England itinerary -covering too much?
 

I thought I had our loose itinerary planned for the driving portion of our England trip in mid February, but my sister just commented that it sounded like we were going too far north. We're traveling with our 10 year olds and have a car rental for the first 6 days (4 remaining days in London).<BR>We are picking a car up in Heathrow when we land (7am) and driving to Bath. I thought we could go to Windsor Castle and Stonehenge on the way if we're not too tired. (We did sightseeing &quot;right off the plane&quot; in Paris and did fine.) I thought we'd spend 2 nights in Bath (this is a definite since we have a place to stay), one night in the Cotswolds, one night in Warwick and from there drive to York for 2 nights. (I think we'll return the car in York and take the train to London).<BR>In the Bath area, we want to see Avebury and Salisbury.<BR>In the Warwick area, we may want to stop at Stratford-upon-Avon. We'll definitely go to Warwick Castle either way.<BR>York intrigued me, but it is far. If we went up there, we'd want to go on the North Yorkshire Moors Railway.<BR>Our kids travel very well. I'm a photographer and like time to just &quot;absorb&quot; where I am, so I'm thinking my sister may have a point. If we cut the York portion out of this trip, we'd like to see southern Wales, which is closer to Bath.<BR>I know we're working with a short amount of time, but there are so many intriguing places we'd like to see. On the otherhand, spending the whole time in the car wouldn't be much fun. I'd really appreciate your comments. Thanks!<BR>

Hello,<BR><BR>Suggestion. If you do decide to cut York you may want to consider Central Wales (or Cotswolds) vs Southern Wales.<BR><BR>You can visit Southern Wales from your base in Bath with ease. From Bath to Warwick Central Wales offers a ton of photo ops and some interesting castles for the children. Touring the Cotswolds is again a good option with tons of photo ops and places for the children to explore.<BR><BR>I would chose one or the other and cut some of the driving out of the tour.<BR><BR>Have a a great trip.

The one thing I would change for sure in this itinerary is drop the one night in the Cotswolds. Either do 2, 2, 2, in Bath, Warwick and York or better, in my opinion, 3 in Bath and 3 in Warwick. While the Cotswolds are a great destination in season, in the bleak mid-winter a drive through between Bath and Warwick would be adequate. <BR><BR>If you were to do the three and three, you would have more time to see Bath properly as well as go to Wells or Glastonbury, if they interest you. With 3 nights in Warwick, you could see Warwick properly (it is more than just the castle), as well as Stratford and other options such as Kenilworth Castle or Coventry. If you feel that you still haven’t seen enough after that, you could visit Oxford on the return to Heathrow to drop off your car.

You must not be bothered by jetlag. I'm a pretty seasoned UK driver and I always wait a day before getting behind the wheel. <BR><BR>Regardless, consider picking either Windsor or Stonehenge to visit your first day. Realistically you will not be on the road before 9 am and between traffic, lunch and shortened daylight hours, you will not be able to visit both places. Viewing hours are shorter too (Windsor closes at 4:15 in the winter).<BR><BR>I'd choose Windsor over Stonehenge. It's less weather dependent and there are nearby shops and eateries in case the castle isn't the end all be all for the 10 year olds. My 11 year had a good time there. Be sure to ask for the &quot;trails&quot; books for the kids at the ticket kiosk.

Van: Your basic itinerary is OK but you do have some problems. In or on the way to Bath you want to see Bath, Avebury, Stonehenge, Salisbury, and Windsor. I don't think you can squeeze in Salisbury. Windsor is a good first stop because it lets you walk around in the fresh air before tackling the rest of the drive. Then Avebury is about 50 miles west of Windsor and Stonehenge is about 20 miles south. You cannot realistically get on the road from the rental office before about 10AM so by the time you finish Stonehenge it will be late afternoon and you need to get to Bath - it gets dark early and you don't want to be doing any night time driving while jet lagged.<BR><BR>2 or 3 days in the Cotswolds/Warwick is good. But don't treat them as different areas. Warwick and Stratford are on the fringes of the northern Cotswolds. If you stay somewhere like Chipping Campden or Broadway you will be in the Cotswolds and still only 15 miles or less from Stratford. Warwick and Stratford are only 6 miles apart. So by staying in the Cotswolds you will be able to spend one day driving around the villages and the next day at Warwick and Stratford w/o having to pack up and move. You can decide if you want a third day in the area - that could be used to see Oxford.<BR><BR>Thne drive up to York and stay 2 nights (3 if you drop one of the Cotswold nights).<BR><BR>Taking the train south is a good idea since you go into Kings Cross in Central London and don't have to go back out to LHR to return the car.<BR><BR>

