familygirl

We are finally ready to explore Europe. I have overloaded my brain with info. Unfortunately we only have around 12 days to visit Germany, Austria and Italy with two kids (12-9). Seeking any information to help us plan the perfect vacation. What sights are a must and where we can skip. We are looking at early June. Looking to maximize our time and budget friendly. Please help!!!!

dfourh

OK. Spend a little time in Munich, then maybe rent a car for driving around southern Germany, see some Alps, take the ferry to Herrenchiemsee. Get rid of the car and see Salzburg, then train to Italy. Either concentrate on Venice, or consider Lake Garda area.

Ta da!

PalenQ

Yeh 12 days ain't much for three countries - but say yes you start in Munich for a few days - maybe go to Neuschwanstein to see Mad Ludwig's famous castles - can easily do by day trip by train - yes then like dfourth says train to Salaburg for a few days and then down to Venice for say 3 days - spend the final 3 days in Rome - rushed but can do.

Trains are best because in cities cars are useless and renting a car in one country and returning it in another can often - usually result in dauntingly steep drop-off fees - trains are modern - with a family I'd consider going first class - often lots of empty seats - bigger seats and some trains even have family compartments - check www.bahn.de/en for discounted fares between Munich and Sazlburg and www.oebb.at for Austria to Venice or Florence or Rome - there are overnight trains between Salzburg and Venice and those other two towns - kids may love that adventure - my kid that age sure did!

In Italy www.trenitalia.com is the site of the state railways again for nifty discounts. You are not taking enough trains to make any railpass pay off IMO.

For lots of great info on European trains and night trains (where you should be able to book a private 4-person compartment) check out these IMO super sites: www.seat61.com - great info on discounted fares; www.ricksteves.com and www.budgeteuropetravel.com - download the latter's free and nice online European Planning & Rail Guide chapters on those three countries for lots of rail-themed itineary suggestions.

I think Venice is one must and also Rome - the others are nice but not so much of musts - kids will love the boats in Venice and of course Rome's colosseum and Roman forum, etc. (and the gelato and pissa too!)

bvlenci

I would skip Rome for this trip. 12 days is a very short time. I think with kids, Venice and Lake Garda would be better; they're near each other. Your kids should enjoy both. There's a big amusement park, Gardaland, on Lake Garda. If you have an extra day, you might want to explore Verona, in the same area, where there is a very well preserved Roman arena.

nytraveler

Does the 12 days include the dayyou land and the day you depart?

That would give you only 10 days on the ground and makes a bif difference.

With kids - even those old enough to deal with their own luggage (and keep luggage as small as possible) it still takes a lot longer to travel than with just 2 adults.

I would stick with 3 places (3 hotels) with possible day trips if you can find the time. Otherwise you will be spending a large part of your time in transit. I would make the centers Munich, Salzburg and Venice - taking trains from one to the other. Between those 3 cities and a couple of day trips you will have used all your time and more.

To do this fly open jaws into Munich and back from Venice - to avoid wasting a day returning to Munich to fly home. (This may be listed as multi-destination on web sites.)
In all of these places there are plenty of sights for kids and areas they can enjoy being outdoors. Be sure to get them involved in the planning so they know what to expect and lok forward to the various castles, lakes, boat rides, etc.

Fussgaenger

"Unfortunately we only have around 12 days to visit Germany, Austria and Italy with two kids (12-9). Seeking any information to help us plan the perfect vacation. What sights are a must and where we can skip."

You'll get many different suggestions. The best ones will share the "keep-it-simple" concept; mainly, they'll minimize the time you spend on packing and on transportation between destinations.

There are no musts in your case. There isn't time to see all the traditional musts in even one of those countries except perhaps Austria. Just see what interests you the most and keep it simple.

Knowing nothing about your specific interests, I can suggest 2 places that offer a little of everything, should you just feel lost and continue to find choosing a difficult task.

Rome: 4-6 nights. It's a huge and wonderful city with something for everyone.

Cochem: 4-6 nights w/ outings (Trier, Eltz Castle, Rhine villages) and recreation. Cochem is gorgeous and quite small but perfect for a taste of traditional Germany amid great scenery and history.

Fly into Rome, fly home out of Frankfurt (or Luxembourg,) or vice-versa. Use a discount airline to fly between Rome and Cochem (Hahn airport is closest to Cochem.)

You would not need a car or a railpass for such a trip - just some day passes for luggage-free outings around Cochem. Rent an apartment in each place for several days for more space and a more relaxed stay.

fourfortravel

I am going play devil's advocate and argue for driving. Whizzing past picturesque scenery or villages, or wasting time to store luggage while trying to see said scenery, or being stuck in even a first-class compartment is not for everyone.

Fly into Munich, rent a car, and base in Fussen (or near) for a couple of days. Rent a holiday house (preferably on a farm, and with kitchen and laundry) to which you can return after touring Neuschwanstein and Hohenschwangau, with perhaps a stop or two at one of the many summer toboggan runs in the area. Back at the holiday house, the children can play outdoors and breathe fresh alpine air.

