Any opinions on the Scilly Isles? Penzance? Need a car?
Apr 26th, 2015, 07:08 AM
#1
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Any opinions on the Scilly Isles? Penzance? Need a car?
I am seriously considering taking the night train from London to Penzance (http://www.seat61.com/Cornwall-sleeper.htm ) and then the ferry to the Scilly Isles. Then I'd spend a few nights in Penzance. However, for a number of reasons I won't drive. Lonely Planet says I need a car on the islands, my (English) sister says I don't.
Has anyone been to the islands, and if so, what's your opinion on the car question? Also, did you think it was worth the trip? Of course, I plan to see the gardens at Tresco, anything else to see? Are the gardens worth seeing in September?
I know that annhig has posted previously that I don't need a car for a visit to Penzance, but I'd like to confirm that I can get to St. Michael's Mount and St. Ives by public transport. Is the Lizard possible?
I will take the (day) train to Portsmouth (via Exeter) after Penzance, unless anyone can suggest a worthwhile stop-off on the way. Recommendations for places to stay or eat are always welcome...
Has anyone been to the islands, and if so, what's your opinion on the car question? Also, did you think it was worth the trip? Of course, I plan to see the gardens at Tresco, anything else to see? Are the gardens worth seeing in September?
I know that annhig has posted previously that I don't need a car for a visit to Penzance, but I'd like to confirm that I can get to St. Michael's Mount and St. Ives by public transport. Is the Lizard possible?
I will take the (day) train to Portsmouth (via Exeter) after Penzance, unless anyone can suggest a worthwhile stop-off on the way. Recommendations for places to stay or eat are always welcome...
Apr 26th, 2015, 08:01 AM
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Sorry, I haven't been there but thanks for your post. It's reminded me about them. Years ago I saw an article which portrayed them and which made me want to go there. The Gulf Stream passes by, there are palm trees, and, I think, both Harold Wilson and David Cameron vacationed there. Please post a report if you get there. The Scillys.
Apr 26th, 2015, 08:26 AM
#3
Lonely Planet says I need a car on the islands, my (English) sister says I don't.>>
lonely planet could not be more wrong! [and your sis is quite right].
the only place you can use a car on the Scillies is St Mary's [the main island] and there's not point because you can walk from one end to the other in about half a day. Locals have cars but they have to import them on the boat from the mainland and they are mainly used for carting things about, not really for transporting people.
all the other islands use tractors if they use anything at all - walking and cycling are the main means of human transport and of course the boats that are needed to get you there.
finally, at least when it comes to buses, it appears that you can get FROM the Lizard to Penzance and back to the Lizard in a day, but not vice versa - the service is aimed at school cchildren going to school in Helston, and students going to college in PZ, not at holiday makers.
so far as the train journey from PZ to Portsmouth is concerned, most of the departures require a change at Exeter anyway so it would be an obvious choice. the station [Exeter St Davids] is a little outside the centre but there is a link to Exeter central or if you were short of time, a cab to the Cathedral would not cost a packet. The Cathedral and the green are the main sights - I wouldn't think of spending more than a couple of hours there to be honest. lots of the trains also require a change at Salisbury - perhaps a night there and then dropping down into Portsmouth in the morning might be fun.
The Scillies are very much worth the trip, and I'd give the gardens on Tresco the annhig equivalent of Michelin's 3 stars. We used to love going there on the helicopter from PZ [you could fly straight into Tresco which you can't do any longer] and spending a day there. September should be lovely - I think that the latest we have ever been is August but in September the tropical plants which abound there ought to be at their peek.
I confess that I have never got a bus from PZ to Marazion or St Ives, but I'm pretty sure that you can do it. The lizard might be a bit more tricky - you might need to get the bus to Helston and get a cab, or to get one from the Lizard to Helston on the way back.
Here are some bus timetables:
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/devo...or=6&source=sp
and here are the ones for St Ives:
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/devo...=1&redirect=no
I see that one route goes through Mousehole which would be helpful if, say, you wanted to walk to Mousehole and walk back to PZ, or perhaps better, get the bus there and walk back.
