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markstevens1 Feb 2nd, 2019 02:38 PM

Italy Trip
 
im the more adventurous international traveler, my wife is not. She wants a package tour with everything laid out ahead of time and an organized group tour. She will not listen to my idea of taking trains, renting cars, and wandering about on our own.

so, in an effort to keep her happy, I need to find a package tour. She has never been to Europe or has ever been out of the country. It was a major hurdle for her to get a passport, because she refused to leave the us in the past.

which package tours are good? Rome, Venice, and a couple of other places on a 9-12 day tour. She mentioned Pompeii too.

If anyone went on this this type of vacation, let me know. Which tour company do you advise?

janisj Feb 2nd, 2019 03:59 PM

It mostly depends on your budget. There are lower end, mass market fast paced tours (Globus,Cosmos, Gate1 and such). They are generall much cheaper, but really hectic and large groups

There are 'connoisseur' type tours (like Tauck) which cost much more, are usually smaller groups, include private and special 'cultural experiences', stay in high end /posher hotels in better locations.

There are more mid range like Rick Steves . . .

You get what you pay for.

AJPeabody Feb 2nd, 2019 04:57 PM

Read the itinerary details of any tour very carefully. "See" or "View" means you won't stop. Visit 3 stops on the same day? Good luck with that. "Perhaps" means you are on your own. So does "you can" or "choose." And keep in mind that getting a bus full of tourists into a bus or into a site or out for a bathroom break will always kill 20-40 minutes. Then realize that your included meals will be at the places that can make enough food all at once that is bland enough so that the pickiest tourist will eat it. And you will have great fun in finding someplace to eat for all the meals not included while guaranteeing you will be back at the bus in time. Speaking of the bus, how much are you going to see out a window at 60 mph when you are in the half of the group with an aisle seat? And, above all, if a place has three top sites, be assured you will tour one, get a 5 minute photo stop at one, and drive by the third.

Compromise with the missus. Get a package that gets you air and a hotel and do the rest on your own. If needed, the hotel can fix you up with a city tour any day you want.

markstevens1 Feb 2nd, 2019 05:15 PM

I have to keep wifey happy. She is very stubborn, and not very adventurous.

So the best tours are? Is YMT tours good? Is there another one?

Calabria62 Feb 2nd, 2019 05:16 PM

Just to add a bit to the previous comments....if you do get an air/hotel package, check to make sure that the hotel is in the city center. Sometimes the hotels are on the outskirts.

elberko Feb 2nd, 2019 05:27 PM

I've done 5 Rick Steves tours--they are different than most other companies, and work really well for me. Read this page and see if they appeal:
https://www.ricksteves.com/tours/the...for-your-money

Jean Feb 2nd, 2019 05:56 PM

I think it's unlikely you'll find an organized tour that goes only where you want to go and doesn't include other destinations (probably Florence and/or Tuscany) in 10-12 days. For me, these tours try to do too much in the time available and start each day way too early for my (vacation) tastes. Others like a fast-paced, full-day-all-day-every-day itinerary.

If Venice, Rome and Pompeii are where you want to go, you could fly to Venice and hire a private tour guide for the days you're there, then train to Rome and do the same (including a day trip to Pompeii). See exactly what interests you. If you're interested in museums, you can see (and take your time seeing) them. If you're not interested in museums, you don't have to go to any. Ditto everything else, like churches, famous landmarks, interesting neighborhoods, etc., unlike organized tours that decide what you'll see/do.

Jean Feb 2nd, 2019 06:18 PM

Would a very stubborn person be happy doing exactly (and only) what a tour guide tells her to see/do?

janisj Feb 2nd, 2019 06:48 PM

>>So the best tours are? Is YMT tours good?<<

I had never heard of YMT - (apparently Your Man Tours) - I don't think they are very well known or a major player

>>Is there another one?<<

Oh lots. . . . have you read some of the posts? -At least 5 or 6 very well known companies have been listed. There are also Perillo and others.

