aussieR

I may do a nine day tour of Scandanavia in December and I would like to know if the cold would be too much for an aussie,especially coming from summer warmth, and what kind of clothing is needed, apart from really wanting to see Stockholm, Oslo and Copenhagen I want to experience that time of year in a winter setting. I would welcome suggestions and info.

regards,

aussieR

baldrick

it will be an extreme experience, with sunrise around 11.00 and sunset around 14.00 hours...
as for clothing, I remember staying in bed for 2 days after coming back from a 28?C Senegal to a -25?C in the Swiss mountains... my body just needed 2 days to adapt.
but I am sure that it will be a wonderful experience. and these countries have a way to celebrate an unforgettable Xmas event.

aussieR

baldrick,

Thankyour for your reply, could you elaborate a little on the description 'extreme' has me thinking twice about the whole idea. I will actually be back in Oz for Xmas. I also have some friends in Sweden I hope to catch up with. Thanks again.

aussieR

baldrick

I thought immediately of the temperature shock I had between Africa and Switzerland, allthough it makes me smile now.
By extreme, I just meant that you'll be coming from your sunny-summertime australia to heart-of-the-winter scandinavia; from your long summerdays to the 3-hours daylight period up north, from your summertime temperatures to temperatures which you probably don't even have in australia during wintertime.
Normally, the temperatures in the cities are 5 to 7 degrees C warmer and there are ample possibilities of keeping warm while visiting Copenhagen, Oslo or Stockholm, but the countryside can really be extremely harsh.
There is nothing 'dangerous' to the meaning I gave to the word 'extreme'.
And I'm sure you'll be happy to have had the experience.
If on the one hand, I find it a pity that you should miss the Xmas atmosphere and celebrations, I also know that Xmas mainly is a family gathering, which would mean that you could be quite lonesome on Xmas eve...
I certainly recommend you to contact your friends in Sweden.

aussieR

baldrick,

Thankyou for your reply, yes I do now understand what you meant by 'extreme' it is certainly very weird moving between different seasons and I can imagine you do smile about it now. The nine day tour ends on the 19th Dec, so I will be back home for Xmas, in any case tours that include Xmas would not be lonely because you are travelling with a group. The time I would be there will certainly have a Xmas feeling because the tour is visiting Christmas Markets. I hope to catch up with my Swedish friends but maybe they will think I am 'nuts' to be visiting them in December. A further question, are euros in Scandanavia and all over Europe now? Thanks for your advice.

aussieR

elina

Denmark, Norway and Sweden use their old currencies (Finland uses euro). And I don't know about this "extreme" - I (and thousands of others) try to spend a couple of weeks in south east Asia or Canaries at the coldest (read darkest) season. It is really not a big deal to go from -30 Celsius to +30 and vice versa. It usually takes two days to adjust.

I go at least twice a week to sauna. Then the difference in winter can be 130 degrees.

shandy

As a fellow Ausie I'm sure you will manage the cold weather quite well. Just make sure you take appropriate clothing. I once spent a couple of weeks in Yugoslavia during one of Europe coldest winter's ever. The highest the temperature ever got to was -10C and was frequently down to less than -20C. All the hotels, restaurants etc were well heated (and I have no doubt Scandanavia is the same) and it became second nature to get up in the morning and get dressed in thermal underclothes (skivvies and long johns)underneath our jeans and jumpers. We had parkas, gloves and beanies and were fine. Besides if you are getting too cold, it's a good reason to stop and thaw out in a nice cafe with a hot chocolate or hot rum toddy, whatever takes your fancy. We are taking our whole family to spend Christmas in Bavaria this year and I'm not expecting any problems. One of the benefits we found was, because the winter was so cold, we did not get much rain we just got snow. Walking around sightseeing during a light snowfall can be quite fun. Walking around in the rain can be a pain. I just had a quick look at climate statistics for Stockholm and the average temp in December is -1.6 degrees centigrade. I personally think that is quite acceptable, although wind chill can be another matter of course - hence you need a parka or similar. The average rainfall is only 1.5 inches which is significantly lower than over their summer months. So it looks like it evens out to some extent, you will be colder but also less likely to get rain. For advice on suitable clothing check out the Backpakka and Paddy Pallin shops, or the shop the Scout Association recommends which name escapes me at the moment. Incidentally I love Norway, Sweden and Denmark and would never pass up an opportunity to go and visit again. Having said all this, you do need to take note of Baldrick's comment regarding how little daylight hours you will have. To me that is a more important factor than the temperature. You need to be sure you will be able to get around and see everything you want, but even that is probably managable. Organise your days so that all your indoor activities, palaces, museums etc. are early morning or late afternoon when it is dark leaving your outside activities for early afternoon. I have just noticed your later posts so now realise you are looking at an organised tour, in that case you should be fine because I am sure they are well versed in terms of scheduling their activities to make the most of the daylight hours.

stardust

If you're really getting into the Scandinavian winter experience, I'd suggest you to take a little trip above the north pole circle and visit the Ice Hotel (http://www.icehotel.com) in Jukkasjärvi. It is a hotel which every winter is constructed again from snow and massive ice blocks they cut out of the frozen river nearby. The 'suites' have ice sculpting and can be visited during the daytime. There's an ice church, an ice bar with drinks served in glasses made out of ice and they have plenty of activities such as dog-sledge or snowscooter rides, ice fishing, etc. With a bit of luck you'll see the Northern Light too !!!

