<I>Much needs to be done to make credit card transactions easier across national boundaries, but for now I am glad to have this card that works well a lot of the time.</I>

I agree much needs to be done. That is why I suggest letting the European market settle on a standard before considering whether to adopt it. Many of the problems being reported have little to do with chip vs strip.

The reality is that much of the problem comes from a highly fragmented European market, but I do recognize the appeal of blaming the "backwards" US for those predisposed to that sort of thinking.

I missed reporting back, I got the card within 10 days of applying. I applied on a Thursday and that meant 2 weekends, as I got the card on a Monday.

What highly fragmented European market?
All EU credit cards are chip and pin cards which work in all other EU countries and other European countries. We have no problem using our Chip and Pin CC in any other European country as a chip and pin card.

Our debit card is also chip and pin and the Netherlands and most other European countries now only accept chip and pin debit cards for payments in shops etc. We had no problems using our debit card in Norway using it as a chip and pin card.

Soon Dutch banks will be issuing debit/ATM cards with no magnetic strip on them only a chip.
For trips outside the EU (read the US) we will have to apply for a separate debit/ATM card with a magnetic strip on it.

Reading the recent thread about pickpocketing in Rome, I did wonder if U.S. credit cards are more attractive to thieves, as they can be easily used without the accompanying PIN.

I have read that theft of cards In European countries is only common when the thief has already identified the accompanying PIN, perhaps by observing a transaction.

<i>All EU credit cards are chip and pin cards which work in all other EU countries and other European countries.</i>

Not true.

In Belgium at least, the banks are aggressively moving away from cards that make use of the magnetic strip. So I have the opposite problem when traveling. My cards don't work on devices that don't support the chip and pin.

Even online within Belgium, it is becoming more and more common that you need a digi-pass reader that requires you input your pin code to complete a purchase with your credit card.

Businesses that still use legacy devices will still support the magnetic strip, but as they get replaced over time, they probably also will only support the chip and pin.

One option is to get a prepaid credit card. Most can be ordered online, but you can also purchase them at any post office here without hassle. While you are there, you can transfer your money directly on to the card in cash and start using it immediately. The whole process takes less than ten minutes.
You can always refill it later either online via another CC, a bank transfer, or in cash at the post office.

The eu has been pushing for a uniform emv chip throughout the eu; whether that's reached fruition I cannot say. Travelgourmet constantly points out a Danish card seems to be on a different system although from what I've read, the push is on to make it uniform within the eu.

Is the hype overblown? Perhaps not today but more and more businesses are no longer accepting magnetic strip cards. Try buying a train ticket in the Netherlands without a chip card as an example. For the most part, right now, ATM's are not affected but you never know.

The good news is that visa and mastercard have finally come to the realization that too many of their American customers are being put at a disadvantage, more and more every month and are pushing for US banks to begin issuing chip and pin cards. Some banks issue a chip and signature card and reports are mixed. I have gotten my Andrews FCU card and will be tgesting it out the next trip to Europe.

Since reading this correspondence, I have started looking more closely at the card readers commonly used in shops in the U.K. I would say that 2/3rds of them will only accept chip and pin cards. They have no facility to accept cards with a magnetic strip.

I am sure that some of the shops may have a card reader for magnetic stripe cards, even if most of the readers only accept chip & pin. I am also confident that hotels, restaurants, and places which serve a large number of foreign tourists will have dual readers or know how to get round the problem. However, self-service machines for transport tickets, car parks and similar will only accept chip & pin.

<i>Since reading this correspondence, I have started looking more closely at the card readers commonly used in shops in the U.K. I would say that 2/3rds of them will only accept chip and pin cards. They have no facility to accept cards with a magnetic strip.</i>

Look more closely. It doesn't look like a card will fit, but there is a gap on one side of the readers where the card swipes (usually the trim around the screen looks slightly different on one side). I have NEVER had a problem using a swipe card in the UK, and I am in London as frequently as every month and give the card (even <gasp> my AMEX!) a major workout while I am there.