Hope that helps!
lonely planet could not be more wrong! [and your sis is quite right].
the only place you can use a car on the Scillies is St Mary's [the main island] and there's not point because you can walk from one end to the other in about half a day. Locals have cars but they have to import them on the boat from the mainland and they are mainly used for carting things about, not really for transporting people.
all the other islands use tractors if they use anything at all - walking and cycling are the main means of human transport and of course the boats that are needed to get you there.
finally, at least when it comes to buses, it appears that you can get FROM the Lizard to Penzance and back to the Lizard in a day, but not vice versa - the service is aimed at school cchildren going to school in Helston, and students going to college in PZ, not at holiday makers.
so far as the train journey from PZ to Portsmouth is concerned, most of the departures require a change at Exeter anyway so it would be an obvious choice. the station [Exeter St Davids] is a little outside the centre but there is a link to Exeter central or if you were short of time, a cab to the Cathedral would not cost a packet. The Cathedral and the green are the main sights - I wouldn't think of spending more than a couple of hours there to be honest. lots of the trains also require a change at Salisbury - perhaps a night there and then dropping down into Portsmouth in the morning might be fun.
The Scillies are very much worth the trip, and I'd give the gardens on Tresco the annhig equivalent of Michelin's 3 stars. We used to love going there on the helicopter from PZ [you could fly straight into Tresco which you can't do any longer] and spending a day there. September should be lovely - I think that the latest we have ever been is August but in September the tropical plants which abound there ought to be at their peek.
I confess that I have never got a bus from PZ to Marazion or St Ives, but I'm pretty sure that you can do it. The lizard might be a bit more tricky - you might need to get the bus to Helston and get a cab, or to get one from the Lizard to Helston on the way back.
Here are some bus timetables:
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/devo...or=6&source=sp
and here are the ones for St Ives:
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/devo...=1&redirect=no
I see that one route goes through Mousehole which would be helpful if, say, you wanted to walk to Mousehole and walk back to PZ, or perhaps better, get the bus there and walk back.
Hope that helps!
Apr 26th, 2015, 08:28 AM
#4
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Bedar - yes, the Gulf Stream reportedly has a very benign effect on the climate! I have indeed heard about palm trees.
There will almost certainly be a report here, or at least a link to my blog, mytimetotravel.
There will almost certainly be a report here, or at least a link to my blog, mytimetotravel.
Apr 26th, 2015, 08:34 AM
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If you are not a very good sailor, I'd take the plane rather than the ferry. I agree with your sister about the car. Why not stay on St. Mary's for a few days and do a bit of Island hopping?
Tresco is worth a visit, but so are St. Martins and St. Agnes. St. Agnes has some very strange rock formations.
The Scillies have long been famous for shipwrecks and the churches have tombstones and memorials to many of them. In 1707 four warships were wrecked because the navigators couldn't calculate their positions. Hence, the prize offered to anyone who could calculate longitude.
One delightful thing about the Scillies is the tameness of the birds. They have no fear of humans. It says a lot for the local people and the sort of tourists who go there.
If you are on Facebook, check the page of the Scilly Seargeant. It is very entertaining
Tresco is worth a visit, but so are St. Martins and St. Agnes. St. Agnes has some very strange rock formations.
The Scillies have long been famous for shipwrecks and the churches have tombstones and memorials to many of them. In 1707 four warships were wrecked because the navigators couldn't calculate their positions. Hence, the prize offered to anyone who could calculate longitude.
One delightful thing about the Scillies is the tameness of the birds. They have no fear of humans. It says a lot for the local people and the sort of tourists who go there.
If you are on Facebook, check the page of the Scilly Seargeant. It is very entertaining
Apr 26th, 2015, 08:43 AM
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Apr 26th, 2015, 08:49 AM
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annhig - thanks so much for the links! And for the other info - I think I will definitely do this, maybe three nights on the islands and four for Penzance? I've been to Penzance before, but not since the early 1990s (with someone who drove...).
Revisiting St. Michael's Mount and walking some of the coast path are high on the list. I have good memories of the Lizard, but it's not a must. I have less good memories of Land's End, but I imagine it is easier to get to?
I may just change trains in Exeter, but does it have left luggage? I visited Salisbury in 2011, but I haven't been to Portsmouth since I worked on the south coast in the 1970s, and I didn't visit as a tourist then. I'm thinking a day trip to Ryde, a day trip to Fishbourne, stopping off in Chichester and the place I used to live, and a day for the sights in Portsmouth.
