Driving on the wrong side of the road across 3 countries....
 

Well aren't you lucky out there that it won't actually be me driving - but my husband Chris. So here the thoughts so far - any additions, thoughts or glaring problems please feel free to point out - it's all gratefully accepted.

The month of travel is October 2011. 2 Parents, (niece) miss17, miss 10 & mr 6. (5)

We are flying into Paris (24hours: 3 kids: lots of electronic help & a fist full of valium for mummy!!) Where we are staying in a self contained flat for 4 nights. No fixed plans here - Louvre/EifTower/ Monmartre/market for me - jet lag for all...

Train to Lyon & pick up the rental car... Driving to Vevey & staying two nights at the Hostel (Riviera Lodge) - looks lovely on the internet & geez it is fun to find short stay accomodation for 5 people that isn't holiday a 'let' .... It just does not exist. Visiting Chateaux Chillion...

& here any pointers on the most scenic drives as we motor would be appreciated as
this is where we come unstuck.. I have booked accomodation in Vevey, & then again in Venice - but the drive across is too long for the kids & Chris - so where would you suggest to stop along the way ? Chris is absolute in his wish to 'climb every mountain' albiet in the comfort of the car ! But he loves the idea of the Alps & really wants us to 'expierience' it.

Venice I have us booked in for 4 nights (Villa Antica Graziella) again based on tripadvisor & reviews - looks lovely - good reviews & you can only hope from this distance that your doing the right thing.... Chris is hoping to get a gondola ride in & we are pretty clueless on the rest (I see a pattern happening starting here).. Any thoughts with kids & a teen in mind ? (Here the forum "venice with children was great : Dec08) - Doge's Palace tours.

Then drivng to Lucca, & again I have booked a flat for the 9 days we are there. This I am more comfortable around as we have already travelled to Lucca before & we loved it. This is where the day trip - or just hang out depending on the day comes into play. I would like to go to Florence - but maybe by train to give Chris a rest from driving.. Pisa, Sienna, & then a drive up into the mountains - (devils bridge) et cetera... but this is our relax & walk & relax & coffee & relax & watch the world part of the trip.

Leaving Lucca behind & again asking for suggestions - we drop the car back at Lyon, so thought driving Lucca to Cinque Terra might be the way to go. Any thoughts on where to stay (with parking) would be appreciated. Lucca to Lyon would you do it differently ?.

We are making our way to London, so dropping the car the next day in Lyon - where to stay the night is the question.. Chris is thinking to stay near (think in) Lyon, then train to Paris, stay overnight then train to London - he is thinking adventure, I am thinking hard slog with moaning/squabbling kids in tow ! Any thoughts on this one ?? Stay the night then fly to London maybe ?? Or is the train- tunnel to London really worth it ?

Then once in London 9 days staying with family. Hampton Court (childhood memories) Richmond Hill & Park to see the deer, shopping on Oxford Street /chilling days.... tea with the Queen, try on a crown or two, shop whist the Auusie dollar is still okay.... Big red bus for the kids - & any other kitch touristy thing my husband thinks he can get away with. Here we have also rented a car - for trips out to Oxford or Caimbridge, maybe Bath. With 5 of us - it makes it cost effective to drive (even factoring in petrol)... plus as anyone travelling with kids can tell you PT is only an adventure for the first 15minutes for a 6 year old - after that it's how can I annoy my sister the most, without looking like it's my fault. Plus of course the weather in October may not be kind.

I have read quite a few previous chats & the info is given with such generosity of spirit - so thanks if you reply to this... it's greatly appreciated.

Now I'll skip over to the Sydney chat & see if I can add anything to someones Australian visit - it's the karma merrygoround.
thanks, Deb.

Driving on the 'right-hand' side of the road when you are used to left-hand side in Australia is no biggie, as you normally just follow the flow. Be careful when entering or leaving a car park, or rejoining the road after pulling in for petrol (more likely you'll get a diesel car in France), because it's easy to slot back into your 'old' ways and start going on the wrong side of the road!

I would stay the night in Lyon - a fine city and many good restaurants, and then return the car at the airport and fly to London. No point in taking the train, and the ride through the channel tunnel is just 20 min of total darkness!

"I have booked accomodation in Vevey, & then again in Venice - but the drive across is too long for the kids & Chris - so where would you suggest to stop along the way ?"

If that makes it a 2-day drive, be aware the scenery in Italy can be pretty tedious between the bit where the road from the Alps hits the Lombard/Piedmont plain and Venice.

You've two basic choices, and in Oct they're often best left till you know what the weather's like, since in the rain (snow's unlikely) this can be a dismal, claustrophobic drive and you'd want to go by motorway, stopping off in places like Verona where there's stuff inside to see, whereas on a bright sunny two days you might like the long mountainous diversion via Domodossola, Lugano, the northern shore of Lake Como and the diversion roundtghe Lago di Garda to Roveretto and hit the motorway at Vicenza.

Decide that first.


"Or is the train- tunnel to London really worth it ?"
Worth what? Book now and it's cheaper and (depending where "family" is) almost certainly faster than flying to London from Paris (though flying direct from Lyons can be cheaper and faster than the train). Some modern children do whinge on about how slow fast trains are (we had a clutch of the litle brats next to us, self-pitying for the whole of a train journey back from the Alps) - but find a train from Lyons that lets you do an almost cross-platform change at Lille-Europe, arriving in London about 5 hrs after leaving Lyons and you'll decide that:
- what do these brats know, and
- planes will always seem second rate afterwards.

Sorry: Alec has spotted the killer argument, which I can't believe I'd forgotten.

It's simply immoral to be offered an opportunity to eat in Lyons and turn it down. Leon de Lyon's cooking trumps any argument about speed.

Can you change your 'Venice' hotel? It's not in Venice, it's in Marghera, an industrial town on the mainland. Imo it's much better to be in Venice when you wake up and when you want to go to bed. It will mean leaving your hire car on the mainland (it's very expensive to park in the Tronchetto, I believe). If the reviews are good on Tripadvisor, you may be OK with it.

Staying at the Villa Antica Graziella would be like staying in Newark, New Jersey when you really want to visit New York City. You can save money, but money really isn't everything. If you just absolutely can't afford to visit Venice without staying outside the city, fine, but if you can possibly afford it get a hotel in Venice.

Bert & Yostwl: Many thanks for your input - re the Venice stay, it's not so the cost - but finding somewhere that accepts 5 people. There just isn't that much out there catering for 2 adults & 3 juniors + car for 3 night stays. I know what your saying, & my absolute preference would be inside Venice - but I think for this visit we might have accept the the commute. Really it's just somewhere to sleep & I think might be one of those compromises that you sometimes make when travelling.

Oh & the kids aren't that bad, in fact they are pretty good - please don't think I have two horrors - it's just that in a confined space even great kids only have a finite amount of 'goodness' to go around.

Flanneruk & Alec, thanks for the vote of confidence for Lyon - will definitely stay... & eat there then.

& your'e right will have to do some more work on the fly vs train option for getting from Lyon to London. By 'worth it' I meant time vs experience ratio, not so much the cost. Instead, maybe we could take the day or two that it would have taken in travel time & swap it for a look around Lyon & a small side trip ?

thanks again. Deb.