How many days for Amsterdam and Brussels?
 

We're a couple in our early and mid-70s and we've got about enough pep left for one more trip to Europe (we've been lucky enough to have managed a half dozen over the last 12-13 years--based on the philosophy that we don't necessarily need to leave our very modest savings to our grown children and their children, and that we don't want to be confined to rocking chairs someday wishing that we'd made these trips before it was no longer physically possible to do so).

We've always been convinced that Europeans were much crazier drivers than we so we've always traveled by train and independently (I.e., not with tour groups) and we'll do the same in the Fall with this trip we're planning.

Sorry for this long intro, but both of us have been teachers at various times, so we can't easily resist conditional sentences and "setting the scene."

We plan to travel first to Amsterdam, thence to Brussels, and, finally, by Eurostar from Brussels to London for about ten days before heading home to the west coast (we've taken the Eurostar twice from Paris and it's a pleasant short trip (probably shorter overall than some of the economy airline trips from the Continent to lesser UK airports).

To our question(s). We'd like to plan our number of days to be set aside for Amsterdam and Brussels. We're thinking four or five full days for Amsterdam and we're not necessarily thinking of any day trips from there (is it true that the Anne Frank House is now closed?). We're also thinking of four or five days in Brussels with day trips to Bruges and Ghent. Antwerp seems principally focused on shopping events and we're not so interested in that aspect of our trip (except for perhaps a couple of bottles of Stateside-uncontainable Scotch if a nonstop return Heathrow-home destination works out for us).

We'll appreciate any advice re stay times for Amsterdam and Brussels, while we're checking Rick Steve's, Fodor's and Frommers for appropriate center-of-city accommodations. Maybe that question will be a logical one for a future enquiry here.

Anne Frankhuis is open. You are better off booking your tickets for it online for a timed entry so you do not have to spend hours in the queue. They now accept the Museumkaart, which most of the other major museums also accept, but you still need to book a timed entry with that to avoid queueing. At other museums you can jump the queue with the card.

Be adventurous and travel outside Amsterdam too. There are lots of places you can visit by train for a day trip, or even take a guided bus tour if you don't feel up to sorting it for yourselves. with four, or even better five, full days you can take your time exploring the city, and have time for a trip out too.

I think 4 or 5 days in Brussels would work well. there are many easy day trips including the ones you have identified.
Antwerp is a great destination, too, with much to recommend it beyond shopping.

I wrote a trip report in the fall of 2011 describing what we did which includes things to see in Brussels and Antwerp. We had visited Bruges and Ghent on earlier trips

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...etherlands.cfm

I find Brussels a rather hectic city that is much less enjoyable to stroll around then either Ghent or Antwerp, and I'm not sure why you have the impression it is focused on shopping events, unless you mean the Diamond Market, where I've never been. Antwerp has a spectacular cathedral, a highly atmospheric historic center and port area. It has marvelous restaurants and, best of all, it has jenever -- which if you are looking to buy spirits, this is the stuff to buy. Read up on Belgian jenever, which even in Belgium is not easily found outside of Antwerp.

If you have a long list of museums to see in Brussels, it makes sense to "base" there, but otherwise, you might think about basing elsewhere and visiting Brussels to see the incomparable Grand Place and the incomparable Horta House.

Fairy-tale Brugge is too much of a tourist island for my taste, but many other people love it and don't have my complaints, so you might want to check that out. But Antwerp or Ghent would by my pick for a Belgian base.

Regarding places to stay in Amsterdam, check reviews very carefully for information about interior stairs and elevators. Many of the most "charming" lodgings in Amsterdam are in antique houses with exceptionally narrow, steep, spiral staircases and no elevator. I would give this advice to travelers of any age. I was shocked on my first visit to Amsterdam to be an expensive "canal house" hotel where I had to brace myself with both arms inside the stairwell and feel my way down the steps and thought I was going to break my neck every time! (When I returned to Amsterdam for a visit with my mother, more than a decade older than you, I booked the NH City Centre for its elevator. I liked the hotel, but be sure to ask for a renovated room facing the canals, and there are probably equally good and cheaper options elsewhere).

