Another Toddler and Family Planning on Going to Paris
Nov 29th, 2004, 10:20 AM
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Another Toddler and Family Planning on Going to Paris
Hi All,
It seems as if there is a good handful of experienced and thoughtful people out there with loads of info on traveling and vacationing in Paris with toddlers. I need your help.
My husband and I are planning a vacation in Paris (at least a week) and we have another week unplanned - meaning if you have any suggestions on where to go, please let's hear it. We loved Rome and Florence, but never went to Venice. I don't know if it's going to be feasible. And please remember, the US$ is weak.
Here is what I'm wondering about:
1. We need to find suitable accomodations for our toddler, who will be 19-20months at that time, in Paris. He needs to sleep in a room with a door. We don't mind sleeping in the living room or on a sofa couch. From some preliminary research, apartments seem the best route. I've also read that some apartments have even provided portable cribs. Please tell me where you've stayed or heard of in Paris, how much and how I can get in contact with them.
2. Nanny services in Paris. We would like a night or two to go out. I've read in print that there are nanny services available. Any advice? Warnings? Suggestions on who to contact?
3. Getting around - I've read a lot about stroller and subways. What about taxis? Are they expensive? If we need to use one, is it okay not to have a car seat?
4. The Time Change - How did your toddler and children adapt? THis is very important that I hear your story as I know my experience will be different, but we need to mentally prepare ourselves!
I've been trying to catch up on all of the posts regarding toddlers, but if you know of a post that would address any of these questions, please point me in that direcation...If you can comment on any of the above, please do! We would really appreciate it!
Bev
It seems as if there is a good handful of experienced and thoughtful people out there with loads of info on traveling and vacationing in Paris with toddlers. I need your help.
My husband and I are planning a vacation in Paris (at least a week) and we have another week unplanned - meaning if you have any suggestions on where to go, please let's hear it. We loved Rome and Florence, but never went to Venice. I don't know if it's going to be feasible. And please remember, the US$ is weak.
Here is what I'm wondering about:
1. We need to find suitable accomodations for our toddler, who will be 19-20months at that time, in Paris. He needs to sleep in a room with a door. We don't mind sleeping in the living room or on a sofa couch. From some preliminary research, apartments seem the best route. I've also read that some apartments have even provided portable cribs. Please tell me where you've stayed or heard of in Paris, how much and how I can get in contact with them.
2. Nanny services in Paris. We would like a night or two to go out. I've read in print that there are nanny services available. Any advice? Warnings? Suggestions on who to contact?
3. Getting around - I've read a lot about stroller and subways. What about taxis? Are they expensive? If we need to use one, is it okay not to have a car seat?
4. The Time Change - How did your toddler and children adapt? THis is very important that I hear your story as I know my experience will be different, but we need to mentally prepare ourselves!
I've been trying to catch up on all of the posts regarding toddlers, but if you know of a post that would address any of these questions, please point me in that direcation...If you can comment on any of the above, please do! We would really appreciate it!
Bev
Nov 29th, 2004, 12:34 PM
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type in skatterfly- She travelled with her child and has ideas. In addition, many of us sent replies to her querries. I have travelled with my children at that age and I think that time from about 20 months to just under 4 is probably the most difficult! I would suggest an apt or a hotel room with a fridge as a minimum. Strollers are great and if one of you can back pack him that is also an option (assuming he likes a back pack). I always used an umbrella stroller for travel. The metro is fine in off hours. Remember your trip will have to be quite child focused and will be very different from pre-babe or infant in arms. Providing you remember this the trip should be enjoyable.
Nov 29th, 2004, 01:19 PM
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I can only tell you this madame: please don't do it unless you prepare the child correctly. It seems that these days parents do not properly prepare the little ones for the flight. For the sake of the other passengers, a child should be "unstuffed" if you catch my drift. It just takes a little castor oil or similar ingredient to do the trick. Many parents these days neglect to do the task, and the result is foulness for the rest of us. I speak only of the "untrained." I find it terribly callous of parents to not take these duties seriously. Also, they fail to give children the serums that will properly knock them out for the flight. There are natural ingredients we have been using for generations. Young parents these days do not bother. The result is that rather than sleepy angels we have raging devils! This is rude. And another thing, do not ask me to move my seat because you did not bother to plan your itinerary properly. I raised my children already and now I sit my touchy where I please. Now it's your turn, so take your responsibility seriously. Now bhppek, this is not directed at you, I just had to get my two cents out about what is going on these days. Also, what you do after the flight, that is your business!
