Cotwolds Day Trip - Plan B - will it work?
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:20 AM
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Cotwolds Day Trip - Plan B - will it work?
I posted earlier regarding a day trip from London with my elderly mother and received some good ideas. Unfortunately, hiring a private guide is not in the budget so I have devised Plan B. Please advise what parts of the plan won't work.
Train from London to Moreton-in-Marsh on Tuesday, May 4th, arriving approximately 10:00 am then catching local bus #22 to Chipping Campden. I have contacted a taxi service (and am waiting to hear back from them) concerning pre-arranging cab service to take us to Hidcote Manor Garden, then pick us up again after a couple hours and take us back to Chipping Campden. After spending some time shopping the High Street in CC and stopping for tea, we will probably take the local bus back to MIM, possibly stopping at Broadway if time allows.
I am going to book our return ticket to London for the 7:30ish train to we should have plenty of time...possibly having dinner in MIM. I have printed a local bus schedule between MIM & CC and plan to use the bus, but realize that we may have to use a taxi to get back to MIM if need be. Any ideas what would be a reasonable amount to plan on if we need to take a cab from CC to MIM?
On paper this plan looks like it will work but if you experts see anything that I haven't anticipated, please let me know. The goal is just to be able to show my mom a peek at the Cotswolds and be able to enjoy Hidcote and one or two Costwolds towns.
Regards,
Cindy
Train from London to Moreton-in-Marsh on Tuesday, May 4th, arriving approximately 10:00 am then catching local bus #22 to Chipping Campden. I have contacted a taxi service (and am waiting to hear back from them) concerning pre-arranging cab service to take us to Hidcote Manor Garden, then pick us up again after a couple hours and take us back to Chipping Campden. After spending some time shopping the High Street in CC and stopping for tea, we will probably take the local bus back to MIM, possibly stopping at Broadway if time allows.
I am going to book our return ticket to London for the 7:30ish train to we should have plenty of time...possibly having dinner in MIM. I have printed a local bus schedule between MIM & CC and plan to use the bus, but realize that we may have to use a taxi to get back to MIM if need be. Any ideas what would be a reasonable amount to plan on if we need to take a cab from CC to MIM?
On paper this plan looks like it will work but if you experts see anything that I haven't anticipated, please let me know. The goal is just to be able to show my mom a peek at the Cotswolds and be able to enjoy Hidcote and one or two Costwolds towns.
Regards,
Cindy
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:56 AM
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1. The train
There's no point booking this journey. On any train on or after 0921, the walkup fare's £27 return, and that ticket's valid on any train. There's no lower fare available, and you're not travelling on trains that'll be standing room only. Try doing the journey in reverse, and it'd be a nuther story...
2. Gardens
I'd allow time to go to Kiftsgate as well. Hidcote's all very well - but it's a designer's garden: the kind of thing no-one ever does, and quite unlike any real garden round here .
Kiftsgate, OTOH, is the Cotswold uber-garden. Precisely what we'd all do with unlimited time, money and skill. Differs from what we've all got in the back only by being about a million times nicer, ten-twenty times bigger and on an entirely different planet as far as horticultural skill and taste are concerned. And really nice owners.
3. Contingency
A cab'd probably go a roundabout route from Ch C to MiM, because it's a great deal quicker. Say about 9 miles: £20-£25. Without a mobile phone, best ordered by going into a pub and asking their help.
There's no point booking this journey. On any train on or after 0921, the walkup fare's £27 return, and that ticket's valid on any train. There's no lower fare available, and you're not travelling on trains that'll be standing room only. Try doing the journey in reverse, and it'd be a nuther story...
2. Gardens
I'd allow time to go to Kiftsgate as well. Hidcote's all very well - but it's a designer's garden: the kind of thing no-one ever does, and quite unlike any real garden round here .
Kiftsgate, OTOH, is the Cotswold uber-garden. Precisely what we'd all do with unlimited time, money and skill. Differs from what we've all got in the back only by being about a million times nicer, ten-twenty times bigger and on an entirely different planet as far as horticultural skill and taste are concerned. And really nice owners.
3. Contingency
A cab'd probably go a roundabout route from Ch C to MiM, because it's a great deal quicker. Say about 9 miles: £20-£25. Without a mobile phone, best ordered by going into a pub and asking their help.
