CDF's Guide to European Trains and Railpasses for the Clueless!
Oct 22nd, 2007, 08:26 AM
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British Overnight Trains
Though many overnight trains in the U.K. have been axed some still run nightly except Sat between London and points in Scotland.
These are the so-called Caledonian Sleepers - going to Glasgow, Edinburg, Inverness, Perth, etc.
www.nationalrail.co.uk for schedules
Caledonian Sleeper Trains. First ScotRail’s Caledonian Sleepers... overnight train services operating between London Euston & Scotland. ...
http://www.firstgroup.com/scotrail/c...eper/index.php
Though many overnight trains in the U.K. have been axed some still run nightly except Sat between London and points in Scotland.
These are the so-called Caledonian Sleepers - going to Glasgow, Edinburg, Inverness, Perth, etc.
www.nationalrail.co.uk for schedules
Caledonian Sleeper Trains. First ScotRail’s Caledonian Sleepers... overnight train services operating between London Euston & Scotland. ...
http://www.firstgroup.com/scotrail/c...eper/index.php
Oct 25th, 2007, 11:45 AM
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SOME GREAT SOURCES FOR INFO ON EUROPEAN TRAINS AND RAILPASSES
www.ricksteves.com
www.budgeteuropetravel.com
www.raileurope.com
www.euraide.com
www.seat61.com
NATIONAL RAILWAY OFFICIAL SITES
www.nsb.no (Norway)
www.vr.fi (Finland)
www.dsb.de/english (Denmark)
www.sj.se (Sweden)
www.nsb.no (Norway)
www.serbianrailways.com (Serbia)
www.ose.gr (Greece)
www.hznet.hr (Croatia)
www.cfr.ro (Romania)
bdz.creato.biz (Bulgarian)
www.cd.cz/static/eng/ (Czech)
www.slovakia.com/travel/train (Slovakia)
www.cfl.lu (Luxembourg)
www.mav.hu (Hungary)
www.polrail.com/pkprozklad (Poland)
www.cp.pt (Portugal)
www.irishrail.ie (Ireland)
www.voyages-sncf.com (France)
www.trenitalia.com (Italy)
www.b-rail.be (Belgium)
www.ns.nl (Netherlands)
www.oebb.at (Austria)
www.renfe.es (Spain)
www.sbb.ch (Switzerland)
www.bahn.de (Germany)
www.ricksteves.com
www.budgeteuropetravel.com
www.raileurope.com
www.euraide.com
www.seat61.com
NATIONAL RAILWAY OFFICIAL SITES
www.nsb.no (Norway)
www.vr.fi (Finland)
www.dsb.de/english (Denmark)
www.sj.se (Sweden)
www.nsb.no (Norway)
www.serbianrailways.com (Serbia)
www.ose.gr (Greece)
www.hznet.hr (Croatia)
www.cfr.ro (Romania)
bdz.creato.biz (Bulgarian)
www.cd.cz/static/eng/ (Czech)
www.slovakia.com/travel/train (Slovakia)
www.cfl.lu (Luxembourg)
www.mav.hu (Hungary)
www.polrail.com/pkprozklad (Poland)
www.cp.pt (Portugal)
www.irishrail.ie (Ireland)
www.voyages-sncf.com (France)
www.trenitalia.com (Italy)
www.b-rail.be (Belgium)
www.ns.nl (Netherlands)
www.oebb.at (Austria)
www.renfe.es (Spain)
www.sbb.ch (Switzerland)
www.bahn.de (Germany)
Oct 29th, 2007, 08:24 AM
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www.eurostar.com - prices in pounds for London-Paris Eurostar tickets are here.
www.thalys.com - highspeed train Paris-Brussels-Amsterdam/Cologne
www.cisalpino.com - premier trains between Switzerland and Italy
www.thalys.com - highspeed train Paris-Brussels-Amsterdam/Cologne
www.cisalpino.com - premier trains between Switzerland and Italy
Oct 30th, 2007, 11:50 AM
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MORE ON SOURCES
www.ricksteves.com has lots on transportation and trains and railpasses but also cheap flights and buses, etc.
www.raileurope.com is the major purveyor of European rail products in the U.S. Largely owned by the French railways with a minority stake by the Swiss railways, RailEurope is much maligned on Fodors - often for reason and at times blindly without. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater however. More on RailEurope and raileurope.com later - but there is some useful stuff on their web site.