As for Stockholm: they are prepared for cold winters, so you can actually do quite some walking underground and there is cell phone coverage everywhere, even in the entire subway. In the north every parking lot has little electric boxes where you can 'plug in' your car to prevent your motor from getting frozen

aussieR

Hi Elina,

Thankyou for your info re the euro, the change of temperature on returning back to Australia has not been on my mind because I will not be away long enough to, I would imagine, have any effect on me. Obviously I have had different reactions here at visiting a country like Scandanavia in winter but sometimes it is good to do something you have never experienced before.

Best regards,
aussieR

aussieR

Hi shandy,

Thankyou for your very informative and helpful reply, very encouraging and positive to read. Yesterday I went to a snow clothing sale, being a fellow aussie you know the type they hold every year in the Town Halls, I purchased some double-bonded track pants and was advised that ski wear here is not really suitable for a country like Scandanavia in that it would not be warm enough. I will have thermals, gloves, beanie and whatever gear I need, you may think this is a 'silly' query but what about arrival in Stockholm you would obviously not be dressed for cold weather on your departure from Melbourne and a probable stopover in Singapore, so you would have to take all the winter clothing on the plane with you, and when and where would you change for the chilly arrival?. How did you handle this situation? I ride a bike here everywhere so I am an outdoor person also going to the gym a lot which could help me in facing the cold in Scandanavia. That other shop you mention may have been Katmandu or Rays Outdoors. So what kind of parka would you recommend? My son goes to Hotham to ski and Canada, and has offered a parka to me that he has worn in Canada in freezing mountain conditions so maybe that would be enough. I am sure I will love Norway, Sweden and Copenhagen too, and yes, being on an organised tour will make a difference, I have heard from other people that have done similar tours that all the visits and optionals on the tour do not always happen because of the weather they may be closed, but the tour leader and driver get together and create other different things to do that may even be more interesting. Your Christmas in Bavaria sounds wonderful!!!

Regards,

aussieR

aussieR

Hi stardust,

Thankyou for your reply, most appreciated. I have actually seen that Ice Hotel on a TV travel show we have here, I have to say it did not attract me at all I was 'shivering' just watching it but it would certainly be a very different experience. When I visited Switzerland and we went up to the peak of Mt. Titlus they had a small version of an ice tunnel and I really was very apprehensive about entering it, but was more or less urged by another traveller to walk through it, I was really glad to get out of there. I would rather view snow and ice from outside, but thankyou for your suggestion, although I would definitely go for the dog-sledge and snow scooter rides that would be great.

Regards,

aussieR

shandy

Hi AussieR,

In terms of what to wear for arrival I think I would simply go to the airport in jeans and shirt as you normally would. You carry your jumper/parka onboard with you. If it looks like you are trying to carry too much on to the plane, just wear them while you at the check-in counter and whilst actually boarding and then immediately shed them. You certainly don't want to try and stuff the parka in your suitcase anyway as they tend to be bulky. This should suffice for when you first arrive. Have your gloves and beanie accessible in your handluggage to also put on. You will probably be heading straight into a city and/or hotel room so shouldn't need to worry about thermals as soon as you arrive. If you know that you will be wandering around around in the open for an extended period when you first get there, just stick a pair of thermals in the bottom of your carry on luggage, and whilst waiting for your luggage to turn up at the carousel you can nip into the toilets and pop them on if need be. One thing I forgot to mention last time was to make sure you have decent shoes and socks. Don't expect to get away with a pair of light shoes or runners. You will not have fun if your feet are freezing and there is high possibility that they will get damp or even wet from puddles/snow/slush. I don't mean actually rush out to get proper hiking boots but I think you will need some type of boots. In the past we have bought cans of scotchguard to spray on our shoes to make them more water resistant with a fair degree of success. By the way, in relation to gloves a pair of woollen gloves won't suffice. Not only because they might get damp but they won't keep you warm enough if it gets windy. I bought for myself the other week a pair of gloves from Bakpakka that are leather on the outside and lined with "thinsulate" insulation. I also then bought a pair of the "thinsulate" liners separately ($12.00) so that when we actually go play in the snow with the kids I should be well protected - that is I wear both at the same time. I didn't want to have ski gloves for my normal wear as we will be spending most of our time in cities. If you would like to discuss anything re the trip in any more detail just let me know your email address and I will get in contact with you. By the way I am also from Melbourne so we could even talk on the phone if you like.