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:54 AM
#3
Another option would be go to Kiftsgate first, then on to Hidcote (I'd definitely try to do both). Have a big lunch in the National Trust restaurant on site. Then spend the rest of the day exploring Hidcote. Then you can just catch a light meal or have a late tea in CC or M-i-M.
Mar 30th, 2010, 09:35 AM
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Thanks, flanneruk. Actually last June I did visit Kiftsgate and really loved it. That's why I would like my mom and her friend to see it. I wasn't aware what the differences would be between the two gardens, so if we have time only for one it will be a return visit to Kiftsgate.
As far as the train goes, if I booked 3 tickets today it would be 62.85£ (about 20.95£ apiece)but I think that would be for the train leaving at 8:22 am and returning at 7:30 pm. If I understand you correctly, to get the 27£ return fare, our train would have to be off-peak or leave after 9:21am. I like that we could then travel back anytime we were ready on any train but we wouldn't arrive in MIM until later than the 8:22 train arrives (9:48 am). I'll have to think about that one.
I haven't heard back from any of the taxi companies I emailed, so may just have to rely on just finding one when we get there. Having one drop us at Kiftsgate for a couple hours and then pick us up later shouldn't be a problem, should it?
And, janisj, the suggestion to have a big lunch then just tea later as time allows sounds like a good plan. I know there is a tea room at Kiftsgate, also, that serves lunch. If I remember correctly, the entrances between Kiftsgate and Hidcote aren't too far. Do you think it's walkable so we could have the taxi drop us at one and pick us up at the other?
Sorry for all the questions but I want to have this planned out as much as possible so I can just enjoy the day and not worry about the details.........
As far as the train goes, if I booked 3 tickets today it would be 62.85£ (about 20.95£ apiece)but I think that would be for the train leaving at 8:22 am and returning at 7:30 pm. If I understand you correctly, to get the 27£ return fare, our train would have to be off-peak or leave after 9:21am. I like that we could then travel back anytime we were ready on any train but we wouldn't arrive in MIM until later than the 8:22 train arrives (9:48 am). I'll have to think about that one.
I haven't heard back from any of the taxi companies I emailed, so may just have to rely on just finding one when we get there. Having one drop us at Kiftsgate for a couple hours and then pick us up later shouldn't be a problem, should it?
And, janisj, the suggestion to have a big lunch then just tea later as time allows sounds like a good plan. I know there is a tea room at Kiftsgate, also, that serves lunch. If I remember correctly, the entrances between Kiftsgate and Hidcote aren't too far. Do you think it's walkable so we could have the taxi drop us at one and pick us up at the other?
Sorry for all the questions but I want to have this planned out as much as possible so I can just enjoy the day and not worry about the details.........
Mar 30th, 2010, 10:44 AM
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I'm puzzled where you're getting your fares from. Because your assumption that you;ve got to book in advance is almost certainly wrong.
As a general rule, there are no advance discounts on this line. These things are never quite set ibooking n stone, and they're always doing something to make sure we're paying attention. But the only fare I can find on the 0821 that day is the higher offpeak of £31.70 return.
With a Senior Railcard, An F&F card, or a Network Card, that comes down to £20.90 (which is the price you're quoting). But that discounted fare can be got from a machine or ticket office 2 mins before travelling .
Wait till the 0921 and the rack price comes down to £27, or £18 with a card. You're probably right to assume the £3 saving's not worth losing an hour for: but neither the £18 fare nor the £20.90 fare need advance booking.
Do understand that the mechanics of railway fares on this line matter a great deal more to me than to you. So if you've found a discount that requires advance booking, I'd really appreciate hearing about it.
As a general rule, there are no advance discounts on this line. These things are never quite set ibooking n stone, and they're always doing something to make sure we're paying attention. But the only fare I can find on the 0821 that day is the higher offpeak of £31.70 return.
With a Senior Railcard, An F&F card, or a Network Card, that comes down to £20.90 (which is the price you're quoting). But that discounted fare can be got from a machine or ticket office 2 mins before travelling .
Wait till the 0921 and the rack price comes down to £27, or £18 with a card. You're probably right to assume the £3 saving's not worth losing an hour for: but neither the £18 fare nor the £20.90 fare need advance booking.
Do understand that the mechanics of railway fares on this line matter a great deal more to me than to you. So if you've found a discount that requires advance booking, I'd really appreciate hearing about it.