Thanks for the reinforcement, janisj.
I was thinking of going to France via the Channel Islands and Brittany, but the logistics aren't working out.
Revisiting St. Michael's Mount and walking some of the coast path are high on the list. I have good memories of the Lizard, but it's not a must. I have less good memories of Land's End, but I imagine it is easier to get to?
I may just change trains in Exeter, but does it have left luggage? I visited Salisbury in 2011, but I haven't been to Portsmouth since I worked on the south coast in the 1970s, and I didn't visit as a tourist then. I'm thinking a day trip to Ryde, a day trip to Fishbourne, stopping off in Chichester and the place I used to live, and a day for the sights in Portsmouth.
Thanks for the reinforcement, janisj.
I was thinking of going to France via the Channel Islands and Brittany, but the logistics aren't working out.
Apr 26th, 2015, 08:59 AM
#10
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MissPrism - I don't do FB, but that is an absolutely fabulous piece in the Guardian!
Actually, I think I will be happier on a boat than in a small plane. I was once on a ferry from Calais to Dover that went round in circles outside Dover for hours waiting for it get calm enough for an approach, and I was one of the few people not throwing up. On the other hand, I have been developing a serious fear of heights. But thanks for the thought.
I like the sound of the rock formations.
Actually, I think I will be happier on a boat than in a small plane. I was once on a ferry from Calais to Dover that went round in circles outside Dover for hours waiting for it get calm enough for an approach, and I was one of the few people not throwing up. On the other hand, I have been developing a serious fear of heights. But thanks for the thought.
I like the sound of the rock formations.
Apr 26th, 2015, 09:39 AM
#11
here is the info re left luggage at Exeter St Davids; it seems rather strangely to be located in a cab office, but it's reasonably up to date as there is a count down to the General Election in the corner of the website!
http://www.exeter.gov.uk/index.aspx?...37&listid=9786
You should be all right on the ferry [says she, possibly the worst sailor in the world who once threw up due to mal de mer on dry land]. My colleague, who was born on the Scillies and whose dad was master of the ship does the trip all the time and rarely reports delays. if there are and you have to get off, they will generally find a way.
That piece about the police vacancy on the Scillies went viral - the fried egg left outside the shed that had been broken into was a particular joy.
and here's the timetable for PZ to Land's end:
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/devo...or=6&source=sp
it would be nicer to go to Sennen and walk to Land's end from there - or vice versa.
Lamorna is also lovely - a local artist, Lamorna Birch, renamed himself after the village, or so the story goes. his work and that of the other Newlyn Artists are displayed here:
http://www.penleehouse.org.uk/artists/lamorna-birch
A most beautiful collection of art and a terrific cafe set in a lovely garden. A definite PZ must see.
[don't make the mistake that I made and go to the Newlyn art gallery which is much more avant gard - a mistake I made the first time I wanted to see them]
Three nights on the islands doesn't give you much time - one day for Tresco and another for St Martin's perhaps. The usual form is that your B&B hostess will put various options to you, either in the morning or the night before, depending on what the boatmen are recommending - they know where the best place to see the birds and/or seals are, how the tides are running, etc. ditto 4 nights in PZ - especially if you are going to be dependent on buses which may not run that frequently. if you could stretch it to at least one more night in each place, i think that you would have a far more satisfactory trip.
http://www.exeter.gov.uk/index.aspx?...37&listid=9786
You should be all right on the ferry [says she, possibly the worst sailor in the world who once threw up due to mal de mer on dry land]. My colleague, who was born on the Scillies and whose dad was master of the ship does the trip all the time and rarely reports delays. if there are and you have to get off, they will generally find a way.
That piece about the police vacancy on the Scillies went viral - the fried egg left outside the shed that had been broken into was a particular joy.
and here's the timetable for PZ to Land's end:
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/devo...or=6&source=sp
it would be nicer to go to Sennen and walk to Land's end from there - or vice versa.
Lamorna is also lovely - a local artist, Lamorna Birch, renamed himself after the village, or so the story goes. his work and that of the other Newlyn Artists are displayed here:
http://www.penleehouse.org.uk/artists/lamorna-birch
A most beautiful collection of art and a terrific cafe set in a lovely garden. A definite PZ must see.
