Ditto what Stu says, especially regarding Monaco, which I would either skip entirely or devote maybe two hours to. Certainly not a place to rent an apartment in - UGH!

Some (I repeat some) gites are offered for as little as a long weekend or 4 days, but certainly not all of them (by far) and not in high season but on the shoulders

If you have visited Paris once, and your family not at all, why would you not share that premier experience. I have been numerous times, and haven't near "seen it all".
Switzerland is a wonderful country and worth a "drive through", but I find it not as interesting as so many other places.
You are going on a Mediterranean cruise, and then want to stay a week on the Mediterranean? That is a little like double dipping to me, when you plan to omit Paris. Not that I don't love Provence, but that is different.
I might suggest that one trip with our family we started in Luxembourg, since we flew Icelandair. Went to Heidelberg, Munich, Austria, Switzerland, etc. YOu could fashion a loop with your cities, (we didn't do Prague but did go to Italy--only 3 weeks and no cruises), starting and ending in Paris. Luxembourg is very close via train from Paris.
I don't think you have said how old your "family" is. Our kids helped plan the trip somewhat. It was a GREAT trip.

If you're concerned about time commitment regarding gite rental, just because you must _rent_ the gite for a week doesn't mean you have to _stay_ in the gite for a week.

My family rented a gite but only used 4 nights -- it was still much more comfortable and much less expensive than a couple of hotel rooms.

(I apologize if this sounds stupidly obvious, but it was something it took me a while to realize when I was planning that trip.)

Hi Stu, StCirq, bilboburgler and Gretchen,

I will look for a gite in or near Nice. Thank you.

The Mediterranean cruise is more of the Eastern Med (Italy, Greece, Turkey, Croatia). It's out of Venice and is a good price. We have never cruised before and are all pretty excited about this part of the trip. Might be a nice break from land travelling in the middle of our journey.

I am getting feedback from my family as I plan.

My husband wants to mostly visit some highlights of France & Germany.

My 16 year old son wants to visit France & Germany as well as he is seriously into the world wars and wants to see all he can regarding this subject.

My 6 year old daughter is a bit too young for this trip but we don't have much choice as this is the last summer we will be able to travel with our son. We cannot move too fast with her.

We have friends in Luxembourg we would like to visit for a couple of nights only.

I wish to see mostly Prague, Austria and Switzerland. I could omit Switzerland to spend more time in other countries. That darn chocolate train in the Alps keeps bringing me back:) I haven't done enough research on Austria yet so don't know if I could give that up yet.

We all want to visit Auschwitz in Poland but cannot seem to be able to fit it in.

I still have a problem with where to start and where to end and so am unsure how to order the countries. Thought at first we would start in Prague, then Austria, the cruise out of Venice (relaxation week), Switzerland, Germany, Luxembourg, and finally southern France (another relaxation week) then northern France and fly home out of Paris.

Then I thought maybe better to fly into Paris (less expensive than flying into Prague). Then do northern France, on to Luxembourg, Germany, cruise (relaxation week), then it gets messy ... Switzerland, Austria, Prague then south France (relaxation week) then back to Paris to fly home. It doesn't really work this way.

Any ideas would be appreciated!

Diane

Hi Diane - for the south of France I think you would like staying in Nice. From there it is easy and very affordable to travel to Monaco, Cannes, Antibes, Villefranche sur Mer, etc. We rented our apartment through Homelidays.com.
Micheline from Ottawa.

A substitute for Auschwitz (not the same, but close enough for me) is Dachau outside of Munich. If your son is a car lover there is also the BMW factory.
Are you considering driving any of this?
Even if cruising isn't the same as the French coast, there would seem to me to be a lot more of interest.
As I suggested, arriving and departing from Paris makes a good loop.
You could rent a car at CDG and go to Normandy.
Return to Paris, train to Luxembourg. Train to Munich (or drive). I can't quite visualize the map but make your loop back to Paris, saving a week for that great city, and its environs. Take some time off the mediterranean, and Switzerland. Just my thoughts. Look at a map and connect the dots.

Getchen,

You are too funny. I'm going to have to reserve some time in Paris just for you:) It's a wonderful city; that's for sure.

Yes, we are going to Dachau. It's already on the agenda!

Where is the BMW factory? In Munich? My husband is the car lover.

Did you mean the French coast would be more interesting or the cruise? I couldn't quite understand what you meant.

Is there no trains from Paris to Normandy?

We are trying to avoid driving altogether. I don't really want to and my husband doesn't know how to drive a standard ... which means I would be doing all the driving and that's not a holiday for me:(

I've looked at various maps until I turned blue and the dots are still not connecting properly:(

Diane

>>my husband doesn't know how to drive a standard <<

Then rent an automatic.

Stu Dudley

Oh they have those in France?!:)

Diane

First of all, your France question has turned into a pan-European itinerary question. I think you should start a new thread, as people who know a lot about Prague will hardly look into this thread. So you may miss out on potential information.

You should maybe also elaborate a bit on why you find a cruise essential. If you need a week to rest (which is no bad idea at all) why not rent a house on the beach and just stay there. Should be cheaper than a cruise anyway.
In July it should be lavender season in Provence. You can get gîtes there around Sault (which has a bit of elevation already so it does not get that hot) and stay right in the lavender fields, stroll around, get some wine and cheese from the next village and relax.

If your son is interested in WWII sites, he won't find much in Munich except for Dachau. Though Munich has the BMW factory which you can tour.
Most to see re. WWII is in Berlin, then maybe Nuremberg for the party rally grounds. The Eagle's Nest near Berchtesgaden is more folklore than anything meaningful. So is Neuschwanstein. If you get the chance to visit one or two castles on the Loire you have no reason to waste a day on Neuschwanstein.

