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-   -   Italy is in total lockdown now (https://www.fodors.com/community/europe/italy-is-in-total-lockdown-now-1678576/)

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bvlenci Apr 12th, 2021 07:11 AM


Originally Posted by europeannovice (Post 17231110)
... I also read that because of certain issues with Astrazeneca the vaccine rollout was halted for a while and now Italy is relying on getting shipments from Johnson and Johnson....

The use of AstraZenaca was halted for a short time in Italy as in other EU countries. It's been resumed and is recommended for people over age 60.

Starting in a week the Johnson and Johnson vaccine is supposed to be offered, to all ages I think.

bvlenci Apr 12th, 2021 07:17 AM


Originally Posted by leonbalmain9167 (Post 17231061)
Thanks for the info, bvl it sounds pretty tough but if it works it will be worth it. Strange to have to go out separately to walk the dog or whatever - what if you cannot physically go out without your carer, for example?

This was the case a year ago. The rules have changed considerably since then, as the various types of risk have been reevaluated.

LucieV Apr 12th, 2021 07:39 AM

bvlenci, I'd be curious as to what you think of this article, which makes the vaccination rollout process sound like it's been something of a disaster. As one who cannot wait to re-visit my beloved Italy, I can't say this gives me much confidence.
https://www.ft.com/content/19cb0b7d-...8-7b39e04e9f93

scrb11 Apr 12th, 2021 11:51 AM

So from TA, Dragi quoted as citing an aspirational date for restarting tourism. Certainly the plan is to have tourism this summer:

https://www.tgcom24.mediaset.it/cron...-202102k.shtml


(Excerpt in Italian)



"Accogliamo tutti i turisti con certificato vaccinale" - Sul versante turismo, il ministro Garavaglia indica il 2 giugno come "giorno zero" per la stagione turistica. "Chissŗ, speriamo anche prima", dichiara Draghi. "Dobbiamo preparare la stagione turistica, non darla per abbandonata. Molti siti sono prenotati ma bisogna fare come gli altri Paesi, dire che siamo pronti ad accogliere tutti i turisti con certificato vaccinale".



(Google translated)



"We welcome all tourists with vaccination certificates" - On the tourism side, Minister Garavaglia indicates June 2 as "zero day" for the tourist season. "Who knows, hopefully even sooner," says Draghi. "We must prepare for the tourist season, not give it up. Many sites are booked but we must do like other countries, say that we are ready to welcome all tourists with vaccination certificates".
They're trying things like having covid-free islands to make tourism possible to those relatively isolated places -- though I wonder given how easy it is to reach these islands like Capri from nearby cities, will that really work?

Campania official said he's going to reserve some vaccines for business owners so that they can reopen business. With Italy locked down, what good would this do? These businesses might not have many customers until the lockdowns are lifted, which won't happen until new infections go way down and vaccinations go way up.


But politicians probably feel pressure to at least have tourists from within the EU this summer, just like last year. Maybe they will require proof of vaccination or recent negative tests. But unless new cases get worse rather than better from now until June, it seems likely Italy will open to some tourists.

LucieV Apr 12th, 2021 03:00 PM


Originally Posted by scrb11 (Post 17231500)
So from TA, Dragi quoted as citing an aspirational date for restarting tourism. Certainly the plan is to have tourism this summer:

https://www.tgcom24.mediaset.it/cron...-202102k.shtml



They're trying things like having covid-free islands to make tourism possible to those relatively isolated places -- though I wonder given how easy it is to reach these islands like Capri from nearby cities, will that really work?

Campania official said he's going to reserve some vaccines for business owners so that they can reopen business. With Italy locked down, what good would this do? These businesses might not have many customers until the lockdowns are lifted, which won't happen until new infections go way down and vaccinations go way up.


But politicians probably feel pressure to at least have tourists from within the EU this summer, just like last year. Maybe they will require proof of vaccination or recent negative tests. But unless new cases get worse rather than better from now until June, it seems likely Italy will open to some tourists.

Maybe Iím missing something, but if the majority of Italians are not vaccinated by, say, June, how can vaccinated tourists feel comfortable amusing themselves?

bilboburgler Apr 13th, 2021 04:55 AM

Lucie, good point of course it is Italy so not only does it matter what the technocrat PM thinks, but all the regional assemblies so if traveling to Italy you will need to think trhough where you transfer, where you get to and how seriously anyone should take the local rules. Sardignia has certainly surprised us all by jumping from white to red while the Palermo district in Sicily did exactly what we expected and faked the figures. I don't expect to get to Italy this year.

Dukey1 Apr 13th, 2021 08:27 AM

I suppose the Arena Di Verona opera festival is purposely waiting until the very last minute, just as it did last year, to decide what to do. The place holds 15,000 people not including the hundreds who might also be on stage and the 100+ orchestra members (depending upon which work is being staged). The venue is, of course, "open air" but the seating is anything but conducive to "distancing" so what to do? The city's accommodations and restaurants make a lot of revenue during the usual 11-12-week "season" and I am sure the pressure to go forward this year has to be tremendous.

bvlenci Apr 14th, 2021 03:04 AM


Originally Posted by bilboburgler (Post 17231697)
Lucie, good point of course it is Italy so not only does it matter what the technocrat PM thinks, but all the regional assemblies so if traveling to Italy you will need to think trhough where you transfer, where you get to and how seriously anyone should take the local rules. Sardignia has certainly surprised us all by jumping from white to red while the Palermo district in Sicily did exactly what we expected and faked the figures. I don't expect to get to Italy this year.

