France: "Fines Herbes" Include Dandelions?
 

a French friend is visiting and yesterday went out to my yet-to-be-tilled backyard garden and returned with what she said were "fines herbes"! Fines herbes I thought - in that weed patch - what could be 'fines herbes' - or fine herbs - voila - they were dandelions, including the yellow blooms! The other fines herbes I could understand - some chives and mint that she also found - but dandelions? And dandelion flowers?

Q - Are dandelions considered to be 'fines herbes' by the French - do they French routinely eat dandelion greens and blooms - or is my French friend as I suspect a bit out of the loop?

Fines herbes, no, but edible, yes, when young. The Italians eat a lot of this sort of thing, wilted in oil and salt, or in salads.

I suggest you read this.
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/d/dandel08.html

My chef brother says that while there is no exact recipe for fines herbes, it usually includes parsley, tarragon, chervil and chives. Marjoram is occasionally included in fines herbes as well.

I assumed the "fines" referred to their being chopped fine. No reason why that shouldn't include whatever you like that's to hand, surely? You could try nasturtiums too for a bit of a peppery kick.

"Salad" greens maybe. Fines herbs, probably not. but they should be very young--not to the bloom stage. But to each his own.

<i>it usually includes parsley, tarragon, chervil and chives.</i>

I would agree with your brother.

French markets do sell dandelions for use in salads. I have also seen seed packets of dandelions sold in stores. The French have a unique relationship with something that many of use consider nothing other than a useless weed.

I have always been amused by the French word for dandelions, <i>pissenlit</i>, and it translates exactly as you would think. The French also call it <i>Dent-de-lion</i> or lion´s tooth which is probably from where the English form originated.

Are you sure you didn't misinterpret - did she say "mauvaise herbes"?
Dandelions are eaten, both flowers and leaves, but they are also referred to as "weeds".

Thank you for that link, hetismij2, very interesting, particularly the Dandelion sandwiches.

I can recall having dandelion greens salads as a boy in southern Missouri during Depression times. It was a common and popular dish there; nothing to do with everyone being poor.

Dandelion, dan-de-lion, or in French Piss-en-lit, probably best not to think too much, but for the older man maybe a no-no :-)

Dandelions are salad, not herbs. I spent long happy times with my grandmother cutting them out of the back field for dinner.

And it is true that <I>fines herbes</I> means finely chopped herbs. There is nothing particularly <I>fine</I> about them.

one of my favorite drinks is dandelion and burdock. My aunt used to make her own, but I don't have her recipe so have to make do with the commercial stuff when I can find it.

hetismij - thanks for the informative link - have eaten dandylions before but never thought of eating the flower - Q - do Brits eat dandelions like the French - routinely or do they consider them as an edible weed?

Even though eating flowers has become fashionable in France, I have never eaten a dandelion flower for the simple reason that I was taught that by the time a dandelion blooms, it is far too late to use the leaves for salad. You have to go for the little dandelion plants that are just beginning to develop.

You have to go for the little dandelion plants that are just beginning to develop.>

ah now getting the nuances - the big old rather tough dandelions my French brought in with very mature but not over mature flowers may not be what typical French would do (and as my son says of his mother - in no way is she typically French - even though her French roots go back hundreds of years at least!

We have similar memories, Kerouac. My Mom would be cooking dinner and would call out to me, "Son, I need some Dandelions for salad to night. Go gather me enough for dinner." I would whine and grumble, but actually rather enjoyed it.

Hetismij, what kind of drink is dandelion and burdock? Never heard of it. Is it a wine, liqueur, or non-alcoholic?

Dandelion and burdock was a folk herbal drink, made by fermenting leaves (and sometimes roots) of the burdock and dandelions.

I suspect it once had medicinal claims: by the end of the nineteenth century, with sugar plentiful and cheap, it began being made on industrial quantities - usually sweetened, carbonated and bottled, and usually dispensing with the vegetables.

It was latched onto by the temperance movement at a time there were even non-alcoholic pubs, but was probably more popular sold through sweet shops in pint bottles at a time soft drink consumption was dominated by children, brands were weak and the flavour mattered more than the brand. Most shops would stock at least lemonade, orangeade, cherryade, cream soda, gingerade, d&b and sarsparilla: there were dozens of small, local businesses making undifferentiated ranges of these drinks.

Though the whole point of these drinks being aimed at children and non-drinkers was that they weren't alcoholic, it's also easy with the fermented drinks like d&b to make the process create alcohol. There was always a small part of d&b manufacturing that belonged more to the traditions of herbal wines, and some modern purists claim they taste better if allowed to retain some alcohol content.

The memory of d&b as an essential part of childhood seems limited these days to Britons (and probably only the English) of the Call the Midwife generation. There is, allegedly, a 19th century tradition that Thomas Aquinas invented it in the 13th century - but no-one's ever shown any evidence for it, Aquinas never came to Britain, there's no Dominican culture of d&b and I've never heard any Italian regarding the drink as anything other than a typical British monstrosity.