www.budgeteuropetravel.com - i often recommend this site for various reasons - primarily because you can request their free and excellent European Planning & Rail Guide that is a great primer for the clueless on planning a European rail trip - country by country chapters on trains with maps, etc. and loads of sample itineraries - many on their web site as well. Plus i've used them for years for passes and can testify to the great service and accessibility - 800 phone where you talk to real experts who have traveled for years on European trains - without any strong sales pitch. Railpasses their specialty. (800-441-2387)
www.euraide.com - a different type of operation that's been around a long time - American company it seems but based in Munich where they have a Euraide office in the main train station. They sell tickets - point-point, night trains, etc. at German prices (but however charge about a $40 mailing/handling fee) but something different.
www.ricksteves.com has lots on transportation and trains and railpasses but also cheap flights and buses, etc.
www.raileurope.com is the major purveyor of European rail products in the U.S. Largely owned by the French railways with a minority stake by the Swiss railways, RailEurope is much maligned on Fodors - often for reason and at times blindly without. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater however. More on RailEurope and raileurope.com later - but there is some useful stuff on their web site.
www.budgeteuropetravel.com - i often recommend this site for various reasons - primarily because you can request their free and excellent European Planning & Rail Guide that is a great primer for the clueless on planning a European rail trip - country by country chapters on trains with maps, etc. and loads of sample itineraries - many on their web site as well. Plus i've used them for years for passes and can testify to the great service and accessibility - 800 phone where you talk to real experts who have traveled for years on European trains - without any strong sales pitch. Railpasses their specialty. (800-441-2387)
www.euraide.com - a different type of operation that's been around a long time - American company it seems but based in Munich where they have a Euraide office in the main train station. They sell tickets - point-point, night trains, etc. at German prices (but however charge about a $40 mailing/handling fee) but something different.
Nov 1st, 2007, 09:07 AM
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OVERNIGHT TRAINS
As long as night trains came up earlier than i had planned i guess i'll give my 2 cents on night trains now.
NIGHT TRAIN SYLLABUS
OnBoard facilities - Sleeper Car (singles, doubles, triples) vs Couchettes vs Sleeperettes vs Regular Seats
Hotel Trains - types of night trains
Food Services
Fellow Room Mates
Taking Passport Away
7 pm Rule with Railpasses
Safety
"Can You Sleep"
Night Trains by Country
Booking
TBC
As long as night trains came up earlier than i had planned i guess i'll give my 2 cents on night trains now.
NIGHT TRAIN SYLLABUS
OnBoard facilities - Sleeper Car (singles, doubles, triples) vs Couchettes vs Sleeperettes vs Regular Seats
Hotel Trains - types of night trains
Food Services
Fellow Room Mates
Taking Passport Away
7 pm Rule with Railpasses
Safety
"Can You Sleep"
Night Trains by Country
Booking
TBC
Nov 1st, 2007, 12:24 PM
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NIGHT TRAIN ACCOMMODATIONS
Though modern Hotel Trains are changing the ancient formula of makeup of overnight trains, generally such trains have:
SLEEPER CARS aka Pullman
Sleeper cars are the fanciest of digs on night trains - there are private single rooms, doubles and triples typically and there is an attendant who accompanies the train throughout the whole way.
Double and triples are typically two or three bunks stacked on one side of the compartment though some newer trains may have double beds.
Sleeper cars have sheets, blankets and pillows usually and a wash basin in the compartment but very few have en-suite facilities but share a WC and Washroom at the ends of the car. Sometimes breakfast is included or can be bought and delivered to the compartment by the attendant.
Some newer trains do have compartments with toilet and douche in the compartment - mainly it seems in Spain and Germany and these can double the cost of a compartment.
Triples or doubles may or may not be sex segregated.
Doors have locks - usually two or three now on the inside where even the old porters key that could open them from the outside won't let someone else in as there is often a bolt lock on the inside - to prevent theft which at one time before such locks were fitted seemed rife.
Many folks will not consider anything but a private compartment to negate the roll of the dice sleeping with strangers as you may well have in a couchette.
NEXT COUCHETTES
(any comments or experiences from others is more than welcomed - or corrections, etc.)
Though modern Hotel Trains are changing the ancient formula of makeup of overnight trains, generally such trains have:
SLEEPER CARS aka Pullman
Sleeper cars are the fanciest of digs on night trains - there are private single rooms, doubles and triples typically and there is an attendant who accompanies the train throughout the whole way.
Double and triples are typically two or three bunks stacked on one side of the compartment though some newer trains may have double beds.
Sleeper cars have sheets, blankets and pillows usually and a wash basin in the compartment but very few have en-suite facilities but share a WC and Washroom at the ends of the car. Sometimes breakfast is included or can be bought and delivered to the compartment by the attendant.
