Greetings from Portugal
Apr 18th, 2022, 12:36 PM
#241
As mentioned earlier, we're not really museum people.
How in the world did you get that Seagull picture in Porto. !!
Percy - that bird was literally posing
We re-traced our steps from last night and walked up that crazy steep hill that runs alongside Elevador da Gloria for an encore dinner at Gandhi Palace in Bairro Alto - we took in the views from the nearby viewing platform en route.
After dinner we took a different route back to the apartment via the winding streets of Chiado and god knows where else - it was just one of those "let's follow this road and see where it goes". We then sought out Santa Justa Lift, and somehow, miraculously, found our way home, passing yet another canned sardine tourist shop - that makes one in every city we've visited.
Much quieter on the streets today. Hope we're out of here before the next string of cruise ships arrive.
Street art
How in the world did you get that Seagull picture in Porto. !!
Percy - that bird was literally posing
We re-traced our steps from last night and walked up that crazy steep hill that runs alongside Elevador da Gloria for an encore dinner at Gandhi Palace in Bairro Alto - we took in the views from the nearby viewing platform en route.
After dinner we took a different route back to the apartment via the winding streets of Chiado and god knows where else - it was just one of those "let's follow this road and see where it goes". We then sought out Santa Justa Lift, and somehow, miraculously, found our way home, passing yet another canned sardine tourist shop - that makes one in every city we've visited.
Much quieter on the streets today. Hope we're out of here before the next string of cruise ships arrive.
Street art
Apr 18th, 2022, 11:27 PM
#243
Have yet to run across a missing toilet seat in Lisbon. But I've been wondering about the pantyhose - I've seen more pantyhose clad women here than I've seen since the 90's - is it a matter of what's old is new again? Some things don't need repeating, and pantyhose is one of them IMO.
Apr 19th, 2022, 08:45 AM
#244
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I'm currently in Madrid and have also noticed young women wearing pantyhose with short dresses or shorts. I probably wouldn't have noticed except for the lower "control top" portion being exposed lol.
We were in Lisbon in fall 2019. I regret not visiting the Carmo Convent and think you would get some great photos on a beautiful day.
One morning we took a nice walk up to the Castelo de San Jorge, enjoyed the views and wandered over to the Igreja se Sao Vicente de Fora which was a very pleasant surprise. In the cloisters we loved the tiles depicting fables.
We were in Lisbon in fall 2019. I regret not visiting the Carmo Convent and think you would get some great photos on a beautiful day.
One morning we took a nice walk up to the Castelo de San Jorge, enjoyed the views and wandered over to the Igreja se Sao Vicente de Fora which was a very pleasant surprise. In the cloisters we loved the tiles depicting fables.
Apr 19th, 2022, 11:12 AM
#245
Tiles, tiles, tiles...I loved the tile museum.
Didn't love the Time Out Market...not that we dared to dine there. It was crazy busy and we wanted nothing to do with a gazillion unmasked people dining at communal tables. Took a few photos and hightailed it out of there.
Found a nice Italian place nearby for lunch, then eventually worked our way towards the LX Factory, which wasn't quite what we expected, but interesting none-the-less.
Took a couple of buses that were full to the gills and very uncomfortable - we've worried about COVID a lot this trip and will get tested tomorrow for our return home on Thursday. Fingers and toes crossed.
Had another near panic attack in a grocery store near our apartment - way too many people in too small a space. Felt like I couldn't breathe. I absolutely cannot imagine living here - read this morning that there are nine tourists for every one resident in Lisbon. OMFG.
Tile museum
Tile museum
Tile museum
Tile Museum
Tile Museum
Tile Museum
Tile Museum
Tile Museum
Okay then...
Tile Museum
Time Out Market...thanks but no
When one dessert just isn't enough
Walking to LX Factory
LX Factory
LX Factory
Didn't love the Time Out Market...not that we dared to dine there. It was crazy busy and we wanted nothing to do with a gazillion unmasked people dining at communal tables. Took a few photos and hightailed it out of there.
Found a nice Italian place nearby for lunch, then eventually worked our way towards the LX Factory, which wasn't quite what we expected, but interesting none-the-less.
Took a couple of buses that were full to the gills and very uncomfortable - we've worried about COVID a lot this trip and will get tested tomorrow for our return home on Thursday. Fingers and toes crossed.
Had another near panic attack in a grocery store near our apartment - way too many people in too small a space. Felt like I couldn't breathe. I absolutely cannot imagine living here - read this morning that there are nine tourists for every one resident in Lisbon. OMFG.
Tile museum
Tile museum
Tile museum
Tile Museum
Tile Museum
Tile Museum
Tile Museum
Tile Museum
Okay then...