<i>However, self-service machines for transport tickets, car parks and similar will only accept chip & pin.</i>

Not true, at least to the extent both the HEX and the tube constitute transport tickets. Or maybe the US cards I used last weekend for both have a hidden chip and a mystery PIN I don't know about? Can't speak to UK car parks.

<i>The eu has been pushing for a uniform emv chip throughout the eu; whether that's reached fruition I cannot say.</i>

Even if they get the technology aligned, there is still the issue of disparate networks. The famous troubles with purchasing tickets for Dutch trains, for example, is because they only accept the local Dutch debit card network. The same is true of many, if not most, Danish train ticket machines (as well as many shops). And I've seen several grocery stores in Germany that only accept local standards. In most cases it isn't the lack of a chip that is the primary problem, sorry.

<i>Try buying a train ticket in the Netherlands without a chip card as an example.</i>

See above.

I know my position isn't popular with the "the US is too stubborn" crowd but, as someone with cards from 3 different countries (US, Switzerland, Denmark) and who travels a lot across Europe and elsewhere, I'd like to think that I have more than a passing familiarity with the actual situation, as opposed to blowing up misunderstandings about difficulties purchasing Dutch train tickets to be some sort of failure on the part of American banks or consumers.

I have a different question as to why certain sectors in the EU feel that they have to upend a system that has worked exceedingly well in the rest of the world (despite substantially higher credit card penetration in many other countries, especially the US). Is it that Europeans are less trustworthy and more prone to fraud? Is it that EU banks prefer to push risk of use to consumers? Is it that Europeans are stubborn and simply want to be different? Who knows, but there must be some reason why they have decided upon a quixotic and meandering path to haltingly and partially implement a technological standard across the EU, while ignoring a) that the technology is obsolete and barely a marginal improvement over the old standard and b) that technology is only part of the problem.

Travelgourmet, as someone who uses U.K. card readers every week, and actually owns one which will accept both chip & pin cards and swipe cards, I think I can tell the difference. The card readers I see are not in London, and not in tourist destinations, and are designed solely to accept chip & pin.

Because I have a card reader, I also know that the rules (and commission) for accepting swipe cards differ from those for chip & pin, at least in the U.K.

<i>Travelgourmet, as someone who uses U.K. card readers every week, and actually owns one which will accept both chip & pin cards and swipe cards, I think I can tell the difference. </i>

So there is only one model? If you don't own the other models, are you really such an expert in what they can or can't do? And if you've not tried to use a strictly swipe card, just how much experience do you have with the problems it may or may not cause?

<i>The card readers I see are not in London, and not in tourist destinations, and are designed solely to accept chip & pin.</i>

Are you saying that Tesco, for example, uses different terminals in London than elsewhere? That seems odd, and brings me back to my question about why Europeans can't seem to settle on a standard! I mean, I know the Scots are a stubborn lot and might consider it out of spite, but Reading can't get on the same page with Liverpool? But, hey, humor me, if we exclude chain retailers, as well as any business that deals with tourists, and pretty much all of London, how do we get to 2/3 of the readers in the UK, again? More importantly, how do we extrapolate from your numbers, given what you describe as a highly fragmented card reader situation in the UK?

<i>Because I have a card reader, I also know that the rules (and commission) for accepting swipe cards differ from those for chip & pin, at least in the U.K.</i>

Small shop owners that obsess over credit card fees are small for a reason... If shops want to turn down affluent credit card users and chase after debit card holders to save a few pennies on the transaction costs, then it is no wonder that much of Europe's retail sector seems so positively antiquarian compared to the US or Asia.

Travelgourmet. methinks you do protest too much.

There are many different types of card reader in use in the U.K.. Some are connected by wire to a computer terminal/cash register, some connect wirelessly or by bluetooth. Some are standalone, some are portable. Look at a catalogue and you will see dozens of different models, all with particular features. The one I have is a portable machine with 3 sim cards in it, which connects using a mobile telephone signal to the bank. It uses whichever mobile phone signal is strongest.

