Germany, Austria Switzerland Itinerary
 

We are planning 16 days in Germany, Austria and Switzerland including 2 days travel to/from the US. We are planning 2 days in the Black Forest region...5 days in Bavaria/Salzburg/Tirol...and 5 days in the Berner Oberland region. Driving through Germany and Austria. Training through Switzerland. Best flight connections are through Frankfurt, Munich or Zürich, Is this doable? Can someone help us with recommendations regarding the logistics/itinerary connecting the three areas?

If you want to avoid cross-border drop-off fees on your car rental, it might be best to land in Frankfurt and drive through the Black Forest, Switzerland, Austria and end up in Munich for the return trip home.

Thank you for the information. We are traveling the last week in May/First week in June. Our intention was to end the trip in Switzerland in order to avoid seasonal closures in the Swiss Alps.

and 5 days in the Berner Oberland region. Driving through Germany and Austria. Training through Switzerland.>

what are you doing after Switzerland? You may look into the Swiss Transfer Ticket which gives you a trip from any airport or border point to anyplace in Switzerland and then another ticket back to any airport or border point and you can also buy a Half-Fare Card at 50% off and get 50% off everything that moves - including the pricey Jungfraujoch train - regular price I think over $200 p.p.

For lots of Swiss trains and passes I always highlight these IMO superb sites: www.swisstravelsystem.com; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com.

You may want to return your German car not in Munich but in Lindau, on Lake Constance - a few miles near the Swiss border and take a train from there.

Here is a chart of fares for all conveyances in the Jungfrau Region - see how many you may use and the prices and then compare with the Half-Off Pass which can be bought seprately for about $135 if not doing the Swiss Transfer Ticket which gives you a Half-Fare Card for 50% off its regular price. Swiss Transfer Tickets I believe must be bought outside of Switzerland but the Half-Fare Card can be bought at any Swiss train station TMK.

http://www.jungfrau.ch/en/tourism/tr...al-travellers/

And by not tipping they will not think you are a grippe-sou! Just doing like the French do (though some may leave a few lose change but not much).

Thank you for the information. We planned on touring Bavaria and Salzburg dropping the car back in Germany and then training to Switzerland specifically the Jungfrau region. From their we fly home. We are doing Switzerland last to avoid the seasonal closures. I appreciate all the train information. Any recommendations on where to stay in the Black Forest region?

We really enjoyed our five nights in Freiburg im Breisgau, but with only two days, you won't see a whole lot of the Black Forest. Freiburg can be reached from Zurich in under two hours, which is why we chose it as our base.

<<We are traveling the last week in May/First week in June. Our intention was to end the trip in Switzerland in order to avoid seasonal closures in the Swiss Alps.>>

Have you checked actual opening dates for what interests you in the BO? I've visited the area several times in May/June and there were still plenty of closures, with many attractions and hotels not opening until the third week of June. This may vary year to year, but you'd do well to double check so you're not disappointed.

I spoke too soon, seems more is open than I remembered:

http://www.jungfrau.ch/en/tourism/tr...-of-operation/

I actually own a second home in the Black Forest, in a town called "Schluchsee". The Black Forest is a mountain chain that stretches about 100 miles in North-South-direction.

Picturesque towns like Freiburg, Staufen, Gengenbach or Baden-Baden (which is not so picturesque but has the spa) are actually not in the Black Forest but in the Rhine Valley below the mountains or in the foothills.

The Black Forest is very scenic. You have mountains, lakes, forests, meadows, wildflowers, murmering creeks, waterfalls, and the typical Black Forest-style farmhouses with half-hipped roofs. Many farms sell their own organic mountain cheese and the famous Black Forest ham with a rich taste of fir smoke. Others have been converted to cozy inns with wood panelling and ceramic stoves.