Although I wouldn't miss eating out in Belgium for all the world, you might look at apartment rentals in Amsterdam, and of course London.

We are attempting, where possible, to minimize train changes, hence selecting Brussels as a second base after our few days in Amsterdam. If we would be satisfied with three full days (excluding arrival and departure days, of course) in Amsterdam, that would would useful in helping us to extend the third journey leg, i.e., our stay in London before heading home to the west coast.

We thought Brussels would principally seve as a base because 1) it's a single stop from Amsterdam and the central station is the Eurostar embarkation station as well. 2) the attraction of being able to take two (Bruges twice?), three or four day trips from Brussels and not be burdened by luggage.

In any event, our stay in Amsterdam would probably be too short for an apartment option. However, in our previous three stays in London, we've happily stayed in flats, each time for a week. There's nothing quite like having a washing/drying machine in one's flat, and being able to enjoy a modest American breakfast with good coffee, toast with authentic British orange marmalade, and a leisure read of The London Times, before starting off on the day's adventures.

Spent 2 weeks in Amsterdam, Brussels, and Bruges in late August/early September. I had been to Amsterdam twice before and was wondering if the week we planned there was too much. Not so--that city has so much to do, the dining and bars are fun, and it's a great base for day trips. Have you been there before? I would recommend a week there. Then a couple of nights in Brussels to see the museums and enjoy the food. If you have a third night, I'd do a day trip to Bruges.

Have a great trip!

I was satisfied with 3-4 days Amsterdam We visited Anne Franj house and several museums and took a trip along the canals and ate well. Brussels held no fascination for us and 1 or 2 days was plenty, Antwerp was a different story.e both loved it and spent too little time there a
for 4 days. Of course I have a fiend whi=o lives ther eand we saw things a regular tourist might miss. 2 days in Brugges was plenty.Wespentagreat deal of time in Belgium discovering the WWI battlfields , Ieper was a special place!

Here is a link to our trip to Amsterdam and Bruges plus Brussels.

http://www.rimerson.com/Netherlands0...erlands09.html

I think three or four nights in Amsterdam is probably plenty. Bruges is wonderful and the Grand Place in Brussels is possibly the best square in Europe.

Roblm,

Thanks for the comprehensive covering of your adventures. We've not yet picked up Rick Steve's 2011 book on Amsterdam, but we will when our new local bookstore opens later this month. I could save a few bucks on Amazon or BN, but I'd like to contribute to keeping one of the smaller local ventures in business. Based on our previous travels, we'll use Rick's book to focus on the best general location for lodging (we don't drive in Europe--that's carrying adventure a bit too far for us older folks), and it's usually around the town center. What has worked well for us is to come up with lodging based on Rick's book, Fodor's and Frommers (which I can get from the library, but won't carry with us), and online reading of the three sites, including recommendations by the sites and by the real travelers like you in the forums. We've been pretty lucky coming up with a consensus for each lodging.

Most dining we figure out for ourselves, but usually will try a couple of others' recommendations.

I will write more tomorrow but is VERY easy to day trip from Antwerp and it is a 2 hour express train ride from Amsterdam.

I have been to Brussels several times and always enjoyed it. As you will be traveling in the Fall there will probably be fewer tourists and tour groups to content with. The Grand Place is not to be missed. If you are there when the city hall is open for a tour, its worth a stop to see the tapestries. There are fine museums, and architecture, the area around the grand sablon and petite sablon are interesting with antique shops and restaurants and parks.

You can take a train from Brussels to Bruges and its well worth a day trip. Another nice day trip is to Ghent, go to Antwerp and visit Ruben's House, the Cathedral and other interesting sites..it certainly isnt all about shopping and fashion.

