First Time Trip to Europe
Oct 25th, 2005, 03:52 PM
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First Time Trip to Europe
Will be taking first trip to europe, in May. Madrid, Barcelona, Marseille(?), Florence, Rome and Venice. Any suggestions on afforable hotels in these cities? Also any suggestions on what we should definatly make time to see and what we should skip?
Please provide any helpful info.
Please provide any helpful info.
Oct 25th, 2005, 04:10 PM
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How much time for the whole trip?
What do you consider affordable per night?
Is it a two-person room you will need?
You might want to start by clicking at the top of this screen on Destinations so you can narrow down what your interests are.
You must have some ideas of what you want to see, since you've already picked your cities. Help us out a little.
What do you consider affordable per night?
Is it a two-person room you will need?
You might want to start by clicking at the top of this screen on Destinations so you can narrow down what your interests are.
You must have some ideas of what you want to see, since you've already picked your cities. Help us out a little.
Oct 25th, 2005, 04:39 PM
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We're going to try to do this in 2 weeks ( my travel agent friend says it's do-able, although each stop will be very quick). We're traveling via train from Madrid to Venice. We're thinking these were some stops we'd like to make (depending on time), though as we get closer we may decide otherwise.
What's affordable? $75-100/person per night. The problem I'm running into is that there are 3 of us, from what I hear it's a little hard to get a triple.
What's affordable? $75-100/person per night. The problem I'm running into is that there are 3 of us, from what I hear it's a little hard to get a triple.
Oct 25th, 2005, 05:03 PM
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>>We're going to try to do this in 2 weeks ( my travel agent friend says it's do-able, although each stop will be very quick).<<
Get a new travel agent - or a new friend. Better yet, save some $$$ and rent a Rick Steves video & visit these cities from home.
Rome, Venice, & Florence can possibly be done in 2 weeks - and that's what I suggest you do. I assume your 2 full weeks exclude arrival & departure days.
Stu Dudley
Get a new travel agent - or a new friend. Better yet, save some $$$ and rent a Rick Steves video & visit these cities from home.
Rome, Venice, & Florence can possibly be done in 2 weeks - and that's what I suggest you do. I assume your 2 full weeks exclude arrival & departure days.
Stu Dudley
Oct 25th, 2005, 05:30 PM
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Six cities in 14 days, if you have two travel days from the US and back, and then add travel time between cities? You'll see a lot of airports and train stations I think. Please, I'm NOT meaning this as sarcastic, but want to make sure you have thought this through. You are definitely trying to cover too much territory I think. I'ts hard on a first trip especially, you want to do it all, and you simply just cannot. It's your trip, your money, your time,your choice, but you might want to rethink just a bit.
Oct 25th, 2005, 05:50 PM
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Oh 1st_timer, has this travel agent friend of yours made this trip that you are talking about? I can't imagine any travel expert telling you it is doable. Well of course it is if you just want to spend your entire two weeks traveling via train without any time to ever enjoy the various spots you will be going through.
I heartly agree with others here. I would gently suggest that you either visit Spain (to which I have never been) or visit Italy.
I would suggest if you want to see Italy that you buy an open jaw (multi city) airline ticket. For example, fly into Venice, visit there, train to Florence, visit there and than train to Rome. Visit Rome and fly home from Rome.
I won't comment on Spain/France since I have not had the pleasure of visiting there.
Do some research on your own. Please do not take your travel agent friends advice. It sounds like a nightmare. Best wishes to you.
I heartly agree with others here. I would gently suggest that you either visit Spain (to which I have never been) or visit Italy.
I would suggest if you want to see Italy that you buy an open jaw (multi city) airline ticket. For example, fly into Venice, visit there, train to Florence, visit there and than train to Rome. Visit Rome and fly home from Rome.
I won't comment on Spain/France since I have not had the pleasure of visiting there.
Do some research on your own. Please do not take your travel agent friends advice. It sounds like a nightmare. Best wishes to you.
Oct 25th, 2005, 06:10 PM
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1st timer
Start by trying to fit your trip into as near a straight line, or at most a gentle curve, as possible. With minimum time, this 'shape' of trip is the most efficient.
With a good map, you will quickly see that Venice will require a detour, and you don't have time for detours.
You can also save time by moving the start and finish points of your trip closer together. Consider dropping either Madrid (start in Barcelona) or Rome (finish in Florence). I suggest you drop Madrid since Rome is a lot closer to Florence, than Madrid to Barcelona.
There's quite a bit of territory between Florence and Barcelona. You need to add some stops there just to break up the distance.
You need to get this part of the trip constructed before considering hotels, sightseeing, and so forth. You might consider 3 nights Barcelona, 1 near Perpignan, 2 Nice, 2 Italian Riviera, 2 or 3 Florence, 3 or 4 Rome. Believe me, even this is quite a quick trip.
