Europe in November, need some help!
Sep 14th, 2016, 04:36 AM
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Europe in November, need some help!
Hey everyone,
Due to an unforeseen change in jobs and living situation, I now have some time to burn and plan to travel Europe for the month of Novemeber. A bit non-ideal in terms of weather, but I've been saving credit card points for a while and PROMISED myself that the next time-abundant portion of my life (while young) I'm just going to bite the bullet and go. So I'm going. Apologies for any redundancies or newbness but I have some questions and need some help. I'm obviously cognoscente of the weather and understand some northern spots and even others will be cooler, which I'm fine with and will pack accordingly.
So here are my givens: 1 Month, $3K-$4K budget (sans flight), have about $1200 worth of flyer miles money on my chase sapphire preferred. Traveling alone. Very flexible and nimble, and right in the middle between shoe string and "balling out", obviously will lean on being frugal. IE not a ton of drinking, mostly museums and hostiles, occasional dinner or snack kind of thing. Will buy a one month eurorail pass.
Given that, here are my questions:
- Can credit card points be redeemed for INTL flights?
- There's a super dirt cheap ($200) WOW flight from SF to Amsterdam, where I plan to start.... anybody go with WOW before? From reviews it looks like as long as you do your homework, stay diligent, it's totally feasible.
- Keep in mind here I'll be flying to Ireland to END the trip for 3-4 days to meet with family... so with that in mind 80-85% of the balance will be continental Europe and then a small stint planned at the tail end in Ireland, so that may affect how I get there either VIA plane from Spain or France.
- Some thoughts on itinerary: Amsterdam, Berlin, Prague, Vienna, Barcelona, Sevilla, Lisbon. Paris either in between or at the end. Any cities based on context and weather you would omit or add here? Any to emphasize for length of stay vs others?
- I'd definitely like to hit France (Paris or South of France) so would it make sense to cut across and hit there before heading to Spain, or revert back up after spain?
- Any thoughts on AirBnB vs hostile? Maybe focus on hostiles mostly and AirBnb in a few choice cities where it would be worth it?
- Any general thoughts/help would be greatly appreciated and thanks so much in advance!!!!
Due to an unforeseen change in jobs and living situation, I now have some time to burn and plan to travel Europe for the month of Novemeber. A bit non-ideal in terms of weather, but I've been saving credit card points for a while and PROMISED myself that the next time-abundant portion of my life (while young) I'm just going to bite the bullet and go. So I'm going. Apologies for any redundancies or newbness but I have some questions and need some help. I'm obviously cognoscente of the weather and understand some northern spots and even others will be cooler, which I'm fine with and will pack accordingly.
So here are my givens: 1 Month, $3K-$4K budget (sans flight), have about $1200 worth of flyer miles money on my chase sapphire preferred. Traveling alone. Very flexible and nimble, and right in the middle between shoe string and "balling out", obviously will lean on being frugal. IE not a ton of drinking, mostly museums and hostiles, occasional dinner or snack kind of thing. Will buy a one month eurorail pass.
Given that, here are my questions:
- Can credit card points be redeemed for INTL flights?
- There's a super dirt cheap ($200) WOW flight from SF to Amsterdam, where I plan to start.... anybody go with WOW before? From reviews it looks like as long as you do your homework, stay diligent, it's totally feasible.
- Keep in mind here I'll be flying to Ireland to END the trip for 3-4 days to meet with family... so with that in mind 80-85% of the balance will be continental Europe and then a small stint planned at the tail end in Ireland, so that may affect how I get there either VIA plane from Spain or France.
- Some thoughts on itinerary: Amsterdam, Berlin, Prague, Vienna, Barcelona, Sevilla, Lisbon. Paris either in between or at the end. Any cities based on context and weather you would omit or add here? Any to emphasize for length of stay vs others?
- I'd definitely like to hit France (Paris or South of France) so would it make sense to cut across and hit there before heading to Spain, or revert back up after spain?
- Any thoughts on AirBnB vs hostile? Maybe focus on hostiles mostly and AirBnb in a few choice cities where it would be worth it?
- Any general thoughts/help would be greatly appreciated and thanks so much in advance!!!!