Nov 29th, 2004, 01:42 PM
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I doubt there's much risk anyone will take that advice, but please do not use castor oil on a child unless advised by a doctor (and then get a second opinion). It would be quite cruel to do so without urgent need.
Nov 29th, 2004, 02:16 PM
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..I do think Nelly Anne's rant is extreme BUT she does remind us that when travelling with "our darlings" we must have consideration for others! It is terribly rude to bring a toddler to a nice restaurant catering to couples who are out for a special night. The last thing those people need to hear is the crying of a child; they are probably out on that special evening to get away from those sounds they can hear at home. If children say 5 and up have excellent manners take them to a nice restaurant but be ready to leave if they have a meltdown. I am afraid that too many parents get so focused on their brood that they just seem to forget others....but forget the casteroil ect...but do give the child some dramamine if he/she is prone to car sickness!!
Nov 29th, 2004, 03:30 PM
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I have read a lot of stuff about strollers on the cobble stones, trains etc, but I have never had too many problems with that. Best thing is to get a European brand umbrella stroller, as they tend to be a lot more sturdy. Also, using a good umbrella stoller makes it a lot easier to fold up and get onto the train. Save your money and take the train.
As for bad behavior, I am afraid that too many couples get so focused on themselves that they just seem to forget others, but don't let them spoil a Special evening out with your child. Sorry, but restaurants are for eating and I don't know why "special" is only confined to adults.
Children tend to be more behaved if they are used to being allowed out in society. Any child will be misbehaved in a restaurant if they haven't been allowed out to restaurants on a regular basis. I have seen many well behaved children under the age of five in restaurants, but for some reason people only remember the ones that misbehave. Best idea to start introducing your child to restaurants so they will know how to behave properly is to take them for an early dinner before the busy time sets in, and there aren't many people there yet and your child will be less likely to be tired and crabby.
As for bad behavior, I am afraid that too many couples get so focused on themselves that they just seem to forget others, but don't let them spoil a Special evening out with your child. Sorry, but restaurants are for eating and I don't know why "special" is only confined to adults.
Children tend to be more behaved if they are used to being allowed out in society. Any child will be misbehaved in a restaurant if they haven't been allowed out to restaurants on a regular basis. I have seen many well behaved children under the age of five in restaurants, but for some reason people only remember the ones that misbehave. Best idea to start introducing your child to restaurants so they will know how to behave properly is to take them for an early dinner before the busy time sets in, and there aren't many people there yet and your child will be less likely to be tired and crabby.
Nov 29th, 2004, 08:55 PM
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Bhpopek, totally with you on the need for a room with a door for the kid! Only way to get any peace in my house. So definitely rent an apartment. Venice is OUT for young children. You have never in all of your days seen a more stroller unfriendly location. You will have to carry the thing up and down the stairs on the bridges across every canal and it gets old fast. I guess if you can handle your son in a backpack it would be more of an option--our daughter is a chunk of 34 pounds and I can't carry her all day on my back.
As far as the jetlag, it will be much better than you think. Keep him up the day you arrive and go to bed at close to his normal time. He will wake up at 3am and not want to go back to sleep for a couple of hours. Cope. In the morning, wake him up early (the time you're going to want him to wake every day). After this he should be oriented. Just wait until you come home--isn't that a treat, up at 5am for close to two weeks!
We just took our children to Italy for two and a half weeks. It went really well--we kept our expectations low (i.e. no churches and museums) and they did great. You can read our trip report (lots of tips!) at www.markandmonica.com/travel/italy.htm .