So, for a Black Forest experience, here are my recommendations:

- For picturesque towns, I recommend Gegenbach, Staufen, Freiburg (in this order, with Freiburg being a bigger city with an impressive cathedral).
http://www.regio360.com/360/gemeinde...ach_hd_60.html
http://staufen-im-breisgau.de/index_gb.html

- For historic, farmhouse architecture and rural life, the Vogtsbauernhof open-air museum.
http://en.vogtsbauernhof.de/

- For cuckoo clocks Triberg with its stores (warning: touristy) or the German Clock Museum in Furtwangen.
http://www.visiting-germany.de/triberg.html
http://www.deutsches-uhrenmuseum.de/.../en/start.html

- For boating, swimming, watersports, scenery on of the lakes (Titisee with its lively town or the larger, quieter Schluchsee).
http://www.hochschwarzwald.de/Schluchsee#/page/1
http://www.hochschwarzwald.de/Titisee-Neustadt#/page/2

- For a mountain experience, the cable car (or hike) up to the top of the Feldberg, the highest mountain in the Black Forest.
http://www.hochschwarzwald.de/Feldberg#/page/1

- For hiking, there are endless possibilities. One of the best hikes is from the Feldberg to the Feldsee, a very scenic glacier lake. Another scenic hike is through the Wutach canyon near Lenzkirch.
http://schwarzwald.region.org/feldberg/feldsee.htm
http://www.wutachschlucht.de/#/page/1

- A very picturesque village is Menzenschwand which also has a beautiful spa with a thermal swimming pool (indoor/outdoor), saunas and hamam.
http://www.menzenschwand.eu/bilder.html
http://www.radonrevitalbad.de/

- The most scenic drives are through the valleys up into the Black Forest and south of the Feldberg (around Bernau, Todtnau, Todtmoos).

- Sankt Blasien has an impressive monastery with a baroque church and an impressive dome.
http://www.dom-st-blasien.de/home/ki...ius,l-en.xhtml

Another aspect:

The Black Forest is close to Switzerland. Travelwise, this would be the best itinerary:

- Fly into München and visit Bavaria first.
- Drive to the Black Forest.
- Drop the rental car in Freiburg.
- Take the train to Basel/Switzerland. Visit Switzerland by train.
- Fly home from Zürich.

BTW, spend a few hours in Basel. The Old Town is very picturesque and Basel is excellent in modern art.

thank you all so much for your responses. One more question. Assuming that we are in Salzburg with a car that needs to be dropped off in Germany before heading into Switzerland. Some in my party would like to head to Zermatt via one of the Panoramic trains for a view of the Matterhorn before moving onto the BO region. Any recommendations on how to proceed would be appreciated.

The panoramic train is the Glacier Express which runs from St. Moritz to Zermatt. The total train ride is from 8:02 to 16:10, so a whole-day affair.

The train from Salzburg to St. Moritz takes 6:59 with two changes of trains.

From St. Moritz to Interlaken the train takes 2:14.

For my taste, a lot of time and hassle for a panoramic train ride - with the risk of having bad weather and seeing nothing.

I would rather spend a couple of days in the Berner Oberland. From Interlaken, you can take the regular train to Brig or Visp and change there into the Glacier Express. Unfortunately, the Glacier Express arrives at Zermatt in the afternoon, so you have to stay overnight in Zermatt to explore the Matterhorn in the morning of the next day. In the afternoon you can take a regular train back to Interlaken.

http://www.glacierexpress.ch/EN/time...s/default.aspx

From St. Moritz to Interlaken the train takes 2:14.>

No it is much much longer than that - have to go via Lucerne and back up - 5 1/2 hours is the quickest, via Zurich or Lucerne and no specail scenic train most of the way.

My thanks to all of you form your input.

One scenic train you could do is to take the Golden Pass scenic train from Interlaken-Ost up and over the Brunig Pass to Lucerne - a sweet scenic ride and you can ride the official Golden Pass train or regular ones with of course the same scenery.

The Glacier Express is highly publicized so it is the most famous scenic train in Switzerland BIME it is not nearly the most scenic - but the portion you would take to Zermatt from Visp is gorgeous and short and sweet - not the 8-9 marathon the complete GE takes from St Moritz/Davos to Zermatt. But the scenery is the same on regular trains which do not demand a reservation and reservation fee of some substance.