Good posting. I will use it in an English class and ask that it be re-written. I also bet that there are more English speakers in Germany than German speakers where ever 'tomfod' comes from?

Aloha,
I am going to Germany for the first time to meet my family (I am now in my early 40's) I will be meeting my two older Uncles and their wives and childern etc. I know that the older generation does not speak english but have been told that the younger generation does (my cousin who is 43 speaks very broken english) and will be my primary translator. I have taken some time to learn a few nice phrases so that when I meet my Uncles it will make them feel like I am trying "not make them feel as out of place as I am". I must remember I am in their Country (I am the outsider). I will take a pocket dictonary and hope that with the flow of some good German Beer we will have a wonderful time! I can teach them some Hawaiian phrases that I know they will love as well. Danke! and Mahalo!

Is that BillyandBettyJones?

A bit off-topic, but a few years ago, while walking around Grindelwald in the evening, I was stopped and asked for directions to the campground by a young Asian backpacker. He spoke perfect German (Hoch Deutsch, not Swiss German). I answered in German that I was sorry, but didn't know, because I was a foreigner there. His response was, "What do you mean you're a foreigner---you speak perfect German!" And I said, "So do you." Then we both had a good laugh.

It occurred to me later that he could easily have been American, and there we were, chatting away in German.

>>>>
especially coming from someone who appears not to be a native English speaker.
>>>>

why does that make any difference? non-native speaking europeans routinely use english to speak to other europeans who do not speak their native language. i have seen more than one frenchman (just one example) get frustrated when a czech can not speak english. this is not unusual at all.

after years of living and working in germany, i concur with tomfod...younger people often study in english as it is the world's international language for travel, business, science, and just about anything else that crosses borders. older people are often less cosmopolitan and therefore do not have experience in the world's language.

Sorry - I don;t buy that older Germans didn;t have the chance to learn English. English has been widely taught in German schools for over 100 years. My great grandfather, who came to the US before 1900, told us he was required to learn English in his gymnasium (high school).

No - if you've been out of school for 40 years, rather than 10, you have probably forgotten more unless you used it regularly. (And we've never had trouble with Germans of any age, although naturally some have much more english than others.)

escrowmanager, I'm sure your relatives will appreciate your efforts to communicate in German. I'd say learn words for some common conversational topics (doesn't even have to be whole phrases) and bring a pad of paper to write numbers. This comes in handy talking about dates, ages, population numbers, etc.

When it comes to education, Switzerland and Germany are quite similar.

I asked my English class last night how their fathers would react if an English tourist asked, "Can you point me to Rigi Scheidegg?"

They all smiled and agreed their fathers would only understand "Rigi Scheidegg" and answer in Swiss German or High German.

Why do I think this was a brilliant troll post?

>gymnasium (high school).
Gymnasium isn't hish school and there lies the mistake. The school systems im most of Germany were't (aren't) equal opportunity, but are based on social classes. Gymnasium was only for the sons and daughters of the rather wealthy and powerful. The majority went to "Hauptschule" with basic education.

Just informational on "High" and "Low" German:

Low German (also called Niederdeutsch, Plattdeutsch or Plattdüütsch) is a name for the regional language varieties of the West Germanic languages spoken mainly in Northern Germany where it is officially called Niederdeutsch ('Low German'), and in Eastern Netherlands where it is officially called Nedersaksisch ('Low Saxon'). "Low" refers to the flat sea coasts and plains of north Germany, Denmark and the Netherlands, as opposed to High German and the mountainous areas of central and southern Germany (including Alsatian spoken by most German-French residents of Alsace, France in addition to French), and the Alps (Switzerland and Austria).
The High German languages (in German, Hochdeutsch) are any of the varieties of standard German, Luxembourgish and Yiddish as well as the local German dialects spoken in central and southern Germany, Austria, Liechtenstein, Switzerland, Luxembourg and in neighbouring portions of Belgium, France (Alsace and northern Lorraine), Italy and Poland. The language is also spoken diaspora in Romania (Transylvania), Russia, the United States, Argentina and Namibia.

"High" refers to the mountainous areas of central and southern Germany and the Alps, as opposed to Low German spoken along the flat sea coasts of the north. High German can be subdivided into Upper German and Central German (Oberdeutsch, Mitteldeutsch).

The German term Hochdeutsch is also used loosely, but not by linguists, to mean standard written German as opposed to dialect, because the standard language developed out of High rather than Low German. This is based on a misunderstanding, and the attempt to rationalise it by suggesting that "high" means "official" doesn't solve the problem. In English, "High German" has never been used to mean "Standard German".

Well, that's all very interesting information, but I still call Hochdeutsch the very proper, standard German...and so do all the Germans I've ever met. I lived in Oberfranken where the dialect, while not quite as severe as southern Bavaria, is still quite confusing. I asked a couple of people to speak Hochdeutsch to me so I could understand them and they literally laughed in my face. It's really hard for them to concentrate on speaking without their dialect...so I had to learn it instead. I really enjoyed learning the dialect of that region...it's a language in and of itself. And that's what I learned while living there...the locals call Hochdeutsch what the people in places like Göttingen speak...standard, high German. Regardless of the initial 'misunderstanding', that's what Hochdeutsch means now.

-In English, "High German" has never been used to mean "Standard German".-

I'm not sure what you meant by this. High German means, in my experience, both in Germany and in the US, proper German with no dialect whatsoever...the pure language. And I've really been to only a few areas that speak it on a daily basis (besides professors, TV personalities, etc.)

In Switzerland, we use the term "Hoch Deutsch" for standard German. We speak Schweizer Deutsch but read and write Hoch Deutsch. Schoolchildren are required to speak Hoch Deutsch in the classroom.

However, there's a trend of Schweizer Deutsch becoming the language for text messaging.

>However, there's a trend of Schweizer Deutsch becoming the language for text messaging.

And then there is an unique brand of what Swiss conside Hochdeutsch or "Schriftdeutsch", but which actually isn´t.
The best example I have seen:
"Automobilisten, die mit den Pneus auf dem Trottoir parkieren, werden verzeigt"
(from an official parking regulation sign in Basel)

Merci!:)

My husband learned English in elementary school as well, and that was in the 40's.
He remembers them showing the students the original "Blue Angel" movie. Opening scene, the teacher is trying to get the German boys to use the "th" sound...
Both of his parents were multi-linqual as well.

Aloha,
May I ask what is a "Troll Post" I see this on some peoples reply and it mustbe me as a newbie not knowing this but could someon answer this for me.
Mahalo,
Jeanne