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CDG Insanity=No time to get Tax Stamp: What are my options?

CDG Insanity=No time to get Tax Stamp: What are my options?

Old Aug 5th, 2005, 06:40 AM
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CDG Insanity=No time to get Tax Stamp: What are my options?

Hello, fodorites!
We've just returned from an action-packed 10 day trip to France & Italy, which was a huge success due in great part to tips from fellow travelers. I'm putting together a trip report, but have a fairly big problem I hope someone can help me solve...

The Global Tax refund program allows people who live outside the EU to get refunds on the tax paid by residents. Since we did some serious shopping, we qualified for the refund for what totals to several hundred euros. We got the refund at the local branches, or the merchants never charged it, but here's the catch: you need to get a form stamped at the airport before leaving the EU, or the company has your credit card # and they will charge the tax back onto your card!!

Well, as many of you know CDG is an absolute nightmare to navigate, and we only caught our plane by minutes, which was actually a small miracle.

Needless to say, there was no time for any lines to get the stamp on the required form, so now we're looking at the possibility of a hefty charge on our card in less than 21 days.

We've contacted Air France, which had no clue how to help us. They suggested a travel agent or this board. I don't have a travel agent and I trust the collective wisdom of this board more than any agent.

Can anyone help? Thanks in advance!
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 06:52 AM
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As far as I know if you took the goods home w/ you you are out of luck w/o having the stamp.

I have several times had the merchant ship my purchases home and they took the VAT off the top and I didn't have to have any forms.

But in order to get the refund for goods you are personally carrying - I'm pretty sure you need the stamp BEFORE you leave the country.

Maybe some other fodorite can figure a "get around" for you
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 07:06 AM
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..I know this won't help you, but it should serve as a warning to others. Roissy can be a mess and disorganized. I have flown in and out more times than I can remember and have almost missed (and missed) several flights. Allow extra time!
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 07:13 AM
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I too think you are out of luck. The form had to be stamped at the airport and the goods available for inspection, to prove they were being taken out of the country. I don't think you can do this retroactively. You can try writing, faxing, or calling the stores that took the refund off the top, to see if there's any way of their bending the rules. They would be taking a chance because if the government is efficient enough to audit their books, they would be required to match VAT refunds issued, with stamped forms received back from airport officials, which in your case they won't have. Maybe they can take pity on you, though.
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 07:28 AM
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Hi cy,

From the French Consulate in the US

May I still claim the tax refund if the Retail Export Form has not been endorsed by Customs upon my leaving the European Union?

You may. The process is time-consuming, may turn out to be more expensive than the amount of tax refund that you are claiming.

You have to address within 6 months after the date of purchase of your goods a request for a tax refund to:

Direction générale des douanes et droits indirects
Bureau F/1
23 bis, rue de l'Université
75700 Paris SP
France


This request must be supported by the following documents:

1- A copy of your passeport

2- A copy of your travel ticket or your boarding pass

3- An "attestation de présentation des marchandises" issued by a French Consulate. In order to get this document you must go to the Consulate with the goods you bought, your passeport and your plane ticket
OR
-The US Customs or Canadian Customs declaration you made for those goods when entering your country

4- A letter with exhaustive explanations of the reasons why you were not able to get your form stamped when leaving France

5- The Retail Export Form

If your application is held as justified, you will be mailed an endorsed "customer" copy of the Retail Export Form. The Customs will mail the other copy to the store, which will, in turn, refund you the VAT.


If that doesn't work, try these guys:
http://www.thevatclearinghouse.com/VATRefunds2.htm

Good luck.

I'm still waiting for my VAT refund from 1998, and I filled out all the forms and had them stamped.



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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 07:29 AM
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PS, you are aware that the VAT is refunded only if you spent more than 175E, before the VAT is added, in one store, yes?
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 08:57 AM
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Thanks everyone,

Ira, those clear steps to follow are a help, and they do sound very time-consuming--not too promising if you've been waiting since 1998.

Yes, I think you have to spend at least 150Euros all in the same store. The merchants in those cases took care of filling out the forms.

Tip to readers: When I paid cash, the whole tax issue just disappeared. Thanks to fodorite tips, I was prepared with cash for most of my purchases, but we ran low at the end of the trip...

Since at this point, I really haven't paid any tax, since the merchants didn't charge it up front, I still haven't lost my money. The only way the company can charge me is on the credit card. Do you think the credit card company could help?

I really hate to lose this money!
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 09:22 AM
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no, the credit card company can't help you. You didn't make enough time at the airport to get the necessary materials to get VAT back. That's too bad, but that's what is required. I guess you don't want to do the officials steps to petition to get it back, cited above, either (and they could reject your petition anyway if you just say the reason is you didn't want to spend the time at the airport). I actually am not clear on that customs declaration you need if you don't go to the Consulate -- I declare everything when I enter the US, but they keep the form, so I don't know how you could have that. I suppose if duty was required, maybe they give you something, I've never spent that much.
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 09:24 AM
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good information ira, thanks
I'd be suitably discouraged, which I'm sure is one of the benefits to the government of the procedure.
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 11:29 AM
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"We've contacted Air France, which had no clue how to help us. They suggested a travel agent or this board." - are you saying the Air France customer service representatives know about Fodor's??
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 11:48 AM
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Ira - How quintessentially French!
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 11:55 AM
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Is it quintessentially American to be aware of an airport's deficiencies, and yet arrive just in time to get one's flight, instead of allowing enough time to get all the administrative paperwork done?
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 04:44 PM
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Well, I wasn't really aware of the CDG issues when I booked the flights. I just picked what appeared to be good flights from the Orbitz selection and got a good price. I assumed (obviously not a good choice) that they would not offer a flight package that didn't allow enough time to connect if there was any sort of delay on the incoming flight. So, yes I was naive in trusting Orbitz, but not quite as remiss as some seem to feel.

