Fodor's Travel Talk Forums - English anybody??

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English anybody??

Can you imagine a Paris without tourists? I cannot. After a few visits to Paris I had noticed a very bad attitude toward tourists and worst if they are english-speaking. Don't that people realize that the tourism in Paris is a billionare industry? Perhaps they don't. On their side, Paris is an deeply charming city with the world best museum with masterpieces, and despite the fact that those masterpieces are mostly from foreign countries, at Louvre and D'orsey museums all informations are only in French. With the due respect to Frenchs, a touristic city should adapt to the tourists, not the tourists to the city. How come that in the 21st century still people ,in such-called Citá Lux, who doesn't speak a second or third language, as english or spanish? And if they do, why do they refuse to speak it? Something should be done about it, I believe americans tourists who go to Paris to spend their dollars should be treated with due respect, not as the managed to made fun of an american old lady in a very well known French chain store in my presence. Even the Taxists refuse to speak english, spanish and even italian. Unfortunately I must keep visiting Paris for business, in my vacations I should visit friendly cities as Barcelona, London or Rome.

Marco: I was a bit distrubed by your comments. I've been to Paris and a other Cities were people do not speak English. We are visiting them, why not learn abit of their language instead? I have never been treated rudely. If I were, I'd walk away, simple as that. NYC is a big tourist town too. Do I need to speak the language of every tourist that comes here? Hand signals, signs and smiles go alot further in my humble opinion.

This is such a troll.

Now that's a wierd concept. You're saying all French should become multi-linguistic for the benefit of tourists visiting their city? Pray tell. What exactly should "be done about it"??? Require them by law to learn a multitude of foreign languages for our convenience? Throw them in the slammer for rudeness? Do you know how absurd you sound? You sound just a tad ethnocentric to me, Marco... Ever thought of getting off your own high horse and learning a few new languages yourself? I really hope you're trolling here.

I live in Naples, Florida where there is a thriving tourism business. Many of our tourists are from Europe, particularly Germany. We have a deplorable situation here. There is not one taxi driver in Naples who speaks German, nor is it likely that you can converse with a waiter in nearly any of our restaurants in one's native German tongue. Shopping must be a nightmare for German tourists as virtually no one has taken the time to learn German to make these people feel welcome. Why do these people continue to come when nobody is making them feel welcome? Hope I have answered your question. Personally I feel that I am visiting a foreign country and it is up to me to be able to adapt to their way of life and language. I have never been made to feel unwelcome in Paris, maybe it is because I travel with a smile on my face instead of a chip on my shoulder. Try it, you might find that you will be treated differently.

I'm not in the mood to comment on the substance of his post at the moment, but FYI note that Marco is writing in English, which is NOT his native language.

Right Sherlock, my native language is Italian, my second Spanish and my third is English. I own a restaurant in a caribbean beach and all my 11 waiters speak Spanish, German, English and Italian. They don't speak French since we don't receive french tourists at all. Let me tell you that in Rome, even the street vendors speak Italiano, English, Spanish and French. And to add substance to your comment, my comments are in english since I haven't read any other language on this forum. Once again, congrats Polly, you have a good eye. Arrivederci, Marco

Let us remember this. English is the universal language. It should be everyones first or second language. The USA is not dependant on tourists to make our economy florish. Some countries such as France need tourists deperately to survive. It is wonderful to visit there and many of the people are very gracious and kind, but we are not guests per se-- guests do not pay. We pay dearly, but it is worth it. America is the best country in the world. We do not have to flaunt it, but we certainly should be proud.

Hey Marco, here's a thought. If you don't like it and feel unwelcome then stay away. It will leave more room for those of us who don't expect or even want everybody in France to Americanize.

English is the universal language. It should be the first or second language of everybody. The Amnerican economy is not dependant on international tourism to florish. Some countries such as France depend heavily on tourism to thrive. Most French people are gracious and kind, but not all. It should not bother us--just move on. We should always remember that we are not guests per se--- guest do not pay. We pay dearly, but it is our choice. We should not flaunt our behavior, but we should always be proud and thankful that we are Americans.

