shutterbug85

I've been reading through the numerous posts on itineraries, consulting our guidebooks, and perusing the internet in an effort to solidify our itinerary for a two-week trip next April. This could change as we continue learning about the destinations, but I'm looking for some initial thoughts on specific parts. And yes, this is a busy itinerary, but we're comfortable moving around frequently and with the amount of time we've spending in places (except where I have questions). We also are planning to go back to Italy in the future and see the west coast (Pisa, Cinque Terre, up to Milan), so we're thinking we'll have more time in Tuscany in the future

Day 1 (Saturday): Fly into Venice - arrive about noon
Day 2: Venice
Day 3: Venice
Day 4: Venice; evening train to Bologna / Modena
Day 5: Modena / Bologna
Day 6: E-R Food Tour; evening train to Florence
Day 7: Florence
Day 8: Florence
Day 9: Florence (1/2 day wine tour one of the days we're there)
Day 10: Early morning train to Naples (or late train to Naples and more time in Florence?)
Day 11: Pompeii; evening train to Rome
Day 12: Rome
Day 13: Rome
Day 14: Rome
Day 15: Rome
Day 16: Rome & fly home

Question 1: We know we want to do a food tour in Emilia-Romagna. Not sure on if we'd prefer Bologna or Modena. I've read good things about both; sounds like Modena is smaller but has beautiful sites. Any thoughts?

Question 2: Would Siena make a good day trip from Florence? Would the time be better spent with 2.5 days in Florence or take one out for Siena? (Pisa & Lucca we're saving for the next trip.)

Question 3: Still debating on spending most of a full day in Naples. if you've been, did you enjoy it? Or feel the time is better spent with extra time in Florence?

I'm sure I'll come up with more questions as time goes on. Thank you in advance!

ekc

More time in Naples is warranted, especially if you are going to visit Pompeii.

Waldo

One day in Naples is not nearly enough.

kybourbon

I don't think you understand what a hassle some of these late trains might be. You will have to check out of your hotel in the morning and either take your luggage to the train station to store it or see if your hotel will store it (some will, some won't/can't). Either of those options takes up time (trekking over to the train station or trekking back to your hotel).

>>>Question 2: Would Siena make a good day trip from Florence? <<<

Siena is an easy day trip by bus. You catch the Sita bus (near the Florence train station) and it drops you at the edge of the historic center. Take the rapid bus (takes about 75 minutes). Cost is around 8€ one way. I would day trip to Pisa/Lucca (could be done in half a day) and save Siena for a longer stay on the next trip.

Bucket_List

Ciao,

Yes to more time in Naples. We could have spent two days just touring the Spaccanapoli (spine) of Naples. I would be willing to recommend a well qualified tour guide for Naples & Pompeii if you want.

You didn't mention if you made reservations for the sights you want to see online so you don't have to wait in-line when you arrive?

Auguri e buon viaggio!

yorkshire

While I would not venture down to Naples just to visit Pompeii (I'd prefer to stay more regionally focused and avoid all that train travel), one benefit is that you will be visiting in April when it won't be so blazing hot--so if you have your heart set on doing it, that is a plus. You might want to give yourself enough time in Naples to at least see the archaeological museum to see what was removed from Pompeii.
If you decide to leave the south for a later trip, you might instead want to visit Ostia Antica outside of Rome.

PalenQ

For your long-distance trains book early to get deep discounted tickets - some as low as 9 euros regardless of distance - www.trenitalia.com but such tickets - usually much more than 9 euros but way cheaper than walk up fares sell out early so to guarantee them book as soon as they come on the system but you are set in stone as I think those discounted ducats are non-refundable non-changeable though the fare maybe can be applied to a full-fare ticket, not sure but in practice booked in stone.

www.trenitalia.com can be a hassle to use for novices but there are always helpful Fodorites like kybourbon and others who will walk you thru the haze if you post your troubles as they have countless others here IME.

For general stuff about Italian trains check www.seat61.com - goo dinfo on discounted trains; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com.

IMO first class is worth the extra and it comes in discounted tickets too so if not much more go first class - significantly more relaxed though 2nd class is now nice enough for most but those with luggage especially will find easier stowing them IME in first class.

shutterbug85

@kybourbon - We're still feeling out what we'll be doing during each day and whether we're comfortable bringing our luggage with us. We're light packers and use backpacks, and this would not be our first time carrying them around to sights. We might decide to flip it and take early trains out in the morning, but it's the same problem with finding somewhere to store it if the hotel won't before we check in. We'll have to look into the details and figure all that out. Solid advice for those who haven't done it before, though.

Sounds like we'll have to debate between Siena and Pisa/Lucca. Definitely want to see both, just have to figure out logistically which works better for this trip.

Also sounds like we definitely want more time in Naples. I might have us add a night there, then we could in theory take an early train, drop our stuff at the hotel, see Pompeii, then see Naples itself the next day. Or, we could scratch Naples this trip, put more time into Tuscany and/or Emilia-Romagna and save Naples and Pompeii for the next trip. Thoughts on that?

@PalenQ - Thanks for the train advice. I've been using Trenitalia to look up train times and durations so I'm getting more and more familiar. Not too difficult to use as long as you remember to think in military time and use the Italian names of cities! We'll definitely be booking early once our itinerary is solid.

