Frustrated and need advice!
 

I have been working forever on this itinerary. I finally have it set for budget, time in each city, and allowing for transportation time which I hadn't done so well on in the beginning. It's a good itinerary according to several forums that I've posted to. It's about 300 dollars over budget for me but not for the girls I'm going with. So, I tell them we are ready to make the reservations and one wants to redo it because I don't have Sicily on the latest schedule. Can someone tell me how to include Sicily in this itinerary without going over budget more than another 100-200 dollars? We can't cut any of the cities on the list because they all want them to stay but they also want a few more added. So frustrated and ready to go on my own at this point. (Not that I'll admit it to anyone besides you all). Below is my itinerary. You've all seen it before, I've posted it often for comments/feedback. (They also want less days in Venice and Florence but I was told several times on this forum that I shouldn't cut days off of that and they don't think that another day is needed in Rome)

July 1st-leave ATL to Italy
Land on July 2nd near Venice
3 nights in Venice (July 2-4th)
3 nights in Florence (July 5th-7th)
3 nights in Cinque Terre (July 8th-10th) with day trip to Pisa on route to CinqueTerre
2 nights in Siena (July 11-12th) with day trips through Tuscany
3 nights in Rome (July 13th-15th)
Three nights in Sorrento (July 16-18th) with day trips to Capri, Naples and possibly Pompeii if time
Two Nights in Amalfi (July 19-20th)
Take train back to Naples on the day of July 21st for flight back to ATL
Arrive in ATL on July 22nd.

You can't add it in without cutting something out, especially with the financial contraints. Sicily is the largest island in the Mediterranean, it's about the size of Vermont. To do it ANY justice you would need to have at least 10 days there alone. If it's a must than I would cut out Cinque Terre & Siena, and spend 3 nights in Palermo and 2 in Taormina.

You may want to re-post this with a more specific title.

I'm sure it's hard to be responsible for planning an itinerary for multiple people. It seems you can't please everyone, and if something unexpected happens on the trip, you're the one to blame. I feel for you!

Having said that, I don't see any conceivable way you could squeeze in Sicily. It's a looooong way from the Amalfi Coast and requires a lot of time to see what's worth seeing. If it's a huge priority for everyone in the group to go, I think you'd have to cut out Venice, Cinque Terre, and ideally Florence and Siena to give you enough time for sightseeing and transit to and from Sicily. Maybe others here will have other suggestions. Good luck.

If you are spending two nights in Siena, hence one day in Tuscany, how do you plan to do day trips (pl.)? Siena itself is worth a day. You might be able to leave out Cinque Terre since you will be seeing the Almafi coast. But I do not think that it will get you down to Sicily.

When you travel with others, except for immediate family, you ask for trouble. Everyone's different. There is no right or wrong way to travel. Best way for the future is to go alone or with one intimate friend or relative. For this year perhaps you could go separately to the places you wish to see then re-join at a common site.

I also like an itinerary that is flexible, not planned to the nano-second. This way if something strikes your fancy you can explore it further. It is not how many places you see but the fun you have learning about other people, cultures.

My wife and I go to Provence every year because we learned early on that, for us, it is a paradise.

Good luck.

Anthony

Hi
You have a thankless task, I've been there.
Either tell the Sicily-lover,nicely, that she should save it for the next trip, or hold a meeting and vote on which other destination gets dropped.
Please just don't squeeze any more stops into this schedule--you only have 3 nights in Rome (not nearly enough) and a lot of inter-city travel which makes you lose more time. Not only can't you squeeze in Sicily, I'd drop at least one other stop.

I'm writing this really sincerely-
you have my sympathy.

That said, I've a Euro that says I'd very sweetly tell the "ladies" OK...here's what I suggest.. you don't like it? Do it yourselves. I'll meet you for a drink in Capri...or someplace...and I think in Italian is Buono Viaggi (?) not to be confused with buona viagra...whole other topic

I suppose what I am about to say will be ignored but here goes anyway: I have, on numerous occasions, planned trips which involved the input of others.

Since there seems to be a consensus that there is no way to squeeze in Sicily you can (and probably will) do one of two things: tell "the others" that the itinerary is SET and leave it at that; tell them it is set and that lots of other people agree with you that Sicily cannot be squeezed in.

The "difficult one" is going to act in a very predictable way: throw a little tantrum, pooch out her lips, and start sulking. This is all designed to get YOU to do more work.

For ONCE, be strong and resist; reiterate that it is set. If she persists, hand her the goodies and tell her to fix it while you go relax.

Enjoy your trip..you've earned the rest.

My goodness, That's already 13 places in 21 days!!! Do the math... is 1.6 days per place, not even factoring in transportation time. Basically 1 day per each destination you named. Yikes.

Sounds like it is too late for this trip, but this is exactly why I prefer to travel alone, or with one other person max.

Hi livi,

>I have been working forever on this itinerary. I finally have it set for budget, time in each city, and allowing for transportation time... It's a good itinerary according to several forums that I've posted to. It's about 300 dollars over budget for me but not for the girls I'm going with. <

You've done a splendid job.

I think your companions should kick in and give you $300.

As noted, you can't squeeze Sicily in as it stands.

I wouldn't go to the extra trouble of trying to redo the itinerary by dropping something(s) and adding Sicily.

A travel agent would get a hefty commission from this trip.

Have a great visit.

