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help with italy
My husband and I are traveling to Rome and Florence at the end of May. We would also like to visit part of Italy that is small, quaint, as well as offers some shopping, great food, and wine. One suggestion was Cinque Terra; the other was Montepulciano. I need to know the difference and the difficulty of getting there. We do not want to do another large city. Any insight to these suggestions would be very helpful.
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Cinque Terre is a string of five fishing villages with not very good wine, and no shopping to speak of.
Montepulciano is probably what you are looking for, although there are about 5,000 other choices that would thrill you as well. If you can be very specific about what kind of shopping you want, what kind of wine you like, and what kind of food you like, people here can probably nail down for you exactly the right Italian town in Tuscany, Lazio or Umbria. |
Cinque Terre in Liguria:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinque_Terre Montepulciano in Tuscany: http://www.montepulciano.com/index.eng.php |
My suggestion would be to go to the library or a bookstore or station yourself at your computer for a few hours and do some basic research about towns in areas of Italy that interest you.
I could name a thousand and one towns that would meet your general expectations. Cinque Terre does not, but all over Italy are towns and villages that fit your description. When you've got a better handle on what appeals to you I'm sure folks here can help you with specifics. |
Here is a more specific description. I love pottery and clothing at reasonable prices. We love all kinds of food, especially pasta. We are fans of red wine. The more I read on the internet the more overwhelmed I become. We have nailed down Rome and Florence; we would just like to spend 1-2 nights in a small place where we can really shop, enjoy a good wine at a reasonable price, and see some beautiful views.
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Small town and shopping don't usually mix. Given the USD/Euro exchange rate clothing shopping and Europe don't really mix period. My European friends flock to US malls or outlets when the visit since prices here are much cheaper for the same items.
For 1-2 nights Montepulciano would fit the bill perfectly. Great wine, many good restaurant options, beautiful views. To enjoy rural Tuscany though one really does need to have a car. The small towns are quite sleepy, especially once the busloads of day tourists leave. If a car is not in the game plan, then there are many other options you can consider. Here are just a few ideas. Siena might be a good choice - it's a bigger town/small city, but much smaller than Florence and a very pedestrian friendly inner city. There's a little more to see in Siena vs smaller towns like Montepulciano. You can also get there by bus quite easily. Something to consider if you don't have a car. I also like Assisi - high up on the hill, two beautiful, historic churches, one right on top of the other. Neither of those will have the concentration of wineries (outside of town) or wine tasting cellars (in town) as Montepulciano & vicinity. Haven't been there, but Lucca is also an option. I'd say leave your shopping to Rome & Florence, and pick a town in Tuscany or Umbria that works for your travel logistics. You have great views, food & wine all over the region - perhaps fly into Rome and out of Pisa or Florence. Cinque Terre isn't convenient at all, especially for 1-2d. I'd rule that out from the get go. |
You would need a car for Montepulciano. Another option where you could train from Florence and then on to Rome is the hilltown of Orvieto. From the train station you take a funicular to reach the town. There are lots of ceramic shops and plenty of clothing stores.
http://www.argoweb.it/orvieto/orvieto.uk.html |
Here's a picture of Orvieto and one of the ceramic shops.
http://www.terragalleria.com/europe/....ital7294.html http://www.terragalleria.com/europe/...ia/umbria.html |
At this point, I think I'm going to scream.
AAAAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHEEEEIEIIEEHEHEIEIIGGGGHHHHHHHHY AH!!!!!! Okay. That felt better. Tnfan, right above Florence (Firenze) is a town called Impruneta. It is the most important maker of terra cotta pottery in the world. The world. You can get there by bus, from Florence. It's true that Orvieto -- famous for its WHITE wine -- famously produces decorated ceramics of a distinctive design. However, before you go there, do take a look at images of Orvieto ceramics, because they are not to everybody's taste. Also, please bear in mind that almost any style of ceramic that is made in Italy, you can buy in Rome and have it shipped. And many are available in Florence as well. If you like to shop, there are some specialty publications available on Amazon called things like "A shopper's guide to Italy (or Florence, Rome, etc)." The hills immediately surrounding Firenze all produce world famous RED wines, in towns like Fiesole, Certaldo, the Chianti area. It is filled with lovely places with lovely views, and you can get there without a car. I think maybe these two websites will help you out. http://www.welcometuscany.it/tuscany/chianti/index.htm http://www.chianticlassico.net/ |
The shopping is best in Rome unless you mean browsing through small shops then I would suggest Montepulciano. As said above, great restaurants, wineries and some small shops with leather goods, Italian ceramics, and paper products. At the Sax Bar, the owner sings opera on request while you enjoy wonderful wines and snacks. At the Cafe Poliziano you can sit on the back veranda and admire gorgeous views while watching the swallows dive. Can you tell Montepulciano is one of my favorite places?
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zeppole - I'm not sure why you would want to scream. As you pointed out about buying ceramics in Rome, you can easily buy any of the Tuscan reds in Orvieto (or Rome). Orvieto doesn't only sell their white wine.
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Ok, I am still confused. I want to go somewhere small and not as tourist driven as Florence and Rome. I want to be able to shop in specialty places, not high end, just local. We love red wine. Someone suggested Sienna but it seems too big. Does anyone know about Lucca?
I don't want it to be too far away from Florence. We will not have a car (at least at this point) so traveling needs to be by train or bus. I don't want to spend the whole vacation moving. Does anyone have any thoughts? The two friends I have love the Cinque Terra, but hiking is not my thing so while it seems beautiful, it seems a little dull |
I did Rome, Florence, Siena and Cinque Terra this summer and I agree, after Rome and Florence it is VERY nice to be in a small town.
Siena was not very crowded during the middle of the week, compared to what I had heard about on weekends. There are some very nice shops there--mostly pottery but clothing also. They are mostly middle to upscale. It's a 2 hour bus ride from Rome and an hour bus ride from Florence. Buses are punctual, clean and ours were not crowded at all. If you decide to do that, you need to get very clear directions on where to catch the bus in Rome and where to get off in Sienna--both confusing and important. I'd be happy to help you with that. We did Cinque Terra at the end of our four Italian cities and I went out on our hotel's balcony over the sea, looked at the beautiful scenery and just melted. I was finally able to just totally relax. We sat out there for hours just soaking it in. We did very little hiking. We bought the all day boat ticket for 12Euros. This allows you to ride the boat, which is pretty much a shuttle boat, from one village to another. They are all similar but different. The Lingurian area of Italy is home to pesto and there's lots of good restaurants. Shopping is pretty spotty. |
So, how much time will you have? Here are some suggestions for you, but if you do want a small quaint village with great vino then you will enjoy it more with a car. Lucca and Siena are too big for what you want. San Quirico or Montepulciano would be good.
BOB the NAVIGATOR’S FAVORITE ITALY ITINERARIES UPDATED AUGUST, 2006 I am now older and hopefully wiser. Here is an updated version of my favorite itineraries & my “Bella Italia” photo gallery. I hope you enjoy. http://www.slowphotos.com/photo/show...y.php?cat=3827 1. BELLA ITALIA: Five destinations in 15 days—car & train travel * Arrive in Milan[MXP] & depart from Venice[VCE]or vice versa. * Itinerary to include the Italian Lakes, Ligurian coast, rural Tuscany, Florence, & Venice. Suggested timing is 3-2-4-2-4. * Option: Drop the coast & rent a villa in Tuscany[ 3-7-2-3]. * Best time to go: May & June or Sept. & Oct. 2. LA DOLCE VITA: Three destinations in 12 to 14 days-car & train * Arrival & departure from Rome[ FCO] or arrival in Naples * Itinerary to include Rome, the Amalfi coast, and Tuscany * Best time to go: Easter to end of October * Option: Fly into Naples & stay at 2 locations on the coast 3. CLASSIC ITALIA: Three destinations in 12 to 14 days-car & train * Arrival & departure from Rome—may start trip in Florence * Destinations to include Florence, Rome & Tuscany/Umbria * Best time to go: Anytime, but May & Oct. are my favorites * Option: Consider a weekly rental in Tuscany/Umbria 4. SICILIAN CHARMS: Five destinations in 15 days—car travel * Connections to Catania & Palermo via Rome or gateway city. * Itinerary to include Taormina, Siracusa, Palermo & more. * Best time to go: March to November—May is best for flowers * See: http://www.slowtrav.com/tr/tripreport.asp?tripid=634 5. THE VILLAGE SAMPLER: My favorite venues for those who enjoy natural beauty and quaint, small villages. Arranged north to south. * Arrive Milan & depart Rome—car travel-- 3 nites per location * Itinerary to include Lago Orta, Castelrotto/ Ortisei[Dolomites], Portovenere[Liguria], Montalcino[Tuscany |
Siena may fit what you're looking for. It's not a small town, but a small town is likely to have less shopping (pottery/ceramics or clothing). It's definitely a quieter place than Florence or Rome. And it's near Chianti and Montepulciano/Montalcino, so you'll definitely see a big variety of great wines from those regions. And it would be easy to get to.