The recent re-emergence of these traditional drinks as highly niched brands in Britain (backed by venture capitalists, listings in Waitrose and exotic cocktails in Cotswold gastro-pubs) has resulted in some variants now being alcoholic.

This article churns out the Aquinas nonsense, so it's clearly not been fact checked. But most other things are kind of believable: https://summerfruitcup.wordpress.com...ktails-recipe/

Dandelion and burdock was traditionally served in chippies
Fentimans make a version which is rather nice. We have a local veg box delivered. It always contains mixed leaves which we refer to as ugos or unidentified green objects. It often contains dandelion leaves and sometimes nasturtium leaves.

Dandelion & Burdock is available in most supermarkets in this area as a carbonated drink in 2L bottles. I still buy it occasionally as a memory of childhood, though I get the "No added sugar" version.

For "real" D & B, you need to visit Fitzpatricks in Haslingden in the Rossendale Valley. http://www.mrfitzpatricks.com/ just a 15 minute drive from me.

Thank you all for the information about dandelion and burdock. I'm astounded that I never heard of it before now, seeing that I once was afflicted with an English wife, and lived in England for some time. I'll put it on my bucket list of things to try, though I wonder if I will appreciate the taste, not having had it as a child.

As an aside, I recall my British in-laws coming to the States and recoiling with disgust when they first tried our "Dr. Pepper" soft drink. To me it tasted fine, having grown up with it. To them it tasted "HORRID".

There are all kinds of delicious "weeds" that you can readily find out in your lawn and garden. We have two tortoises living in our backyard and they just forage among whatever grows there. Most of what they eat is edible for humans as well, and often quite tasty.

Most of what they eat is edible for humans as well, and often quite tasty.>

And so are the toroises!

You are not allowed in my garden PalenQ. ;)

When you go to eat weeds, they are instead referred to as "edible wild plants."

FMT - would never eat a tortoise myself but I live on a large pond and some newly arrived Chinese folks were fishing for the very very large turtles we have in the pond - snapping turtles which can grow to be very very large and decades old - i consider it a sacrilege to angle for such old and noble creatures but to them it was just another food source - they were told that it was not allowed - they just did not understand or would not have been doing it. Culture clash - I guess everything that moves in China is fair game for the table, including dogs and cats in the far western provinces!

The recent re-emergence of these traditional drinks as highly niched brands in Britain (backed by venture capitalists, listings in Waitrose and exotic cocktails in Cotswold gastro-pubs) has resulted in some variants now being alcoholic.>

flanneur - thanks as usual for the erudite eloquent take on dandelion-dock brew - maybe you can capitalize on it for the American market - if enough booze in it it could be a quirky thing that takes off! You could make zillions off weeds from your Cotswold estate perhaps!

I remember my father, whose parents were French, going out into our front yard to collect dandelions for salad that he would serve usually after dinner. Who knows what one might find in a "salade mixte"?

Wow - she's been eating pis-en-lit salads practically every meal - dandelions nearly extinct in my garden - she loves em!

A casual glance could easily assume dandelion leaves were rocket.

The Greeks eat dandelion leaves amongst other weeds, it is called horta which is a generic term for greens, usually wild. They are delicious. Steamed dandelions are quite bitter but with olive oil and lemon juice very tasty. They appear on restaurant menus sometimes.

I know this thread is about dandelions, but since herbs were mentioned in the title, I feel an imperious need to mention how wonderful fresh tarragon is. When I was living with my grandparents in Lorraine, my grandmother often asked me to go out and get some sprigs from the tarragon bush that grew on the sunny side of the garage wall across the garden.

She would chop the leaves into salad, but she would also use it when baking veal or pork among other things, not to mention using it as an element of her marvellous pâtés. Probably a lot of people have tasted tarragon as a dried herb in a jar, but really the fresh leaves will absolutely blow your mind.

It's not just in China that people will eat anything that moves. Poor people in the US, Great Britain and every other country in the world will eat anything they can to survive - turtles, squirrels, alligators, and insects are very tasty, if you know how to prepare them.
Crayfish were promoted as edible protein under Huey P Long's administration, in an effort to keep the people of Louisiana from starving. Now they are consumed by the tons at backyard parties and in fine restaurants - but before Long's program, they were only used as bait.

Unfortunately, Louisiana crayfish were imported to France about 50 years ago and have become an invasive species which is destroying the ecosystem of southwest France, not to mention damaging the sides of canals and waterways with their huge burrows.

Farmers Markets in NYC sell dandelion green for about $3 a bunch. In spring, I make salads with them, using a bacon/mustard/vinegar/shallot dressing. Had this for dinner a few nights ago. It is not just Greeks and Italians who eat dandelion greens!