Lily

We are planning a trip for next summer and are hoping for some input from our Fodor's friends. Our plan is to fly to Paris from the US. From Paris to Stuttgart by train and then to Garmisch (Germany). From Garmisch we hope to visit the other countries - day trips if possible by train. The idea is to see the countryside and small towns, after Paris we aren't worried about "big cities". If trains aren't practical please give me ideas on what would be. We will drive if we need to. There will be 6 of us (1 couple 65, 1 couple 36, 1 female 35, 1 female 16) We will have 10 days once we get to Garmisch.

dougd

My wife and I just got back from 10 days in Austria. What a wonderful country! We drove from Vienna westward along the Danube, then to Hallstat and Salzburg and down to Venice. <BR>For beautiful small towns, it's hard to beat Hallstatt. There is a train that takes you to a ferry landing across the lake from the village. Other beautiful towns we encountered were Weissenkirchen on the Danube, and Golling, just south of Salzburg. If you have any questions, feel free to contact me.

Richard

Lily, Firstly, I think the train to Munich, not Stuttgart would be advisable. 2nd, it probably would be more economical to drive and a better way to see the countryside and small towns. Driving in the countries you mentioned is no problem, roads are good and well marked. Check with Autoeurope for the rate on a minivan or minibus.

Patrick

I would forget Lichtenstein, if you are looking for charm. We stayed for two nights (at least 1 and 1/2 too many), but at least now we can see we've been there. It was hard to reach --no trains, must switch to bus, and although the countryside is nice, it is nothing compared to the beauty of the countries surrounding it. Vaduz is very dull and non-charming. It was OK, just not worth any extra effort. Now I know why the main thing to do there is stamp collecting. That's probably the biggest excitement you could find there. We did not realize that you can't even visit the castle as the Royal family still lives there. All the literature they sent us listed the castle as one of the great sights in Lichtenstein, but they never mentioned that you only can look up at it from the valley below.

Lily

Thanks guys. I'm taking notes! If you can think of anything else let me know.

bo_jack

Normally we drive, so I don't know much about train routes or connections. However, I do think Garmish is an excellent central location to settle in for a week or more. With 6 people, if you have two or more capable drivers, you may want to rent two cars -- probably cheaper than one vehicle large enough for 6. And, it will give a lot more flexibility. [If you do this and budget is not a big concern, you may want to get two two-way radios with a 2-3 mile range so you can communicate between cars en route -- can be got for about $100-$150 for the pair.] From Garmish there are literally dozens of good day trips or over-nighters. I agree with Patrick that Lichtenstein, while OK, is hardly worth the long trip from Garmish, although driving there along the German Alpine Road is quite spectacular. However, Northern Italy is do-able as a long day trip, and forays into Austria and Switzerland are quite easy.

Lily

Bo Jack, your idea about the 2 way radio and 2 cars is a god one. You mentioned that Northern Italy as a day trip. This sounds great, do you have a suggestion on where to visit in N. Italy? A small town perhaps? Also, we would consider spending a night there if it would be better - any suggestions as where to stay? Thanks.

wes fowler

Lily, <BR>I would not think of northern Italy in terms of a day trip. There is a highly scenic route from Garmisch to Bellagio on the eastern bank of Lake Como that winds through Landeck and Pfunds, Austria, Susch and St-Moritz, Switzerland on to Bellagio. The distance is about 350kms and easily encompasses about five and a half hours drive time. Lake Como is extremely lovely with many lake side towns of great charm. <BR>If you take this route, or any other that passes through Austria; don't fail to get the vignette required to drive on Austrian highways. Inexpensive to acquire, its absence can result in stiff on-the-spot fines. You'll also need a vignette for travel in Switzerland. <BR>I agree with earlier posters that taking the train to Munich from Paris makes more sense that Paris-Stuttgart. If your interest is countryside and small villages, auto rental is definitely the way to travel. I have some itineraries for auto travel in Upper Bavaria that will expose you to three castles, eleven Alpine lakes, the Zugspitze, Baroque monastic churches and some spectacular scenery. If interested, Email me directly.

Hans H

As for the two-way radios, make sure that they use frequencies which are allowed in Germany for private use. I'm not sure how the situation is today but 20 years ago Germany made problems with importing US walkie-talkies. It might be the best to ask at a German embassy or consulate. Otherwise they might be confiscated when you enter the country.

bo_jack

Lily -- <BR>I don't have personal experience with going to northern Italy from Garmish [in fact, we've not been in Italy at all]. I mentioned it only because during our last trip to Garmish our apartment landlord and his wife went on a day "shopping trip" to Italy. I do know that they left early and returned late, but do not know where they went -- consistent with Wes's advice that it would be a long day. I have done a two-car trip and found it works well -- except for the frustration of communicating en route while "caravaning" with the other vehicle. It was then, that I concluded radios are "the answer" -- but, again, I haven't actually used them in this way. Han's advice seems sound; however, I don't see, as a practical matter, how radios would come to be confiscated unless you go out of your way to reveal that you have them. (I also would think that similar products could be bought in Germany -- so you might want to buy them there.) If you do plan to go to Italy, confirm with the auto rental company that the class of car you rent is OK to take into Italy. [Hertz, for example, will not approval taking BMW 500 class and similar Mercedes into Italy. But lower class cars are OK. [Basically, their principal is that one should "blend in" with local vehicles -- so there is no problem taking the higher-class cars into Austria or Switzerland.]

Jochen

<BR>Lily, <BR> <BR>your original plan ( train form Paris to Stuttgart, then drive to Garmisch ) is not as bad as one may think. By starting your drive in Stuttgart rather than in Munich you'll spend about two more hours driving, but you'll save up to 2.5 hours in the train. Furthermore, it should be cheaper for a group of six. <BR> <BR>I'd second Hans' warning concerning the use of two-way radios in Europe. The laws differ from country to country, and while I don't think they'd confiscate the radios at the border you might get into trouble when you use them. How about cell phones as an alternative ? <BR> <BR>Day trips to northern Italy are easily doable provided you use the highway over the Brenner pass. For the stretch from Innsbruck to the Brenner pass you'll have to pay a toll ( not included in the general Austrian highway vignette ), but the time saved is worth the money. For the use of Italian highways one has to pay on a per-distance-basis. <BR> <BR>Within less than two hours you can reach beautiful towns such as Vipiteno/Sterzing or Bressanone/Brixen. <BR>There are many well preserved castles and monasteries in that area ( Reifenstein close to Sterzing or Novacella/Neustift close to Brixen, just to mention a few ). You can even venture into the dolomites. By the way, this part of Italy is bilingual ( Italian and German ). That's why all places have two names. <BR> <BR>Hope that helps. <BR> <BR>Regards, Jochen

Lily

Again - THANK YOU ALL! You have all been VERY helpful to us working out some very confusing logistics. We love to travel and really enjoy adventure, but of course like to have a few ideas ahead of time in an effort to not waste time. <BR> <BR>I should explain that the reasons I chose Stuttgart over Munich are that I know the town well (years of trade shows) and therefore feel comfortable as a "starting" point. Also, as Jochen pointed out, the train ride is 2 1/2 hours shorter this way. <BR> <BR>Thanks again for all the advice - we are much better informed now!

Ruthann

Another vote for visiting Italy instead of Lichtenstein.