Some card readers accept both swipe cards as well as chip & pin, while some accept chip & pin only. All I wrote was that as far as I could tell, about 2/3rds of those on open display were chip & pin only. Why don't you go to John Lewis and look at the terminals on their counters? They are chip & pin only, although I am sure they have other ways of accepting payments from tourists who have cards which only have stripes.

I am not obsessing over credit card fees. However, I am aware that our bank has different commission rates and security requirements depending on the card used. Chip & pin has the lowest rate, with swipe cards a little higher (and sometimes requiring telephone authorisation). The highest commission is charged on "cardholder not present" transactions.

This is not a matter of "My country is best". I just want to make sure that international travellers, especially those from North America, are forewarned about the ways things can be different.

I don't know; I visit London several times a year and quite frankly have never come across any shop that doesn't have the ability to process both magnetic strip cards and chip cards. If you want to tell me things are different outside London, well I can't argue as I am usually not in that neck of the woods. Credit card terminals have a very limited shelf life (many are rented not owned) and are constantly being replaced. I believe for the most part almost all card readers (note almost) in the UK are both swipe and chip (as I remember and I can be corrected, there was an outcry when the UK went to chip and pin and certain handicapped people were exempted from the requirement that only chip and pin cards would be issued by UK banks).

As to the whys and wherefores, the US banks claim crtedit card fraud is less of a problem in the USA than elsewhere that the phone lines used to transmit credit card data in the US are more secure (don't shoot the messenger here).

Is it a big problem as of today, probably not but it is a growing problem and as I've said both mc/'visa in the USA have finally thrown in the sponge on this and have set a time line as to when chip and pin will be necessary in the USA whether any of us like it or not.

<i>Why don't you go to John Lewis and look at the terminals on their counters? They are chip & pin only, although I am sure they have other ways of accepting payments from tourists who have cards which only have stripes.</i>

I was there last week. Bought some stuff for the kitchen. Used a US credit card. They may have swiped it on the register, but I don't remember.

<i>This is not a matter of "My country is best". I just want to make sure that international travellers, especially those from North America, are forewarned about the ways things can be different.</i>

Agreed. That is why I seek to correct misstatements like you made.

The reason why they are stepping away from magnetic strips here is due to the problem of card skimming that was on the rise. Several gangs have been installing fake card readers on ATMs and other automated devices that look almost indistinguishable from the original slots.
When you insert your card, you are also passing it through their card reader, which copies all the info from your magnetic strip. With a hidden camera somewhere above, they can also retrieve your pin code while you are none the wiser. With this information, they can easily make duplicates of your card and start charging things off your account.

A second reason is online e-commerce. A lot of people here don't really trust handing over their card details online, and so banks had to come with a more secure solution.

And as far as I know, each country in Europe has its own payment system for debit cards. But they are all interconnected provided that both your card and the reader has the Maestro logo. Otherwise, it will likely not work.

In switching our banking to a local credit union, now we have chip and pin debit/check cards, 1% foreign transaction fee, plus we get interest on both checking and savings accounts in excess of what BofA offered. We'll keep the BofA account for a while, but it may only be used for six months more. The credit union is a much better deal, and a friendlier placed, too.

After hundreds of posts on the subject of chip and pin credit cards I have still not seen a single post claiming to have bought a train ticket (SNCF) or a Paris metro ticket from a ticket machine with a chip and pin card obtained from a source in the USA. Anyone...............

Last September I bought Metro tickets from a machine in the Gare de Lyon Metro station, and Transilien tickets from a machine at the Gare du Nord and a machine at the Auvers-sur-Oise station using my U.S. Bank Flexperks chipped card. No PIN was required for either transaction.

hi folks, I'm a first timer here and wonder if you can help. I have a visa debit card from the Caribbean with no chip and pin. I have been unable to find an ATM which accepts it. In some cases it will not even enter the slot. Tried with Barclays, Santander, HSBC & Link without success.
Spoke to the issuing bank and have been told that some of their customers are able to use it but just don't know where. Any suggestions much appreciated.

The chip and pin issue is for CREDIT cards, not debit cards.

Where are you trying to use the ATM card, calixtied? You need a 4 digit PIN to get money from most ATM machines in Europe and USA.