Start by trying to fit your trip into as near a straight line, or at most a gentle curve, as possible. With minimum time, this 'shape' of trip is the most efficient.
With a good map, you will quickly see that Venice will require a detour, and you don't have time for detours.
You can also save time by moving the start and finish points of your trip closer together. Consider dropping either Madrid (start in Barcelona) or Rome (finish in Florence). I suggest you drop Madrid since Rome is a lot closer to Florence, than Madrid to Barcelona.
There's quite a bit of territory between Florence and Barcelona. You need to add some stops there just to break up the distance.
You need to get this part of the trip constructed before considering hotels, sightseeing, and so forth. You might consider 3 nights Barcelona, 1 near Perpignan, 2 Nice, 2 Italian Riviera, 2 or 3 Florence, 3 or 4 Rome. Believe me, even this is quite a quick trip.
Oct 25th, 2005, 09:24 PM
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We just returned from Italy on the 11th of October. We stayed a total of 10 days and visited Rome, Venice, and florence. My husband and I are extremely active and enjoy walking and hiking; so the hustle and bustle of this trip was no problem.
* anyway 10 days was fine, but fast. I would have preferred a total of 14 days for just those 3 cities and would of used the extra days for a few day trips to the south of italy.
My question to you, is are you giving Spain enough justice? My husband and I are planning a trip to Spain in May 06 and definitely will go for 10 days.
Just ask yourself, are you there just to see landmarks, or to see landmarks, enjoy your trip, and remember it? If it's just to see landmarks, then you may be okay; but if you want to remember your trip, I suggest do Spain or Italy in 2 weeks, not both.
* anyway 10 days was fine, but fast. I would have preferred a total of 14 days for just those 3 cities and would of used the extra days for a few day trips to the south of italy.
My question to you, is are you giving Spain enough justice? My husband and I are planning a trip to Spain in May 06 and definitely will go for 10 days.
Just ask yourself, are you there just to see landmarks, or to see landmarks, enjoy your trip, and remember it? If it's just to see landmarks, then you may be okay; but if you want to remember your trip, I suggest do Spain or Italy in 2 weeks, not both.
Oct 25th, 2005, 10:27 PM
#11
LoveItaly: "I can't imagine any travel expert telling you it is doable" Well, 1st_timer didn't say it was a "travel expert", it was a "travel agent". Not often the same thing . . . .
1st_timer_in_europe: As the others have said your plan is very nearly impossible. And IF it were doable you literally would spend more time in train stations/trains/planes/airports than in most of your cities.
Before making any firm plans that you can't get out of - hopefully you haven't already booked all your transport -- you need to sit down w/ a map and decide which 3 or 4 of these cities are most important to you.
And factor in that every time you move from one city to the next you lose 1/2 to a full day. This includes packing, checkout, getting to train station or airport, travel time, and transfer/check in at the next town. So w/ your plan you will only have about 7 or 8 actual full days for sightseeing. Or 1+ day per city. That is nuts.
If it were me - I'd do EITHER just Italy or just Spain.
1st_timer_in_europe: As the others have said your plan is very nearly impossible. And IF it were doable you literally would spend more time in train stations/trains/planes/airports than in most of your cities.
Before making any firm plans that you can't get out of - hopefully you haven't already booked all your transport -- you need to sit down w/ a map and decide which 3 or 4 of these cities are most important to you.
And factor in that every time you move from one city to the next you lose 1/2 to a full day. This includes packing, checkout, getting to train station or airport, travel time, and transfer/check in at the next town. So w/ your plan you will only have about 7 or 8 actual full days for sightseeing. Or 1+ day per city. That is nuts.
If it were me - I'd do EITHER just Italy or just Spain.
Oct 25th, 2005, 10:43 PM
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Don't feel bad, 1st timer in europe, everyone picks on you the first time you try to plan a trip to Europe. Same thing happened to me. But they're right though! I live in southern California...If you asked me if Disneyland, Knott's Berry Farm, and Disney's Calfornia Adventures are doable in 1 day, I'd have to say, technically, yes, it's possible. But WHY would you want to do them all in 1 day, when any 1 of those parks has enough to delight you for a whole day? It's possible, but NOT ADVISABLE!
Oct 25th, 2005, 11:47 PM
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Hello janisj, I believe you misread my post to 1st_timer. I will repeat " I can't imagine any travel expert telling you it is doable....." I was gently trying to say to 1st_timer_in Europe that their travel agent friend was not a travel expert. I believe that we all agree that trying to visit all of these places in 2 weeks was not good travel advice.
