bridge. Not much to add to make a point of Prague's beauty.

Something that I would have never guessed about Paris: <BR> <BR>the pollution from cars is so bad that it is hard to breathe sometimes. <BR> <BR>daniel

A note about public bathrooms: Have always found McDonalds a great place for a clean, free bathroom. Nothing else, just the bathroom. And of course, they are all over Paris as well as the rest of Europe.

Daniel: <BR> <BR>Thanks for all your info so fresh from the trip. My Mom and I are going to Paris for the first time in May, I can't wait! We leave the 14th. I also have a question on this site about information, hotel, etc. and have received about 3 replies so far. It is very nice and interesting to have you share all of this, I have received a few trip notes from other folks as well and that is so nice and very helpful when you have never been to a particular city or country before. I am printing out all these informative responses and keeping them in a folder and reading them over and over with my Mom and jotting down certain ideas, restaurants, tips, etc. You certainly told me a lot. <BR>I can't believe you didn't like Versailles though? My Mom is very anxious to see it. Why were you so disappointed? Anyway, thanks again for all the info and if you can think of anything else let me know. I have also mentioned a hotel on the north bank called The Waldorf Madeleine, a 3 1/2 to 4 star, did you happen to see it or know anything about it? It is on Blvd. Malsherbes right across from the Madeleine Church. Thanks again and welcome back! <BR>

I can't answer for Dan, but I was interested to note that he wasn't crazy about Versailles. Until his message, I thought my husband and I were the only two people in the world who didn't love it. We spent the morning in Chartres (which we loved) and drove to Versailles in the afternoon. We wish now we had spent more time in Chartres. There's nothing wrong with Versailles, I just think it has to do with our particular interests. Your admission fee at Versailles only allows you to see a small part of the castle. To see more you must choose one of the guided tours, and we just don't enjoy guided tours in the least, so we didn't want to pay for one. We are very interested in artwork, and while there is some interesting art, it is, for the most part, not as interesting as the art from the period which is now at the Louvre. We found it interesting to walk around the grounds for a while, but that's not the type of thing we enjoy for any great length of time. The one reason we are still glad we went is for the Hall of Mirrors. My husband is an historian and he loved being in the place where so much history was made. To be fair, I've never met anyone else who didn't love Versailles, so chances are that you'll fall into the category of people who do!

Daniel: <BR> <BR>You've created such a dilemma! I'll only be in Paris a short time and originally, had thought Versaille was on my "must see" list. Now that I've read thru this topic, I'm re-evaluating that position. So much to see - so little time!!! <BR>

Hi Daniel, <BR> Thank you for your input about your trip. My friend and I are going to Paris in April and we have been searching everywhere for some information that I think you can give us! We read about the museum pass that you wrote about, and although it does sound like a good deal, we would like to get an idea of exactly which museums are included in the pass. We were just afraid it would not be worth our money if it included museums and monuments that we were not planning on seeing. Could you give us as much of a list as possible? Any information would be appreciated! Thank you!

Arc de Triomphe <BR>Napoleon's Tomb <BR>Musee Art Moderne <BR>Pompidou Centre <BR>Balzac's house <BR>Conciergerie <BR>Delacroix last home & studio <BR>Egouts de Paris (sewers) <BR>Victor Hugo's house <BR>Louvre <BR>Musee Cluny (lady & unicorn tapestries) <BR>Notre Dame <BR>l'Orangerie (Monet waterlillies) <BR>Musee d'Orsay (the best) <BR>Pantheon <BR>Musee Picasso <BR>Musee Rodin <BR>St. Chapelle <BR>Chateau de Chantilly <BR>Fontainebleau <BR>Versailles <BR>Straight off the brochure that comes with the pass. Not even the whole list. If you go to about 4 places, it's paid for.