[don't make the mistake that I made and go to the Newlyn art gallery which is much more avant gard - a mistake I made the first time I wanted to see them]
Three nights on the islands doesn't give you much time - one day for Tresco and another for St Martin's perhaps. The usual form is that your B&B hostess will put various options to you, either in the morning or the night before, depending on what the boatmen are recommending - they know where the best place to see the birds and/or seals are, how the tides are running, etc. ditto 4 nights in PZ - especially if you are going to be dependent on buses which may not run that frequently. if you could stretch it to at least one more night in each place, i think that you would have a far more satisfactory trip.
Apr 26th, 2015, 10:19 AM
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Lucky lucky you!
I spent every moment of free time on Scilly in the early 70s and had lots of friends there. Have never been back as life has moved on, but I hear not much has changed, just things have smartened up.
We never had a car, you absolutely don't need one. Can walk everywhere and it is a delight. Get one of the little boats from the quayside at St Mary's and explore a different island each day. I hear there is now a pub on Martin's and Agnes, never used to be! Have a drink in The Mermaid where we used to studiously avoid Harold Wilson sitting at the bar with his golden retriever.
Can't recommend anywhere to stay because we stayed with friends and new places will have popped up by now. But in those days there was only The Atlantic as a fancy hotel, everywhere else was local people doing B&B for the tourists... and there were not that many of us.
Re Penzance, we never even stopped there, just parked the van on the quayside and got the Scillonian. No parking restrictions, no advance tickets, just some sea-sickness for 3 hours due to the boat's flat bottom!! Absolutely the best way to get there plus the joy of the train ride. I am already seething with envy.
I spent every moment of free time on Scilly in the early 70s and had lots of friends there. Have never been back as life has moved on, but I hear not much has changed, just things have smartened up.
We never had a car, you absolutely don't need one. Can walk everywhere and it is a delight. Get one of the little boats from the quayside at St Mary's and explore a different island each day. I hear there is now a pub on Martin's and Agnes, never used to be! Have a drink in The Mermaid where we used to studiously avoid Harold Wilson sitting at the bar with his golden retriever.
Can't recommend anywhere to stay because we stayed with friends and new places will have popped up by now. But in those days there was only The Atlantic as a fancy hotel, everywhere else was local people doing B&B for the tourists... and there were not that many of us.
Re Penzance, we never even stopped there, just parked the van on the quayside and got the Scillonian. No parking restrictions, no advance tickets, just some sea-sickness for 3 hours due to the boat's flat bottom!! Absolutely the best way to get there plus the joy of the train ride. I am already seething with envy.
Apr 26th, 2015, 11:41 AM
#14
Original Poster
@annhig - that is odd about the left luggage, but good that there is some! Would you believe we are already into electioneering here for an election that is not due for over <b>18 months</b>???
Quite agree about Sennen. Thanks for the timetable. I have pretty much given up on any art after the Surrealists.
Now that I've dropped the Channel Islands and Brittany I could add some time - I just want to get to the Italian Lakes before it gets too late in the year. However, the ferry back to the mainland doesn't leave until 16:30, so that is almost another day.
@gertie - too many places, too little time, right? I can't believe I've only been to the Lake District once since the 60s. Love the Harold Wilson story.
@carolyn - thanks.
Quite agree about Sennen. Thanks for the timetable. I have pretty much given up on any art after the Surrealists.
Now that I've dropped the Channel Islands and Brittany I could add some time - I just want to get to the Italian Lakes before it gets too late in the year. However, the ferry back to the mainland doesn't leave until 16:30, so that is almost another day.
@gertie - too many places, too little time, right? I can't believe I've only been to the Lake District once since the 60s. Love the Harold Wilson story.
@carolyn - thanks.
Apr 27th, 2015, 09:37 AM
#15
However, the ferry back to the mainland doesn't leave until 16:30, so that is almost another day.>>
depending on the tides, that might still make it difficult getting back to catch the Scillonian - probably a good day to explore St Mary's.