Oct 26th, 2005, 03:04 AM
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I have to agree with everyone else. To give you an idea on train travel, my friends went from Florence to Barcelona by train. It literally took them 22 hours to get from one city to the other. While I think it can be done in less time, I would think maybe just 2-4hrs less. You'd be taking an overnight train, not getting much sleep due to the shaking trian I bet, and then try to see a city on poor sleep. It just isn't advisable.
Marseille would be more doable, if your target is either Spain or Italy. It's more of a half-way mark between the two, although it's still a bit of a hike. I would recommend (like everyone else here) that you pick one of these countries (Italy or Spain) and try to go back to the other on a different trip.
Florence, Rome and Venice could each take 3-4 days easily for you to properly enjoy the cities.
Marseille would be more doable, if your target is either Spain or Italy. It's more of a half-way mark between the two, although it's still a bit of a hike. I would recommend (like everyone else here) that you pick one of these countries (Italy or Spain) and try to go back to the other on a different trip.
Florence, Rome and Venice could each take 3-4 days easily for you to properly enjoy the cities.
Oct 26th, 2005, 03:24 AM
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Rather than dwelling on the negative much less telling you, "gently" or otherwise, about how undoable this may or may not be and also since I have no idea how much depth you want out of each stop I'll offer my own suggestions.
I usually travel by train in Europe and have done every one of the routes you are talking about. If you want to do most of these places I suggest you consider flying between Madrid and Barcelona which will cut the 4-5 hours trip down to one hour and a few minutes. Iberia and Spanair compete HEAVILY on that route and if you purchase tickets early enough you can usually get a good deal.
You can take an overnight train from Barcelona to Milan but that would mean cutting out Marseilles (yeah, I would definitely forget that city) or you could possibly find a budget flight out of Barcelona (check out www.whichbudget.com).
You also might consider cutting out one of the three cities mentioned in Italy.
I agree that you are "covering quite a distance" but it can be done...not in depth but then again, you say nothing of the "depth' you want.
No, you are NOT stupid and no you are not foolish...it really depends on what you want to get out of the trip and how much moving around you are willing to do.
I usually travel by train in Europe and have done every one of the routes you are talking about. If you want to do most of these places I suggest you consider flying between Madrid and Barcelona which will cut the 4-5 hours trip down to one hour and a few minutes. Iberia and Spanair compete HEAVILY on that route and if you purchase tickets early enough you can usually get a good deal.
You can take an overnight train from Barcelona to Milan but that would mean cutting out Marseilles (yeah, I would definitely forget that city) or you could possibly find a budget flight out of Barcelona (check out www.whichbudget.com).
You also might consider cutting out one of the three cities mentioned in Italy.
I agree that you are "covering quite a distance" but it can be done...not in depth but then again, you say nothing of the "depth' you want.
No, you are NOT stupid and no you are not foolish...it really depends on what you want to get out of the trip and how much moving around you are willing to do.
Oct 26th, 2005, 04:07 AM
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Ack! In my earlier post, I suggested Perpignan as a stop, I meant to say "Montpellier". Sorry, middle-aged moment.
Each of the following legs is about 4.5 to 5 hours by train: Barcelona-Montpellier; Montpellier-Nice; Nice-La Spezia (Italian Riviera); from La Spezia it's about 2.0 hours to Florence (a little longer if you stay somewhere west of La Spezia). So using Montpellier, Nice, and somewhere near La Spezia as stops in between Barcelona and Florence, makes the journey manageable, although the sightseeing time at any of those intermediate stops would be limited to severely limited. Good luck!
Each of the following legs is about 4.5 to 5 hours by train: Barcelona-Montpellier; Montpellier-Nice; Nice-La Spezia (Italian Riviera); from La Spezia it's about 2.0 hours to Florence (a little longer if you stay somewhere west of La Spezia). So using Montpellier, Nice, and somewhere near La Spezia as stops in between Barcelona and Florence, makes the journey manageable, although the sightseeing time at any of those intermediate stops would be limited to severely limited. Good luck!
Oct 26th, 2005, 04:20 AM
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Hi, 1st Timer. You're doing just the right thing--putting out a potential plan and then gather information about it.
First, I'll agree with most of the other folks on the original plan--you'll be spending a lot of time traveling as opposed to being places. If all of you are high-energy, short attention span people, this might be OK. But I would really recommend limiting the trip to either Spain (and possibly Portugal) or Italy (and possibly parts of Austria).
If you do end up going to Venice and have trouble finding an affordable triple in the main part of historic Venice, here's another possibility.
