Barbara

Those with better information, please post. Is it safe? Are there widespread riots in Northern England? What is that about?

janis

Not to worry - the problems are not in any areas a tourist will find himself - unless they are VERY, VERY lost. The disturbances are generally in areas where the eqivilent of US skinheads conflict with Asian or Black youths. In areas like Bradford, Oldham, South London.

JOdy

Northern england I'm sure is mosdtly safe, there are scattered instances of racial rioting. I read the London Times daily ( much better than our local paper and even though we also get the NYX I like a different outlook) . Please check it out to keep abreast and to asae some of your worries. <BR> <BR>http://www.thetimes.co.uk/?999

Ben Haines

Fodors <BR> <BR>There aren't widespread riots, but there are riots in different ex-industrial towns and cities about once a fortnight. I live in south London, and we don't have these riots nowadays -- we had them in Brixton 20 years ago. <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR>It may be useful to repeat a note I've just written on Fodors forum <BR>We had the first riots in April, and expect them somewhere in the north every fortnight or so through the summer. The mechanism is simple. In former industrial towns and cities, now with few unskilled jobs to offer, bored children with no training, few interests and little money hang around the streets on warm evenings, and get drunk at weekends. The fascists, the British National Party, declare that they'll hold a parade in a given town or city. Local youngsters and a few adults declare that they will defend their territory from the incursions. The police appear, armoured, and are a target for both sides: the police, too, become violent. The disorder is a good moment for breaking shop windows and thieving. <BR> <BR>The Prime Minister says he's thinking of using water cannon, avoided so far on human rights grounds. <BR> <BR>It is so long ago that York lost her rail repair industry that she now has no young people of this kind, and will be peaceful. Ripon, Skipton, Harrogate, Durham, Lancaster, and Wakefield are similarly unlikely to see trouble. Indeed, as a rule of thumb, the grubbier the town or city the more likely the riots, and the less likely tourists are to be there. <BR> <BR>Please write if I can help further. <BR> <BR>Ben Haines, London <BR> <BR>

Ben Haines

Sorry: I failed to catch your reference to the Bradford area. Thinking of the places and people, I'd say trouble is possible in the following: Leeds, Dewsbury, Huddersfield, Halifax, Barnsley, Sheffield. Not trouble in all at once (!), but one weekend here, one weekend there. A shame, because I've been a tourist in all six places, and all but Barnsley have something interssting to show -- a great town hall, a converted textile mill, a good art gallery. Maybe the water cannon will wotrk a change. <BR> <BR>Ben Haines

jim

Ben - i think you give a slightly loaded answer - to expect rioting every two weeks seems a bit extreme. <BR> <BR>There are problems in areas with regard to poverty, lack of opportunities, ignorance and stirring by right wing groups. All these areas are well off the tourist track.

Sheila

But as political analysis,Ben is spot on. These riots are being orchestrated by the far right, and will occur regularly (strange they're all at weekends?)with the anti-fascists stirring things up with the Asian youths. <BR> <BR>The things jim identifies are what cause the seeds of community violence to take root, but they're being very deliberately sown

Sarah

Problem areas in these cities's especially Bradford are confined to small districts mainly in the cities residential suburbs where there are a large number of Asian Communities. <BR>What it is all about is that during and after the second world war big industrial cities like Bradford didn't have enough men to work in the woollen mills and so they brought in people from abroad, mainly Asia, countries like Pakistan and Indian to work in the mills and keep the industry going. When then the Woollen Industry slumped in the 60's the workers stayed and brought over lots of their families and friends. The numbers have hence grown and now they want to have there own communities, mosques etc and equal rights. Especially 2nd and 3rd generation Asians who were born in the cities and are English citizens and want to exersize these rights. The problem is that they do not want to mix with the white communities, they want to have their own areas, this causes problems with white people who feel that their cities / towns are been taken over. <BR>It is however only a small number of mainly male youths that cause problems and it's mostly territorial. <BR>The areas where the problems occur are not areas that tourists would visit anyway. <BR>Bradford tourist area's e.g. Saltaire, Haworth, Bolton Abbey etc are safe and you will not come across any problems. <BR>Please don't let news reports put you off coming as it is (especially Haworth and Bolton Abbey) a very beautiful part of the country. <BR>The problems that these cities are facing are problems that cities and countries face all over the world as we take in immigrants and travel between these countries is so easy and accessible. <BR>

Ren

<BR>If you're going to northern England, try not to miss the town of Beverley.

