dress attire for tour in Itlay
 

We are taking a globus tour in August to Venice, Rome and Florence. I heard you cannot wear shorts or sleeveless tops into churches . Is this true? It will be very hot when we visit and don't want to wear pants--any suggestions?? Thank you

Yes. This is enforced in the major cathedrals and "sites" and only polite in smaller local churches you might visit. For women linen capri slacks, sandals, top with sleeves. Or mid-calf skirt, sleeveless top, w/ shawl over. For men maybe those pants that zip off to shorts w/ knit shirt.

Yes this is true. I just got back from Rome, Venice and Tuscany a few days ago. They will not let you into many churches if shoulders or knees are showing, most especially at the Vatican. T shirt and long pants was accepted when we went.

When you are in Rome, just accept the fact that no matter what you wear you will be very hot. We wore shorts and sleeveless tops and everyone was still DYING from the heat! But once the sun goes down it gets much cooler. In Venice, it was not so bad, the temps are much more bearable, breezes and some cooling rains as well. You'll be fine.

But it's definitely true about wearing conservative clothes.

'Tis true. If you don't want to wear slacks, think skirts. Just be sure your knees are covered. You could wear shorts and pack a wrap skirt to pop on when you visit a church.

Enjoy your trip.((@))

Aside from the attire required in churches, you should be aware that the Italians do not wear shorts in the cities. Unfortunately many establishments (shops and restuarants) tend to treat the short-wearing / brand new sneaker clad tourist with, how shall I say it... less appreciation than finer dressed tourists. Go for knee-length anything and even a sleeveless top (with a light scarf to wrap around the shoulders when entering a church). Obviously sensible footwear is essential for covering the hours of cobblestone trodding - whatever it might be.

You've got to be kidding, amelia_101, about store owners treating shorts- and sneakers-wearing customers with "less appreciation." If they're spending money, believe me, they're appreciated just as much as the "finer dressed tourist."

Re: Shorts... Although not for cathedrals, I wore shorts all over (puchased them in Switzerland when we hit a heatwave), but then I didn't visit churches much. These were rayon print fabrics, long and loose, that I usually wore with a tank top and light vest over that, with nice looking comfortable sandals. This was fine. Really. I wouldn't go around in my gym shorts or shortie cutoff jeans, but "no shorts" in 90F+ degreee heat is a but much of a statement, and I disagree.

I definitely think that skirts feel cooler than shorts. They're more versatile, too; you can dress them up in the evening. I think that in most cities around the globe, you won't find many locals wearing shorts downtown. I know that's true in Chicago.

note to Howard: perhaps only the owners of the shops / restuarants are well versed in the art of customer service, but the shop/wait staff usually isn't and since they usually do not get any commission (or tips) they tend not to make that extra effort which defines good customer service -- of course there are exceptions. The concept of customer service has not yet hit Italy. It is the same if one were to wear shorts in an upscale store on Michigan Ave or wear a smart/comfy/airy light skirt, the shop staff would probably tend to the better dressed customer first.

The supposition, of course, is that the better-dressed customers have more to spend.

I spent three weeks of May in Italy and surrounding countries. No women were wearing shorts. Wear light weight cotton pants and tops and you will fit in nicely everywhere.

I was going to write that too, in most major cities in the world shorts are out of place.

You will be treated better as others have written if you are in a skirt, I would think the sales people think if you can't respect yourself, why should we?

People who wear shorts not being respected as much by salespeople as those people in skirts or pants?
And, how silly of me....Everyone knows that women in cotton pants are much more affluent than those wearing shorts!
Give me a break!
And, I never knew that wearing shorts while shopping means I don't respect myself.
Oh, c'mon people!

I may have asked them before, but is "Itlay" a new EU country?

It is really only enforced, it seemed to me, at St. Peters (Vatican City) and St. Mark's (Venice). Most of the other places seemed pretty lax about it, including the cathedrals at Siena, Orvieto, and all of the small churches we went into. Some of them had signs that indicated that sleeveless shirts were fine, but spaghetti straps and tank tops were not, but I never saw anyone enforcing those.

I wore a sleeveless dress with a lace over-top when we went to St. Mark's, and I wore a short sleeved cotton shirt and tan capris when we were at the Vatican.

