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-   -   European crows (https://www.fodors.com/community/europe/european-crows-350113/)

cmt Aug 20th, 2003 05:07 PM

European crows
 
Are crows dying out from disease in European countries as they seem to be in the US? I think they are fascinating, intelligent, underappreciated animals and would hate to lose them. A friend sent me an article a few days ago, and I found the online link to it, for anyone who cares: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2003Jul31.html Every now and then I do a search on crows, but I haven't searched for info about their status worldwide. Does anyone feel like commenting?

Anonymous Aug 20th, 2003 05:37 PM

Thanks, that was an absolutely fascinating article! You might be comforted to hear that crows are still thriving in the Boston area.

Although they seem to be succumbing to West Nile virus, and perhaps other diseases, crows are among the most intelligent and adaptable of creatures, and will prevail. Here in the Northeast, we lost most of our raccoons to a rabies epidemic ten or 15 years ago, but now the raccoons are re-appearing.

Indeed, I can't help wondering whether there's some relationship between crows' recent proliferation and the raccoons' populaiton dip. Not only do they fill similar niches as urban scavengers, but raccoons are among the few creatures that will prey on crows' nests, keeping populations in check; with raccoons scarcer due to rabies, the crow population expanded.

Another competitor around here is coyotes, which were unknown 10 years ago but which now regularly snatch cats and little dogs out of suburban gardens. We no longer see many road-killed animals along the highway, since the coyotes come in the night to do their grocery shopping, leaving fewer snacks for the crows.

cigalechanta Aug 20th, 2003 05:45 PM

There are plenty in the back of my place in Cambridge, Ma. What a raquet they make. Thanks for the link.

cigalechanta Aug 20th, 2003 05:48 PM

lol
no they are not playing tennis, i meant racket.Tho in the city, we also have racoons living in back, possums, skunks. We usually rattle something to anounce our arrival at night as one or the othere hangs out on the walkway.

Marilyn Aug 20th, 2003 05:55 PM

Anonymous, you are almost certainly correct about the link between the raccoon population decline and the crow population increase. If you want to know for sure, try asking your local Humane Society or a wildlife care center if there is one in your area.

As for West Nile, crows (and other corvids like ravens, jays, and magpies) are unfortunately the most susceptible of birds and are considered a "sentinel species," i.e., their infection is often the first sign that the disease has reached the area.

cigalechanta Aug 20th, 2003 06:09 PM

In the back over the fence in one of the trees is a night bird, that makes one chirp like sound, a pause then another, this goes on for hours and sometimes I answer and it will wait til I chirp back. Anyone know what it is? It's out there now chirping and it's after ten pm.

Anonymous Aug 20th, 2003 06:12 PM

Mockingbirds will do that. Some of them have long, complicated repetoires but others go for a simpler approach.

cmt Aug 20th, 2003 06:30 PM

I never thought anyone would reply to this post, and I'm glad there are other people who pay attention to crows. Since some of you are interested in crows, you might like some of these links that I found about a year ago. There were more, but many of the pages can no longer be found.



http://www.jcrows.com/crolang.html

http://www.jcrows.com/crow.html

http://www.crows.net/language.html

http://www.crows.net/mjw.html

http://www.crows.net/culture.html

http://www.crows.net/project.html

http://www.clcookphoto.com/crows.htm

http://www.pbs.org/lifeofbirds/brain/

http://www.ux1.eiu.edu/~cfpvs/Moore&Switzer1998.pdf

http://omega.cohums.ohio-state.edu:8.../9506c.20.html

http://216.239.39.104/search?q=cache...en&start=7



BrimhamRocks Aug 20th, 2003 06:37 PM

Went to the weekly market in Knaresborough last week, and there was a vendor that had a raven walking around in her stall. The woman said her raven and one other are allowed to hang out at Knaresborough Castle as a sort of local tribute to the ravens at the Tower of London.

I got to hold the raven...she pecked me a few times, ow ow ow ow, but she sure was beautiful!

BrimhamRocks Aug 20th, 2003 06:39 PM

(I know ravens and crows are not the same, but I thought I would share, anyway....)

