EuroTrip Summer 2009
Jul 14th, 2008, 07:52 PM
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EuroTrip Summer 2009
My friend and I are planning on spending next summer in Europe. We are in the very early stages of planning. We are both in college and are not looking to study abroad because we don’t want to be primarily confined to one area. Neither of us have been to Europe before, but are very excited to begin traveling abroad.
I’m just going to throw out an outline of our basic plans as of right now. Suggestions of where to stay, how long to stay, what to see, things to do, etc, etc would be greatly appreciated! Also, if you see any red flags, please let me know!
Our plan is to fly into Madrid, Spain sometime mid-May and fly out of Athens, Greece early August. So around 90 days in Europe! Glorious! Here’s a list of all our desired destinations:
Madrid, Spain
Barcelona, Spain
Lyon, France
Paris, France
Hamburg, Germany
Berlin, Germany
Zurich, Switzerland
Milan, Italy
Venice, Italy
Rome, Italy
Athens, Greece
Not too shabby, right? Suggestions? Anything we should add/take out/replace? My friend is an International Business major with a focus in Spanish and German languages, so our trips to Spain and Germany will be very beneficial to him. And while we are completely ecstatic about all of our potential destinations, we both concluded that Italy is probably our number one choice, and time willing, would like to dedicate spending an entire month there. It is also important to note that we wouldn’t mind hitting up at least one gorgeous beach setting in our travels. (Greeeeeeeece?)
To save money, we plan on staying in hostels every night. I realize that hostels limit the length of your stay, so with 3 months of luggage (we are not backpacking, though obviously we will want to pack lightly) is it unreasonable to plan on hostel hopping as much as we will have to? We’re planning on joining hihostels.com and begin booking as soon as we get things figured out and hostels become available for summer ’09.
Also, any idea of a rough estimate of the cost? We’re planning on about $2,000 for airfare and nearly $3,000 for accommodations. (And a question about hostels: When it lists the price, say 20 euros, is that per person? Or per room being occupied?) Unsure about how much we should expect transportation to cost doing as much moving as we will be. And of course we’ll need to eat every now then. We’re very interested in hitting up restaurants, museums, churches, nightclubs, and pretty much completely immersing ourselves in European culture. We were hoping to spend no more than $8,000. Is that entirely too far-fetched? (Please say no, ha.)
We’re both saving up and reading a lot about what we will be experiencing next year, and are very much looking forward to getting things in order. I realize I asked a lot of questions, but ANY insider information would be very much appreciated. Thanks so much!
I’m just going to throw out an outline of our basic plans as of right now. Suggestions of where to stay, how long to stay, what to see, things to do, etc, etc would be greatly appreciated! Also, if you see any red flags, please let me know!
Our plan is to fly into Madrid, Spain sometime mid-May and fly out of Athens, Greece early August. So around 90 days in Europe! Glorious! Here’s a list of all our desired destinations:
Madrid, Spain
Barcelona, Spain
Lyon, France
Paris, France
Hamburg, Germany
Berlin, Germany
Zurich, Switzerland
Milan, Italy
Venice, Italy
Rome, Italy
Athens, Greece
Not too shabby, right? Suggestions? Anything we should add/take out/replace? My friend is an International Business major with a focus in Spanish and German languages, so our trips to Spain and Germany will be very beneficial to him. And while we are completely ecstatic about all of our potential destinations, we both concluded that Italy is probably our number one choice, and time willing, would like to dedicate spending an entire month there. It is also important to note that we wouldn’t mind hitting up at least one gorgeous beach setting in our travels. (Greeeeeeeece?)
To save money, we plan on staying in hostels every night. I realize that hostels limit the length of your stay, so with 3 months of luggage (we are not backpacking, though obviously we will want to pack lightly) is it unreasonable to plan on hostel hopping as much as we will have to? We’re planning on joining hihostels.com and begin booking as soon as we get things figured out and hostels become available for summer ’09.
