jeff

Family of four is considering a trip to Austria and Germany this summer. We are trying to decide whether to book a tour or travel alone. While we normally like to travel on our own schedule, the logistics of a European trip seem difficult. Would appreciate any thoughts on using a tour as well as any recommendations on tour companies. Thanks.

stee

It would probably be much cheaper to travel on your own and you get to go where you want and do what you want. <BR><BR>However, if the potential language problems are an obstacle, I would probably go the tour route for a first tour. After you have gone to Europe once, it is easy to go on your own.<BR><BR>Highlights for me in these countries are: Rhine River cruise, Rothenburg, Neuschwanstein, and Salzburg

Wayne

Even as a first-time traveler, especially to these countries, you could do it independently and have no problems. You get so much more out of going at your own pace if you have prepared yourselves properly by studying a bit about the areas you'll visit. With the internet you can make all your reservations well ahead of time, and with some study of the basics of the language and of the road signage, you'll be able to get around easily---but have a good, detailed road map if you rent a car, not one of those little maps the car rental company hands you when you check in. So if you have the time and inclination to study, and the aptitude for learning a few German words, you will have a ball. Otherwise, for a really special tour I would recommend one of the tours by Grand Circle Travel or Vantage Tours. You will find, though, that there are a zillion other tour companies; and most of them are pretty good. I know these two are among the best.

Barbara

Hi Jeff. We are a family of three and travelled three yeears ago to Austria, Germany and Switzerland. Although my husband and I had been on several tours to Europe, we wanted to do Europe "our way". We had so much fun we are going back to Europe this summer. Planning is the key. We booked small hotels near the rail station that welcomed kids(our son was 9 years old at that time). We took trains for most of the trip and rented a car for the last week in Germany. Planning your own trip allows you to see and do what you and your family wants to do when you want to do it.

Liz

Get a copy of Rick Steves "Europe through the back door". It will give you the information and confidence to do it on your own.

Lee

Jeff, you have already received some very good information and I second the recommendation made by Liz. The Eyewitness Guides and Fodor's also have good info on Germany. We pick up one prior to just about any trip and they really help with all kinds of details. I lived in Germany about 13 years ago and have been back about three times in the last five years, so it's easier for me, but I would always 'go it alone' and not opt for a tour. If you do some research and make some preparations, your trip can be relaxing and fun. Do your homework and it won't be difficult.<BR><BR>I suggest that you solicit Wes Fowler on this board. He can suggest some delightful itineraries to you. If I can help with something specific, email me.

Philip

I have taken tours with Globus and have liked them (www.globusandcosmos.com). Their cheaper cousin is Cosmos.<BR><BR>The positive side of taking a tour:<BR>you have very knowledgeable guides (Globus hires professionals in the major cities to give you the "city" tours), the tour company does everything for you including booking your flights and arranging airport transportation, many times you go to the head of the line at popular tourist attractions, a reputable tour company will not book you into "Hotel Hell", it's usually cheaper by tour because they get discounts for groups<BR><BR>Negative of taking a tour: you are stuck on a bus with 30 other people and the bus only stops every two hours for pee breaks, sometimes a tour tries to cover too much ground and you end up tired and overwhelmed, if dinner is included in the package it will always be at the hotel and it may not be the most palatable and you usually don't have a choice (you can end up eating the same thing three nights in a row), sometimes the hotels are quite a distance from any identifiable life form<BR><BR>Planning a European trip is not that difficult for Germany/Austria. Many citizens there speak good English and many of the restaurants have English menus.<BR><BR>I would suggest picking a few cities as home base and making daytrips out to see other places. For example, Munich makes a great city as a home base. Germany has an excellent train system and one railpass will get you unlimited train travel on certain days.<BR><BR>If you decide to plan it for yourself, I can recommend the book "Daytrips Germany" by Earl Steinbicker. Mr. Steinbicker suggests a few base cities and explains what you can see by public transportation in the area.

Dougd

Jeff, my wife and I visited Austria 2 years ago - we planned the whole trip on our own, and did great. Planning the trip was actually half of the fun. We got a big Michelin map of the country, plotted out a rough driving itinery, and then spent hours on the web and at the local Borders pouring over travel books. Austria is a very friendly, easy to get around in country.I'm sure Germany is the same. In the large cities, most people spoke at least some English. We did borrow a German language tape from our local library, and played it several times before our trip. Aside from getting lost driving out of Vienna during rush hour, everything couldn't have gone smoother. Even though we booked most of our hotels over the phone or on the web well before our trip, we did leave a few nights open to find small places on the spur of the moment. The nicest place we stayed on the whole trip was a tiny b&b winery on the Danube, that we just happened upon. We are now finalizing our first trip to Italy. Have fun!