Sep 14th, 2016, 04:57 AM
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A couple of thoughts:
You state you're going in November, so about 4 weeks. Then you list 8 places in 7 countries. Which means you're moving around every few days. Moving around so much wastes time and is expensive.
Use this site to view train travel schedules, times between cities, etc: https://www.bahn.de/p_en/view/
For example: it's about 6 hours from Amsterdam to Berlin and will cost about 60 Euros.
Since you're focusing on large cities you can easily spend a few days in each and have plenty to see/do.
Find out what you'd like to do or see in each place, then map out a route that makes the most sense time & $$ wise.
You may want to take out one or two places such as Lisbon and Seville, since geographically they are "out there."
A somewhat logical route would be:
Amsterdam > Berlin > Prague > Vienna > Paris > Barcelona
Since you're headed to Ireland, check Ryan Air. They may fly from Barcelona to Dublin, but you'll need to check their website.
Just my thoughts.
You state you're going in November, so about 4 weeks. Then you list 8 places in 7 countries. Which means you're moving around every few days. Moving around so much wastes time and is expensive.
Use this site to view train travel schedules, times between cities, etc: https://www.bahn.de/p_en/view/
For example: it's about 6 hours from Amsterdam to Berlin and will cost about 60 Euros.
Since you're focusing on large cities you can easily spend a few days in each and have plenty to see/do.
Find out what you'd like to do or see in each place, then map out a route that makes the most sense time & $$ wise.
You may want to take out one or two places such as Lisbon and Seville, since geographically they are "out there."
A somewhat logical route would be:
Amsterdam > Berlin > Prague > Vienna > Paris > Barcelona
Since you're headed to Ireland, check Ryan Air. They may fly from Barcelona to Dublin, but you'll need to check their website.
Just my thoughts.
Sep 14th, 2016, 05:18 AM
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Frankly, I'd pick 4 places and do 4 one-week AirBnB rentals, with a lot of day-trips to explore the areas. That will give you a better sense of place, save you a lot of money, and limit your need to travel. Virtually the entirety of the Netherlands is reachable on a day-trip from Amsterdam, so that's a good place to start. But I'd do only one other destination in the northern reaches, either Paris, Munich, or Berlin.
Then I'd go south and pick an Italian city (Bologna might be a good an centrally located place, which would allow you to do day-trips to more expensive places like Venice and Florence since it's less than 2 hours by train from both, and the region itself is the heartland of Italy, with excellent food). You might also look at Spain or Greece or even Croatia.
I'm not sure a Eurail pass is a good idea for you, but it could be. Eurail passes are very expensive, and you can often do better by booking individual rail tickets in 2nd class in advance. Some countries (Germany for example) offer well-priced regional day-trip special tickets that are significantly cheaper than a Eurail pass. And to move on to Spain, Greece, or Italy can take a long time even by high-speed train. Flights are often cheaper and more convenient for longer trips, as are buses for shorter day-trips.
If you do decide to do a peripatetic survey of Europe in your month abroad, then hostels (not "hostiles") could be your best or not. There are a lot of good, cheap hotels in Europe, and November is the shoulder season, so rates can be very attractive.
Then I'd go south and pick an Italian city (Bologna might be a good an centrally located place, which would allow you to do day-trips to more expensive places like Venice and Florence since it's less than 2 hours by train from both, and the region itself is the heartland of Italy, with excellent food). You might also look at Spain or Greece or even Croatia.
I'm not sure a Eurail pass is a good idea for you, but it could be. Eurail passes are very expensive, and you can often do better by booking individual rail tickets in 2nd class in advance. Some countries (Germany for example) offer well-priced regional day-trip special tickets that are significantly cheaper than a Eurail pass. And to move on to Spain, Greece, or Italy can take a long time even by high-speed train. Flights are often cheaper and more convenient for longer trips, as are buses for shorter day-trips.
If you do decide to do a peripatetic survey of Europe in your month abroad, then hostels (not "hostiles") could be your best or not. There are a lot of good, cheap hotels in Europe, and November is the shoulder season, so rates can be very attractive.
Sep 14th, 2016, 05:19 AM
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This is great feedback, but I'd really like to hit as much as I can. Would Amsteredam -- Berlin -- Prague -- Vienna -- Paris -- Barca - Sevilla be feeasible? I could forego Lisbon as it's kind of far out but I have a super close old friend there that I haven't seen in ages.