Some newer trains do have compartments with toilet and douche in the compartment - mainly it seems in Spain and Germany and these can double the cost of a compartment.
Triples or doubles may or may not be sex segregated.
Doors have locks - usually two or three now on the inside where even the old porters key that could open them from the outside won't let someone else in as there is often a bolt lock on the inside - to prevent theft which at one time before such locks were fitted seemed rife.
Many folks will not consider anything but a private compartment to negate the roll of the dice sleeping with strangers as you may well have in a couchette.
NEXT COUCHETTES
(any comments or experiences from others is more than welcomed - or corrections, etc.)
Nov 2nd, 2007, 07:42 AM
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COUCHETTES
So on overnight trains we have sleeper cars with singles, double and triples and also COUCHETTE WAGONS where there are typically compartments with six beds or occasionally in first class mainly 4 beds.
Couchettes are the way most Europeans seem to take night trains and are much much cheaper than sleeper cars - usually around 25 euros or so on ordinary night trains but more on hotel trains.
A couchette is literally yes a couch with sheets, a blanket and a pillow. They are stacked in three bunks on each side of an aisle (two on each side in 4-person couchettes)
There usually is no wash basin like in sleeper cars but of course WCs and washrooms at the ends of the cars. (TIP - if you wait until the train nears its destination in the morning these shared facilities may be full so get an early start.)
There is ample room for luggage in couchette compartments, especially if you have the upper berth where there is a wide ledge that extends over the outside hallway so there are loads of room there.
LOWER, MIDDLE, UPPER BERTHS
Or Lower and Upper in 4-person couchettes.
I always request an upper berth if i can get it - more room for luggage and you don't worry about theft like you may if you leave your luggage on the floor or under the lower berth. Plus more privacy. But you do have to climb a ladder so no for physically challenged folks. There are typically bars or straps on the upper ones to prevent falling off and it is several feet to the floor.
To me the middle berth is the worst option. Lower berth provides easy access in and out without jumping or laddering down.
Usually in europe you can request upper, lower or middle when booking your ticket.
Most couchettes convert to regular seating when the beds are not in use - they fold up and down. So if the train starts early you may be sitting like on a normal train until someone decides it's time to make up the beds and though this may seem simple it's not always obvious how these things click into place.
TBC MORE ON COUCHETTES:
door locks
third party operate
passport, ticket taken away
food
fellow passengers - crap shoot?
So on overnight trains we have sleeper cars with singles, double and triples and also COUCHETTE WAGONS where there are typically compartments with six beds or occasionally in first class mainly 4 beds.
Couchettes are the way most Europeans seem to take night trains and are much much cheaper than sleeper cars - usually around 25 euros or so on ordinary night trains but more on hotel trains.
A couchette is literally yes a couch with sheets, a blanket and a pillow. They are stacked in three bunks on each side of an aisle (two on each side in 4-person couchettes)
There usually is no wash basin like in sleeper cars but of course WCs and washrooms at the ends of the cars. (TIP - if you wait until the train nears its destination in the morning these shared facilities may be full so get an early start.)
There is ample room for luggage in couchette compartments, especially if you have the upper berth where there is a wide ledge that extends over the outside hallway so there are loads of room there.
LOWER, MIDDLE, UPPER BERTHS
Or Lower and Upper in 4-person couchettes.
I always request an upper berth if i can get it - more room for luggage and you don't worry about theft like you may if you leave your luggage on the floor or under the lower berth. Plus more privacy. But you do have to climb a ladder so no for physically challenged folks. There are typically bars or straps on the upper ones to prevent falling off and it is several feet to the floor.
To me the middle berth is the worst option. Lower berth provides easy access in and out without jumping or laddering down.
Usually in europe you can request upper, lower or middle when booking your ticket.
Most couchettes convert to regular seating when the beds are not in use - they fold up and down. So if the train starts early you may be sitting like on a normal train until someone decides it's time to make up the beds and though this may seem simple it's not always obvious how these things click into place.
TBC MORE ON COUCHETTES:
door locks
third party operate
passport, ticket taken away
food
fellow passengers - crap shoot?
Nov 3rd, 2007, 07:29 AM
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HOW TO FIND YOU BERTH
When you book a night train you'll get a ticket which on it indicates
1- the train number - this is like #9603 and is the number for the whole train and should be on the overhead moniker at the entrance to each track as well as the major cities that train will serve
2- the car number - once you have the right train then each car on that train will have a number on its outside, usually be the front door - your berth is somewhere inside this car. They often is an attendent at the door checking reservation tickets to make sure you're in the right car.
