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Denied entry to UK; could this give me problems going to Estonia?

Denied entry to UK; could this give me problems going to Estonia?

Old Oct 5th, 2013, 12:53 PM
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Any young person without a return ticket, limited funds and saying they are staying with a SO versus a hotel is going to be asked a LOT of questions - into the UK - or many other countries - including the US.
is in mind

All should keep in mind that almost every country is being more stringent about searching out potential illegal immigrants.
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Old Oct 5th, 2013, 01:08 PM
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"A computer check..."

Why should immigration officers spend their time running computer checks for would be visitors? It's up to the visitor to show up with the right paperwork.
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Old Oct 6th, 2013, 04:57 AM
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My first trip to the US was in the 80s - and the hoops I had to jump through to get - not a visa, but permission to APPLY for a visa were many, illogical frivolous and risible....including the interview where the officer basically went into a diatribe about various racial stereotypes and as he didn't perceive me as one just stamped my card..;.....

.I was stripped searched in almost every country I entered in the 80s guess because I was young and good looking..and the time I entered US from Canada, well at least 4 machine guns were trained on me as I drummed my fingers on the car roof.......when they realise they have got the wrong end of the stick is when you have to learn how to handle these people - they don't like being made a fool of so arguing with them, demanding "rights" and pointing out they are wasting time is deffo a no-no.
in the end they can hold your connecting flight if you're nice enough....as a planeload of about 80 angry passengers in Calgary found out to their expense whilst I was sitting in my underwear in immigration joking with some marines......
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Old Oct 6th, 2013, 04:59 AM
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I think I've also told the story elsewhere of leaving Heathrow with a 10 inch carving knife in my hand luggage?
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Old Oct 6th, 2013, 05:51 AM
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OP, the problem is that immigration agents are supposed to be tough.

I am not sure if Schengen countries and the UK share information, even electronically, but I am also not sure about this 'get a new passport' thing. The US Passport office might well wonder why someone who just got a passport (you are just of the age of majority) is suddenly willing to spring for the cash and inconvenience of getting a new one so soon. It flags you as being an unusual case, and your being flagged as an unusual case with the UK was what caused your problems in the first place. My gut tells me that this is a bad idea. It looks, well, frankly it is, an attempt to cover up something, even if it doesn't directly relate to the US. Don't. Don't. It's not worth it.

It was very disappointing what happened to you, and nobody here can tell you why it happened to you, but what is done, is done. Meanwhile you have a long traveling life ahead of you, so don't despair. Now you must work with the hand you've been dealt. My suggestion is to get a job and hold it for a year or two, build up your assets and also your credibility record. If you can show you have held a full-time job in the US, or even if you take further advanced training to prepare you for one, that will be very reassuring to any immigration officer. When you do plan your next trip, make it a brief, simple one, so that you can state to the officer, "I'm going to A, then to B, then heading on home in two weeks because I have to continue building my career." But that statement will be a lot more credible if you have in fact invested in starting to build that career.

Look, you can disregard the following, it isn't relevant to what you asked. But for what it's worth: Re your Estonian boyfriend. Look, no doubt he's very nice and all, but just a thought: having a foreign-situated boyfriend, be he in Estonia, the UK, or even just across the border up here in Canada, is making life rather complicated for you, especially since you have plenty of other problems in your young life to sort out (any further education, career, etc.) If he finds a way to immigrate to the US in the next six months to a year, great. Otherwise, well, there are lots of fish in the sea. Okay, here endeth my motherly lecture.

Best of luck.
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Old Oct 6th, 2013, 06:10 AM
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"If he finds a way to immigrate to the US in the next six months to a year, great."

By the way, by that I meant, if he finds a way to immigrate that doesn't involve you.

"even though we have proof he's met me three times in the US before, knows my whole family and is just a regular person."

Forgive me, but this sounds an awful lot like your Estonian boyfriend is attempting to 'prove' he has a pre-existing relationship with you, for the purpose of proving that any subsequent marriage is genuine and not just arranged for the purpose of facilitating immigration to the US. I'm not saying this is what is happening, I'm saying that that is what it can look like.

If, and I'm not saying he is going down that road, IF that ends up being the case, that you guys marry, know that immigration agents are very cynical creatures on both sides of the pond.

Here is a post I found on another forum:

"I received my refusal letter in the mail, saying that my husband failed to prove that our marriage was genuine in his interview and that we did not have enough proof that we communicate as often for which I don't understand as I sent in many phone records proving that we talk daily sometimes 2 or 3 times for last 2 years. I have visited in 1 year, alone, 3 times, but I travelled less after then, because of how much the phone and the distance cost and we decided to marry and he live here. Nonetheless - declined."
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Old Oct 6th, 2013, 01:44 PM
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I think the OP took skyking"s advice and bailed a long time ago. She hasn't posted anything or responded to any comments in several days.
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Old Oct 6th, 2013, 02:57 PM
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"There is no pooling of general immigration record between UK and Schengen countries..."

"I thought that someone wrote the UK doesn't share the rejection information and stuff with Schengen countries? Hmm."

"I am not sure if Schengen countries and the UK share information, even electronically..."

