Fodor's Travel Talk Forums - Just back from Provence

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Just back from Provence

Hi, I just got back from a trip to Europe where I spent a few days in Provence (March 25 - March 31). I have a mixed reaction about the region... some of it positive, some of it disappointing. Much of the disappointment is due to the fact that Avignon and Arles were not what I expected them to be like. I expected Avignon and Arles to be very scenic with charm but instead they lacked both and actually had a "run-down" feeling. HOTELS: Avignon: I stayed at the Hotel Danieli. This is a nice 2-star hotel in the center of town. The hotel's lobby and waiting area have a bizarre collection of decorations that is somewhat interesting to view and the rooms are basic and "functional." It's a decent place to stay at. Arles: I stayed at the Hotel Le Calendal which is between the amphitheatre and the ancient theatre. This is officially a 2 star hotel but should be a 3 star hotel. It is terrific. The rooms are charming and there is a wonderful courtyard and garden in which to relax. A few thoughts: 1. Arles and Avignon are both very cramped, little cities that are more urban then rustic. I was surprised at the lack of greenery within the city. What I thought I would find in Arles and Avignon in terms of greenery, I later found in Amboise and the Loire Valley. The sidewalks (especially in Arles) are very narrow and the streets are very dangerous for pedestrains. You have to be very careful. One of the things that I will unfortunately remember the most about Arles and Avignon is the amount of "dog poop" that is in the street. Walking the streets is a hazard because you constantly have to avoid these piles and it is quite disgusting. They really should clean it up because it is quite nasty and dirty. On to happier things. Although, Arles and Avignon were disappointing to me, other cities/sites in Provence were not. The following are all day trips accessible via public transportation. 1. NIMES: this is a great city that has one of the best preserved amphitheatres/colliseusms in the world. I recommend going to the seats in the top ring. I found this amphitheatre to be better then the one in Arles. 2. Orange. This has the best preserved Roman theatre in the world. It is amazing. 3. Pont du Gard has a massive Roman aqueduct that has several levels that you can walk on. There are 2 banks from which you can approach the aqueduct. I recommend using the "right bank" (i think this is what it is referred to as) because it provides a much more "majestic" initial view then the other side. 4. Les Baux is a city built in the mountains with a castle/fort at the top. This is a worthwhile visit. A tour of the castle provides a great view of the surrounding area. In addition, there are life-size models of weapons (e.g. catapults) that were used to lay siege to a castle. Supposedly the sandstone mountains around the castle were images that influenced Dante's Inferno. 5. Carcassone is a walled/fortified city. It is interesting to see although 2.5 hours from Arles via train. 6. Vaison la Romaine has an "old" and a "new" city that makes a good 2nd city to visit during a day trip to Orange. The "old city" has a small fort that you can climb to at the top. Lee

Thanks, Lee, for your trip report and honest reactions, especially to Arles and Avignon. What town or towns would you recommend instead?

Hi Santa, <<What town or towns would you recommend instead>>. If you are going to Provence, I still think that you should go to Avignon and Arles because they are "the most well know cities" in the region. However, this is what I learned from my recent stay. Prior to going, I budgeted 2 days of sight-seeing in Arles and 2 days in Avignon. After visiting the cities, Avignon can be completed in 1/2 a day. As a matter of fact, Rick Steves also says that 1/2 a day is enough for Avignon in his France/Belgium/Netherlands book). I should have listened to him. Arles can be done in 1 day. I highly recommend that you go on a Saturday, when they have their market in the morning. This is the largest market in Provence and is a lot of fun. However, it closes by 12:30. There is also a market on Wednesdays but I didn't go so I don't know how it compares to Saturdays. Also in Arles, there is a "Van Gogh walk" where you can see places that Van Gogh painted from. Get a brochure from the Tourist Information office for a few francs. Just a warning that this walk, especially the walk along the river is full of dog poop. Of course, the amphitheatre/colliseum is a fun visit although I think the one in Orange is better. Also, keep in mind that Arles and Avignon are good places to stay because they provide good access to trains and buses. Try to check bus/train schedules before going if possible because certain cities only have 1 or 2 stops each day via bus/train. Other cities that I recommend visiting are the ones that I listed in my original post. The following was my travel itinerary during my visit which was completed using public transportation. March 25: Arrive in Avignon around lunch time, check into hotel, and head out immediately to see the city. March 26, Go to Pont du Gard and Nimes. March 27, Go to Orange and Vaison de Romaine. March 28, Travel to Arles and check into hotel around 2:00 and head out immediately to see the city. March 29: go to Les Baux March 30: go to Carcassone March 31: spend relaxing day in Arles and go to the Sat market Regards, Lee