So assuming 3-4 days at each, that's feasible right? Assume a 3-4 days for travel in between and that's feasible right?
Would a Eurorail pass make sense here or just book individual trains by my schedule per the bahn schedule above as one-off's?
This is great feedback, truly.
So assuming 3-4 days at each, that's feasible right? Assume a 3-4 days for travel in between and that's feasible right?
Would a Eurorail pass make sense here or just book individual trains by my schedule per the bahn schedule above as one-off's?
This is great feedback, truly.
Sep 14th, 2016, 06:26 AM
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You can save travel time by taking night trains, if they are available.
Again, you can look at the train schedules online and see how long it will take between destinations.
If you really want to go to Lisbon, then focus your trip more on Spain & Portugal than on Prague & Vienna.
Look at Google Maps to get a sense of the distances between places and see what makes sense for you.
Google Maps can also tell you generally how long it will take to get from Point A to Point B via train or car.
Also look at the destinations you have in mind to see which interest you the most. Your interests and mine are two different things. You need to plan a trip around what is important and relevant to you. Only you can answer that question.
Again, you can look at the train schedules online and see how long it will take between destinations.
If you really want to go to Lisbon, then focus your trip more on Spain & Portugal than on Prague & Vienna.
Look at Google Maps to get a sense of the distances between places and see what makes sense for you.
Google Maps can also tell you generally how long it will take to get from Point A to Point B via train or car.
Also look at the destinations you have in mind to see which interest you the most. Your interests and mine are two different things. You need to plan a trip around what is important and relevant to you. Only you can answer that question.
Sep 14th, 2016, 06:42 AM
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Whenever anyone talks about "hitting" someplace, my hackles rise. WHY do you want to VISIT these places? You have far too many of them in the short month that you are planning to go for, to begin with. Pick 4 destinations and do them justice rather than "hitting" them.
A Eurrail Pass is probably a big waste of money. Learn how to buy inexpensive point-to-point tickets in each country and save your cash.
They are hostels, not hostiles.
No, you can't do 8 destinations, with 3-4 days in each plus travel in between, in a month. Do the math.
A Eurrail Pass is probably a big waste of money. Learn how to buy inexpensive point-to-point tickets in each country and save your cash.
They are hostels, not hostiles.
No, you can't do 8 destinations, with 3-4 days in each plus travel in between, in a month. Do the math.
Sep 14th, 2016, 07:06 AM
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Thanks for the feedback everyone!
StCirq: Easy. Breathe. It'll be OK.
I move quick and that's just the nature of my trip. - I get the point of soaking things in and being here/now and all that and fully dedicating proper time. I get it. But remember my trip doesn't = your trip.
I don't see the big deal here. Even IF I went 8 destinations, which i've clearly planned to lean down a bit, I could still manage 2-3 days in EACH spot if I strategize travel accordingly and at night.
Am I the only one who gets the math here? 1-2 days wouldn't be a crime!
StCirq: Easy. Breathe. It'll be OK.
I move quick and that's just the nature of my trip. - I get the point of soaking things in and being here/now and all that and fully dedicating proper time. I get it. But remember my trip doesn't = your trip.
I don't see the big deal here. Even IF I went 8 destinations, which i've clearly planned to lean down a bit, I could still manage 2-3 days in EACH spot if I strategize travel accordingly and at night.
Am I the only one who gets the math here? 1-2 days wouldn't be a crime!
Sep 14th, 2016, 07:37 AM
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It's your trip and you can do as you like. As some of the previous posters have said, it's not how I would choose to travel, especially if I were looking to save money and maximise time in each location, since each flight or train you take, requires spending time and money, but you know your budget/travel style better than we do.
As far as the Eurrail pass goes, I would compare the costs of individual train tickets (or flights) with the cost of the pass. The only way to know if it's going to offer you good value, is to do the math ahead of time. There is good train information on the website of the Man in Seat 61. Some of the long-distance/high speed/TGV type trains are best booked in advance for the lowest prices. I am not sure that night trains are as available in Europe as they used to be, so am uncertain if you will find night trains for all your travel routes, but am admittedly not a train expert, and would direct you, again, to the Man in Seat 61.
By "hostile," do you mean a hostel?