Also, any idea of a rough estimate of the cost? We’re planning on about $2,000 for airfare and nearly $3,000 for accommodations. (And a question about hostels: When it lists the price, say 20 euros, is that per person? Or per room being occupied?) Unsure about how much we should expect transportation to cost doing as much moving as we will be. And of course we’ll need to eat every now then. We’re very interested in hitting up restaurants, museums, churches, nightclubs, and pretty much completely immersing ourselves in European culture. We were hoping to spend no more than $8,000. Is that entirely too far-fetched? (Please say no, ha.)
We’re both saving up and reading a lot about what we will be experiencing next year, and are very much looking forward to getting things in order. I realize I asked a lot of questions, but ANY insider information would be very much appreciated. Thanks so much!
Jul 14th, 2008, 08:49 PM
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Although your excitement is very charming , 3,000 dollars is about 1,900 euros; for 90 days it gives you about 21 euros per day for food, transportation in Europe, tickets to attractions , clubbing etc...
You are planning to visit some of the most expensive places in Europe...
Does this amount of money seem realistic to you?
Reading a good guide book might give you an idea of what to expect.
You are planning to visit some of the most expensive places in Europe...
Does this amount of money seem realistic to you?
Reading a good guide book might give you an idea of what to expect.
Jul 14th, 2008, 10:36 PM
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I agree with Danon-rethink your budget because with the dollar tanking it is VERY VERY expensive these days.Unless you are planning on eating alot of street food and staying at some "interesting" hostels I think that you need to rethink the trip. I travel overseas to Europe everyweek and its absolutely ridiculous how high everything is these days.
Just to give you a clue-unless you are eating street pizza in Rome you are going to be shelling out at least $10-18 USD a meal there for basically nothing.
Zurich is unbelievably high so you might want to bypass it-friends on my airline layovers have spent over $30 USD for a coffee ,brat and fries to give you a clue.
Get a good book like Londly Planet Western Europe:Rick Steves Europe to get an idea what you need to plan and do.
From a mom who has had two kids study abroad in "non typical study abroad situations"-I cannot begin to tell you how that semester or year abroad will change your life. And yes, you will be able to travel quite alot.If you can swing it, think in that direction. Have fun and good luck!
Just to give you a clue-unless you are eating street pizza in Rome you are going to be shelling out at least $10-18 USD a meal there for basically nothing.
Zurich is unbelievably high so you might want to bypass it-friends on my airline layovers have spent over $30 USD for a coffee ,brat and fries to give you a clue.
Get a good book like Londly Planet Western Europe:Rick Steves Europe to get an idea what you need to plan and do.
From a mom who has had two kids study abroad in "non typical study abroad situations"-I cannot begin to tell you how that semester or year abroad will change your life. And yes, you will be able to travel quite alot.If you can swing it, think in that direction. Have fun and good luck!
Jul 14th, 2008, 11:07 PM
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Young travellers have been making such trips for years. Student age tour groups do this with ease and at minimal prices. Two suggestions: Bicycle and camp or buy a van and camp. European youngsters, gap year students, are busy with such trips. Geography will help, get maps and plot your trip. Start in the south and work your way north. The EU has standardized travel rules and signing gets better every day.
Jul 14th, 2008, 11:13 PM
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>Zurich is unbelievably high so you might want to bypass it-friends on my airline layovers have spent over $30 USD for a coffee ,brat and fries to give you a clue.
If your friends went to Kronenhalle may be; but if you go to one of the most expensive restaurants in your city you can shell out unreasonable amounts of money too.
Zürich (except with accomodation) is not more expensive than Venice or Paris. You just have to know where to look for inexpensive food.
Example Rome: If you go into a cafe right at the Piazza Venezia you will spend 6-7 € for a glass of coke. 2-3 blocks away the same glass will cost 1,5 - 2 €.
A meal in a trattoria in a side street in the old city center (say around Piazza Navona) will cost you 1/3 to 1/2 of what you pay for the same meal on the main drag.
In Zürich, use the numerous serlf-service cafeterias of the major supermarkets for a godd inexpensive meal. It´s nothing exciting but high quality and good amounts.
If your friends went to Kronenhalle may be; but if you go to one of the most expensive restaurants in your city you can shell out unreasonable amounts of money too.
Zürich (except with accomodation) is not more expensive than Venice or Paris. You just have to know where to look for inexpensive food.