In my experience what amelia101 and nocinonut say is true. If you are dressed in tidy, smarter clothing you will be treated better in many shops than if you are wearing shorts and white runners.
Maybe that hasn't been the case in the stores you have gone into Howard, but that doesn't mean it isn't true in many places.... or maybe you are oblivious to it, I don't know. It might depend on your gender. Women may be more sensitive to that kind of thing, or maybe women are going into different shops than you are. Right or wrong, assumptions are sometimes made about what a person will spend based on appearance. I'm not saying one has to dress up all the time or be uncomfortable, but look appropriate and have some decorum. Huge t-shirts with slogans on them tucked into shorts, with white lumpy legs ending in blinding-white runners... eeewwww. Maybe for the gym (maybe....), but not for shopping.

I don't think that it is so much "what you can get away with" and what as enforced. It is more about respect.

Respect for the places you are visting and culture of the people.

I think that if a bunch of people entered my church wearing summer/beach clothes, talking loudly, ignoring the rituals of Catholicism and taking photos I would find it offensive.

I would always keep that in mind when trying to decide what to "get away with".

Even if others wear shorts, be a bit bigger and show a bit more respect that those around you.

My 2c ;-)

Having just returned (today) from these parts, I'll give you the scoop on the Vatican. For St. Peters, women can get in wearing a summer dress. Stuff a poncho or shall in your purse and throw it on where they check you.

Women can also get in in pants with knees covered. This is NOT true for men. Men (and my husband was unceremoniously ousted) wearing shorts that stop below the knees will NOT get in.

2 options here: get the zip on kind that changes shorts to pants or, alternatively, most of the kiosks around St. Peters sell these really ugly cheap black pants designed with an elastic waist for the sole purpose of entering this church. About 10 euro. Get them big and have the man throw them on right before the security check.

Following up on surfgirl --

-- Or have a little class and show some respect for the fact that you are entering the Vatican and dress appropriately. You can always go back to your hotel and change into shorts when you're finished.

Would you wear flip flops, bathing suit, and tank top to a restaurant in the states? If not, then don't wear shorts, sneakers and baseball cap in Rome. They dress up more and you will feel more properly dressed in nicer clothing.

I so disagree with the dressing up part. When it's 96 degrees outside and you're menopausal or your ankles are all swelled up or you have no leg at all, it's what's in your heart and soul that tells you it's okay. You're not going to a fashion show. How can one concentrate if one has fainted?

If it's 96 degrees and the Italian women are menopausal they still get dressed to go to the Vatican. It's not Disneyland for Christ's sake (pun perhaps intended). It's the most sacred site in the Roman Catholic Church, and even if you're not a believer, even if you're an atheist, you should show the proper respect.

We live in southern California and it is over 100 degrees for weeks on end and I don't even own a pair of shorts. They are simply not a necessary item of clothing. If you want to wear them, go ahead, but don't say you can't survive 96 degree heat without wearing shorts. It's not true! Shorts haven't even been invented for that long.

Furthermore, if you are menopausal with swollen ankles and no legs, why in the world would you want to wear shorts and show the world?!

I would love to know where this love of "skirts" comes from. I have to say that most women that I see wear skirts look like old matrons! The skirts seem to always have elastic waistbands (now THAT'S tacky) and some shapeless top. However, I have seen woment with nice longer linen shorts and nice fashionable tops that look 100% better than women in their "skirts". Personnally, if I don't wear shorts, I wear a dress, sometimes a sundress, and if visiting churches, keep a light shawl with me.

I apologize for my rant, but I get so tired of reading about the fashion police saying that skirts are so much better than nice shorts than I couldn't keep quiet anymore.

SalB-could not agree with you more! If I can survive the Valley of the Kings in Egypt in 120 degree heat with pants and long sleeves-and going everywhere all over Egypt in some variation of long dress, skirt, pants-(no shorts-only because I don't own any-but acceptable in Egypt at the beach resorts) what is the problem? Shorts are NOT cooler than a long skirt-and indeed, why would you want to show your swollen ankles by wearing shorts??? Makes no sense to me!

lyb, I do agree with you on the skirt/short issue. Only problem is, even a nice linen pair of shorts won't get you into some churches. You can't have your knees or shoulders exposed. That's why the suggestion was made for a long skirt when visiting the cathedrals. I suppose you could bring a long scarfy type thing to wrap yourself in as a skirt to cover the knees before you enter the cathedral and if you're wearing even a simple short sleeve shirt you're ok, as long as no shoulder is exposed...

Townclose,

I agree about the churches and hiding your knees. My solution was wearing Capri pants, which actually I wore most of my trip to Italy last year, except on the day that I went to Capri, I wore shorts. Ironic not to be wearing Capris in Capri :) I also had a couple of sundresses that went below my knees.

