Help needed with itinerary
 

Hi, We are a family of 4 and are planning a trip to Europe this summer for a maximum of 10-12 days. We would ideally like to visit France, Portugal and Spain. We have never been to these countries before and would like to see the main places of interest. Since we have a very limited amount of time, we could use your help in determining the "must see" sights in these places. I personally would like to visit Fatima in Portugal. I would really appreciate any help in starting the planning process as I am very lost and don't know how to go about this. We are travelling from Toronto. Also may be I should mention that we are on a moderate budget. Thanks a lot in advance for your help and look forward to your suggestions.

I suggest your pick say Paris and then fly to Portugal or Spain.

You can't see 3 countries in 10-12 days -figure in a day between each place.

Or better yet chose Spain and Portugal or France and one.

Is this not possible if we just do a few main sights in say, Lisbon, Paris and Barcelona.. or what about if we do France and Portugal?

With 10-12 days and a moderate budget, 3 countries is not possible for you. I was gonna suggest France and Spain, or even better, staying in one country. But if you wanna visit Fatima, then you may pick France and Portugal. Must see? I will make a very one dimensional list:

Paris (Eiffel tower - no need to climb it, Notre Dame cathedral and the quarter around, try freshly-made crepes on street stands, Louvre museum, Champs-Elysées avenue all along from Place de Concorde to Arc de Triomphe passing by Alexandre bridge, try croissants in the morning, Monmartre hill and Sacré Coeur)

Paris day trips (Versailles, Reims, Chartres,...)

Fatima
Lisbon (Jeronimos Monastery, try the Pasteis de Belém nearby, Torre de Belem, Alfama quarter, any kind of seafood and local foods)

Just as an example: Paris and Barcelona would be best with at least three full days apiece for a first visit, with the better part of a day to get between them. Counting the day you leave Toronto, the day you arrive at your first destination (assuming an overnight flight), and the day you leave, that's already ten days.

I haven't been to Portugal so can't comment on what to see there or how easy it is to get back and forth. But especially if any of the four of you are young kids, I wouldn't try to cram too much in. And if budget is a major concern, buying another set of four plane tickets to a third destination will cost quite a lot.

Given the limited time, I would limit the trip to the Iberian peninsula. Maybe start in Madrid, travel (by bus?) to see Segovia, Avila, Salamanca (perhaps only two or one, depending on your stay in Madrid) on the way to Coimbra, Fatima and Lisbon, returning from Lisbon.

Or stay in Madrid with day trips to Segovia and Avila, and then fly to Lisbon or Porto to visit Fatima and Lisbon, returning home from Lisbon.

Agree about one country. Any flight you burn up a major portion of a day. For future reference, you luckily can fly non stop to Paris, Barcelona, Madrid, Venice, Milan and Rome.

Or, just stick to Lisbon, Sintra, Fatima, Porto, and then continue on to Santiago de Compostella (Spain) since you're interested in religious sites. Rent a car to travel betweem these, and there's plenty to see for the time you have.

Flights don't "burn up the major portion of a day" when they are only a short distance, if your definition of a day is 24 hours. They will burn up the morning, though. It does NOT take "the better part of a day" to get from Paris to Barcelona, either. I've flown it, the flight is only 2 hrs and BCN is an easy airport.

That would get pretty expensive for a family of 4 though.

You can do 2 countries, but not 3 in that time frame. You could do Portugal and Spain. Now flying Lisbon to Paris does take up 3 hrs. I prefer Easyjet within Europe, they fly that route. Or you could fly Lisbon to Madrid easily on Easyjet, that's 2.5 hrs. Taking the train takes forever, though, that takes 911 hrs. That is a night train, though, so I guess that could save time. I'm not even sure they have a day train. Again, that won't be cheap if a night train for everyone. You can take the bus from Lisbon to Seville in about 9 hrs or to Madrid about same time.

But you don't want to go to Andalucia in summer, anyway, and probably not Madrid. Too bad Spain is your least desired place as iot would be easy to see a lot just in that one country for that time.

You could do LIsbon and Paris, flying between them in that time, that wouldn't be bad at all, just two major cities. Not exactly what you want, though.

Not saying it's not an easy airport, Christina (I agree, it is), or a quick flight, but by the time you add up transit to the departure airport, time for check-in and security, flight time, baggage claim, and transit time to the second city's lodging, it's a lot of time when you only have ten days, especially if there are kids involved. Sure, they'd have time to do something that evening if they had a daytime flight, but it's hardly like a full day, and that's if there are no flight delays or other snafus.

I agree that it does not make sense to try and cover three countries in one trip. Assuming you plan on flying in to one country and flying out of the other, my suggestion would be to check out airfares first. I know that the airfare is ridiculously expensive to certain popular European destinations in peak summer months eg, Paris from the NE. We were able to get a decent fare to Lisbon last summer. This may help decide which country to eliminate.

Thank you all so much for your suggestions. Our boys are 24 and 18 so it is not a problem travelling. It is now clear that we should be only looking at 2 of the 3 destinations - the problem is which 2?? My husband is keen on visiting Paris and other than Fatima I am not overly interested in religious sites.

Would it make more sense to fly to London, UK from Toronto and may be look into budget flights from there (i.e. Ryanair etc.)

For some reason I though 10 days was a LOT :( I have never been to Europe so obviously have a lot to learn.

If your husband is keen on Paris and you, on Fatima, then the choice would be France and Portugal, isn't it? There are plenty of budget flights from Paris too. Last time I flied to Lisbon it was quite cheap.

I think what you can do now is looking for multi-destinations flight from your city (Toronto) to one city in Europe that interests you (Paris, London, Lisbon,..) and then from the second Europe city back to Toronto. The prices may decide it for you and get rid of the headache for you :)

<i>Would it make more sense to fly to London, UK from Toronto and may be look into budget flights from there (i.e. Ryanair etc.)</i>

Not generally, unless you're able to get unusually cheap fares to/from London (this was the case for my upcoming trip, so it can happen if there's a fare sale, but usually it's just as good to, say, fly into Paris and out of Lisbon).

Ten days is a long trip by North American standards for sure! And it can feel like plenty of time depending on what you do - if you, say, went to London and then took the train to Edinburgh or the Lake District or something, ten days would be plenty. But once you start adding in places that are more than a fairly short train ride away, the time adds up quicker than you'd think at first.

You can't "do" any of the larger countries in your time frame, only a couple of cities or areas.
With only 10 days, fly into the city you actually want to visit. Don't waste all that time (and extra money) making connections through a city you will not be visiting. Every 1/2 day used up with extra traveling is expensive vacation time with nothing to show for it.

Pick places that offer a lot of sightseeing without much travel.
Fly into Paris for 4 or 5 days, then one other place (with a lot to see) by plane or train. Fly home.