Tile Museum
Time Out Market...thanks but no
When one dessert just isn't enough
Walking to LX Factory
LX Factory
LX Factory
Apr 19th, 2022, 11:18 AM
#246
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Nice photos, Mel! Glad you loved the Tile Museum.
I feel the same way as you do about the Time Out Market these days, especially during these covid times.
This is what we found there on a very busy Sunday-No where to sit and enjoy a meal.
I feel the same way as you do about the Time Out Market these days, especially during these covid times.
This is what we found there on a very busy Sunday-No where to sit and enjoy a meal.
Apr 19th, 2022, 11:59 AM
#247
I'm currently in Madrid and have also noticed young women wearing pantyhose with short dresses or shorts. I probably wouldn't have noticed except for the lower "control top" portion being exposed lol.
Ha! Haven't seen that yet, but plenty of pantyhose encased legs. Just don't get it. Thought those horrible things were gone for good, but evidently not.
Ha! Haven't seen that yet, but plenty of pantyhose encased legs. Just don't get it. Thought those horrible things were gone for good, but evidently not.
Apr 19th, 2022, 12:04 PM
#248
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I'm not surprised that Portugal is so crowded - it seems at least a third of the questions on this forum are questions about traveling in Portugal! I LOVED my trip there in 2018 and even details about the crowds are making me miss it. I'd go back in a heartbeat!
Apr 19th, 2022, 01:06 PM
#249
The Tile Museum looks fantastic! And those desserts….yum! Looks good!
I really don’t understand why Portugal is more crowded than, say, Italy, another super popular place. I’m more than a little concerned about crowds given that we’re going in 2 weeks! Of course, we ARE city folk (live in NYC) so hope that we are more comfortable and able to better deal with crowds in Lisbon than Melnq8. Time Out doesn’t look like a place where we will eat but I do hope the rest of the city is not all crowds! Is Portugal the flavor of the month?
I really don’t understand why Portugal is more crowded than, say, Italy, another super popular place. I’m more than a little concerned about crowds given that we’re going in 2 weeks! Of course, we ARE city folk (live in NYC) so hope that we are more comfortable and able to better deal with crowds in Lisbon than Melnq8. Time Out doesn’t look like a place where we will eat but I do hope the rest of the city is not all crowds! Is Portugal the flavor of the month?
Last edited by progol; Apr 19th, 2022 at 01:53 PM.
Apr 19th, 2022, 01:06 PM
#250
I wonder whether the crowds are so bad because Portugal seemed to be one of the safer and easier countries to visit?
That said, those planning trips to Lisbon might want to check the cruise ship arrivals for their planned dates, e.g.: https://cruisedig.com/ports/lisbon-portugal/arrivals
Sadly, looks like around 8,000 passengers arriving on the 21st...
That said, those planning trips to Lisbon might want to check the cruise ship arrivals for their planned dates, e.g.: https://cruisedig.com/ports/lisbon-portugal/arrivals
Sadly, looks like around 8,000 passengers arriving on the 21st...
Apr 19th, 2022, 01:31 PM
#251
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I agree with thursdaysd.
The visitors have coming flooding/ running back (sometimes literally ) in part because of the great success of their vigilant vaccination campaign. Portugal has one of the highest covid-19 vaccination rates in the world, and thus, people believe that it's one of the safer countries to visit right now. This is why we didn't cancel our March trip.
Bookings for the late spring and summer are now almost back up to pre-pandemic levels. And there's been a great deal of foreign investment in Lisbon (and Porto), thus the construction cranes you find everywhere. Hotels being built everywhere you look in both cities.
We used to check the cruise ship arrival log before planning a visit but stopped doing si, we gave up, only because we realized that cruise ships arrive (or did, pre-covid) almost daily, and almost all year long, even in the winter. The UK lines like Cunard and P& Oand the Italian Costa cruises dock in Lisbon then.
I've lived in a major European city (Madrid), and until we moved to the Seattle suburbs, we lived within the city for 10 years and took our visitors regularly to the Pike Market and Space Needle during cruise season, which is a zoo, so I guess I'm more used to the teeming crowds, being a former city dweller.
And Lisbon and Porto have been most affected by the cruise ship traffic, as have Barcelona and now Málaga.
Portugal does have its quiet corners but one needs car to best seek them out: the western Algarve, west of Lagos and in its interior, the Alentejo Costa Vicentina (except for July-August), all of the Minho, Central Portugal, the schist villages, the National Park of Peneda-Gerês, the Arrábida Natural Park, the Douro Valley, the lovely town of Bragança, Castelo Rodrigo, etc.