Example Rome: If you go into a cafe right at the Piazza Venezia you will spend 6-7 € for a glass of coke. 2-3 blocks away the same glass will cost 1,5 - 2 €.
A meal in a trattoria in a side street in the old city center (say around Piazza Navona) will cost you 1/3 to 1/2 of what you pay for the same meal on the main drag.
In Zürich, use the numerous serlf-service cafeterias of the major supermarkets for a godd inexpensive meal. It´s nothing exciting but high quality and good amounts.
Jul 15th, 2008, 01:05 AM
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First of all, good luck! I wish I had done this but never had the opportunity. Fortunately I had the chance to move to Europe a couple years ago and am trying to catch up on my travel now.
We almost always stay in hostels - the price is per room. If you look at www.hostelworld.com you can find reviews, etc. and decide what kind fo room you want (price is always per person). I did hear a tip though that you should book hostels on www.hostelbookers.com as they don't charge a booking fee. If you are planning on staying in dorms, you will want to keep your luggage to the size of a backpacking backpack otherwise it won't fit in the lockers everywhere. I think you should reconsider backpacking - it's much easier in most of these cities than dragging a wheeling suitcase around (cobblestones, etc. make it a challenge!) plus getting a suitcase on and off trains, etc. can be a challenge!
We have been able to travel incredibly cheaply almost everywhere - it's just about being flexible. Don't eat out often - find a grocery store or small neighbourhood cafe and it can be kept very cheap. Don't look at places with English menus - they're almost always more expensive, just walk a few blocks away from the tourist areas and you'll find something.
We usually pick one or two things we want to see in each place we visit and then spend the rest of the time wandering about seeing free things etc. A lot of places will have discounts for students so make sure to get your internationals student ID.
I've heard Let's Go are the best guidebooks for this kind of travel - I think they have a Let's Go Europe which will give you an overview.
Have fun!
PittPurple
We almost always stay in hostels - the price is per room. If you look at www.hostelworld.com you can find reviews, etc. and decide what kind fo room you want (price is always per person). I did hear a tip though that you should book hostels on www.hostelbookers.com as they don't charge a booking fee. If you are planning on staying in dorms, you will want to keep your luggage to the size of a backpacking backpack otherwise it won't fit in the lockers everywhere. I think you should reconsider backpacking - it's much easier in most of these cities than dragging a wheeling suitcase around (cobblestones, etc. make it a challenge!) plus getting a suitcase on and off trains, etc. can be a challenge!
We have been able to travel incredibly cheaply almost everywhere - it's just about being flexible. Don't eat out often - find a grocery store or small neighbourhood cafe and it can be kept very cheap. Don't look at places with English menus - they're almost always more expensive, just walk a few blocks away from the tourist areas and you'll find something.
We usually pick one or two things we want to see in each place we visit and then spend the rest of the time wandering about seeing free things etc. A lot of places will have discounts for students so make sure to get your internationals student ID.
I've heard Let's Go are the best guidebooks for this kind of travel - I think they have a Let's Go Europe which will give you an overview.
Have fun!
PittPurple
Jul 15th, 2008, 01:37 AM
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I recently stayed in a hostel in Verona, Italy for just 17 Euros a day. You could stay there for the 90 days!
You really should do the Greek Islands if you are in Athens. Santorini is very romantic.
Check out this website: www.busabout.com
Instead of buying a train pass, you buy a bus pass. They take you right to the hostel--you won't have to take the subway from the train stations when you arrive at midnight.
Consider taking some ferries. Barcelona to Rome by ferry. Croatia is a little cheaper as is Eastern Europe.
Prices of hostels are per person. Some do offer private rooms.
You really should do the Greek Islands if you are in Athens. Santorini is very romantic.
Check out this website: www.busabout.com
Instead of buying a train pass, you buy a bus pass. They take you right to the hostel--you won't have to take the subway from the train stations when you arrive at midnight.
Consider taking some ferries. Barcelona to Rome by ferry. Croatia is a little cheaper as is Eastern Europe.
Prices of hostels are per person. Some do offer private rooms.