Mar 30th, 2010, 12:41 PM
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Well, flanneruk, I'll give you the steps I used but can't guarantee I know what I'm talking about. LOL
I used the www.nationalrail.co.uk website and put in London Paddington to MIM for May 4. When the different train times came up, I picked the one departing at 8:22 am, arriving in MIM at 9:58 am. For the return trip I picked a 19:20 something departure from MIM. I requested the price for 3 adult tickets......it showed me a total price of 62.85£ and said it was a "group saver discount". Do you get the same thing when you put those perameters in and, if not, where am I going wrong?
BTW, I received an email from Cotswolds Taxis quoting a price of around 22£ for the one-way trip from MIM to Hidcote. Sounds about right, I think.
Cindy
I used the www.nationalrail.co.uk website and put in London Paddington to MIM for May 4. When the different train times came up, I picked the one departing at 8:22 am, arriving in MIM at 9:58 am. For the return trip I picked a 19:20 something departure from MIM. I requested the price for 3 adult tickets......it showed me a total price of 62.85£ and said it was a "group saver discount". Do you get the same thing when you put those perameters in and, if not, where am I going wrong?
BTW, I received an email from Cotswolds Taxis quoting a price of around 22£ for the one-way trip from MIM to Hidcote. Sounds about right, I think.
Cindy
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:59 PM
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You're not doing anything wrong.
You're just misunderstanding the information you're being given.
You're buying an offpeak return. The only requirement is that you travel on or after 0820 and that three adults travel together. There's no committment to any specific train after 0820 and there's no need to book in advance, You'd get exactly the same fare buying the ticket at the station just before getting on the train.
You're just misunderstanding the information you're being given.
You're buying an offpeak return. The only requirement is that you travel on or after 0820 and that three adults travel together. There's no committment to any specific train after 0820 and there's no need to book in advance, You'd get exactly the same fare buying the ticket at the station just before getting on the train.
Mar 31st, 2010, 07:47 AM
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According to their website, Kiftsgate doesn't open til noon in May.
We missed it because it didn't open until 2 the day we were there. Reading what you all wrote, I'm kicking myself. I enjoyed Hidcote as an intellectual exercise, but I didn't love it.
Can't remember exactly how far apart Hidcote and Kiftsgate are. Look it up on a mapping website. I like www.multimap.com for England (OS map).
We missed it because it didn't open until 2 the day we were there. Reading what you all wrote, I'm kicking myself. I enjoyed Hidcote as an intellectual exercise, but I didn't love it.
Can't remember exactly how far apart Hidcote and Kiftsgate are. Look it up on a mapping website. I like www.multimap.com for England (OS map).
Mar 31st, 2010, 08:22 AM
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Sounds like a busy day, but flanneruk and janisj would tell you if it wasn't doable. Have a suggestion for a tea room in Chipping Campden - Bantam Tea Rooms - if you may need one. Great food and atmosphere. Have a great trip with your mom.
Mar 31st, 2010, 10:54 AM
#11
Oh - the noon opening does throw a spanner in the works a bit. So you really need to hit Hidcote first to make this work. They open at 10AM (closed on Thurs/Fri as is Kiftsgate). You could do Hidcote and stay through lunch time - hint, stop by the restaurant as soon as you arrive and book a table for lunch if they will let you. It does get busy. After lunch you could ask the folks in the National Trust shop to ring a taxi for you.
Kiftsgate stays open until 6 PM so you should still have plenty of time there.
Kiftsgate stays open until 6 PM so you should still have plenty of time there.
Mar 31st, 2010, 11:05 AM
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Ckiskie,
I am about post my preliminary itinerary of our three days/three nights in the Cotswolds for comments, and I saw yours. It's not exactly what we are doing, but we plan to take the train from London to Moreton-in-Marsh and spend three nights in Moreton-in-Marsh while we explore the Cotswolds using public transportation and our feet. I, too, am confused about train fares, because I was told to book trains way ahead of time or pay exorbitant fares, Fares posted on the National Rail Co. website are much cheaper than fares on the First Great Western website.
We are planning to walk from Moreton-in-Marsh to Chipping Campden on the day we arrive in the Cotswolds, and spend the afternoon/dinner in Chipping Campden. We were thinking about taking the bus back to Moreton-in-Marsh after dinner, but I don't think the bus runs that late. What bus company and schedule are you working with? I think we might have to take a cab back to Moreton-in-Marsh. Since there will be 6 of us, we might have to take 2 cabs, unless we can fit into one car (5 adult-size individuals and one small 13 year old).
