elaine, that's absolutely correct. i know i'm not fooling anyone, but if my suitcase is gone... i'll definitely know what happened!!

Robespierre, how odd that you think it's declasse for MK2 to mention how much cash he carries when just yesterday you posted that you usually carry about "$100 in local" currency. If that's how much cash MK2 carries around, that's how much he carries. Just a matter of degree.
At the Phildelphia ski shop where I worked in my salad days, the owner always carried several hundred $$$, often more, with him everywhere--in his shoes. Not my style, but I bet cash stuffed in the toes of laced up work shoes is even safer than cash in a money belt!

MK2, if you come back to this thread, I'd like to pick your brain a minute...can you recommend a REALLY good dry cleaner in central London. The dry cleaners our here in Maidenhead just aren't that good. My husband has been taking his stuff back and forth to DeGeest in Brussels, which is still the best dry cleaner we've ever found. If you can recommend somebody top quality in Mayfair, Kensington, or Chelsea, we'd appreciate it.

OK, apologies to everyone else for wandering off topic. We'ved use the hotel safes in the Netherlands, Austria, Germany, and France and have never had a problem. The amount of cash we carries varies from almost nothing to several hundred £, depending on circumstances. Today in London, I started with £500 in my purse, but I went out for a nice lunch, stopped at a post office to pay our TV license and another bill, then bought a pair of shoes. So I wasn't "holding" that cash for very long...

We have used hotel safes wherever we have traveled, in the US and in Europe, even an island or two..we have never been robbed.
I carry my passport with me these days since now and then there is something (detax) that requires one and I hate to go back to the hotel to get it.
I only take jewelry that I am wearing, and maybe an extra pair of earrings, they come along with my passport in my wallet.

That's funny - I don't think it "odd" at all. Because one sounds like bragging, and the other doesn't.

2500 euros for a week is roughly 350 euros a day (or 275 euros a day if you take a typical "travel" week starting on a Saturday and finishing at the end of the following weekend).
I didn't realize there was an official "bragging" cutoff that Fodorites must not step over. Enlightenment please. You have decreed that $100 a day is permissible to mention in public. Is it ok to mention 200 euros a day? 201?
Please let us know so we can avoid offending delicate sensibilities in the future ;-)

I personally was not offended, nor shocked, nor surprised by the mention of 2500 euro.

What I was noting, and perhaps this was the case for Robespierre, I wouldn't dare say for sure, that m-k's mention of the 2500 euro was a deliberate and transparent attempt to try to impress, which, imo would be consistent with others of m-k's posts. m-k often drops names, prices, brands, not for the purpose of information but to cultivate a particular image. m-k is not shy about these things, he would not be accused of hiding his light under a bushel.

I find, and I don't think I'm alone in this, that there's a qualitative difference between phrases like "I carry a lot of cash with me", "I bought an expensive item there", "I bought a nice pair of shoes", etc, and phrases like 'I keep 2500 euros in the hotel safe for my week's trip' (2500 per week, apparently important to convey the time frame dare we think that's for a whole month) or
"I bought new shoes and I spent $500 on them", for examples.

Robespierre was expressing an opinion on the mention of prices. So am I.
Others may have different opinions.
No one is suggesting bragging cutoffs, though why brag about high prices paid at all? But why mention 'delicate sensibilities' when no one has expressed offense, but only disagreement.

In the same way that Mr. Justice Stewart couldn't define pornography but knew it when he saw it, I know vulgarity.

I couldn't state it any more eloquently than elaine has.

I suspect that m_kingdom2 is an American who for reasons of his or her own wishes to be thought of as a well-bred English person, but whose use of the language is just maladroit enough to blow the impression. What really blows it, though, is that of all people, the well-bred Englishman is the most likely to see m_k2's tiresomely repetitive references to money and possessions as common and vulgar.

Hello Neil. The well-bred American certainly has the same thoughts.

And please don't blame us in the US for MK2! LOL

In actual fact, all hotel safes cannot
be unlocked by a master key. We used
the safe in our room at the Relais
Bosquet and it locked so thoroughly
the manager had to bring in a locksmith
to dismantle the whole mechanism! It
took him the better part of a morning
to do it, too. The manager said it was
the first time this had happened and
we were inclined to believe her - she
stayed in the room for the operation
and seemed a little perturbed by the
entire experience. Fortunately, we
weren't leaving that day so we could
do without the contents.