I'm not into shopping at all, but I do remember lots of ceramics shops in Siena. Lucca is a charming little city (without checking, I'd say about the same size as Siena, or maybe a little bigger), but it's much less touristy. Again, I didn't look at the shopping options when I visited (except I did buy an Alessi teapot there, but you can buy those anywhere), but I would guess that there would be fewer ceramics and clothing choices in Lucca, because it's less touristy. Most any place will have great food, so you don't need to worry about that part of your trip! |
"I want to go somewhere small and not as tourist driven as Florence and Rome. I want to be able to shop in specialty places, not high end, just local. We love red wine."Someone suggested Sienna but it seems too big. Does anyone know about Lucca? Idon't want it to be too far away from Florence."
I think that San Gimignano in Tuscany will meet all of your requirements. Like Orvieto mentioned in another post, the local wine is white, but you'll find a full selection of Tuscan and other reds in any store or restaurant. Lots of local shopping and good food as well. http://www.sangimignano.com/sghomei.htm |
We will be there 10 days, including two for travel. We plan 3 nights in Rome, 3 in Florence and 2 somewhere else.
So far, I have been given the advice of Montepulciano,Impruneta,Orvieto,Sienna,Lucca, and San Gimignano. It seems that Sienna and Lucca are more like a city. Is this correct? I keep reading on the internet only to find myself even more confused. This is my 40th birthday present from my husband and a dream trip for me. I just don't want to spend the whole time running from one site to the other. I would love to go somewhere quaint and beautiful. From what I understand, there are ceramics everywhere, so I would like to focus on local shopping, good food, and ease of getting there from Florence. Can you take the train from Florence to these cities above? I feel like I need a travel agent. I would appreciate everyone's help. I realize that everyone loves a different part. I just want to be able to slow down a little on the trip and go somewhere not so large and touristy. |
Yes, Siena and Lucca are cities (wouldn't describe either as quaint) and more like Rome/Florence although Lucca won't be as busy (I'm not a fan of Lucca,deadly dull IMHO). I suggested Orvieto because of the ease of getting there since it's between Florence and Rome and on the train line. It's big enough to roam the streets and get lost, but quiet because it's a hilltown. It's quaint and has all the shopping you were interested in.
Montepulciano or Pienza meet your criteria (especially the red wine, but not really the clothing), but are a bit more difficult get to unless you rent a car. No trains go to either city although there is a station about 7 miles from Montepulciano. Montalcino (has red wine and ceramics, but not much in the way of clothing shops)is out of the way and Cinque Terre is northwest of Florence so a bit out of the way too. |
It's Cinque TerrE, not Terra.