As to whether you can redeem your credit card points for international air travel, I suspect that's down to whatever your agreement with your credit card says. I'd read the fine print very carefully.
Also be aware that some of the smaller airlines in Europe, while they offer good fares and may save time on longer routes, may use alternate airports and may have strict baggage restrictions. Again, read the fine print carefully before you commit.
We hope you'll return, after your trip, to let us know what itinerary you devised and how the trip went.
As far as the Eurrail pass goes, I would compare the costs of individual train tickets (or flights) with the cost of the pass. The only way to know if it's going to offer you good value, is to do the math ahead of time. There is good train information on the website of the Man in Seat 61. Some of the long-distance/high speed/TGV type trains are best booked in advance for the lowest prices. I am not sure that night trains are as available in Europe as they used to be, so am uncertain if you will find night trains for all your travel routes, but am admittedly not a train expert, and would direct you, again, to the Man in Seat 61.
By "hostile," do you mean a hostel?
As to whether you can redeem your credit card points for international air travel, I suspect that's down to whatever your agreement with your credit card says. I'd read the fine print very carefully.
Also be aware that some of the smaller airlines in Europe, while they offer good fares and may save time on longer routes, may use alternate airports and may have strict baggage restrictions. Again, read the fine print carefully before you commit.
We hope you'll return, after your trip, to let us know what itinerary you devised and how the trip went.
Sep 14th, 2016, 07:57 AM
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It's certainly possible to do all these cities in a month, but it will be quick and dirty. The main things to keep in mind are the distance between Paris and Berlin (a full day of travel) and between Vienna and Barcelona (more than a day of travel in all likelihood). These routes are better done by plane, so that decreases the value of your Eurail pass.
I'm still not sure it's a good deal. If you are only doing 2 nights in each place, you won't really have time for day-trips, so you just need to work out the individual ticket costs vs. the cost of the pass.
I'm still not sure it's a good deal. If you are only doing 2 nights in each place, you won't really have time for day-trips, so you just need to work out the individual ticket costs vs. the cost of the pass.
Sep 14th, 2016, 08:05 AM
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Thanks!
Just so I know, are there other individual train companies that are usually preferred as opposed to Eurail? I'm unaware so pardon my newbness here.
Also does anybody out there have any thoughts on removing Prague/Vienna here and focusing more on Spain as mentioned above? I get each region has it's own unique offerings but would say a more concentrated:
Amsterdam -- Berlin -- Paris -- Bareclona/Lisbon be a good thought vs
Amsterdam > Berlin > Prague > Vienna > Paris > Barcelona
Just so I know, are there other individual train companies that are usually preferred as opposed to Eurail? I'm unaware so pardon my newbness here.
Also does anybody out there have any thoughts on removing Prague/Vienna here and focusing more on Spain as mentioned above? I get each region has it's own unique offerings but would say a more concentrated:
Amsterdam -- Berlin -- Paris -- Bareclona/Lisbon be a good thought vs
Amsterdam > Berlin > Prague > Vienna > Paris > Barcelona
Sep 14th, 2016, 08:06 AM
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Also looks like for a Eurail pass:
5+1 Free in a month = $538
7+1 Free in a month = $655
I'll have to just confirm itinerary first and then go from there and price out individual planes or flights.
5+1 Free in a month = $538
7+1 Free in a month = $655
I'll have to just confirm itinerary first and then go from there and price out individual planes or flights.
Sep 14th, 2016, 08:41 AM
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The train systems in Europe are owned by the government.
Eurorail…Euro Rail…Euro fill-in-the-blank. Call European rail passes whatever you like, but if you’re looking for the most European rail pass options, you’ve come to the right place. Rail Europe.
Rail passes make traveling by train a breeze. Offering flexibility, bonuses – including reduced or free fares on ferries, cruises, private trains, hotels, museums and other attractions, plus local discounts.
Do you know where you’ll be traveling in Europe? Great! We’ve made it easy for you to find rail passes available for each country in Europe and Britain. Simply find the country you’ll be traveling in and click it to see the rail pass options. There’s plenty to choose from, including Eurail Select and Global, BritRail, France Rail Pass and Swiss Travel Passes.
Traveling with a rail pass is like traveling with a great companion who helps you keep your budget on track.