As far as the jetlag, it will be much better than you think. Keep him up the day you arrive and go to bed at close to his normal time. He will wake up at 3am and not want to go back to sleep for a couple of hours. Cope. In the morning, wake him up early (the time you're going to want him to wake every day). After this he should be oriented. Just wait until you come home--isn't that a treat, up at 5am for close to two weeks!
We just took our children to Italy for two and a half weeks. It went really well--we kept our expectations low (i.e. no churches and museums) and they did great. You can read our trip report (lots of tips!) at www.markandmonica.com/travel/italy.htm .
Nov 29th, 2004, 11:12 PM
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Hi Bev:
Indeed, there have been many, many querries/posts re: travel with young children. I have been traveling with my young one to Europe since she was 4 months old, she is now 4 years old. And I am a single, divorced parent at that! If anyone tells you it can't be done, I am the first to say it can be.
In specific regard to your questions:
1) I would get a hotel room. Ask for 2 beds in your double (not just a double bed). Why the room with the door? you may have to get a suite then, if your son can't sleep in the same room with you! With 2 beds, you can easily let your toddler sleep in the 2nd bed, pull it close to your bed so they are not scared of being in a strange, new place (otherwise they won't sleep!). There will be enough room for him to move around without fear of him falling off the bed! I have gotten cribs in hotels before, but always inquire prior to booking the room since you don't want the hotel to be surprised upon arrival.
Additionally, so many hotels offer breakfast with lodging, so getting an apt, IMO, might be a costly and unnecessary option. I've stayed at both the Hotel Kensington (7th Arr) and also the Hotel D'Argenson (8th Arr) - both under 80 euros for a double room with breakfast and both within walking distance to the Champs-Elysees and Seine.
2) I have never gotten a nanny while in Paris or in any city in Europe, for that matter. We went to Paris in March (9 mos ago) and while I would have liked to have gone out somewhere solo, I didn't know of anyone to watch my little girl. I have friends in Paris with little kids too, so we all hung out together at Luxembourg Gardens (great fun for kids!), Tuileries Garden, the Eiffel Tower, etc. Perhaps you might ask your hotel if they know of any nanny/babysitting services IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD that they would recommend. I have been fortunate to have had some very nice hotel staff that have befriended me and my little girl -- one older woman even offered to watch her for me (I was able to skip away to the Monoprix for 1 hour!). That might be an option to consider if you find such a person at your hotel that you are comfortable with around your child for a couple hours.
3) I have NEVER brought a car seat. It is not needed there. I always travel by Metro, train, or bus and my little one either sits in my lap or in the seat adjacent to me. Even in taxis! I would recommend public transportation - it can't be beat. Take one of those lightweight strollers with you (the Graco model at Target is perfect), they fold up flat and can be carried around if not needed. (I've put mine horizontally across the top of my rolling suitcase when in transit; and gate-check it on the airplane so it is not lost in baggage claim!). Taxis are ok if you are in a pinch for time, otherwise, Metros work great and take you right to where you need to go. The Carte Orange card is a good card to buy that will allow transportation on all busses, Metros and local area trains (within zones A & B of Paris).
4) The time change thing was not so bad, frankly, it is worse coming back to the States! The first day my little one is always tired so we take it easy. I usually don't plan a whole lot the afternoon of our arrival, we settle into the hotel, walk around and check things out, then eat an early dinner and go to bed. The next day we are ready to start exploring - without any jet lag.
I wouldn't suggest Venice, with all the waterways and bridges, it would be havoc getting around with a stroller and toddler. I have not taken my daughter there yet and won't do so until she is much older......what about Lucca in Tuscany? Or even returning to Rome since you liked it so much (I love Rome too!) Both cities are wonderful and easy for children.
Indeed, there have been many, many querries/posts re: travel with young children. I have been traveling with my young one to Europe since she was 4 months old, she is now 4 years old. And I am a single, divorced parent at that! If anyone tells you it can't be done, I am the first to say it can be.