Hello, <BR><BR>If you do go to York, then please pre-book train tickets back to London Kings Cross. Don't simply turn up and travel as you will pay a lot of money. <BR>www.gner.co.uk or www.thetrainline.com will help you. <BR>Single (one way) tickets are sometimes more expensive than the cheapest return (round trip) tickets, so make up a return date, not travelling before 1000 or on a Friday/weekends if you want to have the best chances of a cheap return. Expect to pay &pound;25 or so for a Daypex return, or &pound;40 or so for a single. (You see how it makes sense to pretend you are coming back to York!) If you end up phoning them, don't tell them if you are planning to play that trick.

Thank you for all your comments. I am opting to skip the York portion and maybe do a future trip covering the north. But we're still weighing our options.<BR>I agree that Windsor Castle would be a nice first stop off the plane, and then we can go straight to the farm where we're staying. (Stonehenge did seem overly ambitious for that first day).<BR><BR>Could anyone please tell me how long a drive it would be from Warwick to York? I know we don't want to spend most of the day in the car.<BR>I agree that there's plenty right in the Bath and Warwick area, so it may be easier to stay central for a first driving trip to England.<BR>As for the jet lag thing, we don't fly frequently actually. But I like overseas flights that land in the morning so I can step off and start my day (okay, I may be bleary eyed). I think when I'm in a new place, the adrenaline kicks in and as long as I can get to bed at a reasonable time, I seem to catch up. Also, I get right into the eating schedule (this also works out that you get an extra meal!) This sort of tricks your body into the new time. My daughter was 8 when we went to Paris and just got on the plane (9pm departure), covered herself and her Teddy with the blanket and slept soundly. She was actually perky when we got there! (I was amazed).<BR>Anyway, one thing I have to account for in my planning is the shortened hours of daylight.<BR>Thanks again for your input.

I actually think you could get to Stonehenge if you REALLY want to see it - a visit only takes 30 to 40 minutes total, including a stop in the gift shop:-) Avebury usually takes a little longer becaue it is spread over a wider area. Apparently your farmhouse B&amp;B is near Bath, and Avebury is on a direct route from Windsor to Bath. Visit Windsor, have lunch there and the head out to Avebury. Once there you can decide if you have enough time for the hour detour to Stonehenge. If you do great - if not head straight to the B&amp;B.<BR><BR>About the jet lag - Have you driven in the UK before? If so you know how easily you make the conversion to right hand drive. If you haven't - then your first day will be trying because jet lag can be a hinderence to making the switch. Windsor to Bath is mostly a FAST motorway with a short diversion to Avebury. So you won't have to cope with many small roads and roundabouts that first day. Should be OK - just take your time.<BR><BR>The drive from Warwick to York is less than 150 miles and motorway or dual carriageway pretty much the whole way - you could do it in about 3 hours or a little less.

Janis-<BR>Thanks for the thoughts on driving times. I do think we'll see Stonehenge, but it doesn't have to be that first day.<BR><BR>No we haven't driven in England &amp; it's my husband who will be driving. I'm sure it will take some adjustment, and being jetlagged (adrenaline or not) will add to the challenge. I guess that's why I'm concerned with committing ourselves to too much driving.<BR><BR>It's funny a three hour drive for us is nothing, but planning it elsewhere is a big deal!

My advice would be to stay put in the Cotswolds and take day trips. Stow-in-the-wold is very central.<BR><BR>If you are going to see Avebury, I think you can skip Stonehenge. My personal opinion is that Avebury is in a much prettier setting. Someone once said they thought Stonehenge was more popular and well known becuase it is easier to photograph. (The stones are bunched together).<BR><BR>We have visited the Cotswolds a couple of times and there is always something more to see: Oxford, Warwick (our son loved this castle), Bath, Avebury, Blenheim Palace, Stratford (a tourist trap really, but we like to go there in the evening for a play), plus loads of lovely villages. <BR><BR>Even if it's not your usual activity, take a walk - they have many brochures on sale in the village newspaper shops that outline short walks. It would be hard to pick one but the walk that starts in Lower Slaughter sticks in my mind. Short, not too demanding. Kids usually enjoy getting out. <BR><BR>A short trip to South Wales is possible. The Yorkshire Dales are also wonderful but I think you will spend too much time in the car to really enjoy it. The Yorkshire Dales deserve a trip of their own. The Cotswolds has loads of atmosphere and you should take a few days to soak it in.