If you’re looking to book a specific city to city train ticket, visit our European Train Tickets page.
https://www.raileurope.com/rail-tick...ail-pass-list/
Eurorail…Euro Rail…Euro fill-in-the-blank. Call European rail passes whatever you like, but if you’re looking for the most European rail pass options, you’ve come to the right place. Rail Europe.
Rail passes make traveling by train a breeze. Offering flexibility, bonuses – including reduced or free fares on ferries, cruises, private trains, hotels, museums and other attractions, plus local discounts.
Do you know where you’ll be traveling in Europe? Great! We’ve made it easy for you to find rail passes available for each country in Europe and Britain. Simply find the country you’ll be traveling in and click it to see the rail pass options. There’s plenty to choose from, including Eurail Select and Global, BritRail, France Rail Pass and Swiss Travel Passes.
Traveling with a rail pass is like traveling with a great companion who helps you keep your budget on track.
If you’re looking to book a specific city to city train ticket, visit our European Train Tickets page.
https://www.raileurope.com/rail-tick...ail-pass-list/
Sep 14th, 2016, 08:47 AM
#13
>>ndividual train companies that are usually preferred as opposed to Eurail<<
Eurail is not a 'train company'. It is a company that sells expensive rail passes. To see if a Eurail pass will save you $$$ you need to check the actual fares on your various routes (and not on Eurail/RailEurope since they will only show you the most expensive options for comparison.
>>StCirq: Easy. Breathe. It'll be OK.<<
From someone asking for advice . . . okaaaay
You have a limited budget and want to see half of Europe -- is it possible -- yes. Advisable - not really.
The more destinations/more travel the more expensive the trip. So your $100-$125 per day will go a LOT farther when you don't have Hundreds of $600+ in rail passes. Plus that doesn't include the mandatory seat reservation on top of the rail pass. So say $700. So now you are down to about $90 per day. And for many city pairs -- flying is cheaper. Don't count on night trains too often - there are fewer sleeper trains then there used to be and many of those have stops/transfers in the middle of the night.
You are traveling in November -- so you need to take short days and potential weather delays into account as well.
Eurail is not a 'train company'. It is a company that sells expensive rail passes. To see if a Eurail pass will save you $$$ you need to check the actual fares on your various routes (and not on Eurail/RailEurope since they will only show you the most expensive options for comparison.
>>StCirq: Easy. Breathe. It'll be OK.<<
From someone asking for advice . . . okaaaay
You have a limited budget and want to see half of Europe -- is it possible -- yes. Advisable - not really.
The more destinations/more travel the more expensive the trip. So your $100-$125 per day will go a LOT farther when you don't have Hundreds of $600+ in rail passes. Plus that doesn't include the mandatory seat reservation on top of the rail pass. So say $700. So now you are down to about $90 per day. And for many city pairs -- flying is cheaper. Don't count on night trains too often - there are fewer sleeper trains then there used to be and many of those have stops/transfers in the middle of the night.
You are traveling in November -- so you need to take short days and potential weather delays into account as well.
Sep 14th, 2016, 08:48 AM
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'StCirq: Easy. Breathe. It'll be OK. []
Am I the only one who gets the math here?[]
But remember my trip doesn't = your trip.'
Yup. Your trip. I've done trips like that too. But I didn't ask questions and I didn't tell others to go to hell when I didn't like their comments - at your request.
You've had a lot of good info. I might have added more but don't want to get a remark from you so will wish you a great trip !
Am I the only one who gets the math here?[]
But remember my trip doesn't = your trip.'
Yup. Your trip. I've done trips like that too. But I didn't ask questions and I didn't tell others to go to hell when I didn't like their comments - at your request.
You've had a lot of good info. I might have added more but don't want to get a remark from you so will wish you a great trip !
Sep 14th, 2016, 09:13 AM
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I would remove Prague and Vienna from your itinerary given the time of year, both because of the weather and to make the trip more compact. Central Europe can be quite cold--we nearly froze at a midnight Easter Mass in Prague in late April, and there was still snow on the ground.
Sep 14th, 2016, 09:22 AM
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I come in peace people!
lol really all great help and feedback and wasn't trying to be snarky. Just sticking up for the over-analysis of my grammatical error above. Hostel. Ok got it.