You are brand new here so the is a limit to how often you can post . . . so in the time before you can post again tomorrow, why not take a look at the companies already mentioned (Tauck, Rick Steves, Globus, Gate1, Cosmos Perillo, etc.). Cosmos/Globus/Gate1 will be at the cheaper end of the list, Tauck at the top and Perillo/Rick Steves in the middle.

janisj Feb 2nd, 2019 06:54 PM

I meant to ask your ages. That can make a HUGE difference. Many tours do cater mostly to a older demographic. Others will have a wider age range.

Oh -- and jean has a point. If your DW is as 'stubborn' as you say it is very likely she will be at least annoyed having no autonomy at all. That means being told exactly what time the bags have to be in the hall (every morning - usually around 7AM), exactly how long you have for each meal, having next to no time to wander, relax, explore on your own. Being told where to sit on the coach (every day)

bilboburgler Feb 3rd, 2019 01:43 AM

I hesitate to offer advice but I'd like to suggest some questions that might help us help you....

1) Have you ever done a tour in the US? What did she like or dislike about the process?
2) What are your more USA centric holidays like, are stay stationary or do you drive all over, hang out at the beach or visit museums etc, stay in the same state of fly about?
3) Does your wife have a concern about being in a foreign country with languages that she does not understand?

My concerns about using a tour is 1) the hotels never seem to be in the right places, 2) the restaurants all have to be designed for 80 people at a time and 3) you don't really make contact with the locals you live in a sort of USA bubble that exists in a fantasy world.

So, if the issue is fear of languages, then go to London or Dublin, where English is the native main language and she can chat to everyone. If she has never done a tour go on line and look at a USA tour of your own state, (ask her if that tour is a fair measure of her experience). If it is fear of traffic being different, it will be, but if you go on a tour you will end up in it, if you go as a couple then you can use the factastic public transport an avoid it.

As a final thought, if you ever get her to Italy and the cities you have identified, the vast majority of people you will meet will speak Italish English or even very good English. The food will be, just like you get in Italian restaurants in Italy, only it will taste better.

Really finally, i found this https://www.inntravel.co.uk/holidays...-tour-of-italy

Dayle Feb 3rd, 2019 07:25 AM

I will add that my first thought also was that a very stubborn person would find themselves having to give up that stubborness during the first hour of the tour. Having experienced an unreasonably stubborn sister, I have come to recognize that this is actually passive agressive behavior.

If you are willing to travel to her requirements, do a tour, but only after you have researched in detail and she fully understands what a group tour means!

if you do the tour and she has a great time, wonderful! Maybe some doors have been opened. If she comes back saying it was horrible and she will never go again, that can also be good - for you. You can travel solo and really enjoy trips in tue furture!

I sincerely hope you find a good fit and have a good time!


isabel Feb 3rd, 2019 09:07 AM

I think you should consider taking the first trip to Italy solo. It sounds like your wife might not enjoy it however you do it. If you took the first trip by yourself you could 'scope it out', learn the ropes and then take your wife on the next trip - and you could be her guide. A couple of years ago I took a friend to Italy who had zero experience with international travel, but I had been to all the places we went (except a few day trips), had even stayed in the some of the same hotels. I knew the way the pubic transportation worked, where things were, how they were done. She had a great time but we both agreed it was due to my being her 'tour guide'. And I also had a great time, seeing those places through 'fresh eyes' and being her guide.

Take a lot of photos, write everything down, and when you come home give her a 'tour/preview' of what she'll see when you go together.

And while you are on your solo trip she can have a spa weekend or something. And you can bring her presents (jewelry and leather are great gifts from Italy),

StCirq Feb 3rd, 2019 09:12 AM

I think isabel has a good idea. OR book a trip to Italy on your own that roughly mirrors a tour package that your wife thinks she will enjoy. Then, when she goes ape over having to have her suitcase in the lobby of a hotel 10 kms outside of town at 7 am, driving by major sights, and eating lousy food with 60 other people, she can abandon the tour and join you.

lancer11 Feb 3rd, 2019 09:29 AM

Maybe you could find a tour company that does individual itineraries. So you would work with them to come up with an itinerary that fits what you and your wife want to do. However, only you and your wife are on this tour. Have them give you a few hotels in each area to choose from. Tell them you want a central location for sightseeing. The tour company would take care of all your reservations. For example, transfers to and from train stations, airports etc. All your guided tours would be booked. All your transportation would be booked ahead of time. I'm thinking it would be custom or independent travel. It will cost more this way, but all your travel needs would be taken care of and only you and your wife would be on the trip.