After leaving Fussen, stop at Schloss Linderhof (if interested) and/or enjoy your packed picnic lunch at a spot of your choosing along the Deutsche Alpenstrasse. Stop in any little village that looks interesting. Have the driver make several turnarounds along said route so that the family photographer can snap the cow (with cowbell) at just the right angle.

Continue to Salzburg and base in another holiday house for a few days. Enjoy Salzburg; take a self-paced drive around points of interest in the Salzkammergut; visit the salt mines and Herrenchiemsee and whatever else interests you on your schedule.

Take the better part of the day to drive to Venice, enjoying the Austrian Alps. Park your car on the mainland of Venice and take the train across to your lodging. Enjoy Venice for a few days.

From Venice head toward Innsbruck and Tirol for a base in the Alps at one of the many family-friendly guesthouses for a day or two. Enjoy the guesthouse pool and the sauna, and savor the cuisine and the scenery. Take a walk in the Alps, or rent mountain bikes. Sun yourself. Worry not about train schedules.

For the last couple of days, deposit the car and enjoy Munich.

swandav2000

Hi familygirl,

And I'll give some thoughts about how wonderful it is using the trains.

First of all, since this is your first European trip, I think it makes sense to be as "European" as you can be! If you use the trains, you and your family won't be isolated inside your private bubble; instead, you'll be observing and interacting with other travellers and locals. Young people have a gift of making friends of strangers, so they are likely to make friends and memories as they chat with their seatmates. At the very least, you'll be able to do some world-class people-watching -- see how teens treat the elderly, see how families interact, see what businessmen are reading or working on, etc.

At other times, you can read, nap, listen to music, or enjoy a picnic as the scenery slides by your window.

And of course, everyone will be able to enjoy the scenery -- no one will be wrestling with narrow and winding roads and the behavior of other drivers, and no one have to have an eye on the map and an eye on the road.

Finally, using the trains is more green (yaaay!). In many parts of the world, there is no choice but to rent a car. But in your destinations, using the train is efficient, convenient, and fun! We are already seeing some damage from Global Climate Change here in Bavaria, so it seems a no-brainer to minimize your carbon emissions by using the train. You'll probably be happy to help keep Bavaria beautiful!

Have fun as you plan!

s

fourfortravel

swandav, I think the beauty of train travel is in the eye of the beholder. I asked our two teenagers about their experiences riding trains throughout Austria and Germany for school events, and the "see how teens treat the elderly" comment elicited much laughter. In their eyes, it was more, "see how badly the elderly treat the teens" as they went on to describe the "elderly" who would move their belongings when they visited the WC so they could take the seats for themselves (even when the team had reserved the entire car); the "elderly" who would walk through cars saying, "Die Jugend, geh weg" ("Youth, get lost.") while students were catatonic and connected to their iDevices on the return from an event and not being at all raucous. My favorite comment was from our son, returning from a month as BSA Camp Director in your beloved Garmish this past summer, who reported that he was awakened from his sleep in a single second class seat when an elderly person poked him and made him move because "it was their favorite seat." (He, of course, moved.)

swandav2000

That's hilarious, fourfortravel!! I travel quite a bit by train and bus, and I've never, ever seen folks treat teens like that! Truly. Yes, I would also think it's an ironic turn of phrase if I had had experiences that your children had!

But the beauty of train travel does go far beyond the eye of the beholder -- just take a look at the emissions comparisons given by DB on some trips by train vs. car. That beauty is real. \/

s

PalenQ

who reported that he was awakened from his sleep in a single second class seat when an elderly person poked him and made him move because "it was their favorite seat.">

Your son was too kind! Unless the guy had a seat reservation for that seat few I think would have moved - but being in a foreign country at times can be intimidating as to not offend the locals - and the old bloke may not have had all his marbles either.

fourfortravel

PalenQ, both of our children have learned that it's just easier to let the curmudgeonly older folks have their way, especially in residential Vienna. That kind of behavior even happens on the public transportation to and from the school; the older folks make the students move, even if there are other seats available. I (and friends) have had older folks cut in front of us at the grocery store lane if they do not feel like waiting their turn. I even watched one gentleman remove the "Lane Closed" sign at the grocery and place his items on the conveyor; the young clerk said nothing, and rang up his order! Tourist Vienna is different from Residential Vienna, let's just say.

annw

I like the 3 destination plan; in your shoes I would probably go for Munich, Salzburg or Vienna, and Venice--Rome if you want to push it, but only if you can do open jaw.

I would personally go by train though there are good pros and cons to either way. I like being able to move around and also like whoever would be the driver to be able to relax a bit.

The train ride from Munich to Venice is spectacular!

Self-catering could work well and would involve trips to the local stores or provisions, which could be fun and would definitely cut the food bills.

In Venice, take care where you stay, as location/lodging can influence your experience a great deal.

PalenQ

The train ride from Munich to Venice is spectacular!>

Yes it is but there is also an overnight train between Vienna/Munich/Salzburg and Venice and Florence and Rome in case you want to speed things up.

ssander

European overnight trains are a great way to minimize how much travel time encroaches on your vacation time -- though, admittedly, some folks love to see the countryside by train.

We done it between Venice and Vienna and have been very happy.

SS