The classic dilemma: Traveling Europe on a budget. No strange thing. But in the end if I push over into like $4K-$5K, that's fine and can be extended. $3-$4K is just a mental benchmark.
OK SO
Given the places mentioned of interest (Amsterdam, Berlin, Prague, Vienna, Paris, Spain)
And those places pitched/hypothesized:
"Then I'd go south and pick an Italian city (Bologna might be a good an centrally located place, which would allow you to do day-trips to more expensive places like Venice and Florence since it's less than 2 hours by train from both, and the region itself is the heartland of Italy, with excellent food). You might also look at Spain or Greece or even Croatia."
Given a month and budget, anybody have a 2.0 itinerary that might be a best combo for covering a good amount of ground WITHOUT over-extending myself and getting some good/lengthy stays in per what we've discussed thus far?
Trully appreciate any wisdom guys! - Need your help and apologies again!
lol really all great help and feedback and wasn't trying to be snarky. Just sticking up for the over-analysis of my grammatical error above. Hostel. Ok got it.
The classic dilemma: Traveling Europe on a budget. No strange thing. But in the end if I push over into like $4K-$5K, that's fine and can be extended. $3-$4K is just a mental benchmark.
OK SO
Given the places mentioned of interest (Amsterdam, Berlin, Prague, Vienna, Paris, Spain)
And those places pitched/hypothesized:
"Then I'd go south and pick an Italian city (Bologna might be a good an centrally located place, which would allow you to do day-trips to more expensive places like Venice and Florence since it's less than 2 hours by train from both, and the region itself is the heartland of Italy, with excellent food). You might also look at Spain or Greece or even Croatia."
Given a month and budget, anybody have a 2.0 itinerary that might be a best combo for covering a good amount of ground WITHOUT over-extending myself and getting some good/lengthy stays in per what we've discussed thus far?
Trully appreciate any wisdom guys! - Need your help and apologies again!
Sep 14th, 2016, 11:32 AM
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I'd start out in the farthest north you want to go and work you way south for somewhat better weather than reverse - I'd actually limit time to northern Europe to major cities like Paris, Amsterdam and Berlin, Prague and Vienna perhaps then fly south to say Barcelona and end up in Seville and Lisbon - fly home from there.
In a month easily done IMO -trains are the best for visiting such cities and in November in northern Europe things can get icy on roads - cars are useless in big cities - trains are so so great!
For lots on trains check www.ricksteves.com; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.seat61.com - check on Eurailpasses for taking that many trains - 1st class only if over 25 and that is a significant benefit IME of years of taking trains around Europe- especially for those carrying 'too much' typically luggage.
In a month easily done IMO -trains are the best for visiting such cities and in November in northern Europe things can get icy on roads - cars are useless in big cities - trains are so so great!
For lots on trains check www.ricksteves.com; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.seat61.com - check on Eurailpasses for taking that many trains - 1st class only if over 25 and that is a significant benefit IME of years of taking trains around Europe- especially for those carrying 'too much' typically luggage.
Sep 14th, 2016, 11:52 AM
#18
<<But remember my trip doesn't = your trip.>>
OK then. Since all anyone here can do is give their opinions and share their past experiences, if "your trip" isn't our trip...
you might want to get a guidebook and plan it yourself, instead of asking for help here.
Just a thought.
OK then. Since all anyone here can do is give their opinions and share their past experiences, if "your trip" isn't our trip...
you might want to get a guidebook and plan it yourself, instead of asking for help here.
Just a thought.
Sep 14th, 2016, 12:13 PM
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Yes, you can use Chase Sapphire points for an international trip. You can do points plus cash if you don't have enough points.
I go to googleflights.com, put in my dates or flexible dates and places departing from and arriving. Then call Chase Sapphire and they will book the tickets for you.
I just got great tickets from Dulles to Venice and returning from Florence on a combination of 35,000 points plus $391 cash. This is with United and Luftansa.
I go to googleflights.com, put in my dates or flexible dates and places departing from and arriving. Then call Chase Sapphire and they will book the tickets for you.
I just got great tickets from Dulles to Venice and returning from Florence on a combination of 35,000 points plus $391 cash. This is with United and Luftansa.
Sep 14th, 2016, 12:37 PM
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Read www.seat61.com for tonnes of train information