Jul 15th, 2008, 02:40 AM
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>>>have spent over $30 USD for a coffee ,brat and fries<<<
They must have eaten a gold-plated bratwurst.
Being serious:
1) Saving costs on transportation is a matter of accurate planning.
Firstly, when you book an open-jaw flight, ask about connections between airports. Sometimes, these connecting flights are including in your transatlantic flight.
Secondly, there are low-cost airlines in Europe, e.g. Ryanair, easyjet, vueling, AirBerlin, Germanwings etc. The earlier you book the better the rates. If you book well in advance (and if you are somewhat flexible regarding dates and times) you can fly incredibly cheap within Europe.
Thirdly, for trains similar rules apply. In Germany, the bahn has reduced rates (Sparpreis). You can book them 90 days before traveling, but they sell out quickly.
Thus, everything is a matter of planning.
2) Accomodation. Hostels usually charge per person - not per room (hihostels.com charges per night per bed). This means, 25 Euros per person in a hostel is equivalent to 50 Euros per double room in a hotel. I am currently booking accomodation for one of my sons and his friend in Berlin, and we are able to get a double room in a decent hotel (Ibis) for 39 Euros - which is cheaper than a hostel. Try www.hrs.de for hotels (many search options) or some of the low-cost chains (e.g. www.accorhotels.com, www.hotel-bb.com).
3) Destinations. You can save a lot of money if you do not choose to stay in city centers but in suburbs (check public transport) or in smaller towns. Your list of destinations includes exactly the most expensive places in Europe. Why not leaving the beaten path? Explore some of the less-touristy regions which are no less attractive than the big centers.
E.g. for Germany, Berlin is a must. But you may also explore the Ruhr - a very cool metropolitan region with fascinating architecture, culture, nightlife, history.. Or the Münsterland with the historical town of Münster, dozens of spectacular castles and charming little villages.
4) Food and drink etc. You estimate 21 Euros per day - this makes 630 Euros per month. This is about twice the budget of a European college student. You can go along with this. Buy food and especially beverages in supermarkets, find fast-food eateries (I mean the local ones, not the American chains which are pretty pricey). You may go to the local universities and have lunch at their restaurants. In Germany, you can easily get a warm meal for 1.50 to 2.00 Euros in an university restaurant. And it will be fun to meet people there.
No need to eat gold-plated bratwurst.
They must have eaten a gold-plated bratwurst.
Being serious:
1) Saving costs on transportation is a matter of accurate planning.
Firstly, when you book an open-jaw flight, ask about connections between airports. Sometimes, these connecting flights are including in your transatlantic flight.
Secondly, there are low-cost airlines in Europe, e.g. Ryanair, easyjet, vueling, AirBerlin, Germanwings etc. The earlier you book the better the rates. If you book well in advance (and if you are somewhat flexible regarding dates and times) you can fly incredibly cheap within Europe.
Thirdly, for trains similar rules apply. In Germany, the bahn has reduced rates (Sparpreis). You can book them 90 days before traveling, but they sell out quickly.
Thus, everything is a matter of planning.
2) Accomodation. Hostels usually charge per person - not per room (hihostels.com charges per night per bed). This means, 25 Euros per person in a hostel is equivalent to 50 Euros per double room in a hotel. I am currently booking accomodation for one of my sons and his friend in Berlin, and we are able to get a double room in a decent hotel (Ibis) for 39 Euros - which is cheaper than a hostel. Try www.hrs.de for hotels (many search options) or some of the low-cost chains (e.g. www.accorhotels.com, www.hotel-bb.com).
3) Destinations. You can save a lot of money if you do not choose to stay in city centers but in suburbs (check public transport) or in smaller towns. Your list of destinations includes exactly the most expensive places in Europe. Why not leaving the beaten path? Explore some of the less-touristy regions which are no less attractive than the big centers.
E.g. for Germany, Berlin is a must. But you may also explore the Ruhr - a very cool metropolitan region with fascinating architecture, culture, nightlife, history.. Or the Münsterland with the historical town of Münster, dozens of spectacular castles and charming little villages.