I was looking forward to Antwerp - including seeing the Mayer Van Der Berg Museum and Ruben's House. At the airport, the customs agent told me about the MAS, which is another really nice museum.

I was only in Brussels for the day - loved their art museum and thought the Grand Place was spectacular. But I can't say I felt like missed anything very major in Brussels being there only one day.

I doubt you will want to visit Brugge twice. You can probably find apartment rentals for 5 nights in Amsterdam if you'd like one.

Do read up more on Antwerp. I can appreciate that staying in Brussels eases your trip to London, but Antwerp is a good transportation base for daytrips and also has a variety of interesting aspects.

It sounds like you are very much looking forward to returning to London and would like to maximize your time there, and therefore minimize your time in the Netherlands and Belgium. Probably key to knowing how much time in Amsterdam would satisfy you is knowing which museums you want to see. If it is not many, you may not regret leaving after a few days. Likewise, if what appeals to you about Beligum is the picturesque towns available by train from Brussels rather than its museums or explorations of its gastronomy, it can be easy to fix on the minimum amount of time to comfortably accomplish the day trips that are of interest to you.

Here's an additional question: As I was making my first sampling of Amsterdam hotels, I noted that, of the first four I checked, none were available on September 11, which may be one of the days on our travels. Is there some significant holiday that might be observed in Amerstam on or around that date?

As for Amsterdam, I looked at the Calendar and didn't see any holidays.. I would probably email a few of the hotels or call them directly and find out if there's a large conference or other event that has the city booked.

And I must correct -goldenautumn-... Jenever is everywhere in Flanders!!! Any of the larger supermarkets have a decent selection of flavors and distilleries. Plus in Bruges there's a Jenerver bar, I think it's next door to Beertjes, and in Ghent is the Dreupolkot...where I'm met follow travellers from all over! And also next door is the Bierhuis!

Being over 70,keep in mind that your train tickets are dirt cheap! 5 euro and change, r/t to just about any city in Belgium! Altho now it might be up to 6 Euro, but what a deal!!!!

Hey friends, let "the locals" inspire you. 50 year a belgian:)) So you like our "jenever" but you do not know where to find it. OK, it is hidden here in the province of Limburg ( Belgium), capital of taste and capital of "jenever",HASSELT. Start at the "Jenever Museum", then go for a jenever palette ( one coffee and 3/4/5 different jenevers); Moreover, staying in Hasselt is very luxury but rather cheap. Do not forget the unique "Bokrijk", 3 km out of town in the nature. Suggestion, combine with city of MAASTRICHT ( province of Limburg, but in the Netherlands).
In Antwerp, you do not drink jenever but "bolleke", great beer,real brand name is "De Koninck". In Brussels ofcourse the "grande Place and the small streets with 100's of restaurants ( take your time to choose).Like Golden Autumn says: Bruges is a pearl but kind of "tourist trap". In Hasselt do not forget to eat "speculoos"; For jenever, taste first the real thing (klare) and then the more recent new flavors like "speculoos-jenever", "redberry-jenever", "green cactus jenever". For me only the real thing, but beware it is "strong stuff". Can only be beaten by the home-made palinka of my friends in Magyarorszag (Hungary).

"We thought Brussels would principally seve as a base because 1) it's a single stop from Amsterdam and the central station is the Eurostar embarkation station as well"

The Eurostar leaves from Brussels south (Midi)- not an area of Brussels where you want to stay. You may just as well stay in Antwerp, and catch a train to Brussels Midi from there. As a base to do daytrips to Brugge, Gent, Antwerpen, it's ok, but I'm not a big fan of Brussels, would not stay there 3 days.

Trains between Amsterdam and Brussels are a bit of a mess at the moment, that should hopefully be sorted out by September. Or you can take the reliable but expensive Thalys.

