Are you taking the night train to Palermo the day you arrive in Rome??? I would definitely want a night in a hotel in between. Plus, in that case, I would not wait to buy my train tickets until I got to Italy - I would try to buy them from the trenitalia site, although I know people have had difficulty with that. Since you need to be sure of getting a sleeper or couchette, it would be worth checking to see how much AAA would charge.

For October you may be safe waiting to make your hotel reservations until you reach Rome, but I'm not sure why you're doing that. For Europe I like to make my reservations ahead of time (by email or directly through the hotel web sites). True, I need single rooms, which are in short supply, but I put a fair amount of effort into choosing hotels and don't want to get shut out.

"Salerno for 2 nights to tour Pompaii and Paestum" - not on the same day, I hope? I would have thought Pompeii would work better as a day trip from Sorrento or Naples.

I think Pompeii from Salerno makes sense, since it doesn't make sense to stay near the train station in Napoli or deal with it's hassles. This map shows why, I think.

http://goeurope.about.com/cs/italy/l...mpania_map.htm

mhyde,

I agree than an overnight train after an overnight flight sounds grim. Have you checked the cost of simply getting on a plane at FCO for Palermo or Catania? You could pick up the Galleria Borghese on the way back, and other sights.

An overnight ferry even sounds like you'd get a better night's sleep (maybe) but once again, you'll be stuck having to force yourself to stay awake all day. That's a lot of pressure on the body at the beginning of a trip.

mhyde,

Out of burning curiosity, I just checked the costs of one-way flights out of FCO to Palermo for early October. Air One will fly you there for less than $100 per person, and the cost into Palermo on public transport is nominal.

Figuring that you will have to buy two tickets from FCO to Termini, plus two overnight-train tickets to Palermo (and do you need to pay stow your luggage at Termini while you tour Roma?), I find it hard to believe it's all that much cheaper than $100.

And there seem to be a reasonable number of trains - I was thinking that the Circumvesuviana didn't run to Salerno, I didn't realize that Trenitalia trains stopped in Pompeii.

Sorry, to be clear:

The cost from Palermo airport into Palermo central by public transport is nominal.

In sum, you can get from Roma to Palermo for less than $100 if you fly. Even if you want to go into Roma, there are several flights a day, and you could back to FCO and be in Palermo for a good night's sleep the same day.

thursday,

Right! Some trains from Salerno to Pompeii are only 20 minutes.

Boy, you all are teaching me so much! Yes, we planned on taking the over-night train at around 7 pm the day we arrive in Rome. Since there isn't much to see, I thought we could sleep on the train. Need to see the AAA agent again since she didn't say anything about changing trains. (I think I caught her at a bad time). Thanks to all of you, we will only take the train to Palermo so we won't be getting a rail pass. We will take the ferry to Salerno only because we can do Pompaii and herculaneum and Paestum from there. Then we will take the bus down the AC. Ferry to Capri. Ferry back to Naples. Train from Naples to Rome. Hopefully, we will have our last two nights in Rome. It seems as if you all know your way around alot. Will try and make reservations for hotels before we leave. Now, someone mentioned Castellabate di Santa Maria, and it sounds interesting, too. Can we go there from Salerno? Thursdaysd were you traveling alone? Did you feel safe in Italy before joining the tour group for Sicily?

Be sure to ask your travel agent about the possibility of a flight out of FCO.

As for Castellabate di Santa Maria, there is a train station in Agropoli, and from there one takes a bus. It's about 50km south of Salerno.

Given that you are seeing both Paestum and Pompeii from Salerno in the space of two days, you won't really have time.

If I haven't said it already, the stretch of bus between Salerno and the town of Amalfi is relatively flat and unspectacular. If you want to see the famed "Amalfi drive," switch buses in Amalfi to continue to Positano, and ferry from Positano to Capri.

Be aware that in poor seas, some ferries do not run to Capri! There is always a daily service between Capri and Napoli. So if all else fails, you can go from Salerno to Napoli to catch a ferry to Capri.

Your Salerno hotel or the tourist office should be able to advise you on the ground.

mhyde1 - yes, I traveled alone in S. Italy, and in Sicily before and after the tour. The only time I felt a little nervous was in the Spanish Quarter in Naples at dusk, and I think I would have felt fine there if I hadn't been alone. I have done a lot of solo travel in Europe and Asia, and I consider both quite a bit safer than the US. I walk around towns after dark alone without a thought on both continents, whereas I lock my car doors when driving through downtown at home.

Sorry I have been away from the computer for a while. Thursdaysd and zeppole sure do travel a lot and know so much. I haven't been to the AAA agent yet because I will be out-of-town again this week-end to take two grandsons on their first trip to D.C. Then, I can focus on Italy. I checked out four books from the library today to gather info on where to go, etc. There is a music festival in Rome near the time we leave (Festival International di Musicae Arte Sacra) that I would love to see so we will spend the last night in Rome. After reading so much about Sicily, I think we may want to spend 3 nights there. Hope we can "play it by ear" on making hotel reservations since that really forces us to stay on schedule. Thursdaysd you mention a wonderful place on an island off of Sicily, and I cannot find it on the map. Wonder if we should go to Palermo and make our side trips from there? You all have been great.

Thursdaysd. I never did find the hostel in Naples. Any more hints?

mhyde1 - sorry, I thought for sure you were looking for the Bella Capri. I would suggest some research on venere.com and tripadvisor.com, and possibly eurocheapo.com and hostels.com. I can certainly recommend my Palermo B&B - Sky Sleeping.