In specific regard to your questions:
1) I would get a hotel room. Ask for 2 beds in your double (not just a double bed). Why the room with the door? you may have to get a suite then, if your son can't sleep in the same room with you! With 2 beds, you can easily let your toddler sleep in the 2nd bed, pull it close to your bed so they are not scared of being in a strange, new place (otherwise they won't sleep!). There will be enough room for him to move around without fear of him falling off the bed! I have gotten cribs in hotels before, but always inquire prior to booking the room since you don't want the hotel to be surprised upon arrival.
Additionally, so many hotels offer breakfast with lodging, so getting an apt, IMO, might be a costly and unnecessary option. I've stayed at both the Hotel Kensington (7th Arr) and also the Hotel D'Argenson (8th Arr) - both under 80 euros for a double room with breakfast and both within walking distance to the Champs-Elysees and Seine.
2) I have never gotten a nanny while in Paris or in any city in Europe, for that matter. We went to Paris in March (9 mos ago) and while I would have liked to have gone out somewhere solo, I didn't know of anyone to watch my little girl. I have friends in Paris with little kids too, so we all hung out together at Luxembourg Gardens (great fun for kids!), Tuileries Garden, the Eiffel Tower, etc. Perhaps you might ask your hotel if they know of any nanny/babysitting services IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD that they would recommend. I have been fortunate to have had some very nice hotel staff that have befriended me and my little girl -- one older woman even offered to watch her for me (I was able to skip away to the Monoprix for 1 hour!). That might be an option to consider if you find such a person at your hotel that you are comfortable with around your child for a couple hours.
3) I have NEVER brought a car seat. It is not needed there. I always travel by Metro, train, or bus and my little one either sits in my lap or in the seat adjacent to me. Even in taxis! I would recommend public transportation - it can't be beat. Take one of those lightweight strollers with you (the Graco model at Target is perfect), they fold up flat and can be carried around if not needed. (I've put mine horizontally across the top of my rolling suitcase when in transit; and gate-check it on the airplane so it is not lost in baggage claim!). Taxis are ok if you are in a pinch for time, otherwise, Metros work great and take you right to where you need to go. The Carte Orange card is a good card to buy that will allow transportation on all busses, Metros and local area trains (within zones A & B of Paris).
4) The time change thing was not so bad, frankly, it is worse coming back to the States! The first day my little one is always tired so we take it easy. I usually don't plan a whole lot the afternoon of our arrival, we settle into the hotel, walk around and check things out, then eat an early dinner and go to bed. The next day we are ready to start exploring - without any jet lag.
I wouldn't suggest Venice, with all the waterways and bridges, it would be havoc getting around with a stroller and toddler. I have not taken my daughter there yet and won't do so until she is much older......what about Lucca in Tuscany? Or even returning to Rome since you liked it so much (I love Rome too!) Both cities are wonderful and easy for children.
Nov 30th, 2004, 06:10 AM
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Huitres, if her son is anything like my daughters, they get so excited at spending the night in the same room with their parents that they don't settle down until 10 at night and then they wake up at 6am. If they're in their own room, they go to sleep at 8:00 and wake up at 8:00. A huge difference! Hotels are torture for us.
Nov 30th, 2004, 07:09 AM
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I just got back from Paris and Switzerland last night - and we took our 21 month old with us. We are avid travellers and love our little one with our whole heart -- but this was a rough trip. We have travelled with him extensively in the past but this trip was tough on him and thus, us.
First and foremost - make sure and bring quantities of children's motrin, tylenol, cold medicine, and a thermometer. Our son caught a wicked virus on the plane over and we ended up with a pretty sick kid. I had the tylenol with me but needed something with acetomeniphine (sp?) to bring down a fever -- which of course spikes at 3:00 am when nothing is open.
Matt (the toddler) loved the Eiffel Tower -- especially the elevator ride up. We also took him up to Montmarte and had one of the tourist artists up there sketch his picture - which is a very nice momento. I never wanted one of me but the one of Matt is adorable.
I don't know how all these posters managed the subway with a toddler. I must have missed something because we used to always take the subway - but with a 35lb toddler and a stroller (even an umbrella stroller) - the stairs throughout the system were absolutely insurmountable. We ended up in a taxi most places we went.