3- a berth number
each car will have berth numbers ascending in numerical order usually. On the outside of each compartment will be a diagram of berths with their numbers on the inside. Say with a 6-person couchette there will be a small diagram showing the two sides of the couchette compartment with number indicating the lower, middle and upper berths on each side. Sometimes this chart will indicate which berths are reserved and which may be empty (though the conductor can always fill empty berths with customers boarding the train without berth reservations, or it may not show late made reservations)
TRAIN COMPOSITION CHART
On platforms there are often train composition charts that show the numbers of each car so that if the train is not there you can see about where you car will stop. As night trains can be very long and at intermediate stops the train may only stop a few minuutes, it helps to be waiting where you car will stop. Otherwise you may have to board quickly at a car far away and then struggled thru luggage and people filled aisles all the way back to your car. No fun.
When you book a night train you'll get a ticket which on it indicates
1- the train number - this is like #9603 and is the number for the whole train and should be on the overhead moniker at the entrance to each track as well as the major cities that train will serve
2- the car number - once you have the right train then each car on that train will have a number on its outside, usually be the front door - your berth is somewhere inside this car. They often is an attendent at the door checking reservation tickets to make sure you're in the right car.
3- a berth number
each car will have berth numbers ascending in numerical order usually. On the outside of each compartment will be a diagram of berths with their numbers on the inside. Say with a 6-person couchette there will be a small diagram showing the two sides of the couchette compartment with number indicating the lower, middle and upper berths on each side. Sometimes this chart will indicate which berths are reserved and which may be empty (though the conductor can always fill empty berths with customers boarding the train without berth reservations, or it may not show late made reservations)
TRAIN COMPOSITION CHART
On platforms there are often train composition charts that show the numbers of each car so that if the train is not there you can see about where you car will stop. As night trains can be very long and at intermediate stops the train may only stop a few minuutes, it helps to be waiting where you car will stop. Otherwise you may have to board quickly at a car far away and then struggled thru luggage and people filled aisles all the way back to your car. No fun.
Nov 5th, 2007, 06:23 AM
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booked well in advance, you can get SparNight fares at http://buchung.nachtzugreise.de and click on the British flag for English.
I'm interupting the couchette, sleeper train flow to insert this site for booking overnight trains in Germany and between Germany and some other countries - taken from TimS' recent posting - you can get good discounts but like TimS usually only if book well in advance.
I'm interupting the couchette, sleeper train flow to insert this site for booking overnight trains in Germany and between Germany and some other countries - taken from TimS' recent posting - you can get good discounts but like TimS usually only if book well in advance.
Nov 5th, 2007, 06:48 AM
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Can I just speak up for the railways in Britain?
Distances are shorter than in continental Europe, so speed is generally lower. However, trains usually run very frequently, and passenger growth has been greater in Britain in recent years than elsewhere.
Despite the high fairs, trains are frequently crowded.
Distances are shorter than in continental Europe, so speed is generally lower. However, trains usually run very frequently, and passenger growth has been greater in Britain in recent years than elsewhere.
Despite the high fairs, trains are frequently crowded.
Nov 5th, 2007, 08:11 AM
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Yes i would second that - have ridden British railways for decades and the system is dense with many many departures between most places every day.
And train ridership in U.K. has outpaced that of any country in Europe recently. And yes high-speed is not a factor in the typical trips most folks take.
Hats off to British trains and hope they keep getting better.
And train ridership in U.K. has outpaced that of any country in Europe recently. And yes high-speed is not a factor in the typical trips most folks take.
Hats off to British trains and hope they keep getting better.
Nov 5th, 2007, 11:11 AM
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I've learned in the last few days of reduced train fares in Austria listed on www.oebb.at for rail travel between Vienna and Munich and Salzburg and Vienna.
Use a SparSchiene ticket which you need to book in advance for a 29€ ticket from Vienna to Munich. This is a direct ticket, no changing of trains. Normal fare was 59€. These are very limited. We bought ours by phoning the ticket office.
Use a Einfach-Raus-Ticket for 2-5 people for a total cost of 28€ for use only on regional trains for the trip from Salzburg to Vienna. This is also good on other trains in Austria, but they must be regional trains. Normal fare is 45€ each on this route, so it's quite a savings.
Use a SparSchiene ticket which you need to book in advance for a 29€ ticket from Vienna to Munich. This is a direct ticket, no changing of trains. Normal fare was 59€. These are very limited. We bought ours by phoning the ticket office.
Use a Einfach-Raus-Ticket for 2-5 people for a total cost of 28€ for use only on regional trains for the trip from Salzburg to Vienna. This is also good on other trains in Austria, but they must be regional trains. Normal fare is 45€ each on this route, so it's quite a savings.