Not sure what "wonderful place on an island off of Sicily" you're referring to - I stayed in a nice B&B on Favignana, but I certainly wouldn't recommend it for such a short trip - and I suspect the Aeolian Islands would be a better pick. Could you be thinking of Erice? Not an island, although it can look a bit like one poking through the clouds.

Just back from D.C. trip with grandsons. The 4 day trip turned into 5 thanks to US Airways cancelling our flight!We were all ready to come home and had to spend an extra night after we had finished all of our tours. The airlines put us up in a hotel for the night, but it was stressful to have to cancel all of our appointments for the next day. I envy thursdays, zeppole and willit for your knowledge about travels. It seems as if I have so much to learn before going on this trip. My cousin is not really anxious to go, and it is going to be expensive (more than we are used to spending). I have not be able to figure out how to cut costs except on lodging and food. We cannot cut any cost on transportation. I had hoped the rates would be down in Oct., but I haven't found any. I wish I could travel like Thursdays with reservations, etc. Will just have to start back on my readings. I really appreciate your info. Thanks.

"I envy thursdays, zeppole and willit for your knowledge about travels."

No need to envy - It is just an area of the world I know a little about as I have travelled there. If you look up my posts on the e.g Australia board you will see I am more clueless than the majority of people when it comes to new areas.

The important thing is not to get so stressed about a trip as not to enjoy it. I have found Italians in general, and Southern Italians in particular to be among the most helpful and generous people you could hope to meet.

Neopolitans will often go out of there way to help - even if it means running half a block up to a dry cleaners shop to find somebody who spoke English (This happened to me when they failed to understand my phrase book Italian)

"I envy thursdays, zeppole and willit for your knowledge about travels." - well, I'd be a bit lost anywhere south of Mexico! And since I took early retirement I've done a LOT of travel, and practice certainly helps. But not with canceled flights! (I try to plan a buffer around flights these days, but realize that's not so easy when you're working.)

Couple of suggestions for helpful reading - Rick Steves' "Europe through the Back Door" really got me started on budget travel, and Ed Hasbrouck's "Practical Nomad" came in handy when I ventured beyond Europe.

I did notice a warning flag in your last post - if your cousin is reluctant to go you'd really be better off on your own. Also, any particular reason you're not making reservations? In October you'll probably be safe winging it, but for Europe I like to get it sorted beforehand, especially since I need single rooms.

NB - you should be able to get the Amica rate (20% off) on Italian trains provided you don't leave it to the last minute to book your tickets (http://www.trenitalia.it/en/promozio...ffa_amica.html).

mhyde, I don't understand your reluctance to fly from FCO to Palermo. It would be much easier, and quicker, and if it's under $100, it can't be much more expensive (if at all) than an overnight train.

That said, I think your itinerary is way too much moving around. I'm exhausted just reading it! If you fly directly from FCO to Palermo and save all your nights in Rome until the end, that would help. If you take the ferry to Salerno and stay there only 2 nights, I don't see how you will have time for both Pompeii and Paestum. After travel time, you'll have 1-1/2 day or less.

I also agree to skip Sorrento and go directly to Capri. Add the night from Sorrento to Sicily or Rome (even if you've been to Rome a couple of times, trust me, there is much more to see there).

The main thing is, that Sicily is a long way to go for only 3 nights. Assuming 13 nights in Italy, I would do something like this:

Arrive FCO, fly directly to Palermo. Spend 5 nights in Sicily, either all or Palermo or split between 2 places. You've gone a long way to get there and should take advantage of it while you're there. (Naturally, you could spend the whole 2 weeks in Sicily.)

Go to Salerno and stay 3 nights so you have time for both Pompeii & Paestum.

Go to either Naples OR Capri for 2 nights.

Return to Rome for 3 nights.

I realize this cuts out some of the places you wanted, but you just have too much moving around and will have little time in each destination with your current itinerary.

I don't travel far. I live in Italy!

I just looked at some dates in October and Air One from FCO to Palermo is 179€ for two passengers, while an Amica fare for two via overnight train in a two bed compartment is 162€. Time wise, it would seem that the small additional price to pay would be well worth it, but you would also need to factor in that the train fare is also covering one night's lodging which would be an extra expense if flying is preferred over the train.

As for inexpensive lodging in Naples, we stayed in a very nice part of town at the B&B Capella Vecchia 11 (http://www.bednaples.com/eng/beb.htm) for 100€ a night, with private bath. Clean, modern, and safe.

I agree with SusanP. Why not start your trip in Palermo? Ask your travel agent to route you straight through to Palermo with a multi-city ticket...I bet it's the same price as flying to Rome. It might even be cheaper. Spend your 3-5 days there.

Take the ferry or the one-way flight to Naples. Base yourself in Sorrento or Capri. You can see the entire Amalfi Coast by ferry from either one of those places. Spend a few days there. It's easier to see Pompeii from Sorrento.

From there, take the train to Rome for the rest of your trip, and fly home from Rome.

It's really a pretty simple itinerary. You seem to have made it more complicated than it needs to be :)

Forget that overnight train...it's a time waster. You're better off getting to your destination as fast as possible and spending that time enjoying the food, the city and the people.

I don't know why I am having so much "trouble" getting this trip into my mind. Of course, we want to go the cheapest way possible. I am even looking into the possibility of staying in monastery in Palermo--! I am usually much quicker to make all of the arrangements, but I am dragging my feet for some reason. We are going in October because I thought it would be "off-season". When I read about you all, it blows my mind how you stay in such nice places and eat such wonderful foods. I have decided that, from now on, I will take only tours. It is so much easier. But you all are really teaching me so much.