We stayed at a fabulous place in St. Germaine called the Hotel de Buci. We always stay in that area - they have a suite on the 6th floor that has two rooms - one with a murphy bed and the other with a regular bed. It also has two bathrooms (one REALLY small) and a refrigerator. The front desk staff was super.
I also recommend bringing a portable DVD player. I am not a huge advocate of tv for my little guy but it was reassuring to him to be able to pop in Elmo or listen to his favorite cd when falling asleep.
We also went into Switzerland - which Matt loved - the Alps and Lake Geneva were a big hit with the little guy. We took a train ride to see Pere Noel at the top of Roches-de-Ney and have the greatest pictures.
Regarding food - Matt can be finicky and didn't find much food he liked. It also could have been because he was sick. However, I brought over a bunch of mandarin oranges and fruit bars and that is all he ate for 5 days. I also brought a jar of peanut butter for him. While I am all for trying to get him to eat new things - when he hasn't eaten for three days, it was nice to have something that I KNOW he would eat.
We brought Matt's 14 year old cousin with us as well and she served as our nanny when we went out without him.
I applaud your bringing your little one with you but highly encourage you to set your sights low and enjoy seeing the joy he gets out of just watching the boats go by or the people wathcing at Jardin du Luxembourg.
Have a great trip!
p.s. Matt was UP and AWAKE at 4:00 am this morning - ready to go - I think it is going to be a long transition back to sleeping in until 7:00 am......
First and foremost - make sure and bring quantities of children's motrin, tylenol, cold medicine, and a thermometer. Our son caught a wicked virus on the plane over and we ended up with a pretty sick kid. I had the tylenol with me but needed something with acetomeniphine (sp?) to bring down a fever -- which of course spikes at 3:00 am when nothing is open.
Matt (the toddler) loved the Eiffel Tower -- especially the elevator ride up. We also took him up to Montmarte and had one of the tourist artists up there sketch his picture - which is a very nice momento. I never wanted one of me but the one of Matt is adorable.
I don't know how all these posters managed the subway with a toddler. I must have missed something because we used to always take the subway - but with a 35lb toddler and a stroller (even an umbrella stroller) - the stairs throughout the system were absolutely insurmountable. We ended up in a taxi most places we went.
We stayed at a fabulous place in St. Germaine called the Hotel de Buci. We always stay in that area - they have a suite on the 6th floor that has two rooms - one with a murphy bed and the other with a regular bed. It also has two bathrooms (one REALLY small) and a refrigerator. The front desk staff was super.
I also recommend bringing a portable DVD player. I am not a huge advocate of tv for my little guy but it was reassuring to him to be able to pop in Elmo or listen to his favorite cd when falling asleep.
We also went into Switzerland - which Matt loved - the Alps and Lake Geneva were a big hit with the little guy. We took a train ride to see Pere Noel at the top of Roches-de-Ney and have the greatest pictures.
Regarding food - Matt can be finicky and didn't find much food he liked. It also could have been because he was sick. However, I brought over a bunch of mandarin oranges and fruit bars and that is all he ate for 5 days. I also brought a jar of peanut butter for him. While I am all for trying to get him to eat new things - when he hasn't eaten for three days, it was nice to have something that I KNOW he would eat.
We brought Matt's 14 year old cousin with us as well and she served as our nanny when we went out without him.
I applaud your bringing your little one with you but highly encourage you to set your sights low and enjoy seeing the joy he gets out of just watching the boats go by or the people wathcing at Jardin du Luxembourg.
Have a great trip!
p.s. Matt was UP and AWAKE at 4:00 am this morning - ready to go - I think it is going to be a long transition back to sleeping in until 7:00 am......
Nov 30th, 2004, 09:52 AM
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Hi MonicaRichards: True enough re: the beds situation; however, being alone in an unfamiliar place can be daunting for little ones. I usually put my little one to bed, then disappear into the bathroom for my looonnngg bath and in the meantime she falls asleep. I am lucky because she has been sleeping 12-13 hours through the night since 10 weeks old (I trained her with that "core night" philosophy) so no early, early rising for us (8-8:30 am suits me fine).