In my oh so humble opinion I think that shorts make a person hotter with the sun beating right down on your skin.

And if your legs swell up so you cant get your pants on throw on a dress or a skirt (a flouncy one) with a nice top.

I recently went to Disneyland and saw so many people stuffed into tight shorts with sunburned legs that, well, nevermind. I wont even mention the tank topped tourists.

I don't know what my point was, oh, try not to wear shorts to be cooler.

Well, I'm post menopausal, but agree about shorts not being cool. For a start, the backs of your knees stick to seats.
A nice loose dress is the answer in heat, so that any little breeze goes where it's needed.

I agree that for women the most appropriate dress going into church when it's sweltering hot outside is a cotton or linen dress with a covering for the shoulders. It's the men that seem to have more problems getting into churches.

Having said that, when mass is conducted outside (as it was on June 29th), I found it interesting that the toleration level was raised to new heights, so to speak, even with the Pope giving the mass.

You know, as sweltering as I could take it in Roma was in May-and I thought that was mighty intense, I can't imagine how hot it must be in July-Augusts-don't think I'd want to! Even in Egypt, where it must have been even hotter-it was some 110-115 one day we were out in late September-it did not seem as hot as Roma-probably because it was a bit drier heat (but dry heat is pretty intense as well). I've never been able to understand how people think shorts are cooler in hot weather-besides being so much more uncomfortable. A nice long, button- down-the-front shirt-dress is perfect for touring just about anywhere it's hot in the summer in Europe, partic. the Vatican and other Italian cathedrals. For men, well, chinos and khakis with polos are really the uniform of least resistance in Europe.

lyb, It's okay to vent. If it makes you feel any better, I don't own any skirts either . . . no skirts, no shorts.((@))

Without getting into the gory details, in really HOT sweaty weather your legs rub and are sticky in a skirt. Therefore my preference for lightweight and loose capri pants or long shorts. I thought this was a fat thighs problem, but my skinniest European girlfriend makes the same complaint.

I hate to sound anti-anyone, but the tone of this post is so typical of many (un-named) travelers...."how much can I get away with"? As has been stated here, it is you who have decided to visit a place that is sacred to many. You are going there to gauk at it. At least, respect the dress code. If you want to - or must - wear shorts. Fine! Just look at something other than the inside of an Italian church. Its your choice. Why do some people believe that they have the right to ask for all the rules of a society to change just to accommodate them? You are the guest....show some manners.

Suze,

>>Without getting into the gory details, in really HOT sweaty weather your legs rub and are sticky in a skirt. Therefore my preference for lightweight and loose capri pants or long shorts. I thought this was a fat thighs problem, but my skinniest European girlfriend makes the same complaint.<<

That's exactly how I feel as well. And you're right, I know of very thin woment who have said the same thing about thighs rubbing in hot weather. That's what is uncomfortable to me. At home during the summer, I always wear shorts (not at work, obviously) but during the weekend when running errands, etc. Of course, I live in Sacramento where 90 - 100 degrees during the summer is not out of the ordinary.

However, I would NEVER dare wear shorts going to the Vatican or any other churches. When I was in Como, we were going on a boat ride and because it was hot, I chose to wear wear shorts, knowing that I had to forego going inside the duomo, but that's the choice I made that day.

We were in Italy in June and some days were very hot. We also survived a recent trip to Riverside, California where it was even hotter. My secret to surviving the heat is wear very light-weight material, loose-fitting capris...they allow some air flow...wear sandals, and a cool top of light-weight material, loose-fitting also for air flow...And most important of all, STOP STANDING outside in long hot lines! We didn't stand in any lines because we planned ahead of time when to go to the sites at the least crowded time...no lines. do some research and you can avoid the lines.

When possible plan on an afternoon rest in your air-conditioned hotel room. Take advantage of the pleasant night-time temps and eat dinner late...go for a night-walk when it's cooler...lots of atmospheric walks at night in Italy.

TC's post is very well stated about manners. My favorite bad example (this was in Mexico) a foursome entering the local cathedral, stopped to read the sign about no tanks tops or bathing suits, after discussion decided they were dressed OK (which they were) but then proceeded to march around the church with a video camera, taping the local people at prayer, the statues of saints, etc. while talking loudly to each other. So may I add besides dressing appropriately, try to act right too. Most sincerely.