Europe with kids for 2 months in Nov/Dec

Old Nov 22nd, 2022, 04:26 PM
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I think Naples would be fun. Or if you're hill-averse, Rome, as suggested above.
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Old Nov 22nd, 2022, 05:03 PM
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Have you considered Australia or New Zealand? It will be their Summertime, which would be so much easier with two little ones.
A slightly warmer winter than average is p”.

The differences between Australia, NZ and Italia are not inconsiderable…..
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Old Nov 22nd, 2022, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Peter_S_Aus View Post
The differences between Australia, NZ and Italia are not inconsiderable…..
Obviously, and Italy is one of my favorite countries. I especially like Naples, but the OP is concerned about cold, dreary days, which is a real possibility in Italy and much of Europe.

With two small children, one really still a baby, if they are stuck inside too much or getting out and about becomes a chore, they might feel they might as well not have gone. Of course, people live there and have children, but they are at home, not visiting. Our children were a little older, when we lived there eons ago. Even so, we were not trying to see or do a lot of cultural things for two months at a time and we had an established residence. When an unexpected storm came while traveling, we packed up and went “home.” When our DD got very sick, we took her to a hospital, then headed “home.” with her. What they want to do is wonderful and they have plenty of time to consider and prepare. So, just throwing out some compromise options the OP might not have thought of.

OP, honestly, I would be nervous about it, but if you could be assured of absolutely reliable and kind help, some kind of day care or child care would allow some freedom for you and your wife while there.
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Old Nov 22nd, 2022, 09:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Jean View Post
For this winter (and probably the next as well), I would definitely be keeping in mind potential energy shortages.
I hadn't considered this at all - I will look into it more. thanks
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Old Nov 22nd, 2022, 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Sassafrass View Post
Obviously, and Italy is one of my favorite countries ...
I would love to find some child care. I am sure we would be able to find someone we could trust. And we have family in the south of France and the UK so if there is a disaster we don't have to fly all the way home.

But yes, good thoughts on feeling stuck. But I assume in a big city like Rome even with terrible weather there would be coffee shops and museums open somewhere. But yes, this is crystalizing that we need to pick a large city. I had considered a small town but I think that desire is waning.


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Old Nov 23rd, 2022, 12:55 AM
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I think the whole energy shortage thing is being over blown in the US press
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Old Nov 23rd, 2022, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by bilboburgler View Post
I think the whole energy shortage thing is being over blown in the US press
This is true. Right now Italy has more natural gas than they know what to do with. They've got gas coming in from north Africa and tank loads of liquefied natural gas from the US (which I think is being redistributed to other European countries). The price of methane at the pump has gone down considerably.
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Old Nov 23rd, 2022, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by kerouac View Post
.... To be by the seaside (which I fully understand for someone from Alberta), Genoa, Nice or Marseille could be taken into consideration. Or else Dubrovnik, which is spectacular but totally overrun during the warm tourist season.
Genoa is even hillier than Naples. For two young adults, this wouldn't be a problem, but these adults would be hauling two very small children up and down those hills.

Split (also in Croatia) is very nice, and considerably less crowded than Dubrovnik. However, there doesn't seem to be much in the way of indoor activities. We were visiting a friend there, and she struggled to think of a museum to visit. The archaeological museum was poorly organised. There are lots of Roman ruins, and a beautiful seaside park.

Someone else mentioned Cyprus. I spent a few days there, after a medical emergency (of a friend). There is also some splendid seaside scenery there. (The only indoor activity I experienced was in a hospital emergency room.)

I must say that Cyprus has the highest population density I've ever seen of truly gorgeous men. I decided to return home with my husband, though.



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Old Nov 23rd, 2022, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by bilboburgler View Post
I think the whole energy shortage thing is being over blown in the US press
I hope for your sake that you're correct, but there are certainly lots of articles... Some noting the inequities caused by EU "exporting" its energy crisis to other countries... "hoarding" of LNG supplies leading to rise in international prices that non-EU nations can't afford. At some point, will there be a reckoning? This winter? Next?

Forbes magazine, albeit U.S. media, is not known for hyperbole or sky-is-falling reporting:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidbl...h=597397701c84

Even Fodors chimes in:

"This winter, the most direct impacts are likely to come through rentals. Accommodations will be more expensive to account for energy costs. Public buildings, monuments, and other businesses will be colder to adhere to temperature limits set by different governments, and as Germany has done, pools might not be heated and showers will be cold in leisure centers.
Germany is prioritizing coal trains over passenger trains and even France will reduce services to save energy. So, there’s a chance that there may be interruption in services in railways across the continent."

Yikes, coal trains.

https://www.fodors.com/world/europe/...fect-travelers
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Old Nov 23rd, 2022, 09:54 AM
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Sure life changes a bit, but northern Europe has pivoted its energy needs amazingly, Italy has done something similar, Spain has serious deliquification capacity while France has broken the stupid deal on fossil fuel transmission to allow Spain/France and Germany to link up pipelines. The ones that worry me are Hungary (the least attractive member or the EU) and Romania (one of the poorest).

The harder issues are 1) still using methane, 2) the price Europe is paying and the length of contract required.

UK probably have mucked it up more than the EU but have re-opened closed ch4 storage

Ukraine is having a worse time than any of us
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Old Nov 23rd, 2022, 11:45 AM
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In France, they have added an energy report to the weather forecast, and it does not seem like an excessive precaution at all, although it will always be "green" until January and February, probably.
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Old Nov 24th, 2022, 02:35 AM
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Not wanting to rent a car for a 2 month stay really limits the places that are suitable to stay. Two months in Rome in winter with kids? No thank you. South of France, better option, Nice esp. Athens possibly. Rome’s current max daytime temps is around 60F, that is Cyprus’s minimum night temp in coastal areas, daytime temps low 70Fs. It’ll be like that until Xmas. Not unusual to have Xmas dinner outside, same in Provence. Malta will be similar. Cyprus is a large island & a rental car is needed, so that rules Cyprus out.

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Old Nov 24th, 2022, 05:02 AM
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Originally Posted by balthy View Post
Not wanting to rent a car for a 2 month stay really limits the places that are suitable to stay. Two months in Rome in winter with kids? No thank you. South of France, better option, Nice esp. Athens possibly. Rome’s current max daytime temps is around 60F, that is Cyprus’s minimum night temp in coastal areas, daytime temps low 70Fs. It’ll be like that until Xmas. Not unusual to have Xmas dinner outside, same in Provence. Malta will be similar. Cyprus is a large island & a rental car is needed, so that rules Cyprus out.
We've had very pleasant weather in Rome in every winter month, and haven't ever had very bad weather. To a family from Alberta, 60F should seem balmy. Temperatures below freezing are rare in Rome, and when it snows there, it makes the national news.
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