KK2: While Metro travel is no easier than any other mode (except for taxis), most of the Metro stations I used had elevators/escalators so I would fold up the stroller and go on that. Indeed, there are staircases in the other Metro stations, but if there is a spouse helping (as would be in Bev's case), it is not difficult to have one carry the child and the other the stroller. (I have been fortunate since kind strangers have stopped to help carry my stroller while I carried her!)
Certainly traveling with a child is not easy, but at the same time, it doesn't have to be unbearable. I agree with the fact that the smallest and simplest things bring the most pleasure (watching boats along the Seine, seeing the beautiful stained glass windows in the Sainte-Chapelle, going to the parks and watching the ducks on the lake, etc). It's a wonderful experience for both parent(s) and child and one not soon to be forgotten!
KK2: While Metro travel is no easier than any other mode (except for taxis), most of the Metro stations I used had elevators/escalators so I would fold up the stroller and go on that. Indeed, there are staircases in the other Metro stations, but if there is a spouse helping (as would be in Bev's case), it is not difficult to have one carry the child and the other the stroller. (I have been fortunate since kind strangers have stopped to help carry my stroller while I carried her!)
Certainly traveling with a child is not easy, but at the same time, it doesn't have to be unbearable. I agree with the fact that the smallest and simplest things bring the most pleasure (watching boats along the Seine, seeing the beautiful stained glass windows in the Sainte-Chapelle, going to the parks and watching the ducks on the lake, etc). It's a wonderful experience for both parent(s) and child and one not soon to be forgotten!
Nov 30th, 2004, 02:15 PM
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Wow! Thanks for the ideas! I've printed all that you've suggested and I'm researching all of the suggestions. It does look as if Venice is out and maybe 12 days in Paris isn't such a bad thing. We'd like to soak up the Parisian lifestyle and have fun in kid friendly areas. The regular tourist attractions sound great but I'm just excited about eating and being a part of a different culture and society! The parks sounds nice and I think my son is too young for Euro Disney. Isn't also very expensive?
As for the sleeping arrangments. I suppose he's trained to sleep alone now. He used to sleep with us and now we all sleep better separate. He sleeps through the night and we can stay up later than 7PM. The time change doesn't sound too bad but when we're back at home sounds really tiring!
He's done well on trips to Canada, Mexico, Dallas, and on a 7 day cruise. In all instances, I've managed to keep his schedule Pacific Standard Time, but I know with this trip, we'll all have to adjust.
We have a Maclaren Quest stroller right now, but I think we'll buy the lighter version that only weights 10lbs and has a carrying strap. My husband and I are getting psyched about the trip and we'll be in "training" and practice mode regarding fetching everything and everyone up and down stairs.
We'll "try" to pack light, but if we'll be there for 12 days, I'm sure we'll have to do a load of laundry or two. Any thoughts on washing and drying clothes in Paris?
As for the sleeping arrangments. I suppose he's trained to sleep alone now. He used to sleep with us and now we all sleep better separate. He sleeps through the night and we can stay up later than 7PM. The time change doesn't sound too bad but when we're back at home sounds really tiring!
He's done well on trips to Canada, Mexico, Dallas, and on a 7 day cruise. In all instances, I've managed to keep his schedule Pacific Standard Time, but I know with this trip, we'll all have to adjust.
We have a Maclaren Quest stroller right now, but I think we'll buy the lighter version that only weights 10lbs and has a carrying strap. My husband and I are getting psyched about the trip and we'll be in "training" and practice mode regarding fetching everything and everyone up and down stairs.
We'll "try" to pack light, but if we'll be there for 12 days, I'm sure we'll have to do a load of laundry or two. Any thoughts on washing and drying clothes in Paris?
Dec 1st, 2004, 08:26 AM
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A hint that I think has kept my four boys healthy while traveling. When you get on the plane, use an antiseptic wipe and wash down your seats - handrest, tray, volume controls. Use hand sanitizer often, as well.
And no, I'm not a clean freak. (How could I be with four working against me?)
And no, I'm not a clean freak. (How could I be with four working against me?)
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