I'd judt like to second the strong thumbs up for the <<Theatre Antique>> at Orange. This is frequently used for popular concerts and other entertainment offerings, and it is a most worthwhile visit - - even if you don't think you will be able to understand the singer (comedian, whatever). And let me tell you that walking through the back corridors (to get around to seats on the right hand side) is absolutely pitch black - - the kind of place that sends teenage girls in to near screaming (but all in good fun). Best wishes, Rex

Hi, Lee. Thank you for the trip report. I enjoyed reading it. You mentioned in your original post that what you expected to find in Arles and Avignon in the way of greenery you later found in Amboise and the Loire. I'm curious as to your thoughts about the Loire area since we'll be visiting there in late May for the first time. Also, were you aware of any tourist restrictions due to foot & mouth disease? We hear so much in the U.S. about the devastating spread of the disease in Britain. I'm just curious as to the status in France. Though I suppose tourist movements will be more restricted due to strikes than foot & mouth.

Hi Lee, I have to say a word for Avignon and Arles. I lived in Avignon for a while and have spent a lot of time in Arles. Yes they are cramped towns with small streets and sidewalks. They are both very old cities that are well used and lived in. They both struggle between being picturesque tourist attractions and urban cities with growing populations. Avignon can be gritty in some places but very charming in others. We rent an apartment in Avignon near the Palace and we love to just become part of the neighborhood. I know the feeling of walking and constantly looking down for the dog poop, however, we just returned from a while in Paris and it is just as bad there.

Hi Ess, <<I'm curious as to your thoughts about the Loire area since we'll be visiting there in late May for the first time.>> On this trip, I was unfortunately only able to spend 1 day in Loire Valley. I wish that I could have spent more. For my one day, I first took an early morning train from Paris to Amboise (about 2.5 hours). There is a beautiful river/island that you cross to get to the center of town. Along the water, there is a nice area to walk and beautiful flowers. They also have a terrific Tourist Information office with lots of good info. Amboise's highlights that I saw were a large castle that was quite interesting along with the chateau that Leonardo da Vinci lived in for the last 3 years of his life. In addition to being able to tour through Leonardo's last residence and garden, there is a wonderful exhibit of models of the many inventions that Leonardo designed, many of which were ahead of his time (e.g. car, plane). From Amboise, we took a bus to see the Chenonceau castle, which is regarded by many to be the most beautiful chateau in the Loire Valley. This chateau is built across a river and absolutely gorgeous. It is important to note that there is only 1 bus daily from Amboise to Chenonceau. The pick is at approximately 10:50am with drop off at Chenonceau at approx 11:10 and then the return pickup to Amboise is at 12:35pm. This means that there is only a very small window to see the castle for those who are traveling by bus from Amboise. Other option to get there is to take a train from Tours, but I don't know the schedule. While in Amboise, I bought a book "Chateau of the Loire." It is clear from this book that there are many beautiful chateaus to visit in the area. One particular chateau described in the book that I did not get to see but seems very interesting that you may want to consider is the Chateau at Cheverny. From what I've read, there is still a dog kennel there where 70 hounds are fed daily and also a trophy room with 2000 stag antlers. In addition, people still live on the 3rd floor of the facility. Other than that, I can't tell you much more except that I really enjoyed it, found a good mix of sites and greenery and hope to make it back there in the near future. <<Also, were you aware of any tourist restrictions due to foot & mouth disease?>> I didn't see any restrictions due to foot&mouth. You should be aware that there have been train strikes and slowdowns that are severely impacting train travel. Regards, Lee

Thank you, Lee. I do hope to see a select few chateaux (don't want to burn out on too many), and Chenonceau is high on my list. Your info is helpful, and you're very kind to post it.

Hi Lee-- If you loved the beautiful lush countryside of the Loire Valley, visit the Dordogne on your next trip. It's equally gorgeous country with a more rural character, wonderful rich food, very friendly natives, and exceptional sightseeing. Can you tell that I loved it? I stayed in Sarlat on my visit there.

To Lee--Did you see the Hostellerie Les Frenes or the Cloitre de Louis Hotels. If so, do you have an opinion. Michle