The island of Murano (the glass-blowing island) is a short vaporetto ride from the main city--and has somewhat more interest and charm than other options like Mestre (an industrial city on the mainland) or the Lido (the beach resort island--not at its best until summer). We had friends on a tight budget who had a triple at the Locanda al Soffiador on Murano.
http://www.venicehotel.it/
It cost them about 125 euro a night for the triple with ceiling fan, A/C and breakfast. It was basic, but serviceable. You do have to use the vaporetto system to get from Murano to the main part of Venice--about a 10 minute ride after you get on the boat. But you'll likely want to have a vaporetto pass anyway.
It would be better to stay right in the historic part of the city, but this is a viable budget alternative.
First, I'll agree with most of the other folks on the original plan--you'll be spending a lot of time traveling as opposed to being places. If all of you are high-energy, short attention span people, this might be OK. But I would really recommend limiting the trip to either Spain (and possibly Portugal) or Italy (and possibly parts of Austria).
If you do end up going to Venice and have trouble finding an affordable triple in the main part of historic Venice, here's another possibility.
The island of Murano (the glass-blowing island) is a short vaporetto ride from the main city--and has somewhat more interest and charm than other options like Mestre (an industrial city on the mainland) or the Lido (the beach resort island--not at its best until summer). We had friends on a tight budget who had a triple at the Locanda al Soffiador on Murano.
http://www.venicehotel.it/
It cost them about 125 euro a night for the triple with ceiling fan, A/C and breakfast. It was basic, but serviceable. You do have to use the vaporetto system to get from Murano to the main part of Venice--about a 10 minute ride after you get on the boat. But you'll likely want to have a vaporetto pass anyway.
It would be better to stay right in the historic part of the city, but this is a viable budget alternative.
Oct 26th, 2005, 04:54 AM
#18
LoveItaly: No, I totally got what you meant. I wasn't disagreeing w/ you at all. Just using a bit more heavy handed and less subtle way of saying the same thing - Just in case 1st_timer didn't get it the first time.
Oct 26th, 2005, 07:30 AM
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Lots of first timers look at the trips on the big bus tours and think they can do the same trip. Things to consider are that with those types of tours everything is planned and taken care of for you and they will do a lot of "drive by" sightseeing.
I personally like to tour Europe at autobahn speeds but I have been there before so I can skip over stuff I have seen before when I want to.
I remember Rick Steves showing a planning session for a trip by writing down the cities and the number of days he wanted to stay in each one. Then he added travel time in between and had to cut out some of the places that were lower on his list.
I think I would start with travel books or videos on the cities you want to include and see if you can get an idea of how much of your time you want to give each one.
Happy planning. This is my favorite part of the trip, the planning part, because it is where you can dream a lot.
I personally like to tour Europe at autobahn speeds but I have been there before so I can skip over stuff I have seen before when I want to.
I remember Rick Steves showing a planning session for a trip by writing down the cities and the number of days he wanted to stay in each one. Then he added travel time in between and had to cut out some of the places that were lower on his list.
I think I would start with travel books or videos on the cities you want to include and see if you can get an idea of how much of your time you want to give each one.
Happy planning. This is my favorite part of the trip, the planning part, because it is where you can dream a lot.
Oct 26th, 2005, 09:03 AM
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I have been to Europe several times in school and for work. But several years ago my wife and 2 good friends of ours went on a 2 week trip. We did London, Paris, Alps, Innsbruck, Florence, and Rome in that 2 week time. We are currently planning a trip for next spring which will be Athens, Greek Island, Venice, Dolomites, Lake Como, Barcelona in 2 weeks. As you have read some call this crazy but for us it works great. While these trips are whirlwind tours we like all the different stuff we see. We're not the types to want to sit and relax on a Greek Island for a few days or hang out in a big city for 5 days. It IS possible to see a lot and still have peaceful moments at the same time.
As a first time traveler to Europe I think the whirlwind trip works well as it gets you a good overview of Europe and lets you start planning future trips where you can settle down a bit more in a smaller area.
The important thing to consider is how much time you'll spend traveling. Carefully lay out your itenirary and really think it through. Make sure you understand how much time you've given yourself at each stop. (this is really important on whirlwind trips)Include some night trains where possible to keep the days open and try to not include too many all day travel days as it eats up your touring time. During our London to Rome trip we only had 1 full train day...most of the rest were several hour trips.
As a first time traveler to Europe I think the whirlwind trip works well as it gets you a good overview of Europe and lets you start planning future trips where you can settle down a bit more in a smaller area.
The important thing to consider is how much time you'll spend traveling. Carefully lay out your itenirary and really think it through. Make sure you understand how much time you've given yourself at each stop. (this is really important on whirlwind trips)Include some night trains where possible to keep the days open and try to not include too many all day travel days as it eats up your touring time. During our London to Rome trip we only had 1 full train day...most of the rest were several hour trips.