I think I'm going to scream myself now. It's five villages. That makes it plural. I don't know how you do good research on the internet without knowing that. |
tnfan,
Siena and Orvieto are small Italian walled cities. From inside them, you really can't see the countryside unless you go stand on the walls. Impruneta is small town that's a 20 minute bus ride from Florence, so you don't have to spend the night there. But only go if you are mad for pottery -- not ceramics, pottery. As in terra cotta. Otherwise, it's not worth it. Montepulciano is not close to Florence, nor can you get there by public transportation. San Gimignano may be indeed what you are looking for -- but it is also what everybody else is looking for, and therefore it is packed to the walls with tourists. You can get there by bus from Florence but you are well advised to spend the night there if you want to be able to breathe. Lucca is also a small antique walled city, and it is not a hilltown, but in some ways it is more of what you are looking for in terms of fascinating shopping, great food (Buca di Sant'Antonio) and wine. It is mainly car free. It is lovely to walk around its walls, which are now a pedestrian/cycling path, but you won't be gazing on vinyards. I don't think you need a travel agent as much as you need a trip to the library or book store to leaf through some picture books and travel books on Tuscany. Take a map of Tuscany with you, so if you see a pretty picture of someplace you want to go, you can look to see if it is close to Florence. Then come back here and ask how to get to the place that most appeals to you. |
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Pisa isn't small and quaint but go there. Stay at the Royal Victoria Hotel on the Arno. Walk to leaning tower through a very untouristy town until you reach a very touristy tower area. Most tours spend 1/2 day there and don't do it justice imo. The duomo is divine and the tower is great fun to walk up and take shots from.
On the other hand, Orvieto has a gawdgeeous duomo and compact enough shopping area with plenty of stuff. You could take a day trip to Orvieto from Rome and a day trip to Pisa from Florence. Just stay in the 2 cities and simplify things! |
As much as I think you would enjoy Montepulciano, it is too difficult to get to without a car. To get there we rented a car from Florence - the distance is about one hour. However we also stayed a week. With two days you might wish to choose another town that is closer to Florence and easier to get to by public transport.
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I am going to have to spend some time doing more research.
I would like to visit a town, not a touristy city between Florence and Rome. One of the posts said there was a train stop 7 miles form Montepulciano. Would it be possible to take the train from Florence to the station and a cab or bus into town? From there we would go to Rome via the train. Would this work, or do we need to consider renting a car? |
The train station that stops nearest to Montepulciano is more than 7km away. (Maybe 7 miles?) It's a line that runs through both Rome and Florence. But you need transport from the station to Montepulciano. Sometimes you can arrange that with your HOTEL. They will send a taxi to pick you up. But if you don't speak Italian, you can't just go and count on finding a taxi outside the station. Or a bus.
Also be aware that in rural areas, taxis can be seemingly outrageously expensive. You can easily watch the meter climb to 60 euros or more. It's cheaper than renting and parking a car, and I think it's worth it. Just be prepared. Ask the hotel how much it would be. Between now and when you leave, check out the cost of hiring a private driver in Firenze to drive you to Montepulciano with a stop for lunch on the way in another town. I have no idea how much it costs, but adding up 2 train tickets and a taxi ride, it might not be all that much of a splurge. Lastly, Montepulciano is very popular. It's very beautiful, but will see lots of other tourists. You might not care all that much. Most will disappear at night. Just so you know. It's not a secret. |
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Montepulciano is quaint and beautiful and it is a town not a city but, as Zeppole says, there are lots of tourists there so I'm not sure that it would not be considered a touristy town.
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At the risk of driving you crazy: I just looked at Trenitalia, the Italian railway, and saw that there is a train that leaves Firenze at about 10:30 am that gets you to the Chiusi station by 11:35. From there you need to get to Montepulciano by bus or taxi.
HOWEVER, you need to know this: This particular train -- and Inter-City ("IC") fast train -- leaves from a station in Firenze called "Firenze Rifredi" -- it's not the station most people are used to dealing with (which is called Santa Maria Novello). It's a good train, though, because you don't have to change trains to get to Chiusi. Were it me, and this became part of my travel plan, I'd probably want to take a taxi from my hotel in Firenze to the Firenze Rifredi station. Ask your hotel for advice. You also want to read this about getting from Firenze to Montepulciano. There is a bus you can catch in Firenze: http://www.ricksteves.com/graffiti/h....cfm?topic=311 And this gives you specific information on getting the bus from the Chiusi train station if you go that route: http://www.ricksteves.com/graffiti/h...fm?topic=10083 |
By the way, tnfan, I think it's great this all came up because I never realized one could take a bus straight from Firenze to Montepulciano before this thread. It's like an article of catechism everywhere that you MUST rent a car to "see" Tuscany. And while it's true you won't be going from one hilltown to the next, I think you'll have a lovely time relaxing in Montepulciano, tasting it's great wines in its famous wine cellars, seeing its piazza and views, having time to poke around, going to the copper maker, having long lunches. You can always find a corner without tourists.