((I))

There is only one other person going, a very good friend who has had nothing to do with the planning. SHe's left it all up to me and now has a problem with it. I want Cinque Terre, and Venice and FLorence are a must because we've never been to Italy. (right?). I am so tempted to just go at it alone. It originally was 4 of us, two people would never set a date or commit to a time, so we ventured on our own. It's such a hassle! I've never been out of the US and feel unsure about going at it alone but I'm beginning to think it's the only way I can go and enjoy it. Thanks for all of the advice!

Livi- I haven't been following your saga so maybe there are factors I am not aware of. But that itinerary sounds quite stressful, especially moving with a group of people.

Have you or any of the women in your group traveled to Europe before? Do you realize what's involved with all the moving about? Checking in and out of hotels, getting to and from train stations and airports. Sounds like you will need at least 7 different hotel reservations on this schedule.

Maybe you could have a meeting and draw names (destinations) out of a hat, and stop when you reach five places to go to on this trip? Suggest the person who wants to go to Sicily so bad leave the group and go there on her own.

Good luck to you Livi!

Considering she isn't assisting with the planning, except for her demands, I would suggest you go it alone. If she can't compromise, you are better off by yourself. You would know know how to budget by yourself, would be able to make dicisions to suit your needs, and would not have the headaches and complaints with her at your side. Traveling with someone in this kind of situation can wreck a friendship entirely before you ever return home, or even before leaving the ground it seems.

Sociology. How many are in your party? How old are they? Bare bones? Deluxe? Really good friends or casual acquaintances? Spend some time looking at commercial tour itinaries. Are you going to get a free ticket? Please let us know how this trip comes out.

Livi, Oops we were posting at the same time. I was guessing this was a first trip because that itinerary is so brutal. It's simply too much. Travel is a lot of fun but it is also a lot of work, truth be told.

At least with just one other person that hopefully will make the logistics easier. Why not back-up a bit if you have not made reservations? Get her involved in the planning? Get the budget back down to one you are comfortable with? And limit the places you visit to 4... you could each pick the 2 you most want to see.

I don't mean to sound harsh because I feel for your situation. But better to remedy it right now, rather than proceed with what I could turn into a fairly unpleasant experience for you both.

If you really want to stick to all the places you mentioned in your original post, I would consider going on an organized tour instead of attempting to self-plan such a complex and dense itinerary on your first trip to Europe.

I appreciate all of the comments/suggestions/remarks. WE are backpacking and I have found hostels to stay in in all the areas we have selected. I've even considered travel time by looking at how long the train takes to each station into the trip. It is feasible and can be done. We are 26 and 27 and we have backpacked the Grand Canyon together and been on vacations together before but never to Europe. She's been to Italy before, I have not. We are both fairly athletic and since we are teachers-we are broke. We want to see as much of Italy as possible but this is getting out of hand. I don't want to be gone more than 3 weeks because of family, job, and most importantly money. I'll agree, the logistics of this have been a bear and thus why I'm so frustrated that after all the planning and logistics I've put into it, now suddenly Sicily and several other cities are needed to be added. I think I'll tell her that after Amalfi she can go to Sicily and I'll be going back to Naples for the flight home. Thanks again for the comments. I don't feel like I"m being so sensitive now.

Oh, for Pete's sake! Livi's itinerary is busy but far from impossible. We deleted Venice on our first trip and put an extra night in Rome, plus a night each in San Gimignano and Orvieto, but otherwise our trip was very similar and very enjoyable. (We also split the Rome stay, so as to allow for a couple nights there before flying out; would suggest you have a night in your departure gateway, but otherwise it's okay.)

Livi, consider suggesting to your friend that she do Sicily on her own (in lieu of Venice-Tuscany-Cinque Terre) you do Venice-Tuscany on your own, and then rendezvous in Rome or Sorrento. Let her know where you'll be staying, but don't attempt to book hotels/hostels for her. If your heart is set on your destinations and she's set on Sicily, maybe it's best if you split up at least part of the time. Alternatively, the rule has to be, she who does the planning calls the tune. Good luck.

Sure it's do-able and you could conceivably add Sicily. Since backpacking & moving every other day is what you want, you'll most likely have a fine trip.

As always when posting here, at first I didn't know the details (how many people, ages, experience) so we tend to post how *we* would feel doing the itinerary.

Livi, even if you don't agree with some of the thoughts, at least you know you've got people here cheering you on!

I don't think you are being overly sensitive, I think you sound organized and patient thru all this.

I agree with the previous poster who said remove cinque terre if you are going to the Amalfi coast. I have also traveled to Sicily (at the end of a trip a lot like yours) and regret trying to squeeze it in. We were too exhausted by the end of the trip (opposite of how you are supposed to feel on holiday) and the island is so large with so much to see.

Livi, I feel for you...I am leaving in two months on a trip with four other friends. All of us are experienced travelers and I've traveled with each of them before, but there have been moments when I've thought that I'm nuts!

Some random thoughts to stay sane:
-spend some time apart, even a couple days.
-leave some time unscheduled, even 1 night.
- split the planning up (you still have time to delegate something to your traveling companion).
-don't sacrifice what you want to do most; you have done all the complex planning and you will regret it if you miss what YOU really want to see.
-if the other friends you mentioned suddenly want to come, don't take on their trip planning, too!

You've already gotten a lot of good feedback on the itinerary itself from other posters, but I agree that Sicily just doesn't fit in to this trip; her going there on her own is a great idea.

And, as a fellow broke teacher, remember to bring any teacher/faculty ID you have. Sometimes you can get teacher discounts at museums and usually at car rental companies (for example, Autoeurope, but I've always gotten the car discount beforehand, when I reserve the car).Every little bit helps!
Have a great time, you will love Italy