Entry and exit records are shared EU-wide. This is a matter of public record. UK, Germany, and Estonia are all in the EU, so Schengen arrangements are irrelevant to this specific case.

As for getting a new passport - the USA has had machine-readable passports for more than ten years, and biometric passports for about six years. Electronic records - which exist de facto for these types of passports - follow you across successive passports from the same country. These records are shared among countries where agreements allow - certainly among EU countries.

If you've been denied entry to an EU country, it isn't fatal - but don't imagine other EU countries will not see that denial. Be prepared to explain it, but don't spend time and money trying to hide it, as it will be wasted.
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Old Dec 25th, 2013, 04:59 AM
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Kasja wrote: "Entry and exit records are shared EU-wide. This is a matter of public record."
Where are you getting this information?

Accoring to this webpage that is not true (Feb 2013):
http://www.eubusiness.com/topics/liv...mart-borders-2

"Moreover, there are currently no means to record a traveller's cross-border movements. The period of time a traveller has stayed in the Schengen area is calculated based solely on the stamps affixed in the travel document. There is no European data base in which such travellers are recorded."
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Old Dec 25th, 2013, 05:01 AM
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And also from that page:
"Thirteen Member States (3) are currently implementing national Entry/Exit systems, which systematically collect all entry and exit records of third country nationals crossing their respective external borders. However these national systems are not linked to similar systems in other Member States."
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Old Dec 25th, 2013, 07:17 AM
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Oh, well. If the border agencies really need to know where you were and when you got there, the NSA can tell them.
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Old Nov 26th, 2015, 03:28 PM
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Hello,I know this post is old but it's my situation too. To My girlfriend was denied to enter into UK on 12 November in London, they have put a black cross over the Gatwick stamp.

I am Italian, so I'm gonna leave London to stay in Italy and I want to take her to Italy.

Can she enter into Italy? Can she enter into schengen area? That black cross affects just in uk?

Thank you, I will wait also the answer of the girl above and her experience.
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Old Nov 26th, 2015, 04:03 PM
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The original poster is no longer active on this board so you won;t be getting any answer.

I don't know how strict Italian Immigration is and we don;t kow why she was denied entry. The same issue may well apply in Italy.

But there is no way I would suggest your girlfriend try to enter the country without being sure she has everything necessary to prove she will return to the US within a short period:

A return ticket in hand
Proof that she will has reason to return to the US in the form of an apartment lease, job information or proof she is enrolled in college
Proof of sufficient funds to support herself while in Italy
Proof she has full medical insurance coverage

There may be other requirements that I don't know of.

I would look at the Let's Go Student Guide to see if there is any more specific info in there - and you might consider contacting the Italian embassy but I don't know what services they will offer you
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Old Nov 26th, 2015, 09:49 PM
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She will have the invitation letter by my father (own of the house), documents of my parents, salaries, insurance (I bought for her for London) that cover 30000€, the guarantee of my father of 3500€ (it's called in Italy "fideiussione"), of course 2 tickets, and other money that I will give to her in cash to show them. She is from Argentina anyway. And I will arrive with her, so she is not alone.

My doubt was about that black cross on the passport, she is recorded in UK not in Italy and schengen area. The reason of her deny to enter was because she didn't have enough money to stay 5 months in UK and my salary wasn't enough for both (this is another story anyway)
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Old Nov 27th, 2015, 12:28 AM
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I'd drop a email to your local Italian consulate, while we have views they have a responsibility
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Old Nov 27th, 2015, 03:16 AM
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Italian consulate will be no help. Lucky to get a reply, and all you get then is the Schengen rule, with a proviso that the decision whether to admit her will be taken by border official on duty.

While denied entry into UK doesn't automatically bar her entry into Schengen, any black mark recorded will be of interest to immigration authorities of any country. If she is worried, she can try getting a replacement passport, as Schengen border officials have no access to UK immigration database automatically (though they can ask UK Home office to disclose details about denied entry). In the current heightened security throughout Europe, you don't want to travel with a black mark in your passport.
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Old Nov 27th, 2015, 04:11 AM
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Well I don't know the rules for Argentine nationals - but does she need a specific visa - or is it like US citizens that get 90 days as a tourist without a visa?

And I still think it would be good to have info proving why she will go home (work, college, apartment lease, etc).
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Old Nov 27th, 2015, 04:15 AM
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Argentinians don't need a Schengen visa, they can stay in the Schengen states for 90 days out of 180.

She will still have to prove sufficient funds, return booking etc.
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Old Nov 27th, 2015, 04:34 AM
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A bigger problem than Italian immigration may be the airline, who could refuse her boarding on the grounds she may be refused entry into Italy. If she were refused they would then need to fly her back, and pay a fine.
If she can get a new passport that would not be a problem.
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Old Nov 27th, 2015, 07:44 AM
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As Alec has suggested, the way to rid herself of the black mark is to "loose" her passport and get a replacement. An American friend of mine was worried about re-entry into Brasil after having just returned. I said give me your passport. He gave me his passport, I tucked it away and said where's your passport? He said, I don't know". Well then, you've lost your passport and will just have to get a new one. He did, entered Brasil without the old dates stamped in it, problem solved.
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