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Also, to everybody else, as we all know, in the time it takes to rent a car in Firenze and battle your way out through the traffic, and then finding parking on the other end, a two-hour bus trip that lets you off in Montepulciano compares favorably, especially since it only costs a couple of euro.
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Zeppole, Have you been taking your medications?
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to zeppole and Lily
Thank you so much! You have helped me more than you know. I don't speak Italian, so that info. was awesome. How difficult is it to have luggage on the bus? |
I think Montepulciano is a good choice, esp. now that there is bus service from Firenze.
I've been in Montepulciano many times, but I also love Pienza, and San Quirico d'Orcia and Montalcino. Pienza is good for pottery shopping, linen shopping, good restaurants, ditto Montalcino? SOOO does anyone know if there is a little local bus that OP could take to those nearby towns?? |
I have the entire book (160 pages)of bus schedules for Siena Mobilita and don't see any non-stop between Florence and Montepulciano. Frommers lists a non-stop, but no contact info. From Frommers:
>>>By Bus -- Five to eight Tra-in buses (tel. 0577-204-111; www.trainspa.it) run three to five times daily from Siena (1 1/2 hr.) through Pienza (20 min.). LFI (tel. 0578-31-174) buses run hourly from Chiusi (50 min.) through Chianciano Terme (25 min.), and twice daily from Florence to Bettole, where you transfer for the bus to Montepulciano (2 hr. total). There are three direct buses daily from Florence run by Ferroviaria lines (no phone). In Montepulciano, buy Tra-in and Ferroviaria tickets at Caffè Tubino, in the little parking lot just below Porta al Prato; get LFI tickets from the tabacchi/bar at Via Gracchiano del Corso 36-38.<<<< The local bus LFI, runs a few, but the times aren't that convenient. It is difficult to use a bus for these areas. All the various bus links are on the Siena Mobilita webpage. http://www.sienamobilita.it/EN/index.html You need to avoid any local bus between 7-9 am and 12:30-2:30 pm as they will be packed with Italian kids going to and from school. The Montepulciano bus station is below Montepulciano and you will need to catch another bus up to the town. |
Experience something different. Go to the very small town of Panzano [roughly 1/2 way betwen Florence and Siena], beautiful countryside. make reservations to eat at the butcher shop of Dario Cecchini, stay overnight so that you safely enjoy the wines. Dario is a real character [google his name] and read Bill Buford's book "Heat" -- the last 1/4 of the book is about Dario
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Right, bob. Deviate from the rigid, repetitious orthodoxy, and of course people will call you insane.
tnfan, here's some more specific help about taking the train: http://www.ilsasso.com/eng/location.php Very good advice to avoid school hours if you are carrying luggage on the bus. kybourbon, sorry that my language suggested a one-seat ride. One website mentioned a quick change in Bettole, but some more digging fails to turn up more info on that bus. Looks like the best option is an IC train to Chiusi, then the regular bus from the train station, which is just a short ride. |
This has been so helpful. I will need to check the bus and train schedules.
Does anyone have a suggestion of where to stay in Montepulciano? We are staying at a Marriott in Rome and I am looking at Antica Dimora Firenze in Florence. Any thoughts? |
You're very welcome tnfan although Zeppole did all the work!
We stayed in an apartment that rents for a minimum of one week but I'm sure that others have good recommendations for other accommodations. Happy travel planning - sometimes I think I like the planning the best! |
Thanks also to kybourbon for helping with the bus situation. I thought you could just get on the bus and go straight there.
Should we stay In Montepulciano for 1 or 2 nights or just go for the day? Thoughts? |
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