Getting back to Paris

Old Apr 9th, 2013, 02:38 PM
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Getting back to Paris

Hello again,
As a traveler, I am so thankful for this forum. There is no better advice than from the person who has had the experience. You have guided us well thus far, causing us to rethink, and revamp our original plans. I hope that at some point my experiences are varied enough that I too can offer advice. I got a late start, so the truth is that I am still playing catch up. I know that sometimes questions sound silly, but you can read and research until you can't, and there is no advice better than the one whose done it.
Okay, that's the prologue, here is the question. We will be in St. Remy and need to return to Paris to catch a cruise to Normandy. We have a rental car at this point. We considered dropping the car in Avignon or Nimes and catching the train to Paris. After reading the forum, I'm concerned about all of those connections, car drop off, train to Paris, and transportation to point of embarkation. I think this opens the door to what we originally wanted to do. Leave St Remy a day early, drive up to Beaune. The drive would afford us the opportunity to see this area, maybe even find a wine tasting. Per your advice that we are waiting for, we could find an offbeat B&B(Chambres d'Hotes).
Now it gets tricky. We would like to drive the car to Chartres, original pick up, and catch the train to Paris ( I read in your forum that is not a good idea in case of delays). I keep reading not to drive in Paris. Is there a better place to drop the car and then get public transportation, taxi, or whatever to our embarkation?
In a nutshell, " Given 2 days, what is the absolute best use of time and still make connections, to get from St. Remy to Paris?" Well, and see and do everything possible along the way!
Thank you for your patience, expertise and sense of humor as you guide us!
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 04:40 PM
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Hi there. I'm new to your plans, so I apologize if I don't know all the details about the rest of your trip.

I'm assuming you're needing to get to Le Havre?

And I'm assuming you're including Paris in there because it's a convenient transportation hub getting back to Normandy? (Because just one night in Paris isn't much.)

Also, are you allowed to return your car anywhere, or must it be returned to Chartres?

Have you checked the SNCF.com website for train schedules? I don't know that route very well, but it would seem that options for all your train connections are really complicated. From Chartres to Le Havre by train, it's about 4 hours with at least 1 (or 2 transfers). So if you are going to be required to drop off the car in Chartres, you probably want to arrive there the night before, then spend your last day getting to the cruise.

If you can drop off the car anywhere, then you have more options, including the Beaune option you outline, driving through Burgundy and sleeping in Beaune. My thoughts on this are that to really "see the area" you should give yourself more than 1 day. Now, if you are fine with a lot of driving and you are OK with even the most superficial trip through the area (i.e. check into your hotel, grab dinner, then get back in the car in the morning) then you might be OK with it. I'd find it tedious and exhausting, not to mention I would feel like I was missing too much. And I really enjoy Burgundy wines!!! But that's me.

Another thing to consider by adding Beaune is the amount of time your'e going to spend in the car. The quickest drive from St. Remy to Beaune (per google, and not sure it's the scenic route) is about 4 hours. So you'll be in the car half of the day to get to Beaune, then another 4.5 hours to drive to Le Havre. (Assuming you could even return the car near Le Havre.)

I wouldn't want to spend that much time driving over 2 days, and I'd want an extra night in there, so I'd probably (if it were me) only do that if I could have 2 nights in Beaune, since the first day and departure day are filled with driving. If seeing Beaune is something that's really important to this trip, then perhaps you could cut your St. Remy time short by 2 days instead of 1. But I don't have a clear understanding of how long you'll be in St. Remy.

You mentioned Paris in there, but I'm guessing you're referring to it as a train hub to get to Normandy for this leg of the trip, right? Because another option, that errs on the side of convenience and caution is to drop off the car in Avignon, TGV to Paris which is only 2-3 hours, spend the last night in Paris, and take one of the many connections from Paris to Le Havre then next day.

I think the TGV option is the one i"d probably do because I personally love Paris, even a night there can be fabulous. And the connections are straightforward and reliable and quick.

If I felt like I could easily cut back 2 days on St. Remy (and I enjoyed all the driving; my brother is one of those people) I'd probably go for the option of 2 nights in Burgundy, then driving direct to Le Havre.

Now, assuming you will be required to drop off in Chartres, that's like a 7 hour drive, per google. And Beaune is a natural halfway point, I suppose, so you could stop over there for a night. But you'll still need to spend about 4 hours that last day getting yourself by train to Le Havre from Chartres... and there will be at least 1-2 transfers on that route. Doesn't sound like a fun way to say goodbye to France.

Good luck!
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 05:01 PM
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Your post is lengthy and confusing and without paragraph breaks, making it hard to make sense of. What, exactly, do you need to figure out? You haven't even said what the "point of embarcation is," so how would we possibly know?