We're headed to the Silver Coast in October (Ericeira, the interior town of Caldas da Rainha, Peniche. and beyond to below Porto, and expect (hope) to find it peaceful then (surfers, yes) but no mega cruise ships.
From today's The Portugal News (Jeff Bezos was in town this past weekend)-
https://www.theportugalnews.com/news...bourhood/66490
The visitors have coming flooding/ running back (sometimes literally
) in part because of the great success of their vigilant vaccination campaign. Portugal has one of the highest covid-19 vaccination rates in the world, and thus, people believe that it's one of the safer countries to visit right now. This is why we didn't cancel our March trip.Bookings for the late spring and summer are now almost back up to pre-pandemic levels. And there's been a great deal of foreign investment in Lisbon (and Porto), thus the construction cranes you find everywhere. Hotels being built everywhere you look in both cities.
We used to check the cruise ship arrival log before planning a visit but stopped doing si, we gave up, only because we realized that cruise ships arrive (or did, pre-covid) almost daily, and almost all year long, even in the winter. The UK lines like Cunard and P& Oand the Italian Costa cruises dock in Lisbon then.
I've lived in a major European city (Madrid), and until we moved to the Seattle suburbs, we lived within the city for 10 years and took our visitors regularly to the Pike Market and Space Needle during cruise season, which is a zoo, so I guess I'm more used to the teeming crowds, being a former city dweller.
And Lisbon and Porto have been most affected by the cruise ship traffic, as have Barcelona and now Málaga.
Portugal does have its quiet corners but one needs car to best seek them out: the western Algarve, west of Lagos and in its interior, the Alentejo Costa Vicentina (except for July-August), all of the Minho, Central Portugal, the schist villages, the National Park of Peneda-Gerês, the Arrábida Natural Park, the Douro Valley, the lovely town of Bragança, Castelo Rodrigo, etc.
We're headed to the Silver Coast in October (Ericeira, the interior town of Caldas da Rainha, Peniche. and beyond to below Porto, and expect (hope) to find it peaceful then (surfers, yes) but no mega cruise ships.
From today's The Portugal News (Jeff Bezos was in town this past weekend)-
https://www.theportugalnews.com/news...bourhood/66490
Last edited by Maribel; Apr 19th, 2022 at 01:53 PM.
Apr 19th, 2022, 01:57 PM
#252
I’m a city dweller, too, so crowds are the norm, but I’m also going to be a tourist in Portugal so am trying not to worry too much about it and know that we can find our way to the less-crowded spots, if need be. But I must admit I’m still a little nervous.
thursdaysd, looking at the cruise calendar is even more nervous-making! I’m actually stunned by how many people are back cruising again. When we were in Italy and Croatia in the fall, there was an occasional cruise ship, but clearly, the world is traveling again, for better or for worse!
thursdaysd, looking at the cruise calendar is even more nervous-making! I’m actually stunned by how many people are back cruising again. When we were in Italy and Croatia in the fall, there was an occasional cruise ship, but clearly, the world is traveling again, for better or for worse!
Apr 19th, 2022, 02:05 PM
#253
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The only place where we had to wait in line in 2018 was at the Jeronimos Monastery. We were there early in the morning, but they kept letting the large cruise ship tours in before we were allowed in.
Maybe I have a higher tolerance for crowds, but the crowds in 2018 really didn't bother me.
Apr 19th, 2022, 02:15 PM
#254
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Speaking to the topic of crowds, we did stay in a quiet corner of Lisbon. We stayed at the Hotel Real Palacio, Rua Tomas Ribeiro, and really enjoyed our stay there. I don't recommend it to people who are looking to stay in the city center. But we enjoyed it because it is in a quiet location. The hotel is near the Marques de Pombal and Edward VII Park. We did walk downtown several times; it's about a 20-25 minute walk but we really enjoyed the walk down Ave Liberdade with its leafy trees and patterned cobblestones. And sometimes we took taxis which are so inexpensive. And there are metro stops nearby.
Apr 19th, 2022, 02:17 PM
#255
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progol,
I think that you'll be able to keep away from the worst of the crowds by avoiding the Baixa, where the cruise passengers first invade on their DIY walking tours and seem just to settle in there, not moving beyond that packed rectangle.
You can seek out quieter neighborhoods:
visiting the Museu Nacional de Arte Antiga in Santos (it has a nice café), the Estrela Basilica and its pretty, neighboring park Jardím da Estrela, the Gulbenkian coupled with the top of Eduardo VII park (tour buses park at the bottom), an Avenida da Liberdade stroll with a stop at the Casa Museu Medeiros e Almada (we had it to ourselves), the Tile Museum, the interesting Museu do Oriente in Alcántara.