As soon as I get my info together, I will post my itinerary. Good luck with your trip!
I am about post my preliminary itinerary of our three days/three nights in the Cotswolds for comments, and I saw yours. It's not exactly what we are doing, but we plan to take the train from London to Moreton-in-Marsh and spend three nights in Moreton-in-Marsh while we explore the Cotswolds using public transportation and our feet. I, too, am confused about train fares, because I was told to book trains way ahead of time or pay exorbitant fares, Fares posted on the National Rail Co. website are much cheaper than fares on the First Great Western website.
We are planning to walk from Moreton-in-Marsh to Chipping Campden on the day we arrive in the Cotswolds, and spend the afternoon/dinner in Chipping Campden. We were thinking about taking the bus back to Moreton-in-Marsh after dinner, but I don't think the bus runs that late. What bus company and schedule are you working with? I think we might have to take a cab back to Moreton-in-Marsh. Since there will be 6 of us, we might have to take 2 cabs, unless we can fit into one car (5 adult-size individuals and one small 13 year old).
As soon as I get my info together, I will post my itinerary. Good luck with your trip!
Mar 31st, 2010, 01:04 PM
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<i>"I was told to book trains way ahead of time or pay exorbitant fares"</i>
By someone who obviously knows nothing about our trains.
<i>"Fares posted on the National Rail Co. website are much cheaper than fares on the First Great Western website."</i>
Bollocks. Absolute nonsense.
<i>"We were thinking about taking the bus back to Moreton-in-Marsh after dinner, but I don't think the bus runs that late."</i>
The last (1830) bus from Chipping Campden arrives at MiM in loads of time to catch the 1936 train to London. That's obviously far too early for supper in Chipping Campden: I imagine the poster just has a strange idea of eating times. It arrives in London at 2130 - well in time for supper. Alternatively, the journey could be broken in Oxford, or she could eat in MiM and get a later train.
By someone who obviously knows nothing about our trains.
<i>"Fares posted on the National Rail Co. website are much cheaper than fares on the First Great Western website."</i>
Bollocks. Absolute nonsense.
<i>"We were thinking about taking the bus back to Moreton-in-Marsh after dinner, but I don't think the bus runs that late."</i>
The last (1830) bus from Chipping Campden arrives at MiM in loads of time to catch the 1936 train to London. That's obviously far too early for supper in Chipping Campden: I imagine the poster just has a strange idea of eating times. It arrives in London at 2130 - well in time for supper. Alternatively, the journey could be broken in Oxford, or she could eat in MiM and get a later train.
Mar 31st, 2010, 01:21 PM
#14
freberta: I'd definitely forget about dinner in Chipping Campden. As flanner points out it would work easier to eat in M-i-M or in London. You could stay in CC right up until 6:30 - but most everything closes around 5:00 anyway so I'd take an earlier bus to M-i-M. There's one at 1720.
Mar 31st, 2010, 03:27 PM
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flanneruk,
Thanks for your comments, but we are staying overnight in Moreton-in-Marsh and we thought we would have dinner around 7 or 8 in Chipping Campden and then go back to M-i-M after that.
As far as the trains go, I pretended to book travel from London to M-in-M exactly 2 months from that day. I first went on the National Rail site and the fare was, for argument's sake, 53 pounds (that was for 3 adults, 1 child). Then I went on the First Great Western site and put in the same train for the same number of people, and I was given a rate that was about 15 pounds higher. Then I went back to the National Rail site and put in the same info again, but I went further, indicating that I wanted to purchase the tickets. I was redirected to the First Great Western site. At that point, I stopped, since I didn't want to give my credit card info and wind up buying tickets for sometime in May. So, as you see, I was the one who tried both websites.
The person who told me to make sure I purchased my tickets 3 months in advance was the proprietor of the hotel where we are staying in Bath.
Before I post my preliminary itinerary, can someone tell me how long it takes to walk from Moreton-in-Marsh to Chipping Campden? I think we want to arrive in M-in-M by noon, walk to Chipping Campden, look around the town and then head back to M-in-M. What time is high tea served? Will there be enough time to catch the bus back to M-in-M if we can squeeze in high tea? I want to have all these questions answered before my husband asks me the fine details of the itinerary!