Thanks for the thoughts - any more?

sandralist

It's a real toss up as to whether you'd enjoy Modena or Bologna. In some ways, I enjoy the historic covered market in Modena more than I do Bologna -- but that is because I buy food to cook. If you won't have a kitchen for this portion of your tour, and if you are not having dinner at Osteria Francescana (not recommending it), the edge might go to Bologna, which arguably has more to see and better nightlife. From Bologna you an easily visit the morning covered market in Modena + have lunch at Hosteria Giusti (recommending), or Osteria Francescana (never done it) -- plus see the cathedral and town.

All that said, you didn't mention Ferrari factory tours, but for that you should stay in Modena. (For Ducati tours, Bologna).

sandralist

PS: The problem I see with your Naples/Pompei excursion for 1 night is that if you get a bad spring storm, it could turn out to be pointless -- unless of course you are happy to take in the indoor sights of Naples, which are amazing, and forego Pompei.

But if Pompei is really what is drawing you south of Rome, then do it as a day trip from Rome when you're sure you'll have favorable weather.

sandralist

By the way, I'm often derided as a "contrarian" on these boards, but I live in Italy and I think your plan to take later trains out of cities is spot on. You can easily leave your luggage at the hotel if it is too heavy to carry during the sightseeing day. I do it all the time. Personally I like to catch a train that gets me to my next destination later in the afternoon, so I arrive at my next destination in time for dinner. I also budget for cabs, which really makes it easy to pick up luggage at a hotel (concierge will call a cab) and also to get checked into a hotel upon arrival.

I quickly discovered traveling and living in Italy that it was, for me, a mistake to impose the 9-5 un-Italian mindset onto the reality of the Italian day, which is busy in the morning, and carries on through lunch, but then punks out until about 5 or 6, when it picks up again, carrying on through dinner. If you time your in-transit window to be after lunch/before dinner, I've found I can really do a lot of sightseeing.

PalenQ

Not too difficult to use as long as you remember to think in military time and use the Italian names of cities!>

Yes but the problems come when actually trying to book - sometimes you go into limbo wondering if it has gone through or a myriad of problems - easy to reach but rather fickle to work - contact your credit card issuer that you will be having a charge from Italy coming in so it is not blocked as a security measure.

shutterbug85

sandralist - We're contemplating Osteria Francescana as we're foodies, but not set on it yet. That could make or break the Modena/Bologna decision. Right now I think we're leaning toward Modena for the UNESCO sights, but more reading is needed. The market also sounds intriguing. We're not into cars (well, the husband is not but I like them), so skipping Ferrari/Ducati/etc.

You make an excellent point about the weather. We'll have to factor that in to our plans. Any thoughts on major sights we could wait to buy tickets for until the morning-of?

Thank you for the info on the Italian day. I like the idea of putting our train rides in the afternoon: Would be perfect for a rest for our weary feet and get us into the next location for dinner.

PalenQ - Good point, I haven't tried to buy any tickets yet! I'll be back pleading for help if weird things happen. We have a travel credit card with a chip and pin system, but we'll give them a heads-up just in case.

sandralist

If you decide on eating dinner at Osteria Francescana, you definitely want to stay in Modena. As for it being an UNESCO site, that designation could just as easily go to a dozen towns in Emilia-Romagna (seriously!), including Bologna. Modena was probably just more organized/persistent about politicking for it. If you aren't eating in OF, and prefer to stay in Bologna, you will have an experience of historic substance worthy of a UNESCO designation.

There is a long list of attractions in Florence, Rome and Venice where it is prudent to make reservations, and most guidebooks have that info. In Emilia-Romagna and Naples, I can't think of any, escept resturant reservations.

shutterbug85

Good point, sandralist! So many amazing sights to see.

There were comments about waiting for good weather to see certain sights, but everyone says to buy tickets in advance, so those two ideas seem to conflict. Just curious how crucial it is for advance tickets in April (definitely for the Vatican, but other sights?).

bvlenci

You can see the Vatican Museums on any day, regardless of the weather, so there's no reason not to buy that ticket in advance. I would avoid Saturday, Monday, and Wednesday. The late afternoon may be marginally less crowded than the morning. They also have various early entry options.

http://biglietteriamusei.vatican.va/...?weblang=en&do

The tickets for the Colosseum/Roman Forum/Palatine Hill are not for a specific day or time, so you can buy them in advance and use them on a suitable day. At busy times of the year, there may be a long queue even if you have a ticket, because they limit the number of people inside.

http://www.coopculture.it/en/colosseo-e-shop.cfm

In general, I don't change hotels for a one-night stay, unless it's just to break a longer journey. You could either take a day trip, as Sandra suggests or you could stay two nights, which would give you a choice among three different days for the visit to Pompeii.

I often leave my bags at the hotel after checkout, but if I'm planning to do so, I choose a hotel that's either near the station or near what I'm planning to see on that last day.

kja

"Still debating on spending most of a full day in Naples. if you've been, did you enjoy it? Or feel the time is better spent with extra time in Florence?"

I loved Naples and would happily give it more time than I did -- maybe 4 or 5 days.

I'm glad I didn't have to choose between Naples and Florence (which I gave 6 nights -- and I never made it out of Florence in that time).

sandralist

Aprill can be a fairly busy season for Florence and Rome, so the most famous attractions can have long lines if you don't reserve at least somewhat in advance. Especially true for weekends and the holiday of April 25 (which is particularly observed in Bologna, with concerts and such). Make sure you purchase train tickets in advance if you are traveling around April 25 and it is a 3-day weekend next year.

If you are planning a day trip to Pompei, best to wait to see short-term weathr forecasts before picking which day to do it.