wes fowler

Jeff,<BR>Am I right in assuming that you're planning to travel with youngsters? If so, consider independent travel rather than a tour. The problems of meeting tour bus deadlines with youngsters involved can be nerve rattling. Are four of you prepared to pack and unpack every other night or so? Prepared to down breakfasts hurriedly in order to be on a bus at 7:30AM? <BR><BR>The "logistics of a European trip" need not be difficult if you plan carefully and don't try to be overly ambitious in what you see and do. <BR><BR>Drop me an Email if you'd like. Indicate who will make up your travel party and their interests. Let me know, too, the duration of your trip and if you have considered travel by car. I may be able to offer some suggestions of interest. I'm not a commercial travel agent, by the way, simply someone interested in, and knowledgeable about European travel.<BR>

JMM

Do it on your own with GOOD maps and GOOD guide books. I have always been very happy with Michelin maps and guidebooks. Note: the person who drives - does only that - someone else navigates. The highway system in Germany and Austria is excellent. Always choose the scenic route over the fastest route. Learn a few critical phrases in German.

jeff

Thanks everyone for the prompt and insightful responses. The responses reaffirmed my initial thoughts that we should forego a tour. I am leaning toward a few days in Munich followed by stops in Vienna and Salzburg.Given the quality of the highway system I also plan on driving. Any comments or recommendations are appreciated. Again, thanks for responding.

wes fowler

This is a lengthy response; you'll get it in two parts.<BR><BR>Let’s get you started on your Bavarian/Austrian adventure! First, contact the Austrian National Tourist Office (FAX: 212.944.6880) and the German National Tourist Office (FAX: 212.661.7174) and ask for brochures and information related to your interests and those of your travel companions. Ask as well for information regarding accommodations. <BR><BR>Visit your library and bookstores and look for the Michelin Green Guides, one for Germany, one for Austria. Look also for the Michelin map no. 419 for south western Germany and map no. 426 for western Austria. Look also for The Visitor’s Guide to Bavaria distributed by Hunter Publishing, Edison NJ ISBN 1 55650 085 8.<BR><BR>Use the internet! Many of the Bavarian cities, towns and villages have websites with listings of tourist attractions and accommodations. You can find them by simply entering the town preceded by www., succeeded by .de as in www.oberammergau.de Almost all of the towns in the Austrian Tyrol have websites as well, accessed by entering the town name preceded by www.tiscover.com as in www.tiscover.com/reutte<BR> <BR>The Bavarian area southwest of Munich is known both as the Allgau and more familiarly as "Pfaffenwinkel" which roughly translates as "Priest's Corner" due to the number of magnificent Baroque monasteries and parish churches. If you'd like to see what type of scenery you'll encounter, take a look at:<BR> <BR>www.allgaeu-schwaben.com/cneuschwanstein.html scroll to and click on Panorama of the Castle Neuschwanstein. You'll get some idea of the scenery Bavaria offers.<BR> <BR>www.allgaeu-schwaben.com/chohenschwangau.html here you'll find another castle in the same village as Neuschwanstein<BR> <BR>www.allgaeu-schwaben.com/view.html You'll see these where ever you travel in Upper Bavaria. They dominate the southern horizon. You'll also drive across or through them if you choose to visit Austria. <BR>

wes fowler

Before dwelling on itineraries, let's talk a little about your budget. Almost every Bavarian village has one or more gasthausen. These are small inns, usually with 20 to 30 rooms at most, and almost always family owned and operated. Any I've stayed in have been immaculately clean with good-sized rooms and private bath and an in house restaurant featuring excellent regional cuisine. A number also have beer gardens, as well. Many are geared to accommodate families since they do a large business with German families during ski season. All will include breakfast in their room costs. Breakfasts usually consist of cereals, meats, cheeses, eggs, breads, fruit and excellent coffee. Rates for these inns usually range between $50.00US and $65.00US per room, approximately 56 to 70 Euro; slightly more for family sized rooms. No dinner in any of these inns will run you anywhere near as much as $30.00 a meal, regardless of how much beer or wine you consume!<BR> <BR>To see what a couple of these places look like, go to:<BR> <BR>www.steingaden.de/gasthof_lindenhof.htm and<BR>www.steingaden.de/gasthof_graf.htm <BR><BR>To maximize time available for sightseeing, Munich is the ideal city to fly into. I'd recommend picking up a car and driving to an inn in the countryside where you'll find accommodations far less expensive than Munich's. If you choose to visit Munich, you can drive to one of the outlying villages, park the car and take the suburban train (S-bahn) into the heart of the city. I can give you specifics if you're interested.<BR><BR>Gasoline in Germany and Austria is called Benzin. It's between $3.50 and about $4.00 a gallon. Recognize that almost all autos in Europe have standard (stick shift) rather than automatic transmission, are smaller and lighter in weight than American autos and thus much more fuel efficient. To truly economize, a diesel powered auto is desirable since diesel fuel is usually less than $3.00 a gallon and offers more miles per gallon.<BR><BR>If you’d like some driving itineraries and suggested sites to see, drop me an Email. Feel free to ask any questions as well.<BR><BR>