Sassafrass Feb 3rd, 2019 02:23 PM

You have already got most advice I would have given and lots I had not thought of.
I will just include a bit from my own experiences. Wish your wife could understand that things can go wrong on a tour just the same as on your own, and when they do, you are in no position to fix them.

Because of circumstances, I have taken three, mostly bus, tours in Italy, France and Spain. While I enjoy almost any travel, I have to tell your wife that bus tours are the worst. Hours of time wasted seeing the country through the windows of a fast moving bus going down the highway is mostly horrible. Worse is being in the bus caught in a traffic jam. Though some do like them, HOHO bus tours through the middle of a city are equally bad.
At least, on a train, you have room to move around. Sometimes you have tables where you can eat, read, play a game, etc., and they are much faster than a bus.
A very big point for your wife: the three places you mention, Rome, Florence, Venice, are connected by very easy, fast trains. They go from city center to city center. Arriving in Venice and stepping out of the Santa Lucia Station to the sight of the Grand Canal right before you is surely a travel highlight.
Another point she might not realize is that DIY travel without a car is possible and easy in Europe, especally Italy, totally unlike the US where travel without a car in most places is actually impossible.

Where do you live? Can you take a short trip by bus so she would get a feeling for what it is like?

Besides just naming a few places, what are your wife's interests? Food, art, architecture, history culture, nature? Would she enjoy some hiking, cooking class, art museums, archeological sites? Perhaps, rather than a tour, you could visit one place with particular interests or experiences in mind: London with theater, museums, planned tours, etc., easier, one hotel, tours booked ahead.

I realize this is not the kind of tour you asked for and many will feel negative about the idea, but your wife might not and it could work for you to start. I still prefer DIY travel, but have done several cruises and enjoyed them a lot more than bus tours. At least you do the traveling at night, not during the day, leaving all the daylight hours for being in places. That is a huge plus! The same as a tour, you have to pick the right cruise line and an itinerary that has long days in port for sightseeing. You can choose to include an extra day or two in interesting places at the beginning and end. The cruise company can arrange that. It costs more than doing it yourself, but they can also arrange tours for each port. You could try it by doing a shorter, cheaper cruise from the US to the Caribbean, Mexico or the Bahamas. Caution, unless your wife is a party girl, don't do Carnival on a first cruise.
Not suggesting this one specifically, just an example of the possibilities.
https://www.vacationstogo.com/fastdeal.cfm?deal=35347

Gwendolynn Feb 3rd, 2019 03:01 PM

Well... I don't know if I'm as stubborn as your wife. My husband always wanted to travel (had done a lot before I entered his life.) He finally persuaded me to take a trip to England. (Same language, etc. etc.) I've been traveling ever since. Became our chief trip planner.

If you feel you have to go the tour route go high end like Tauck. Otherwise you'll just give her ammunition to torpedo future travel.

MaineGG Feb 4th, 2019 08:47 AM

Not sure if the OP is still around, but Cosmos offers À la Carte Tours that include only the basics - Tour Director, Hotel, Breakfast and Transportation from place to place. Optional tours and activities are offered. This kind of tour could be a good compromise between totally planned and organized and totally independent. I have NO experience with Cosmos Tours (or any others) so cannot recommend, but good friends did a Rick Steves "Bed, Breakfast and Bus" tour some years ago and enjoyed a lot of free time to make their own choices for meals and sightseeing. Now those RS tours are designated as "My Way" tours.
https://www.cosmos.com/Vacations/Cosmos-Lite/
https://www.ricksteves.com/tours/italy/my-way-italy

eastenderusvi Feb 4th, 2019 10:01 AM

Mark: I also like to plan out my own vacations, but I have a friend who swears by https://www.europeandestinations.com/You can customize to your needs, pick out hotels, etc.