As for "must sees" and Versailles. I did see it on my first trip more because I was with others who just had to go there. Personally, it was ok, but would not have been high on my list. I won't tell you how many other trips I made to Paris before finally seeing the Louvre. And I was somewhat disappointed when I did go and have never returned. There are just other musuems that I prefer. Probably the thing I enjoy most about Paris which some hint at and few seem to talk about is doing basically nothing more than just sitting outside at a cafe, relaxing, and having something to eat or drink and just absorbing the atmosphere and watching the people go by. Daniel talked about this which was something of a surprise to me especially for someone on his first visit. <BR> <BR>I wouldn't recommend running around crazy, constantly worrying, if you have or will see all the "must sees". Do see whatever it is you feel you must see, but also try to just relax and enjoy the essence of Paris, as Daniel pointed out. Grab a snack and sit in one of the parks. Watch the old men playing boule. Watch the small and sometimes not so small children sailing their toy sailboats. There is so much in Paris and it just can't be done in a one week or two week trip. Sure you can see a lot, but there is always something else to see. Resign to yourself that it will take many, many trips which really isn't such a bad idea.

OK GUYS: <BR> <BR>Let me establish my position on why I did not fully enjoy Versailles. <BR> <BR>1) All of the fountains were empty and turned off. Those must be really beautiful when they are on. The sculpture was amazing in them. <BR> <BR>2) Only a small portion of the chateau can be seen on your own. The rest of it you have to be in a tour group (paying additional money). I hate tour groups and I hate that commercialism limits what we see. I do undertand conservatory reasons though. <BR> <BR>3) More tour groups than I have ever seen in my life. And we got there when it opend, too. <BR> <BR>4) I don't appreciate that time period's rich lavishness of gold and stylized decor. Too much. Puke. <BR> <BR>5) I expected the town to be more rural, but it wasn't. If you are like me, though, DO check out the hamlet behind the petit trianon. It is marvelously charming. <BR> <BR>OK? <BR> <BR>daniel

Well, I just had to chime in too... <BR> <BR>In my never to be humble opinion, Hall of Mirrors and the palace chapel were my favorite parts of Versailles. I agree that I can't say Versailles was my favorite part of our trip, however, the Hall of Mirrors was one of the highlights for me because I had always wanted to see it. <BR> <BR>We leave Sunday with the kids and will definitely take them there. To me, it's a must see just for the history sake, if nothing else. We just won't spend all day there. <BR> <BR>And Daniel, as for your point #4 above, I cannot agree!! This is one of those times when you see just how different people's tastes are and how we have to agree, to disagree. I happen to love that gaudy, gold glitz!! As a matter of fact, I have two large oil paintings hanging in my living room right now(reproductions of famous works) with big huge carved, gold frames on them and a couple of Louis XV reproduction cabinets and bombe chests. I absolutely love them....and you would positively hate them !! :-) <BR> <BR>To each his own. <BR> <BR>Have to agree about Montmartre. That was one of our favorite areas to walk around behind the Moulin Rouge and Sacre Coeur. On rue des Abbesses we found a little bakery with "to die for" chocolate mousse. I plan on going back and having more very soon! <BR> <BR>Have a great day. <BR>

Actually, Daniel, I like your description of the town of Versailles as "rural" (even though you wish it had been more that way). It always amazes me how a town 20 km from Paris can be so provincial and uptight !

Vincent: <BR> <BR>Actually, it's funny that you mentioned the town of Versailles as being uptight--I did find the atmosphere there less open and friendly. And it definitely is NOT rural. The only rural part I saw was the hamlet that I so dearly love. But I wish that it had been more so. Is Chartres in a rural, provincial area? <BR> <BR>Daniel

I agree with some of your opinions regarding Versailles. We drove into the city at the end of a very long day. Lots of traffic!! Searched out the tourist info spot and were treated unbelievably rudely. She said the entire city was sold out! (We think she just wanted to go home at 5:00) Back in the car with no place to stay, we watched all the tour busses leaving Versailles. It didn't look like something we would want to return to! Our stressful day ended wonderfully in a Chateaux recommended by a hotel owner who was booked. From there we took the train into Paris each day. It was great! <BR>