Amanda: <BR> <BR>I finally really focused on this itinerary, and even trying to remember what kind of travels I took more than 20 years ago when I was just starting out to explore Europe and thinking I could country-jump from day to day, I think it's way too ambitious. I understand you want an overview - that's a valid approach to a first trip to Europe - but this is over the top. You're going to be exhausted and overwhelmed. You're not going to come home with the tools you need to plan your NEXT trip (and there will inevitably be one, and one hopes a more in-depth one) because you won't have been anywhere long enough to form an impression, or your impression will be warped because you saw only the tiniest slice of the culture. Practically speaking,you will spend more of your trip packing and unpacking and getting from one place to another than you will spend actually visiting places - that's a bad ratio and one that will inevitably wear you down. It doesn't matter what you eliminate, but personally I'd eliminate 4-5 of your destinations. Then you'll have some time to appreciate what you do see, and have plenty more to go back to. Unless you foresee never getting back to Europe (and even if that's the case, really), pare it down to a manageable number of places. And please be prepared to diverge from your itinerary - one of the wonderful things about travel is being able to react spontaneously to a new situation. You may meet people in Salzburg who invite you to their home or whatever (this sort of thing has happened innumerable times to me on trips and has changed my itinerary - and sometimes my life - considerably), and you may decide to stay there longer. Be flexible. Your departure date and flight time are really the only thing you need to heed. In between, sure, it's impressive that you've developed an itinerary - it shows you care a lot about this trip - but you never know what might happen. Be open to diverging.......

I agree with Art that it would be a wise plan to visit Paris following London, and flying back from Italy. You will save a great deal of time if an open-jaw is possible. I'll add one more vote for dropping destinations. With this schedule you will see mostly the inside of trains with lots of scenery moving at high speeds. It takes times to experience a culture. You'll also want time to sit at a cafe and people-watch without glancing at your watch every few minutes. Stroll through a park and watch the children. Wander through residential areas. Sleep in one morning. Feel a sense of freedom in what you're doing. Think about how many times you will be checking into a new hotel -- how many times you will unpack and repack. With short stops like this you'll barely have time to unpack. That gets tiresome. If you need to wash out your socks, they will never have a chance to dry! I recommend dropping Vienna and Rome, adding some time to Munich and Paris. A lot of your decision depends on what holds the most importance for you. You are certainly taking the trip of a lifetime and I hope you enjoy each and every moment.

Hi Amanda - <BR> <BR>I agree that the itinerary is perhaps a bit ambitious. Some suggestions - take out Brighton completely. You're the one coming all the way from Manitoba - your Sussex relatives can meet up with you in London. Take out the Koblenz/Rhine cruise and go straight to Munich from London - a 9 hour train trip ideally suited to night travel. Getting rid of Brighton and Koblenz alone buys you 5 days to give to Rome, Florence, or Paris. Vienna is one of my favorite cities, but I agree that it's a bit too far east to fit well into your itinerary. Give more time to Salzburg. You will see some really great Alpine scenery on your trip from Salzburg to Venice, so the Interlaken thing can probably go too. And get rid of the Cinque Terre. I also agree that an open jaw into London and out of Paris makes more sense and will probably be cheaper than going all the way back to London for your return flight. So here's my idea - London, Munich (day trip to Neuschwanstein), Salzburg, DAY train to Venice, Venice, Florence, Rome, night train to Paris. I might be tempted to fly home from Rome and save Paris for its own trip later. <BR> <BR>And remember, once you go, you can't stop going back. You'll be back as often as you possibly can.

Great itinerary rob! And others. But where is Amanda? Did she leave already? Or cancel?

Amanda - Rick's advice generally is good advice to follow. I'm sure he mentions the summer crowds in his books. Please remember that virtually everything you want to do or see will take longer due to peak season crowds, i.e., finding a good seat on the train, waiting in line at the museum, finding that comfortable, affordable little hotel, etc. I'm envious, though. All of our recent trips have been off-season (to save $$). I did do a similar version of your trip in 1972, with a Eurail pass. That ride to & from Vienna is long, and you will almost surely be exhausted by day 11 or 12. Regardless, I'll bet you'll have a trip to remember forever.

Amanda: Here is another vote for cutting out a few stops. I would think that you would be exhaused about half way through the trip. I would love to see a lot of the places you are going, but I have learned from experience that you need time to get a feeling for an area. On my first trip to europe I spent three days in Pairs, on my second it spent four days in Paris and last year I spent two weeks in Paris. I would like to have an over view of all the places you are planning on visiting, but add up all the time you will be spending on trains, etc. to see all these places. What percentage of your days will be spent traveling or checking in and out of hotels? I would look at it as simply time management -- If I eliminated two cities and flew back from Paris or another city, how much more time would I actually have to see things. I think I would limit myself to three of four major places to visit and spend more time to really experience the place and avoid the frustration of trying to see to much and having that frustration effect my appreciation the the areas that I do see. I would really like to hear what you actually do. Bon voyage!

Dear Fodorites! <BR>Thanks for all you advice, it did cause me to rethink my itinerary, and cut out a few places. I want this trip to be good, and I realized that I had planned too much. I cut out Munich, Salzburg, Florence and Interlaken. I'm spending more time in Paris, Vienna and less time travelling on the train/checking in and out, etc. Unfortunatley, my plane ticket is bought and I can't do the open jaws thing. Next time for sure. Thanks again for all you advice (and for not being to "harsh":)

Dear Amanda, <BR> Your itinerary sounds a bit optimistic,but you can make 10 trips to Europe & still not do justice to many of the places.I have made a whirlwind Eurail trip in Apr.99 & it was quite comfortable & most memorable.It involved 18 months of research.I am giving you my suggestions considering that you are going for a 15days unlimited travel on Eurail Pass. <BR>Day 8-Koln-Koblenz-Mainz-Frankfurt <BR> Train runs along the Rhine.You can see the same scenery in much lesser time.The free cruize leaves at 9.00 am. <BR>Day 9--Frankfurt-Munich-Romantic Road <BR> including Rothenburg;for the real <BR> taste of Germany.7.00 to 20.00hrs <BR> This also goes toNeutchhwanstien <BR> instead of Munich. <BR>Day 10-Munich-Salzburg7.00-9.00 <BR>Day 11-Salz.-Vienna 6.30-10.30hrs <BR>Day 12-Vienna city-Don't see Scho- <BR> nnbrun if you are going to <BR> Versailles.--Night train - <BR>Day 13-Venice <BR>Day 14-Florence,Pisa(optional) <BR> Reach Rome. <BR>Day 15-Rome <BR>Day 16-Rome-Day trip to Capri. <BR>Day 17-Rome 1/2 day.Proceed to <BR> Milan. <BR>Day 18-Milan-Zurich via Gothard <BR> Pass-Most scenic train jou <BR>Day 19-Zurich-Appenzel-Rhinefalls <BR>Day20Mt.PilatusInterlaken.Cruize <BR> to Spiez-Free on Eurail <BR>Day 21-Lucern & cruize on Lake <BR> Lucern(free)Night train <BR>Day 22-Paris-Versailes,France <BR> Miniature-Siene cruize <BR> (Last day of Rail Pass- <BR> Use to go to Versailes) <BR>Day 23-Paris city-Don't go <BR> inside museums. <BR>Day 24-Paris London. <BR> <BR> I did it in off-season.Consider early bookings for night trains if you are in peak season. <BR> I was 33years then (with o.k.fitness).Also see your fitness level & age. Feel free to ask for any info. <BR>Best of luck.