shandy

I am topping this thread aussieR because I know you are a first time poster. In case you don't know, if you click on your name at the top of the screen it will bring up your posts no matter how far down the list you have moved.

aussieR

Hi Shandy,

This is a top-up because I lost the screen with my first reply so I typed another one but found the first one was still there so you may receive both of them, my computer has been doing crazy things and I will be seeking technical support main thing it is still receiving and sending everything okay, I will put the email again in case you dont receive it and we can email each other.
regards, [email protected]
Rita

aussieR

Hi shandy,

I see that neither of my replies came up so here goes again. I naturally intended to go to the airport in pants and top etc, and my concern was not about taking too much on the plane I just thought it would be so difficult on the plane to change into all the thermals and layers in that little toilet, but you are right it could be done in the airport toilet while waiting for the luggage although it would have to be quick as I would be catching the transfer bus to the hotel and I would not be outdoors for long only to reach the bus so I may not need the whole lot of coverup. Are jeans warm enough even with thermals? or are they a very thick denim, because that is why I bought the thick 'trackies' because I thought they would be better. I have a pair of gloves with thinsulate lining they were only $8.00 at the market and have been good through the winter but are not the quality of the pair you have purchased from Bakpakka also I wont be playing 'build a snowman' so hopefully no wet hands. I will be buying a pair of walking boots such as 'Rivers' brand because I like them and they will never be a loss because my son lives down the coast and we take lovely bush walks when I visit him and his wife. And I will most definitely be buying the right sox, my son will come shopping with me and because he is an experienced snow person he will make sure I get the right gear, he also plays ice hockey. Thank you very much for the tip re the Fodors site, I am new to the site but I really like it, it is great to exchange views with other travellers. I mentioned in the failed previous reply that I checked out the Christmas Markets online and they looked beautiful especially the Tivoli Gardens, but the way my computer is acting today I still would not be surprised if you receive the earlier one anyway you can let me know if you do. Look forward to further discussion.

Regards,

aussieR

Cobos

I think people are overreacting here... I live in Oslo and it is dark here... but I would say it's more 6 than 3 hours of light. And it's really not that cold. Average cold temp in Oslo is -5C while the record cold temperature is -22 (last 21 years). So prepare for extremes at -10C and +5C mostly it's in the -5 to 0C range.
As for clothing the system I use is a T-shirt and a long-john, jeans or some other pants, a sweatshirt/jumper, a thick woolen sweater (Norway sells lots of good ones) and a thin water and wind proof jacket. I also use a cotton hat, and gloves or mittens. What you should prepare for is your footwear. It might get soggy and wet around december, so you need warm, relatively waterproof and sensible footwear.

Cobos

aussieR

Hi cobos,

Thankyou very much for you input, I realise about the footwear and I would think that a pair of solid walking boots would probably suffice. Obviously coming from Australia I would more than likely have an exaggerated idea of the cold over there but that is the whole idea to experience that part of the world in December with the snow. Also thanks for the clothing advice. I am very interested in hearing about Scandanavia. Are Stockholm and Copenhagen the same re the temps and light?.

aussieR

Cobos

After checking a weatherdatabase it seems Stockholm is mostly the same temps as Oslo while Copenhagen is a bit hotter on average, enough that the average is above 0C. There should be a little more light in Copenhagen, while Stockholm is mostly the same as Oslo. What you should keep in mind though is that all 3 of these cities are coastal cities with the resulting wetter and milder climate than inland. So if you are going a lot inland (especially in Sweden and Norway) expect colder temperatures (depending on where of course, but add say another -5C to the average).
And as a last comment as has been mentioned, in Oslo at least it is always warm inside. Norwegians spend a lot of energy on making sure their houses are warm (as much as the americans spend on keeping their places cold in summertime .

Sindre

aussieR

Hi again,

The nine day tour basically starts with 3 days in Stockholm and the same with Oslo then by sea to Copenhagen over the Oslofjord and the North Sea,it appears to be mainly city based which is why I am attracted to it, because I enjoy seeing different cities, so I guess we would not be going inland. I hope as one person from here advised me they did because they were so cold, that I won't be doing the same constantly trying get inside to be warm. Thankyou again for the information, very helpful.

aussieR

hollyfrances

Hi from Stockholm! The biggest tip I can give you for staying warm is make sure your feet and head are toasty, this makes a hat a necessity and changing socks often, for as soon as your feet get wet with perspiration, they get cold. For this reason goretex boots are invaluable. The one thing people have not mentioned is just how cozy and romantic it is during the winter. Most cafes and restaurants are lit with numerous candles. The big tradition of Santa Lucia happens on Dec 13. The 2 christmas markets not to be missed are at Skansen and Gamla Stan. There you will find handicrafts and glogg which warms you up from the inside out...a spiced mulled wine served with almonds and raisins. hope you have a great time!