I would never drive from St-Rémy to Paris. It's a no-brainer to take the TGV from Avignon to Paris and then figure out the rest of the trip.
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 05:02 PM
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Could you be more verbose? LOL
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 05:09 PM
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Please, exactly where are you getting on this boat. It sounds like the ship sails form Paris to Normandy - but that can't be right.

Does the cruise line offer a transfer form Paris? If so - from where?

Or - if you can drop the car anywhere - why go to Paris at all? Why not go directly to the cruise port?

I'm very confused.
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 06:07 PM
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Ooops, I read his question as needing to get TO Normandy, where he was catching up with a cruise. I better go back and learn how to read. LOL

Yes, I agree, "a cruise to Normandy" is very confusing, but I'm guessing if it is a cruise to Normandy, then perhaps it's the Viking River Cruises or somesuch? (google says so)

If that's the case, then yes, the most straightfoward, easy, efficient approach is to turn in the car in Avignon (if your rental company will allow it) and take the TGV straight to Paris. Plus the TGV is fun.

If for some godawful reason you must drop off the car in Chartres, then I guess you're making the drive anyway you slice it. And Burgundy is a natural midway point if you don't want to drive for 7+ hours in one day. But one night isn't going to give you much of the flavor of the area. I'd still devote 2 nights to Burgundy at a bare mininum.

The trains from Chartres to Paris are fairly easy and reliable (even my 60+ year old parents did it when they wanted a quick day trip out of Paris). So if you have to, for some godawful reason, drop the car off in Chartres, it should be easy to get a connection back to Paris. The trains from Chartres take about an hour, and seem to run every hour all day, if you look at SNCF website.

But... some people love to drive. My brother being one of them. He'd rather have a rental car for the entire duration of his Paris trips (even when staying in the 6th and 7th or the 3rd or the 11th in Paris) and have the flexibility to go out for a drive into the countryside at a moment's notice rather than take a train somewhere. He'll often leave Paris for the day, drive out to Normandy to putter around, and return to Paris that evening. He doesn't mind the Paris traffic or the peripherique. And my brother adores long drives. Go figure. I think he's nuts. But if you're like that, and you want to take the drive through Burgundy, do it. But give yourself 2 days instead of 1 so you can get a chance to "see the area" even a little, have a romantic dinner one night, stroll through a village the next day, do a wine tasting, then enjoy another dinner and restful night before you have to drive back to Paris Chartres.

And FWIW, I highly doubt the majority of the drive from St. Remy to Chartres, if you take the quicker roads, will be terribly scenic.

One other thing, I think you're asking for a "better" drop off than Chartres. I suppose you could drop off at CDG, but WHY would you want to go anywhere near Paris in a car?

Good luck planning.
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 06:08 PM
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I was trying to be succinct and not bore you to death. Geez, I didn't realize paragraphs were so important in the forum, content?
And all of your points were exactly the points I'm contending with in this decision. But I don't have a knowledge base of France to make a confident decision, therefore I'm asking for your input.
We pick up the car in Chartres at the beginning of our adventure. We can drop it about anywhere, including Paris, but everything says don't drive in Paris. We have to be in Paris to get on an Avalon cruise to Normandy. I can't give you the point of embarkation because they don't tell us until 30 days prior.
Our first thought was to take the train from St. Remy area back to Paris. We have 5 nights in St. Remy. But I read some of the forums that discouraged taking the train on the same day you had a major connection.
I realize we cannot immerse ourselves in the area we would see in the drive from St. Remy to Paris. It seemed a stopover in Beaune would be a treat. Perhaps it would give us the opportunity to introduce ourselves to this area to revisit later, wow, that would be great.
I'm not stupid and I know we can't truly enjoy the area. But we are looking at every opportunity to learn about and enjoy France.
On the other hand, perhaps taking the extra day in St. Remy, and just getting back to Paris on the train is better. Again I don't know or understand the logistics of all of this, that's why I'm asking.........some comments suggested the train on the same day as major connection was not good
As for days in Paris, we will have an extended period of time in Paris following the cruise. I should warn you now, we will be asking for input on Paris later.
Bottom line..... take the train from St. Remy(area- Avignon, Nimes) to Paris on the same day we depart on the cruise or take 2 days to drive to Paris.
I'm trying to not write a novel and still give you the information that you need. Thank you for your pertinent questions to make it clearer for you to advise. (Hope you liked the paragraphs this time!)
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 07:11 PM
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You wrote:
"Bottom line..... take the train from St. Remy(area- Avignon, Nimes) to Paris on the same day we depart on the cruise or take 2 days to drive to Paris."

I probably wouldn't---just in case of a strike or a missed train---plan to take the train from Avignon to Paris on the *same* day you're supposed to meet up with your cruise, unless you're not expected for the cruise until 5 or 6 pm and even then I probably wouldn't do that. I'd probably plan to get to Paris the day before you're due to check into your cruise. That would be a long distance to have to cover in one day if you had to drive it in the event of a train strike, missing a train, or someone falling ill.