Our Alfama morning stroll wasn't too crowded (the tourists were packed on the tram 28 and the tuk tuks but not so much on the hilly lanes) and I don't think you'll find hordes at the São Vicente de Fora Monastery, the Ricardo do Espíritu Santo Silva Decorative Arts Museum or the National Pantheon, all in Alfama.
I think that you'll be able to keep away from the worst of the crowds by avoiding the Baixa, where the cruise passengers first invade on their DIY walking tours and seem just to settle in there, not moving beyond that packed rectangle.
You can seek out quieter neighborhoods:
visiting the Museu Nacional de Arte Antiga in Santos (it has a nice café), the Estrela Basilica and its pretty, neighboring park Jardím da Estrela, the Gulbenkian coupled with the top of Eduardo VII park (tour buses park at the bottom), an Avenida da Liberdade stroll with a stop at the Casa Museu Medeiros e Almada (we had it to ourselves), the Tile Museum, the interesting Museu do Oriente in Alcántara.
Our Alfama morning stroll wasn't too crowded (the tourists were packed on the tram 28 and the tuk tuks but not so much on the hilly lanes) and I don't think you'll find hordes at the São Vicente de Fora Monastery, the Ricardo do Espíritu Santo Silva Decorative Arts Museum or the National Pantheon, all in Alfama.
Apr 19th, 2022, 02:21 PM
#256
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Progol, you will find the Gulbenkian Museum quiet and the nearby area is quiet. The museum's cafe is a lovely place for a snack. The Coach Museum and the Mosteiro De Sao Vicente de Fora were quiet when we were there. In fact, we were the only ones at the Mosteiro. It was also quiet when we were exploring the Alfama District, especially once you get away from Castelo De S. Jorge.
Apr 19th, 2022, 03:14 PM
#257
Yes, the Oriente museum is definitely worth seeing, in addition to the less well-known museums/houses I listed above. I also found the Parque das Nacoes area quiet, although the aquarium may now be popular. I'm a big fan of the Gulbenkian - don't miss the Lalique jewelry.
Apr 19th, 2022, 03:36 PM
#258
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thursdaysd,
I'm really glad that you listed the less well-known museums in your post, as I've never been to the Fronteira Palace and noticed your beautiful photo of it from your photo album. I've put it on my list.
We didn't find huge crowds at the Coach Museum either--only a Road Scholar group that arrived at the same time we did.
The cruise ship excursion bus crowds in Belém go straight to the Mosteiro dos Jerónimos at around 11 or slightly before, then to the Monument to the Discoveries, then to the Torre de Belém and often skip the Coach Museum.
It's divided into the contemporary building with the largest group of (amazingly elaborate) carriages and the original museum housed in the former Royal Riding School with a smaller collection under its original frescoes. If pressed for time, you can concentrate on the major collection in the contemporary museum. You can reach it from the Cais do Sodré train station, the same station for the trains to Cascais. The train stop is located directly across from the Museu Nacional dos Coches. It's one of my favorite museums.
I'm really glad that you listed the less well-known museums in your post, as I've never been to the Fronteira Palace and noticed your beautiful photo of it from your photo album. I've put it on my list.
We didn't find huge crowds at the Coach Museum either--only a Road Scholar group that arrived at the same time we did.
The cruise ship excursion bus crowds in Belém go straight to the Mosteiro dos Jerónimos at around 11 or slightly before, then to the Monument to the Discoveries, then to the Torre de Belém and often skip the Coach Museum.
It's divided into the contemporary building with the largest group of (amazingly elaborate) carriages and the original museum housed in the former Royal Riding School with a smaller collection under its original frescoes. If pressed for time, you can concentrate on the major collection in the contemporary museum. You can reach it from the Cais do Sodré train station, the same station for the trains to Cascais. The train stop is located directly across from the Museu Nacional dos Coches. It's one of my favorite museums.
Apr 19th, 2022, 05:50 PM
#259
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I think thursdayd is right...and that cruise calendar is frightening.
On our Belem day (a Tuesday) there will be 3 ships with more than 10,000 passengers. Sunday is not better, another 3 ships, another 10,000 people. Following Maribel's notes, we'll be at the Mosteiro dos Jerónimos doors before they open, so we can get in as early as possible.
On our Belem day (a Tuesday) there will be 3 ships with more than 10,000 passengers. Sunday is not better, another 3 ships, another 10,000 people. Following Maribel's notes, we'll be at the Mosteiro dos Jerónimos doors before they open, so we can get in as early as possible.