Switzerland AND Austria may be a bit too much. Pick either. Switzerland if you can afford it, Austria if you want the same mountains for less money.

Instead of the famous middle Rhine valley you can do easy day trips from Luxembourg to the Moselle valley (even by train). As scenic, less tourists.

Prague is a good choice. Stick with it.
Nearby Prague you will find Terezin concentration camp. It will much easier to reach than Auschwitz.

Don't expect all your destinations to have a railway station. Or to be easily accessible by train.
You can play around with bahn.com to get an idea how easily or hard it is to get from A to B by train and buses only.
It will be very easy to get from Paris to Nice by train.
It will be a day's journey with several transfers to get from some Normandy village to a gîte in the middle of Provence.

For some legs it may more sensible to fly. There is no way to say in advance if it will be sensible to use only trains, or a mix of trains and rental cars, or also flights.

As Stu said, if your hubby can't drive stick, just rent an automatic.

I think that you shoul be renting a car for at least some of this -- more cost effective for a family of 4 and much more efficient for getting to some of the places that you want to see. Is that not an option?

Hi kerouac,

Renting a car is an option but we would rather not. I'm just thinking about the big cities, signs in a language other than English, parking issues, being jetlaged etc. etc. Yikes!

Diane

Hi Cowboy1968,

I am so amazed by this Forum. Everyone has been so helpful.

Thank you for all your information. I need some time to digest and understand it, then I will start a new clean post about Prague or other country. I tried to separate the countries at the beginning but that just confused the issue. However, this one is getting far too long.

The cruise is not essential ... just something we want to do.

We will be renting a gite or house on the beach in Cote d'Azure for our second week of relaxation. I think we need to slow down a couple of times since we have a 6 year old with us. I want to keep her interested in our journey.

I love all your other suggestions.

Included with our Eurail Pass is a Rhine River cruise. Not sure where to start this cruise and where it goes and how to make it a good fit with our spree.

Diane

P.S. Are there cowboys in Europe or are you writing from the USA or Western Canada?:)

<i>We are trying to avoid driving altogether.</i>

Chances are that it is impossible if you are renting a <i>gite</i>.

The idea of not driving is simply incompatible with a lot of your plans. Trains don't go to battlefields. Trains don't go to (most) beaches. Trains don't go to gîtes...etc.

So your choices are: rethink what you want to see and what type of accommodations you want to stay in; rethink your transportation plans; or plan to shell out a LOT of money taking tours and taking public transportation from train stations to wherever you are headed,and back.

I suggest you table the idea of the Global Pass for the moment and focus on organizing your trip. I suspect you are among the many people who begin with the notion of a train pass and then try to wrap trip plans around it - not, IMO, a sensible approach. Once you've nailed down where you are going and what you want to do, THEN it's time to face the transportation issues.

With regard to your specific concerns about driving:

1. Big cities: Don't drive in them. That's when you use trains - between cities.

2. Parking: As long as you avoid the big cities in a car, it's not an issue.

3.Signs in a language other than English: There are international driving symbols readily available on the internet and on any atlas and most maps. It will take you about 10 minutes to learn the few you'll need. Other than the actual names of places that are on road signs, you might have to learn 25 words (sortie, entrée, Ausfahrt, Einfahrt, etc.) in foreign languages (and you should be learning a few for this trip anyway).

4. Jetlag: Easy. Plan the trip so you don't drive with it. That probably just means don't drive the day you land.

If you think I am funny for saying "connect the dots", you may not have planned as many trips as I using it. It really really DOES work well--and gives away the outliers.

Just a word about the Eurailpass. It isn't the be all and end all and can be so much more expensive and less convenient than even point to point tickets, and most especially for a group, renting a car. Use planes, trains AND automobiles for a trip that gets you places you want to go.

As for your plan to take a cruise (still sea and beaches) and stay on the Cote d'azur (sea and beaches)--one or the other--not both, is what I was suggesting.

PLEASE don't start a new thread ("this one is getting far too long"). It REALLY will confuse everything, and all the answers or suggestions you have already gotten will either be lost or repeated by new people.

Oh, and don't go to Paris for me. Do it for YOUR family--maybe the greatest city in the world, and you'd keep it your secret?

"Switzerland (a few days here seeing one city ... not sure which one ... and the chocolate train out of Montreux ... a 10 hour journey)"

Don't waste your time on the cities of Switzerland. Head to the Berner Oberland. It's what you imagine Switzerland to be, and there is lots for your children to do--trotti bikes (scooters) down the mountainside, alpine slides, chairlifts, beautiful hikes to delightful stops at tucked away restaurants.

Another vote for Paris. We are heading to France next June. I have been to Paris a number of times, and as much as I love Paris, I would prefer to head to some places I have never been before. However, my 15 year old son has not been to Paris since he was 8, and that was only a brief visit. So we are spending a few days there so he can see the most beautiful city in the world.

I used a Eurailpass on a trip 40 years ago, and I loved it -- but I basically went only to major cities.

It was instantly obvious that such a pass is no good for anything other than that. On top of that, very many trains now require reservations, and from what I have read, it is a real pain to try to get reservations all the time before you get on a train -- and it is not always free.

Back in "my" Eurail days, I could jump on about 98% of the trains and just look for a seat, which was generally very easy with the 1st class pass that I possessed (can you imagine? -- $300 for 3 months!!!!!). At least in France, I would say that more than 70% of the main line trains now require advance reservations.