Nov 5th, 2007, 12:35 PM
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Author: TravMimi
Date: 11/05/2007, 04:09 pm
http://www.viaggiatreno.it/viaggiatreno/vt.html
This is a good site from Trenitalia to show routes and times. It's a large window so you might have to adjust you display monitor.
I'm collecting various versions of the railways web sites for future reference. Hope TravMimi won't mind me taking this from another post
Date: 11/05/2007, 04:09 pm
http://www.viaggiatreno.it/viaggiatreno/vt.html
This is a good site from Trenitalia to show routes and times. It's a large window so you might have to adjust you display monitor.
I'm collecting various versions of the railways web sites for future reference. Hope TravMimi won't mind me taking this from another post
Nov 5th, 2007, 12:42 PM
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Palen - I was just thinking I should have given it it's own post. Now that it's in English I think it will be a great help to all the people planning train journeys in Italy. Thanks for adding it.
http://www.viaggiatreno.it/viaggiatreno/vt.html
http://www.viaggiatreno.it/viaggiatreno/vt.html
Nov 6th, 2007, 06:18 AM
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Author: TimS
Date: 10/01/2007
For information on the Bayern (Bavaria) ticket, go here: http://tinyurl.com/29mh69.
again stealing from another thread for future reference - TimS is an expert, along with Larryincolorado on bargain regional tickets in the various German regions. Hope he doesn't mind my copying. Tim is always gracious in helping folks sort thru the various online national rail websites and helping those who can't figure it all out for real bargains.
Date: 10/01/2007
For information on the Bayern (Bavaria) ticket, go here: http://tinyurl.com/29mh69.
again stealing from another thread for future reference - TimS is an expert, along with Larryincolorado on bargain regional tickets in the various German regions. Hope he doesn't mind my copying. Tim is always gracious in helping folks sort thru the various online national rail websites and helping those who can't figure it all out for real bargains.
Nov 6th, 2007, 09:32 AM
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Author: TravMimi
Date: 11/06/2007
http://www.trenitalia.it/en/treni_st...ita/index.html
This page of trenitalia gives ticket sale points. First at manned stations with hours of operation, then travel agents, then other places.
Again thanks for the post - i'm accumulating them to rearrange later.
Date: 11/06/2007
http://www.trenitalia.it/en/treni_st...ita/index.html
This page of trenitalia gives ticket sale points. First at manned stations with hours of operation, then travel agents, then other places.
Again thanks for the post - i'm accumulating them to rearrange later.
Nov 6th, 2007, 11:32 AM
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TravMimi gives a useful site for physically challenged in Italy:
http://www.trenitalia.com/en/servizi...a.html#liguria
Services for the disabled at some stations.
http://www.trenitalia.com/en/servizi...a.html#liguria
Services for the disabled at some stations.
Nov 6th, 2007, 12:43 PM
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BACK TO NIGHT TRAIN NITTY-GRITTY
SLEEPERETTES
A fairly new development on a large scale in the past decade or so have been the old 'Pullman' chair or reclining seat.
Now often called Sleeperettes some recline a lot and some hardly at all (like the one i mistakingly was duped into taking on U.K. Caledonian Sleeper - what a long night!)
But on some trains, especially hotel trains and Germany night trains sleeperettes can be relatively comfy - get a blanket and even a breakfast at time
No privacy however of course and with 30-40 other in the 'room' the one snorer can ruin the whole trip for noise sensitive folks
But sleeperettes can be very cheap - with a railpass sometimes just a normal reservation fee.
CAN YOU SLEEP ON NIGHT TRAINS - a question many people have asked on Fodor's having never taken any - well the answer is of course depends on how you sleep. Palenque Traveler correspondent Faye DeDeaux will give her experiences with this next time!
SLEEPERETTES
A fairly new development on a large scale in the past decade or so have been the old 'Pullman' chair or reclining seat.
Now often called Sleeperettes some recline a lot and some hardly at all (like the one i mistakingly was duped into taking on U.K. Caledonian Sleeper - what a long night!)
But on some trains, especially hotel trains and Germany night trains sleeperettes can be relatively comfy - get a blanket and even a breakfast at time
No privacy however of course and with 30-40 other in the 'room' the one snorer can ruin the whole trip for noise sensitive folks
But sleeperettes can be very cheap - with a railpass sometimes just a normal reservation fee.
CAN YOU SLEEP ON NIGHT TRAINS - a question many people have asked on Fodor's having never taken any - well the answer is of course depends on how you sleep. Palenque Traveler correspondent Faye DeDeaux will give her experiences with this next time!