It's not that I don't want to do the necessary steps, but it sounded from Ira's post that even if I did, I probably wouldn't have much luck.

Thanks to all the positive suggestions. I guess I live and learn--it still was a great trip, just cost a bit more than I intended.

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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 06:26 PM
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I confess to being less than knowledgeable about this process, so this may be a dumb question, but...

If you're departing from an EU country and have to first connect within the EU, can the forms be stamped at your initial departure point rather than the transfer point? I've done something like that when taking a flight within Canada and connecting to a flight to the US -- at Halifax they checked that my ticket's final destination, after a transfer at Toronto, was outside of Canada.
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 06:52 PM
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Unfortunately, Ira's instructions would apply if you are DUE a refund. And, one can only wonder whether your circumstances would be accomodated with "exhaustive explanations why you were not able to get your forms stamped..."

To my recollection, if the vendor agrees not to charge the taxes, you MUST have your forms stamped at your final departure EU airport and mail them (there's usually a postal box nearby), and they must received within a certain period of time - otherwise, the taxes are then charged to your credit card.

Getting those charges reversed would be an entirely different endeavor.

I'd have to go back and re-read Suzy Gershman's books (she's a PRO!), but it would seem that the "sales tax refund" is more a DISCOUNT you receive benefit of if you jump through all the appropriate hoops, and has nothing really to do with government refunding sales taxes, which would explain why the minimum purchase requirements vary from store to store, for one thing.

My understanding (which could be completely incorrect) is that the STORE issues the refund, not the government...which, as Ira provided, is probably correct in that "The Customs will mail the other copy to the STORE, which will, in turn, refund YOU the VAT."

While I do not recall the exact explanation for it all, I have learned from Suzy that you receive the very best discount with CASH for large/significant purchases, probably because it relieves the shopkeepers of credit card discounts and all that paperwork. All I know is that whenever I make a significant purchase, I head for the nearest ATM to complete the purchase, so as not to have to bother with forms or finding the Customs Window at the airport. Or, having to produce the goods, versus safely packing them in the checked bags.

Here's thinking all those vendors understand perfectly well that many/most folks will be remiss with the paperwork/requirements.

I cannot imagine that your credit card providers will be of any assistance.

Best bet is probably to immediately plead your case with the individual stores, as THEY will be issuing those charges to your account...
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 08:05 PM
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Cancel the credit card, and the French government can pound sand.
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Old Aug 5th, 2005, 08:26 PM
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Robespierre - Too funny!!
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Old Aug 6th, 2005, 06:42 AM
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>...it would seem that the "sales tax refund" is more a DISCOUNT you receive benefit of if you jump through all the appropriate hoops, and has nothing really to do with government refunding sales taxes,...<

Au contraire, it is a refund of the required value added tax.

Nearly all European countries offer this to tourists as a way to encourage them to spend money.

A similar scheme is also available in the US, where state sales tax is not charged on goods shipped to another state.

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Old Aug 6th, 2005, 09:10 AM
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Cybertraveler,

There is another way to get a refund: go back to the EU within 3 months of your first purchase and get the forms stamped

Contrary to Ira, I have requested refunds countless times for purchases made throughout the EU and NEVER had an issue provided the forms were returned stamped. Getting them stamped in Italy when travelling by train to Switzerland can be pretty much impossible though. Refunds have taken up to 3 months to appear on my CC statement.

As Ira says however, this scheme is most definitely a tax refund, not a discount!

As a matter of fact, the stores that use one of those "refund services" such as Global or Premier take a cut on the full refund, so they actually make MORE on these types of sales.

Premier in France for example only refunds 12%, while the VAT rate is actually 19.6%. So Premier actually skims off almost half the refund, splitting it with the store you purchased the items from.

The store can justify pocketing these tax refunds by claiming to the local tax authorities that it is just offsetting its own "administrative costs" for handling the refunds...

Hope this helps,
Andre
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Old Aug 6th, 2005, 03:47 PM
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Thanks again to everyone. I did use the tax refund plan successfully on my last trip to Italy; my sister & I just stood in line in the Rome airport before we checked in, got the stamp & mailed the forms.

This time it was 5:00 a.m. when we arrived at Marco Polo airport in Venice, so we were a bit foggy-headed. If the office had been open, that would have been the time to get the stamp. However, I never even thought of it until we were in the air on our way to Paris.

At CDG, we stood in line for the Detaxe in Terminal F where we arrived, then finally reached the booth and were told that we had to do this at the terminal we were leaving from (E). At that point we were dangerously close to missing our flight, so we literally sprinted through CDG to our gate (catching the bus by mistake on the way, which is a whole other story...)

Unfortunately, Andre, the EU is not in my plans again within the next 3 months--I wish it was!

I actually liked Robespierre's suggestion...what would be a worst case scenario if I do cancel the card?

What recourse would the company actually have across the ocean?

(or will my next trip be to jail?)
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