The regional councils don't decide which countries are blocked from arriving in Italy. At the moment, the following countries are blocked: Armenia, Bahrein, Bangladesh, Brasile, Bosnia Erzegovina, Cile, Kuwait, Macedonia del Nord, Moldova, Oman, Panama, Perý, Repubblica Dominicana. (I pasted these from an official page, so the names are in Italian spelling, but I think they're obvious.) These lists are subject to frequent change. Countries like the UK and the US, where it seems that contagion is falling, will probably not be blocked this summer, unless they take a serious turn for the worse, as Sardegna did.

In Sicilia, three people have been arrested and a third (their boss) is under investigation for falsifying data regarding Covid-19 cases. It was more a fudging around the edges than wholesale fabrication; for example, when deaths weren't reported in a timely fashion, they didn't correct the data for the days when the deaths actually occurred, nor did they count them on the day when they were reported. The falsification was discovered by two Sicilian functionaries who were investigating something else. They reported their suspicions to the police, who investigated further and arrested the three people.

Of course, the same thing happened in New York. It's been reported that something similar was going on in Florida, too. But I will refrain from impugning the rectitude of Americans.

LucieV Apr 14th, 2021 06:59 AM

bvlenci, correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that you're an American citizen by birth.
In which case, I'm not quite sure why you are offended by those of us who love Italy and are disappointed that we can't visit until the country gets its s#!t together re: vaccination.

bilboburgler Apr 14th, 2021 07:52 AM

thanks bvlenci good explanation, it continues to be tough all over and I'd like to get to Italy this year. I see we Brits have managed to lose control of our borders again and let the SA variant into London (T&T are trying to hunt the stuff down) but what can you do if the arrival person fails to fill in their forms correctly.... grrrrr. Now the airport is beginning to get concerned at the queues to enter the country. "if you would just make them fill in their forms better"

Until we are all vaccinated I suspect none of us are safe.

scrb11 Apr 14th, 2021 08:29 AM

Read that Italy may try to get some of the Russian vaccine? I think Hungary complained that the Russian vaccine they got isn't the same as the ones Russia touted and had tested. So Russia promptly said Hungary is in breech of contract and must return all the doses shipped to them.

Russian reporting of cases and deaths are highly suspect. They are reputed to have over 400k excess deaths in the past year but have only reported 100k deaths from covid. But they've had a lot of deaths due to pneumonia./:)

I'd hold out for the Pfizer or Moderna.

bilboburgler Apr 14th, 2021 08:34 AM

San Marino https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Marino is supposed to have bought Sputnik. Danes are stopping AZ. Czechs want to buy their AZ off them. I hesitate to provide other information. But it is interesting.

If I was under 30 I'd ask for Pfizer or Moderna, otherwise I'd take AZ.

bvlenci Apr 14th, 2021 10:19 AM


Originally Posted by LucieV (Post 17232130)
bvlenci, correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that you're an American citizen by birth.
In which case, I'm not quite sure why you are offended by those of us who love Italy and are disappointed that we can't visit until the country gets its s#!t together re: vaccination.

I'm confused, Lucie. I don't know what made you think I'm offended be people wanting to visit Italy. In fact I'm hoping my family in the USA can visit me this summer.

Do you have me confused with someone else? In my latest post, I said I thought it likely that Americans and Brits could visit Italy this summer, unless things take a turn for the worse.

I'm not sure which country needs to get their "s#!t" together. Italy is among the more effective countries in the EU for getting jabs into arms. The EU has had a slow start at vaccination due to some early mistakes and to some nonfulfillment of contracts. The purchase and distribution of vaccines is done at the EU level, although a few countries, such as Hungary, have made side deals with other suppliers.

Most European countries have now vaccinated about 13% of their populations, and Italy is slightly ahead of Germany in that regard. Whatever vaccines arrive here are getting quickly injected into arms.

bvlenci Apr 14th, 2021 10:30 AM


Originally Posted by scrb11 (Post 17232159)
Read that Italy may try to get some of the Russian vaccine?

I don't think Italy has any such intention. Matteo Salvini, one of our right-wing politicians, has been pushing the idea, but no one else seems to be saluting that flag.

​​​​

LucieV Apr 14th, 2021 01:07 PM

bvlenci, maybe I'm misinterpreting your comments, but you sound a tad defensive about Italy. I know how bad I felt about living in a country (USA) and a state (California) where COVID cases and rates were some of the worst in the world, especially November-January. But I had no trouble acknowledging what was happening. Nor did I feel the need to slam other countries that were doing better than we were.

bvlenci Apr 14th, 2021 02:42 PM


Originally Posted by LucieV (Post 17232244)
bvlenci, maybe I'm misinterpreting your comments, but you sound a tad defensive about Italy. I know how bad I felt about living in a country (USA) and a state (California) where COVID cases and rates were some of the worst in the world, especially November-January. But I had no trouble acknowledging what was happening. Nor did I feel the need to slam other countries that were doing better than we were.

The only thing that offended me was Bilboburgler's comment, "Palermo district in Sicily did exactly what we expected and faked the figures." I just get a little sick of people assuming that Italians, or Sicilians specifically, are all dyed-in-the-wool crooks. I don't think it was defensive to point out that figure-faking is not a monopoly of the Sicilians. I'm sure there has been a bit of fudging in many places.

zebec Apr 14th, 2021 02:55 PM

We are paying close attention to this thread coz of plans to eventually re-instate cancelled travel plans. Pretty sure that we are not alone in this hope. Stating the obvious I know, but still...
Tryna combine input here with that of a similar thread over on RS.
I am done. The bacio.

scrb11 Apr 14th, 2021 03:05 PM

Do you have a link to that RS thread?

zebec Apr 14th, 2021 03:09 PM

I do not Scrb, but seem to recall that it is (wisely) atop all other posts in his Italy section. No clear patterns have emerged, 'cept that no clear patterns have emerged.
And so ongoing delayed gratification.
I am done. The Matia Bazar.


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