Ckiskie, thanks for letting me butt into your post.
Thanks for your comments, but we are staying overnight in Moreton-in-Marsh and we thought we would have dinner around 7 or 8 in Chipping Campden and then go back to M-i-M after that.
As far as the trains go, I pretended to book travel from London to M-in-M exactly 2 months from that day. I first went on the National Rail site and the fare was, for argument's sake, 53 pounds (that was for 3 adults, 1 child). Then I went on the First Great Western site and put in the same train for the same number of people, and I was given a rate that was about 15 pounds higher. Then I went back to the National Rail site and put in the same info again, but I went further, indicating that I wanted to purchase the tickets. I was redirected to the First Great Western site. At that point, I stopped, since I didn't want to give my credit card info and wind up buying tickets for sometime in May. So, as you see, I was the one who tried both websites.
The person who told me to make sure I purchased my tickets 3 months in advance was the proprietor of the hotel where we are staying in Bath.
Before I post my preliminary itinerary, can someone tell me how long it takes to walk from Moreton-in-Marsh to Chipping Campden? I think we want to arrive in M-in-M by noon, walk to Chipping Campden, look around the town and then head back to M-in-M. What time is high tea served? Will there be enough time to catch the bus back to M-in-M if we can squeeze in high tea? I want to have all these questions answered before my husband asks me the fine details of the itinerary!
Ckiskie, thanks for letting me butt into your post.
Mar 31st, 2010, 03:36 PM
#16
What do you men by High tea? Do you mean dinner - which is sort of (but not exactly) what "high tea" means in the UK. Then you are talking dinner time . . But no restaurants will be advertising/serving a "high tea", they'd just serve dinner.
If you mean "afternoon tea" - which is tea/scones/sandwiches/cakes type things -- from about 2 or 2:30 to 4:30-5:00-ish, depending on the tea shop/restaurant.
If you mean "afternoon tea" - which is tea/scones/sandwiches/cakes type things -- from about 2 or 2:30 to 4:30-5:00-ish, depending on the tea shop/restaurant.
Apr 1st, 2010, 05:02 AM
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mirmar - thanks for the update on Kiftsgate's opening time. Missing it on your last trip gives to another reason to return!
rickmav - When I was in CC last June with my cousin, we did have tea at the Bantam Tea Room and enjoyed it. Thanks for reminding me of it.
freberta - My cousin & I spent 4 days in MIM last June and, although we didn't walk to CC, we did do some walking on the public footpaths & enjoyed it. You can email me at [email protected] if you're interested and I will give you the details.
flanneruk & janisj - Thanks so much for all your suggestions. There's nothing like hearing it from the experts!
Sounds like it will be.......cab from MIM to Hidcote first, then to Kiftsgate (btw...the Hidcote website says the two gardens are just a five minute walk apart). Lunch at one or the other, then a cab to Chipping Campden for a few hours and cab or local bus back to MIM. Although a quick trip, it will give my mom and her friend a chance to see beautiful gardens and a peek at the countryside. Plus, with all your help, I will be able to enjoy the day without sweating the details.
Priceless!
rickmav - When I was in CC last June with my cousin, we did have tea at the Bantam Tea Room and enjoyed it. Thanks for reminding me of it.
freberta - My cousin & I spent 4 days in MIM last June and, although we didn't walk to CC, we did do some walking on the public footpaths & enjoyed it. You can email me at [email protected] if you're interested and I will give you the details.
flanneruk & janisj - Thanks so much for all your suggestions. There's nothing like hearing it from the experts!
Sounds like it will be.......cab from MIM to Hidcote first, then to Kiftsgate (btw...the Hidcote website says the two gardens are just a five minute walk apart). Lunch at one or the other, then a cab to Chipping Campden for a few hours and cab or local bus back to MIM. Although a quick trip, it will give my mom and her friend a chance to see beautiful gardens and a peek at the countryside. Plus, with all your help, I will be able to enjoy the day without sweating the details.
Priceless!
Apr 1st, 2010, 07:52 AM
#19
ckiskie: Oh jeeze -- sorry for taxi the confusion! Of course the two are walkable. I didn't confuse the gardens/locations nor the order to visit them. In fact just last May I rented a cottage less than 5 miles from both. But when I posted about calling for a cab, I somehow "brain faded" to thinking of Snowshill.
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