Rocket79 Feb 4th, 2019 11:44 AM

This sounds right up your alley. Rick Steves' Italy My Way. Small groups, intimate local hotels, days on your own to do as you please. Many of us can vouch for this company.

Edit - I see this has been mentioned already. Do look into it.

markstevens1 Feb 4th, 2019 01:43 PM

Thanks for all the replies!
We have traveled all over the US, with me as the planner. Many trips out west for 11 days or so. We did have a trip to Hawaii and land/sea tour to Alaska which were "group tours" such as Princess. That was good because Princess handled all transportation and resort plus free time to do side trips.

Both of us are around 60 years old and love photography, architecture, museums, history and scenic vistas. I'm not as active as 10 years ago, but have travelled all over the world for work and have freinds all over the planet. Wifey has never travelled outside of the us. She seems to have an unfounded fear of foreign countries because she does not know the language, and imagines that they "all hate Americans" When I return from foreign countries and say it was great, she still has this fear.

I want a tour that has some "free time" to relax. Rick Steves looks good, but no Pompeii. My suggestion was to go a couple of days early and take a train there.

Thanks again!!! Mark

MoBro Feb 4th, 2019 01:56 PM

https://www.costcotravel.com/Vacation-Packages

Take a look at the options via Costco Travel. We bought the simple package for Athens & Santorini, which included a local concierge who meets you in person at the airport, shows you to your hotel transportation, and is available for any questions during your stay. This might provide peace of mind for your wife. The hotels they use are top notch. You could hire a personal guide.

This might be a compromise that would please both of you.

janisj Feb 4th, 2019 02:17 PM

This Rick Steves tour includes Pompeii https://www.ricksteves.com/tours/italy/south-italy

markstevens1 Feb 4th, 2019 04:43 PM

Janis, looking for Rome, Venice, Milan, Pompeii. This tour is just southern Italy.

janisj Feb 4th, 2019 04:46 PM

>>Janis, looking for Rome, Venice, Milan, Pompeii. This tour is just southern Italy.<<

Yes - I know -- you could do the RS tour and add a couple of days each in Venice (no one needs a tour in Venice) and either Florence or Milan after the tour.

erfan77 Feb 4th, 2019 05:53 PM

Italy is a great country in Europe. I have some friends there. But honestly didn't meet them yet. Hoping to meet them in 2020. Waiting for the time to come. LOL!

Jean Feb 4th, 2019 09:12 PM

You're not likely to find a package tour that goes exactly where you want to go and doesn't include places you're not interested in.

If you decide on an organized tour that doesn't include Pompeii, you can book a guided day trip to Pompeii while you're in Rome.

janisj Feb 4th, 2019 09:24 PM

>>You're not likely to find a package tour that goes exactly where you want to go and doesn't include places you're not interested in.<<

In fact, unless you take a on-your-own 'non-tour, you are 100% guaranteed to go places that don't interest you and miss some of your musts.

Yet another reason a tour is not a great fit for a 'stubborn' DW.

greg Feb 4th, 2019 09:42 PM

>>> She seems to have an unfounded fear of foreign countries because she does not know the language, and imagines that they "all hate Americans"
Is this the crux of the matter?
Is it more like believing that a group tour offers a cocooned environment surrounded more by other "English" speaking tourists with minimum exposure to the local people?
I have taken some tours in Europe as a part of a special interest group. In my experience, it is rare that the people's outlook about foreign countries change especially those in your age group and older.

>>> land/sea tour to Alaska which were "group tours" such as Princess. That was good because Princess handled all transportation and resort plus free time to do side trips.
If the first statement the key, then the Princes tour was probably palatable more because most of the time was spent on the ship(cruise?) with other Americans, and someone handling the logistics was a secondary?