I don't know of any reason why Amsterdam is so busy in September.

really, dear Mohun, believe me. Comparing to London, Brussels will disappoint you. I was also 5-6 times in London. In 1975,
1977,1983, 1995,2000,... In the earlier days it was more exciting, but Sir Johnson ( am i right ?) spoke the truth: when a man is tired of London, he is tired of live. Brussels ?
Ofcourse grand place and manneken pis, theater Toone , rue de Boucher and other "ruelles"; Then "Atomium", and don't forget Tervuren , museum for Afrika, its Royal parks and grandeur from the past. But you will need a personal taxidriver, since Brussels is not build up like Paris or London, where more tourist attractions are concentrated or viewable from the scenic boat on Seine or Thames:)

As a Belgian I would advice cities like Ghent, Hasselt, Antwerp for Belgium. For the Netherlands: Amsterdam, Leiden, The Hague, Groningen and Maastricht.

>>>There's nothing quite like having a washing/drying machine in one's flat, and being able to enjoy a modest American breakfast with good coffee, toast with authentic British orange marmalade, and a leisure read of The London Times, before starting off on the day's adventures.<<

...sigh. :)

Thanks for all this useful information. I expect that the principal places we'd like to see in Amsterdam will be the Anne Frank House, the Rijksmuseum and the Van Gogh Museum, and perhaps three full days (excluding arrival and departure days) may be sufficient for these. We'll certainly entertain addition suggestions for "must sees" in Amsterdam. As for jenever, we'll certainly sample some (although for "hard liquor" our hearts are in the Highlands and we look forward to sampling at least one or two non-US-available Scotch whiskies in London and environs on the final leg of our trip).

We also look forward to sampling some Belgian beer wherever we end up in that country (we've never tried the imported Belgian brew here in this country (we've heard it's typically fairly sweet, and generally have preferred local ales of which many varieties are supplied by our often excellent microbreweries).

We stayed in Amsterdam 5 nights several years ago, in early June. We LOVED it.

We were at the Hotel Residence le Coin, which does have an elevator. It is in a great central location, very clean and charming and reasonably priced. Note free use of washer and dryer in hotel basement.

Here are my notes:

"Final stop: Amsterdam. Five nights’ stay, first visit for all of us.

LOVED, LOVED, LOVED Amsterdam! You always hear of the Red Light district and the coffee shops and the laissez-faire attitude, but you don’t hear how open and friendly the people are, how lovely the canals and side streets, how wonderfully trendy the restaurants and cafes, how people are out strolling at all hours of the night and you feel safe everywhere. I think I’d expected it to be quaint and charming (which it is), but in a dark wood-paneled cliché way, not in the young and contemporary way it is.

The standard reply we were given in Amsterdam, when we asked for anything, was always “Of course!” How refreshing.

We stayed in a fabulous location, at The Hotel Residence le Coin, which was directly across a small street from the Hotel de l’Europe, down the street from the Hotel Doelan, on Nieuwe Doelenstraat (sp?). A great neighborhood in the heart of old Amsterdam.

The hotel has a lift and A/C, also free use of the hotel’s washing machine and clothes dryer in the basement (which was welcome as we’d been traveling over a week when we arrived there). Each room has a little kitchenette, a nice-sized bath, large rooms with wooden floors and a sitting area. It’s fairly new, so everything sparkles. Very friendly front desk, too.

Two cafes on the same block as the hotel were wonderful: Café Katoen for a university atmosphere, and Café le Jarden, for great table seating on the canal.

Amazing dinners at two restaurants in particular:
“Stout!”, at Haarlemmerstraat 73 (www.restaurantstout.nl). Fabulous ‘foamy asparagus’ soup with shrimp, chateaubriande, fresh fish, dessert course, wine list. Very trendy lighting. Great service. We’d gone to the neighborhood in search of a restaurant called “Lof” which we’d seen written up. We didn’t like its atmosphere, but were lucky that Stout! was just across the street.

Also at “Restaurant Dining Eleven” we had a great dinner. It’s at Reestraat 11. Also trendy and contempory, well-presented and beautifully-served meal.