Marco, Parisians seem to the worse English speakers in all of western Europe. They would have you believe that they are able to speak English, but simply refuse to do so. I suspect that the truth is they can't speak it that well, if at all. A characteristic of the French personality seems to be linguistic insecurity. French Canadians are as guilty of this as French Europeans. In my recent trip to Germany, I discovered that, in addition to already being fluent in English, many of the Germans in the tourist industry were learning Japanese. Even in the US, tourist areas are slowly becoming more multilingual in terms of signs and having at least a few employees that can speak a limited amount of Japanese, German, etc. In my home state of Colorado, bilingual signs and brochures in English and Spanish are not uncommon. Recently, I noticed that the toilets at one of the outlet malls has added Japanese characters on the sign. People that suggest that the tourist has the sole responsibility of learning the language of the place they are visiting tend to be rather narrow-minded in their view of Europe (or the world). These people typically visit the same place (e.g., Paris) over and over, and rarely, if ever, venture somewhere new. According to these people, since my last trip included Germany, Belgium and Holland, I should have learned German, French, and Dutch (and, possibly, Flemish) before my trip. Actually, I did learn a handful of phrases such as "Thank You," etc. in German and Dutch (I studied French for several years in school), but I'm still clueless when someones says something to me in German or Dutch.

Please, lets not be so narrow minded. I fully understand and agree with both sides. Why should people that live in tourist areas change or slightly change their culture for the benefit of tourists? Doesn't make any sense to me. On the other hand why should these residents behave like ass*&^%$ and make it a point in humiliating other human beings. I have seen it happen. An older couple got thrown out of this shop in Paris. The poor old lady was just seeing and trying on some pashminas. She wanted to know if they coordinated with her outfit. This bitch of a woman (an employee) yelled from the top of her lungs something in French.She ranned them out of the shop. I immideatly left before becoming the next target. Another example, my friend got bitched by a waiter when she asked for a soft drink instead of wine. He made a comment on how "we" people from the aAmerican continent vulgarized food.My friend doesn't drink any strong beverages, wine or beer. She just doesn't and that is her choice (there is a history of alcoholism in her family). Did she needed to explain that to the waiter?? I think not. My friend took me to dinner to this nice Parisian restaurant. To make a long story short the Americans that later sat next to us got higher prices than we did and we had order the same. I forgot to mention that the one that made all the ordering at the restaurant was my French friend. Need to say more?? Why be that way?? I just don't understand. They should feel honored, thankful and proud that all these people from all over the world come to their country. All of us come to France to spend our money and some even their lifetime savings. They should be thankful and proud about what they have to show and share with us by treating people in a civil way. I can never understand that type of mentality in France or China or anywhere else. After that we visited Italy and WOW. No wonder more people feel more conneceted to Italy. Love those Italians, their ways, hospitality, food and culture.

Having just returned from Paris and Strasbourg, I can only say that I think most Parisians look on Americans with disdain. Some of the waiters we encountered were OK, we always began with Parlez-vous anglais?, and were grateful when the response was oui! One waiter in particular was very rude, we asked our usual opening question, and his response was "Parlez- vous francais" in a very smart alecky tone. In contrast, almost every one in Strasbourg spoke english and if they didn't they were very good natured about helping us out, maybe they have fewer tourists and more patience. We were traveling with our son, who had been to Amsterdam, Berlin, Munich, Prague, and Budapest, where he said not only did everyone speak english, but many spoke it with no discernible accent! The French need to get with it...we were not rude to anyone but always felt very different and in some cases unwelcome. they should take a lesson from the Irish, the most hospitable people around!

I second that. A lesson from the Irish, Italians, Scottish,Mexicans, everyone else!!!!!!

Cate If you began with parlez-vous angais then the waiter may have thought you rude, because you didn't open with bonjour or bonsoir. This is very important to the French. Just a side note we returned from over two weeks in France no one was rude in Paris and out. Most of the time we ate in places where few if any people spoke English, everyone were helpful.