Warning about Pompeii. A tour including Pompeii often includes Napoli. I love Napoli for its vitality and heavenly tasting anything southern. However, for many people, especially those who want to stay in a cocooned environment and look at other culture only through a partition, Napoli can be a shock. It can backfire big way and cements her belief about dangerous foreign countries.

If you use a tour group that uses budget hotels capable of housing large groups at same time, they tend to put you up in hotels in blah outskirts away from anything easily reachable. This again can turn her off from foreign travels further.

bilboburgler Feb 4th, 2019 11:41 PM

"Everyone hates Americans" I really don't think this is true. An awful lot of Europeans hate your President and loved your last one. But most Europeans will not bring this up in the first five minutes of a conversation (unless they are taxi drivers) :-) . Interestingly when on the continent I've found some Americans who like to discuss the fact that "everyone hates Americans". I've discussed that with them and the issue is more to do with the fact that a fair few people just don't speak English very well and don't gush and fawn over them (see also tipping which is just another whole culture shock you are in for) and people in service industries are just doing a "job of respect". Don't worry, when some Europeans come to the USA we can be shocked by your "non-payment of staff culture". Rather than going into that here, just search tipping on this site.

I agree with Greg above

Naples is "gritty" there is a fair bit of first world poverty there along with graffiti and rubbish in the streets and the people of Naples are often noisy but then so can be some Americans. Cultures vary around the world

Sassafrass Feb 5th, 2019 07:15 AM

Have a look at Tripmasters. Inc. they allow for adding days, etc. to different places.

I looked at some tours that seemed OK, but costs were extremely high. Do a couple of spread sheets and see how much you can save doing things on your own, as well as doing the things you personally would most enjoy.

Pin down exactly what you would like to see or do with your very, very limited time in each place.
Be very careful of tours that say things like "pass by the beautiful hilltop town of Orvieto." You see it from the bus for a couple of minutes, no feel whatsoever for the town.
Just as bad is one day in Venice with an included morning glass blowing exhibition and no tour of anything like the Doges's Palace or the Basilica.

I sincerely hope you can find a tour that actually works for you, but the suggestion of a week in London first is really good.

Rocket79 Feb 5th, 2019 09:31 AM


Originally Posted by markstevens1 (Post 16867929)
Thanks for all the replies!
We have traveled all over the US, with me as the planner. Many trips out west for 11 days or so. We did have a trip to Hawaii and land/sea tour to Alaska which were "group tours" such as Princess. That was good because Princess handled all transportation and resort plus free time to do side trips.

Both of us are around 60 years old and love photography, architecture, museums, history and scenic vistas. I'm not as active as 10 years ago, but have travelled all over the world for work and have freinds all over the planet. Wifey has never travelled outside of the us. She seems to have an unfounded fear of foreign countries because she does not know the language, and imagines that they "all hate Americans" When I return from foreign countries and say it was great, she still has this fear.

I want a tour that has some "free time" to relax. Rick Steves looks good, but no Pompeii. My suggestion was to go a couple of days early and take a train there.

Thanks again!!! Mark

Mark - If you decide to go this route, and I kind of hope you do, I would tack on a few extra nights in Rome at the end of your tour. Your wife's Europe jitters will have all but vanished, jet lag taken care of while in the hands of capable people, and then on to Pompeii from there if that's your desire. This tour ends in Rome, so that's more sensible, methinks...The great thing is that everything is handled for you, so that's a plus for your wife, and the days you're in the various towns you have to yourselves. You can do photography, go to museums, walk the cobblestones... whatever you feel like doing. The guide is there for you to answer any questions, direct you where you wish to go, and so forth.

I have a friend who travels solo all over the world and he did this tour a long time ago, when it was called BB&B, Bed Bus and Board, or something. He still says it was one of his best trips ever. I am not familiar with other companies, so I can't comment on those. But this is not a guided tour, per se, unlike the company's other tours such as the Southern Italy tour suggested above. You've been given lots of advice here; be sure and tell us what you ultimately decide to do!


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