Jet lag is the #1 cause for accidents with rental cars so please don't attempt too much the first day. No matter how &quot;up&quot; you thing you feel, you really aren't. On times we rented a car upon arrival we stayed close by the a/p the first day. <BR>Remember distances look close on the map but in reality are not.

Lori's suggestion to stay close the first day is a ggod one - Windsor would have been perfect. But you have already booked near Bath so that is out unless you cancel. <BR><BR>But you really shouldn't count on seeing Stonehenge unless you do it that first day enroute to Bath. Your 2nd day will be mostly taken up seeing Bath. It would be at least a 3 hour round trip from Bath to Stonehenge - an hour or more each way and an hour there. It is less than 40 miles but it is a very busy road and can get really congested, and there are a lot of lorries (trucks). I have driven that route many times and depending on traffic it can take 45 minutes to over 2 hours.

I appreciate the tips on renting the car. I'm getting a better picture not to set our driving distances too far apart. We may be following my sister to Bath from the airport (arriving at about the same time), but that may or may not work out (and may or may not make it easier for us).<BR>That's why I figured we may as well figure out what we want to see on the way to Bath.<BR>If we end up skipping York this trip, we would probably have time for Oxford.<BR>I like the idea of the walks in the Cotswolds(and yes, we are prepared for rain!)<BR>I forgot to respond to Nigel's suggestion about the roundtrip ticket being cheaper. Yes, it doesn't make sense, but I think a roundtrip ticket would be cheaper.

After reading this thread earlier, I'd mapped out an itinerary based on several of the suggestions provided for our family trip. <BR><BR>Day 1: Gatwick to Salisbury; tour the cathedral, walk through the town; stay at a B&amp;B<BR>Day 2: Drive to Cotswolds with short stop at Stonehenge<BR>Days 3, 4, &amp; 5: Stay in a Cotswolds B&amp;B base for excursions to Warwick, perhaps a pottery tour, or trip to Bath<BR>Day 6 Return to Gatwick; drop car off and take Express to London<BR><BR>After reading a different thread though, there were many less than favorable comments about the Cotswolds so I'm wondering if spending the bulk of our stay there is a mistake. We'll be there next month. <BR><BR>If we do end up staying in the Cotswolds, is there a particular classic style English garden nearby to visit or will we see that anyway in our other trips to Salisbury, Warwick, or London?<BR><BR>Many thanks to all you wonderful people offering suggestions! ;-)

TT, Some find the Cotswolds a bit cliche in its quaintness. I disagree with that but this area is often visited over other parts of the UK because of its close proximity to London. You won't be disappointed and its a good destination for a short visit. Just promise yourself next time you'll go farther afield to see other places.<BR><BR>You may be a bit early for seeing much in the way of gardens. Wilton House (near Salisbury) and Blenheim Palace have gorgeous gardens but check ahead for opening times. I think Wilton opens at the beginning of April and Blenheim around mid-March. Might be more interesting to visit Kew Gardens and Richmond Park.<BR><BR>Have a great trip!

The Cotswolds have some lovely towns. Be sure to visit Broadway.

Any suggestions on whether it'd be better to make the 3 nights in London at the beginning of a trip (would be during the week) versus at the end of the trip (would be Sat-Tues)?

Vanphoto - you've gotten some great suggestions. I just returned from England last week and we went to Salisbury (loved it!) and Bath and Stonehenge with a car. You can hit the hightlights of Bath in a day, and if you go Salisbury as a day trip from Bath you can also hit Stonehenge (I liked it, but it does really only need about 45 minutes or less, so not a big time drain). One thought, when you are taking the &quot;A&quot; roads, you drive through lots of little towns, and it takes a LOT longer than you think it will to get from one place to another. It's very scenic, but don't plan on going 40 miles in an hour, say.<BR><BR>TT - for timing in London, it doesn't really matter. Not all tourist things are open on Sundays, the theatres are dark, and the Abbeys may be closed for services. But, you'll have Sat, Mon, and Tues for that stuff. The British museum is open all weekend, Bayswater Road has an open air arts show Sunday, and Portobello Road has the antiques fair Saturdays. During the week, everything is open but you don't have the extra &quot;weekly&quot; things going on.

Just my 2 pence...<BR>We spent 2 nts in York and 2 nts in Cotswolds and although the cotswolds were beautful we SOOOOO wished we had spent that time in York. It became one of our most favorite places in the world (along with N. Wales). Dont skip it!

Hi Vanphoto,<BR><BR>I really enjoyed Windsor Castle. I saw it during a stopover in Heathrow. There are rooms that just got restored, which should be beautiful. The town of Windsor is adorable and nice to walk around in. <BR><BR>