4) Food and drink etc. You estimate 21 Euros per day - this makes 630 Euros per month. This is about twice the budget of a European college student. You can go along with this. Buy food and especially beverages in supermarkets, find fast-food eateries (I mean the local ones, not the American chains which are pretty pricey). You may go to the local universities and have lunch at their restaurants. In Germany, you can easily get a warm meal for 1.50 to 2.00 Euros in an university restaurant. And it will be fun to meet people there.
No need to eat gold-plated bratwurst.
Jul 15th, 2008, 03:10 AM
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I would advise you against early bookings of anything to save money. Although it might save you money, it might undermine your trip.
There are lots of good reasons to go to Greece, but just remember the seacoast of Italy is gorgeous. Since you want to spend a month there, you might consider taking a ferry from Barcelona to Genova, then from Genova taking a ferry to Sicily, then a ferry to Napoli, then make your way over to Bari for a ferry to Greece, back to Venice, to Milano, then see the rest of Europe, flying home from Paris. That itinerary would give you quite a vivid sense of the unity in the development of Mediterranean culture, and then seeing how and where it meets and mixes with German and Northern culture. The itinerary would also put you in hot places early in your trip and cooler places in August.
In the end, you're going to have to pick the cheapest route, but I thought I'd toss that out there.
good luck!
There are lots of good reasons to go to Greece, but just remember the seacoast of Italy is gorgeous. Since you want to spend a month there, you might consider taking a ferry from Barcelona to Genova, then from Genova taking a ferry to Sicily, then a ferry to Napoli, then make your way over to Bari for a ferry to Greece, back to Venice, to Milano, then see the rest of Europe, flying home from Paris. That itinerary would give you quite a vivid sense of the unity in the development of Mediterranean culture, and then seeing how and where it meets and mixes with German and Northern culture. The itinerary would also put you in hot places early in your trip and cooler places in August.
In the end, you're going to have to pick the cheapest route, but I thought I'd toss that out there.
good luck!
Jul 15th, 2008, 07:03 AM
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Hi A,
>Italy is probably our number one choice, and time willing, would like to dedicate spending an entire month there. <
In that case, I suggest dropping Greece.
Paris and Berlin are worth a week each.
Since you are going to Madrid and Barcelona, I suggest a few days in Provence on your way to Lyon and Paris.
Have you considered Bavaria (Munich and surroundings) in place of Berlin? It will reduce your time on trains.
You could do Paris/Strasbourg or Nancy/Munich.
Have you considered flying into Madrid and out of Paris or VV?
What draws you to Zurich?
Ditto Hamburg.
Ditto Milan.
>We’re planning on about $2,000 for airfare ...<
That's high - more like $1250.
>and nearly $3,000 for accommodations.<
That's low - I suggest $4500.
You can check the prices of point-to-point tickets vs railpasses at www.railsaver.com.
Click "only if it saves money".
If it says to by PtoP, you can believe it. If not, check the prices at the national rail sites, eg, www.bahn.de and www.trenitalia.com/en/index.html
Also look at www.whichbudget.com for cheap flights.
Enjoy your planning.
>Italy is probably our number one choice, and time willing, would like to dedicate spending an entire month there. <
In that case, I suggest dropping Greece.
Paris and Berlin are worth a week each.
Since you are going to Madrid and Barcelona, I suggest a few days in Provence on your way to Lyon and Paris.
Have you considered Bavaria (Munich and surroundings) in place of Berlin? It will reduce your time on trains.
You could do Paris/Strasbourg or Nancy/Munich.
Have you considered flying into Madrid and out of Paris or VV?
What draws you to Zurich?
Ditto Hamburg.
Ditto Milan.
>We’re planning on about $2,000 for airfare ...<
That's high - more like $1250.
>and nearly $3,000 for accommodations.<
That's low - I suggest $4500.
You can check the prices of point-to-point tickets vs railpasses at www.railsaver.com.
Click "only if it saves money".
If it says to by PtoP, you can believe it. If not, check the prices at the national rail sites, eg, www.bahn.de and www.trenitalia.com/en/index.html
Also look at www.whichbudget.com for cheap flights.
Enjoy your planning.
Jul 15th, 2008, 09:19 AM
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I thinkyou need to have a really good look a tht number here - since I don;t think you're allowing nearly enough.