The alternative of taking 2 days (which I interpret as 1 night) to drive to Paris, that seems nuts to me, but if that sounds enjoyable to you, then do it, and turn the car in at CDG or Chartres or somewhere else on the train line. It sounds like that is what you want to do, but are worried about the traffic and the connections.

I guess if spending a night in Burgundy is something you really want to do, here's another idea for avoiding the connections and traffic you'd see as you get closer to Paris. You could turn the car in at Dijon (after a night in Beaune) and take the TGV into Paris. It'll still take a combined total of 3-5 hours to meet up with your group, though less time actually driving, but you avoid Paris traffic.

But I'd encourage you to think about spending 2 nights getting from Avignon to Paris. I know you not looking for an extensive experience of the area and are ok with something quick, but if you only stay one night, you've spent 4+ hours of your arrival day getting there. You'll only have a few hours total to explore and get dinner. The next morning, you'll have to leave early for another 4+ hours of travel to meet up with your group. Having an extra night gives you the time to do a wine tasting and explore a little, maybe plan where you might come next time. You would have one full day and one full night to enjoy the area before you have to race back to Paris (whether you travel by train or car.)

BTW, you mention that you'll have "an extended time" after the cruise. How extended. Hours? Days? Long enough to visit Burgundy for a day or two?

Good luck.
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 07:34 PM
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>

It wasn't succinct,and the lack of paragraphs made it close to impossible to understand. As it does in any form of writing. But it's OK.

Take the train from Avignon back to Paris the night before your cruise. Dont drive; that would be stressful and much longer than taking the train.


I think it's weird you don't know where you're leaving from. But I've never taken a cruise from Paris or anywhere, so I'm clueless about that.

Good luck.
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Old Apr 9th, 2013, 08:32 PM
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I would always rather have a cushion of a day when I need to make a major connection.

If you have time after the cruise, why not just enjoy Paris and take the drive later?

BTW, I think a lot of people are like me and wouldn't even read your 1st paragraph. The folks who attempted it and responded are a brave bunch. In this type of venue, it's makes sense to even add the extra space between "paragraphs" for clarity.
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 09:06 AM
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Hi M,

>I didn't realize paragraphs were so important in the forum, content?<

Paragraphsarealwaysimportantespeciallyforthoseofus whoaregettingoninyearsandcantdecipheralargeblockof letteraseasiyasweusedto.

www.voyages-sncf.com will give you train schedules from Provence to Paris. It take 2:40-3:40 hr from Avignon to Gare de Lyon.

The train to Le Havre leaves from Gare St. Lazare, and takes 2-3 hr.

www.ratp.fr will give you travel times by metro and/or bus between any two points in Paris. It will take 0.25 hr.

So, you will have a 6+-hr trip before you.

I don't think that you will want to try to make it the same day.

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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 09:17 AM
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I strongly suspect the cruise is on the Seine and going TO Normandy, leaving from Paris.
If he said differently in all those words, excuse the interruption.
Still train the night before from Avignon.
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 10:23 AM
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Bet so, just read one of these about Cruises on Fodor's...
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 10:43 AM
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>

Good guess, but since the OP can't or won't tell us and the writing is so incredibly dense, I can't be bothered trying to read this stuff anymore, so...whatever...
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 01:22 PM
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Ouch, sorry I seem to have upset some of you. I appreciate the "brave bunch" that has read and responded.

Obviously in spite of my bad forum writing skills, you have given me incredible guidance in planning the trip. Your experience and knowledge will be a gift in making our trip better.

The forum offers so much and I will continue reading and hopefully get better at asking questions. I have read other travel forums and feel that the Fodor's group is on top of the game. Guess I just wanted to play too!

Thank you again for the last round of advice, it is proving invaluable. The train will definitely be included. I sort of think planning a 4 week trip is "dense"! But with your help, it's coming together and almost planned. I am reading about the train, hmmmm, another adventure!
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 02:47 PM
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Geez, can you not at least tell us where the "cruise to Normandy" is originating? We might be able to help.
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 06:58 PM
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Sorry, I thought I explained. It begins and ends in Paris, but they will not tell us the point of embarkation until 30 days out. Evidently they have more than one, don't always use the the same place.
This cruise set up by family, was the beginning of the France adventure. We decided to come to France before the cruise and stay after the cruise, thus the planning began. That planning led me to the Fodor's forum and all of the questions.
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Old Apr 10th, 2013, 07:25 PM
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btw: according to http://www.cruisecritic.com/memberre...EntryID=107475 if it is on Creativity, Avalon specifies a meeting point somewhere in Paris (such as Montparnasse) and then bus people to the boat.
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