Mia

I was in Northern England visiting my aunt in May (we are both Asian), and I experienced no problems at all. She lives in Harrogate, and I visited most of the places Ben Haines mentioned (Skipton, Durham, York, Leeds), and even took a local bus through Bradford...did not feel in the least bit threatened or even uncomfortable. Just exercise normal caution as you would in any new city. <BR> <BR>And as Sarah mentioned, don't miss beautiful Haworth (Bronte country).

Paul

The northern, white prols with roots in Britain of several centuries have been disinherited by the British elite of both parties. Labour, formerly the party of Kier Hardie and other workmen of yore, doesn't care a wink about the common labourers. They are purely a party for the political expression and aggrandisement of left-wing university sorts, most of whom despise the British past. The de-facto destruction of the House of Lords, the future surrender to the European Union and the future abolishment of fox hunting are only three of the ways the Labor elite shows its contempt for its nation's history. The despised white working classes of the north are also to be lobbed on the funeral pyre of English history by the party that was formed a century ago to fight for their intersts, Labour. It is of interest to know that 95 % of the rioters in the northern industrial (or is it post-industrial?) cities are inhabitants of Britain of recent vintage. Most despise English history as much as the Labour elite, only their hatred is inchoate due to their general stupidity. That is why Labour is siding with the Asian rioters and against those Britons who are being rioted against. As for the lame Conservative Party, the average Tory despises the northern white prols as largely unclean and dirty, not fit to clean the shoes of the ladies of the WCs or the south of England small businessman. Then they wonder why they get smashed in elections, the dolts.

neville

Message Paul, <BR>This is a travel forum, not a place for your Fascist rantings

midge

He's an American fascist too. He was very careful to use English spellings but one little "Labor" managed to get overlooked.

Paul

Neville and Midge have proven that they don't understand what the word Fascist means. Probably they are lefties who attended and lapped up the left-wing blatherings of university professors, Neville in the UK and Midge in the USA.

Paul

....a sure sign of someone who is unsure of their intellect is when they don't refute arguments but instead hurl insulting words. Neville and Midge are two of these sorts.

XXXx

I would stay away from Bradford at this time there is great deal of racial tension and rioting going on in that part of England. Try to watch CNN today.

Terry

If one is able to dodge the stones that the Paki savages are tossing about town, where is the best curry restaurant in Bradford?

Tim

The Pakis and Indians are going plain crazy here in Yorkshire. Who let these maggots into our country anyway, lads?

Mike

Even though I object to the tone here, I would say that I liked the Mumtaz Paan House, though many of my friends did not. Unfortunately, I think I recognised it as the restaurant attacked by the BNP the other night. <BR> <BR>For a completely different experience, there are phenomenally cheap curry houses on the street where the working girls hang out, which I think is called Lumm or Lunn Lane. The one I remember (just behave) is called K2, and you'll eat for about a fiver. <BR> <BR>My favourite restaurant in the area is Rascasse in Leeds - "modern English". Go before 7.30 for their bargain menu.

xxxx

I think Terry and Tim need to get a life. Ignorance such as yours is what causes these problems to begin with. I used to enter this site for intelligent discussions on travel, all of a sudden it's become a forum for racism and ignorance. By the way nobody let the British into India and Africa but they still went anyway, other cultures in Britain makes Britain what it is today. <BR>Use your time to read and learn something useful instead of displaying your stupidity for the world to see. Also the immigration department of each country allows people to enter into the country and in some cases live. I feel very sorry for people like you. <BR> <BR>