First, when hostel sgive a price that's for one bed in a dorm room - that would be 20 euros per night per person in a room with 4 or 6 other people.
Second, you really need to look at the prices of:
Train fares (overnight trips can be very expensive), food (even buying from a market), sights (the Tower of London is no more than $25 for entrance as just one example) and nightlife. In a small local place one beer or glass of wine can be resonable - but other types of alcohol or mixed drinks are VERY expensive, as are soft drinks (think $3 for a miniature can of Coke).
My step-daughter went for several weeks last summer with some friends - modest hotels, not hostels and not nearly such a restricted budget - and she was surprised at prices for meals and sights then - versus NYC prices - and the dolar has fallen even further since then.
I think you need to really figure costs to the penny to see how far your budget will really go. (She and her friends met some other young Americans who had essentially run out of money, eating 1 meal a day and doing only free things, while they waited a couple of days for their plane home. They actually asked my daughter and her friends to bring them leftovers from their dinner.
First, when hostel sgive a price that's for one bed in a dorm room - that would be 20 euros per night per person in a room with 4 or 6 other people.
Second, you really need to look at the prices of:
Train fares (overnight trips can be very expensive), food (even buying from a market), sights (the Tower of London is no more than $25 for entrance as just one example) and nightlife. In a small local place one beer or glass of wine can be resonable - but other types of alcohol or mixed drinks are VERY expensive, as are soft drinks (think $3 for a miniature can of Coke).
My step-daughter went for several weeks last summer with some friends - modest hotels, not hostels and not nearly such a restricted budget - and she was surprised at prices for meals and sights then - versus NYC prices - and the dolar has fallen even further since then.
I think you need to really figure costs to the penny to see how far your budget will really go. (She and her friends met some other young Americans who had essentially run out of money, eating 1 meal a day and doing only free things, while they waited a couple of days for their plane home. They actually asked my daughter and her friends to bring them leftovers from their dinner.
Aug 11th, 2008, 08:58 AM
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My friend and I are also planning to spend about 3 months in Europe next summer. A lot of your destinations we were also thinking about, except less in Germany and Italy as we've lived there before. I am American and when I lived in Europe I found it easy to save money and travel. I recommend a rail pass, maybe do the bulk of your travels at night. You then would not have to spend money on a hostel. Hostels can get expensive, but hostelworld.com is a great place to look for deals. Persoanlly we don't stay in hostels. We couchsurf. It's free, you meet the locals, and you don't have to worry about your luggage. Normally they feed you as well! Don't eat out all the time, go to the supermarkets to save money. Germany has very inexpensive bakery items, and you can buy a pretzel for 40 cents. Travel in Italy by train is fairly inexpensive as well, or so I thought. To save money couchsurf whenever you can! Hope you have a great trip.
Aug 11th, 2008, 09:11 AM
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People may have been traveling like this for years, but they were the homeless ones sleeping in parks and begging for food.
You need more money. Seriously, quite a bit more, unless the dollar gains considerable strength. Even staying in hostels and eating from crepe stands and roasting your own brats over an open fire, I fear you'll be stealing fruit from people's orchards, hitchhiking, and sleeping in fields.
I am in France now with my kids and a bunch of their cousins, all college kids on limited budgets, and we are trying to save money every which way we can, but there is no way any one of these kids could find lodging, eat even two meals a day, travel from one place to another, and see the occasional museum or enjoy the occasional event for 21 euros a day.
It sounds like a wonderful plan, so just figure out a way to make a fair bit more money between now and then.
You need more money. Seriously, quite a bit more, unless the dollar gains considerable strength. Even staying in hostels and eating from crepe stands and roasting your own brats over an open fire, I fear you'll be stealing fruit from people's orchards, hitchhiking, and sleeping in fields.
I am in France now with my kids and a bunch of their cousins, all college kids on limited budgets, and we are trying to save money every which way we can, but there is no way any one of these kids could find lodging, eat even two meals a day, travel from one place to another, and see the occasional museum or enjoy the occasional event for 21 euros a day.
It sounds like a wonderful plan, so just figure out a way to make a fair bit more money between now and then.