I have pretty much given up on any art after the Surrealists.>>
then you should love the Nwelyn School on show in the Penlee gallery in PZ. however you probably shouldn't bother with the Tate in St Ives - it's all modern and some if it even more so!
depending on the tides, that might still make it difficult getting back to catch the Scillonian - probably a good day to explore St Mary's.
I have pretty much given up on any art after the Surrealists.>>
then you should love the Nwelyn School on show in the Penlee gallery in PZ. however you probably shouldn't bother with the Tate in St Ives - it's all modern and some if it even more so!
Apr 27th, 2015, 05:49 PM
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Just an aside really, but do you know about the UK Senior Rail Pass? I have just ordered one online. You get about 33% off regular rail fares in UK. Maybe more offers too. My friends told me to get one if I am doing any amount of travelling over there. Have a look and see if it will be worth your while. You need some kind of UK ID ( I used my UK Driving License but you can also use a passport) and a UK address for it it be sent to.
Just a thought.
Just a thought.
Apr 27th, 2015, 06:44 PM
#18
Original Poster
Thanks gertie. It's never been worth it in the past, but it might be for this trip. I can have it sent to my sister's house, I'm spending a few nights with her before the wedding. I'll have to run the numbers to see, but I have realized I am already under the 90 days for my German trains...
Apr 27th, 2015, 09:52 PM
#19
You don't need any sort of UK ID. (They are lot limited to UK residents/citizens). Just any photo ID w/ age - a passport, drivers license, etc. And you don't need a UK address. If you are outside the UK you simply collect the senior rail card at a mainline train station (after downloading and completing the forms at home).
You can book senior fares even if you don't yet have the senior card in-hand. You just can't collect the tix/use them until after you do have the pass.
You can book senior fares even if you don't yet have the senior card in-hand. You just can't collect the tix/use them until after you do have the pass.
Apr 27th, 2015, 09:59 PM
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There's very little point in pre-ordering a Senior Railcard. And for most visitors, no point in having one anyway.
It costs ~£30, and offers 33% discount on virtually all offpeak railway fares (including those already discounted). So IF you're going to spend £100 on trains, the card makes sense.
The ONLY other material benefits (http://www.senior-railcard.co.uk/usi...times-tickets/) are:
- if you take the card to a TfL manned ticket counter and have an Oyster Card, you can get the two linked, reducing your daily offpeak Oyster PAYG cap 33%, or
- you can get a discount on a Z1-6 one day TfL Travelcard.
Some visitors will be able to benefit from these added offers. But not all.
You don't need actually to own or possess a Senior Railcard to book tickets and get the card's discounts: you MUST have a card to get on a train you've claimed a discounted fare on. For most visitors, the easiest option is to book online and buy the card from a manned ticket office once you're here. The transaction (assuming you fill the form in before you start and your writing's legible) takes about 30 secs - but don't try it at a time or place real customers are trying to get to work.
Some stations - quite rightly, and they ought to have done this years ago - now ban the sale of these cards before around 0930. Do remember that, even at stations still tolerating such antisocial behaviour, the right under English Common Law conferred by Magna Carta to tear such pests limb from limb still applies.
It costs ~£30, and offers 33% discount on virtually all offpeak railway fares (including those already discounted). So IF you're going to spend £100 on trains, the card makes sense.
The ONLY other material benefits (http://www.senior-railcard.co.uk/usi...times-tickets/) are:
- if you take the card to a TfL manned ticket counter and have an Oyster Card, you can get the two linked, reducing your daily offpeak Oyster PAYG cap 33%, or
- you can get a discount on a Z1-6 one day TfL Travelcard.
Some visitors will be able to benefit from these added offers. But not all.
You don't need actually to own or possess a Senior Railcard to book tickets and get the card's discounts: you MUST have a card to get on a train you've claimed a discounted fare on. For most visitors, the easiest option is to book online and buy the card from a manned ticket office once you're here. The transaction (assuming you fill the form in before you start and your writing's legible) takes about 30 secs - but don't try it at a time or place real customers are trying to get to work.
Some stations - quite rightly, and they ought to have done this years ago - now ban the sale of these cards before around 0930. Do remember that, even at stations still tolerating such antisocial behaviour, the right under English Common Law conferred by Magna Carta to tear such pests limb from limb still applies.