Let me tell you this. The Parisians are a bit special. They are fond of their town (and they can be, of course). But there are other cities as beautiful around. A lot of them don't speak another language than French. When you meet them abroad they won't say I am French, no they say I am Parisian. As if it would be so great to live in Paris. I used to live there for two years and it's quite difficult if you are a bit tight with your budget. A lot of them don't know much about other countries nor do they speak a different language. I am Swiss and fluent in four languages. They always would say to me, of course, you are Swiss. It's normal that you speak languages. But let me tell you this: I had to learn real German (I speak Swiss German) and wanted the other languages as well. I was not born with it. And I still continue to improve. I certainly do not want to offend any French here in this forum. If i do so, please forgive. Excusez-moi s.v.p. J'adore la France!

Or perhaps the waiter was making a joke. A pretty good comeback to "parlez-vous anglais" if you think about it. Maybe the foreign culture's sense of humor was lost on you. Had it been me and I couldn't speak French, I would have admitted it and smiled to show that I got his point with no hard feelings.

"Can you imagine a Paris without tourists? I cannot" Yes. I can. And anyway, in large parts of Paris, you hardly find a tourist. "After a few visits to Paris I had noticed a very bad attitude toward tourists and worst if they are english-speaking" That's possible.No idea. "Don't that people realize that the tourism in Paris is a billionare industry? Perhaps they don't" Some probably know it. But apart people working in tourism industry, nobody cares. "On their side, Paris is an deeply charming city" Thanks. "with the world best museum with masterpieces, and despite the fact that those masterpieces are mostly from foreign countries, at Louvre and D'orsey museums all informations are only in French" I do agree that these informations should be displayed in several languages. Even in french, the informations are poor. "With the due respect to Frenchs" Really? "a touristic city" The revenue generated by the tourism industry are marginal as compared to the other activities in Paris. Paris isn't Carcassonne, not even Venice. "should adapt to the tourists, not the tourists to the city" I totally disagree. Anyway, a city will adapt to tourists only if it's financially interesting. I'm not sure I really want to be welcomed somewhere just because people are interested in the content of my wallet. Also, a place too well adapted to tourism totally loose its character. "How come that in the 21st century still people ,in such-called Citá Lux, who doesn't speak a second or third language, as english or spanish?" Because they have no interest in doing so. People seldom spend months studying a language (or anything else)without strong incentive, and certainly not to accomodate tourists they will anyway rarely meet. "And if they do, why do they refuse to speak it?" If they do so, it's either because they're uncomfortable speaking a foreign language or because they dislike having to speak a foreign language in their own country. Anyway, the majority is merely unable to use a foreign language effectively. "Something should be done about it, I believe americans tourists who go to Paris to spend their dollars should be treated with due respect" You mean their dollars should be treated with respect? Perhaps you should try to give a handful of them each time you adress a local.It could work...who knows? "not as the managed to made fun of an american old lady in a very well known French chain store in my presence" Such things probably happen. Only in France? "Even the Taxists refuse to speak english, spanish and even italian" I suppose he didn't know these languages. I suspect also he would learn it if he thought it could be benefit from this. Probably he think it's not worth it. Perhaps he's wrong. And even if it's wrong, it his business. To say the truth, I don't really understand people like you. It's common knowledge that french people usually aren't multilingual. If someone is uncomfortable with the concept of staying in a country where his own language won't be widely know, it's quite easy to find another place to spent his vacations. If if this person is compelled to go to this country for professional reasons (like you)he should remember that duties aren't always fun. Reading your post, I had the picture of someone who thinks the world is (or should be) revolving around him.

Clair, Your final comment sounds like you are accusing Marco of being French.

Dear Can't (pass this over) "America" is not necessarily the best country in the world - people get sick of hearing that said, especially seeing the US's appalling crime rates and watching shootings with worrying regularity. For the french, France is the "best country in the world". Also the French are NOT dependant on US dollars. I wish you had "passed it over"