Another nice dinner at “frenzi”, at Swanenburgwal 232. Very simple and contemporary. We arrived shortly after 10:00p.m., when most restaurants close in Amsterdam, and persuaded the owner to sell us any left-overs they had in the kitchen! They put together a nice Caesar salad with cooked-in-the-shell shrimp and mango. Very nice.

Also a good brunch at a place across the street from frenzi—called “Puccini”. Creative salads and sandwiches. Very nice also.

We took a canal cruise one evening. Toured the Anne Frank Huis and the Van Gogh Museum. Visited the Nieuwe Kerk (sp?) Our teens went to a concert at the Paradiso and loved it.

One afternoon we did the 2:30 “Best of Holland” excursion to Volendam and Marken, with a stop to see wooden clogs made, Gouda cheese created, and to visit windmills. It was by bus, with a boat from Volendam to Marken. A lot of fun. Even our two teens liked it.

Our teens also liked shopping at one street in particular, between our hotel and the museum district. Also a Zara shop there, and many others like it. They thought the selection and prices were better in Amsterdam than what they’d seen in London and Paris even.

A detail about Amsterdam if you go there-- carry enough Euros in cash, because many places won't accept a credit card for a 'small' purchase (i.e. under 25 EU).

The only unpleasantness we encountered in Amsterdam related to cab rides and inconsistent pricing. Especially when our two teens were grossly overcharged cabbing to the hotel from the concert. They were well aware of the route, having walked it already twice, but we'd wanted them to cab home late at night. They knew the cabbie took a very round-about way back in order to over-charge. Also, when we arrived at the taxi sand at Central Station, I was literally swarmed by rather aggressive cabbies and felt uncomfortably jostled by them all.

A great trip all in all. Weather was spotty, with rain showers on and off, but not bad."

Hotel Residence le Coin, if you are interested:

http://www.lecoin.nl/indexEN.html

A thread with lots of suggestions on what beers to try where in Belgium
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...mendations.cfm

All this feedback from both Fodor's and the Rick Steve's forum have been extremely useful, so much so that we've slightly revised our itinerary to select Antwerp instead of Brussels as our Belgian base camp and make just a day trip and the rail journey to the Eurostar embarkation station in the latter city. We still haven't settled on the total and separate days we'll spend in Amsterdam and Antwerp, but we're close on the Amsterdam hotel at least (either four or five nights).

In addition to many (e.g., Rick Steve's says a day and a half is plenty) convincing suggestions that Brussels (given the alternate choices) needs fairly modest attention, a quick review of the maps and the Deutches Bahn website shows that Antwerp provides several opportunities for non-stop (i.e., non-train changing stops) travel from Amsterdam and seems to provide a rail transportation hub with the shortest trips to the other Belgian cities, and plenty of sight-seeing, relative to Brussels.

Brussels gets a bad reputation on this forum. It may not appeal to everyone, but I had a great time in Brussels. I have friends who live there so that may be the difference. I visited the Magritte museum, Museum of Musical instruments, and had a lot of great food. I was based in Brussels and did day trips to Antwerp, Bruges, and Leuven. I would have liked to spend more time in Antwerp.

Amsterdam is lovely. I spent a whole week there in August. It is easy to spent a week there and not run out of things to do. There are additional museums such as Troppen, Artis zoo, and Hermitage satellite in addition to the Van Gogh, Rijksmuseum, and Anne Frank huis.

travelingnomad13,

Based principally on your suggestion and followed with a bit more web reading, we're going to settle on a full five days in Amsterdam (excludes arrival and departure).

Oh, before I forget, for those who travel to Antwerp. For eating out and enjoying good meals at fair prices: let you drive to " 't Zuid" (the South) where many typical resto's and bars are located. Often tourists don't find the large square since it is at the border of the city, 50 meters from the river Schelde, hidden behind the row of buildings along the river. It is very authentic there !! Have a coffee or beer in
"café Congo".