Your hotel may not have possessed a 'master' but it is <b>factual</b> that they exist and are a standard feature, very easy to confirm:

<u>http://www.hotelsafes.us/products.htm</u>

Note stated benefit:
Emergency openings by electronic override key, master code, mechanical key


<u>http://www.hotelsafes.net/</u>
Note stated feature for management:
Capable of programming a Hotel Master code.
Capable of programming a Hotel Master card.

My husband was in the business of commercial security, an additional point of reference for me...

Re drycleaners:

I always use Jeeves of Belgraiva (branches dotted around London), partly because their drycleaning is considered to be, and on most occasions is the best, but also because of the service element. They took great care with a couple of garments that I asked not to be pressed (they had ruched detailing that would be ruined by pressing) and returned them perfectly cleansed.

Also, &quot;local&quot; drycleaners in London tend to be pretty good too, but if something does go wrong they're far less likely to reimburse you for the damage.

Conde Nast Traveler's &quot;Ombudsman&quot; article discusses a theft from the room safe at the Ripa Hotel, Rome. Clients stashed passports, jewelry, credit cards and cash in the safe. Later in the day, they couldn't open the safe so an employee opened it with a 'handheld device' in seconds. Clients were missing $500 out of the $2000 left earlier.

New post on Tripadvisor regarding theft from the room safe at Villa Alessandra - $40 taken one day - management said that no one could have used the master key. Client then set up a 'dummy envelope' and that was tampered with 2 days later.
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...de_France.html

Do what you want, but hotel room safes are not secure.

We only once put passports and credit cards in the hotel safe. Now we generally lock up valuables in a bag, placed inside a locked suitcase. If someone wants to steal the whole suitcase from the room, so be it.

The room safes are used for storing food and dirty clothes, not necessarily together.

I guess anything can happen so I just try to use caution and then not worry about it. I don't leave my passport with the hotel desk because I just know myself too well. I would be ready to board the plane going home and guess where my passport would be? Yea...back at the hotel in their safe. I have used the room safe for plane tickets and some jewelry. I don't have anything very expensive..maybe a couple hundred dollars for a bracelet, but I bought it because I liked it and really wouldn't be happy if it was stolen. I never lock my suitcase in the room...like, fine, if they want to go through it, be my guest..if they want it that bad they are just going to take the whole thing anyway, or cut it open, so I don't ever worry about that. I just don't want to be driving myself crazy worrying about this and that. I watch my belongings, have my purse all closed up and in front of me with my arms over it when on the tube or metro, put it at my feet with my foot through the strap at restaurants etc. So far so good.

I keep my passport and my cards (ATM, credit) with me. I figure I can replace anything else. This saves the hassle of trying to suss out the honesty of hotel employees.

i have a friend who always spreads her valuables into different spots- some in safes, some inside shoes in her suitcase, some in her toiletries,some on her, some with a companion etc.; so she will never be out everything of value at the same time. for example, the chances of your safe and your person hit at the same time are practically nil. i don't know if i would ever bother to do it, but it is an idea. she had a bad experieince obviously. i would probably forget where i stashed something! personally we have left things in a free standing safe where we set the code, used the desk safe for passports, used hotel safes where we were given the key to our own box, and left items in locked suitcases. None of these make you feel totally secure, but i liked the box with our own key the best. i do not think that is too common in the small hotels though. i think aftr reading this thread i will always check around the net for any reports of robberies at places i choose to stay at!

Wondering, if you mean a safe box in your room (like in the closet), the management always has a master key or method to open; the safes are manufactured with a master. So taking the key with you is no insurance.

1. Thief wipes the keypad clean.
2. Guest arrives and puts valuables in safe and presses 4 numbers.
3. Guest leaves and thief dusts the keyboard revealing fingerprints on 4 keys, say 1,2,3,4.
4. Thief draws 4 pyramids using those numbers, each pyramid has 6 combinations.
5. Thief crosses each one off as he goes along, somewhere between 1 and 24 he will open your safe :(.

If you code is say 1,*2,*2,4 it will take the thief 36 tries.

Ahhh...If only I could use my criminal genius for the good of mankind!!!
Actually I had no idea on how many tries it would take, I just thought it was a 'whole bunch' :). I posted this question on an egghead math forum (sci.math) ~2.5yrs ago and they give me the answer :).
Around that time there was an Internet rumor going around that this was how thieves were breaking into hotel room safes. As you can see it is fairly simple. Regards, Walter

Their was a suicide bomber in Cairo today. The train was bombed in Spain. Probably at any given time several people are being pick pocketed on the Metro or the Tube and the beat goes on. Anything is possible at any time so you can either stay in bed, drink?..hmmm that could work...or use due diligence and get on with your life. You just can't worry about everything.