Marilyn Aug 20th, 2003 06:42 PM

cmt, have you ever considered volunteering at a local wildlife rehab hospital? If there is one in your area, I guarantee they can use your help. You might be able to work directly with crows and actually do something concrete to help the population.

cmt Aug 20th, 2003 06:56 PM



BR: This was a "pet" raven? Ravens and crows are closely related, I think, and maybe they are similar in intelligence.

Marilyn: No, I haven't thought of volunteering, but twice I brought animals to the county wildlife refuge.. First it was a baby squirrel that my apartment neighbors had supposedly found. Then a few years later it was a bird I found dying on my property. I checked up on it a week later. It had died. It had been on the mend and was being exposed to the outdoor air in prep. for its eventual release. But it was left out one night when it turned unseasonably cold, and it died.


Anonymous Aug 20th, 2003 07:23 PM

Yikes, of course we're interested in crows -- they're interested in us, too! I intend to look thru all those sites tomorrow, thanks for the links.

Our neighborhood crows became my good friends the year I dug up a bunch of lawn and turned it into flower beds; every time I dug up grass, I produced LOTS of grubs and other disgusting/yummy things, which I tossed into the driveway. Didn't take long for the crows to learn my habits, and to come flying in immediately every time I left the house -- how flattering (or maybe creepy) to think they were paying such close attention! They certainly have a large vocabulary of cries, including one that apparently means -- hey, everybody, over here! The snack lady is out!

BrimhamRocks Aug 20th, 2003 09:46 PM

The woman explained that she had found the raven when it was quite young, apparently injured or abandoned, or something like that. I did notice that it was missing one talon, but it still seemed to get around just fine.

Marilyn Aug 20th, 2003 09:58 PM

Anonymous, crows are very, very intelligent and easily bored in captivity. At the wildlife facility where I volunteer, their food is given to them wrapped up or otherwise hidden so they can have the amusement of discovering it.

cmt, I'm sorry the bird you found didn't make it. :-(

BTilke Aug 20th, 2003 11:10 PM

Another fan of crows!
Last year, we used to go to one section of the Bois de la Cambre (the beltway of woods around Brussels) and take along a big bag of peanuts for the crows. They all flocked over as soon as we arrived--we got to know some of their individual personality quirks.
Then we moved to another part of Brussels and then to Germany and didn't go to that part of the park for almost a year. We went this past week-end, and sure enough, the crows remembered us and came over. We felt so mean for not bringing nuts with us! One crow followed us on our entire walk. We're going back this week-end with a BIG bag of nuts to reward our loyal "customers"
Bird lovers should make note of two very special places to visit in Belgium and the Netherlands:
In Belgium, Parc Paradisio is one of the finest wild bird rescue and rehab centers in the world. The park has beautiful grounds and is well worth a half-day visit.
In the Netherlands, the Dutch Parrot Refuge in Veldhoven (near Eindhoven) is probably the world's best refuge for all species of parrots, mostly pets whose owners died or could no longer take care of them. Some wild birds as well. Also worth a half day's visit.
Neither of these sites make the tourist guidebooks, but they are truly outstanding.

PatrickLondon Aug 21st, 2003 12:09 AM

Don't know about the rest of Europe but crows and magpies have become much more in evidence in London than they ever used to be - a real population explosion, and on purely aesthetic grounds I don't share other correspondents' enthusiasm for corvids. By contrast, there is real concern in Britain about a dramatic decline in numbers of the house sparrow - yer actual Cockney sparrer. The experts tell us the two are not directly related. But something in the environment must clearly have changed to favour the one and not the other.

BrimhamRocks Aug 21st, 2003 01:19 AM

BTilke, I agree with you about Parc Paradisio. We lived not far from the Parc when we were stationed in Belgium, and went there a number of times.

Anonymous Aug 21st, 2003 03:28 AM

I don't think I've ever seen "decline" and "house sparrow" in the same sentence. Patrick, if the Brits ever run out, they can completely restock the nation with the flock that's in my back yard! Both species are thriving here.

It's true that crows will eat young birds, but other threats to sparrows would be environmental -- they thrive on weed seeds and in slightly-neglected residential areas where they nest in nooks and crannies that might not exist in well-kept places, and roost on ivy-covered buildings, which they especially favor in cold weather.

Tulips Aug 21st, 2003 03:37 AM

Can you please come and get the crows from my garden as they are digging up the lawn. I can't stand them; they're a real pest around here.


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