Tim_and_Liz

Hi all,
We are an American couple in our late twenties and heading to Amsterdam and Paris in March. We are staying three nights in Amsterdam at the Hotel Washington near the Museumplein and four nights in Paris at the Hotel Saint Jacques in the Latin Quarter. I have previously visited Paris and Amsterdam a few times, but DH has not been to Europe. We like to wander around interesting neighborhoods, see the typical tourist sites, and see the highlights in the museums (but not spend several hours in each museum.)
These are the places we are interested in visiting; would the Amsterdam/Paris experts please help us arrange our days so that we don't unnecessarily backtrack our steps the following day? What should we try to "group together" on the same day? We have guidebooks and maps but would appreciate your opinions. Thanks so much.

Day 1: Arrive in Amsterdam at 9:10am
Day 2: Amsterdam
Day 3: Amsterdam
Day 4: Morning train to Paris
Day 5: Paris
Day 6: Paris
Day 7: Paris
Day 8: Depart CDG at 1:55pm

These are the places we are most interested in seeing:
Amsterdam
Rijksmuseum (main highlights, probably 1-2 hours needed)
Van Gogh Museum
Anne Frank Huis
Canal Cruise
Red light district (combine with canal cruise?)
http://www.lovers.nl/main_content/169
Coffeeshop--not to participate, just to take a look ;-)
Train or tour to see cheese/clog making-- Mike's Bike Tour http://www.mikesbiketoursamsterdam.com , take the train to Zaanse Schans, or bus tour?
Heineken Experience
Indonesian dinner (at Sama Sebo?)

Paris
Notre Dame and Ste. Chapelle
Montemarte: Sacre Couer and dinner at Chez les Fondus (I went there as a backpacker and would love to take DH)
Eiffel Tower
Arc de Triomphe
Fat Tire bike tour (day and/or evening tour)
http://www.fattirebiketoursparis.com/
Musee D'Orsay (for the building itself and the highlights)
Louvre (probably 2-3 hours)
Versailles (On our own or on a tour? This is a must-do.)

We know we don't have a lot of time, but we also know we will definitely return to both places multiple times in our lives.

THANK YOU!!

ira

Hi Tim,

For DH's first visit to Europe, with only one 7 days, I strongly urge that you visit Paris for the week.

Tim_and_Liz

We have already purchased open jaw flights into Amsterdam and out of Paris and are comfortable with the 3 nights/ 4 nights combination. I am looking for suggestions on how to roughly sketch out an itinerary given our above interests.
Liz

DonTopaz

For Amsterdam, I'd suggest spending a half-day strolling through the Jordaan section. It's one of the nicest neighborhoods in any city, filled with canals and wonderful-looking buildings, with plenty of cozy places to stop for a snack or drink when you feel like a rest. The Anne Frank house is in (or at least very close to) the Jordaan, so they're easily combined.

I can't imagine going to a coffeeshop "just to take a look." There's nothing much to see except some number of stoned and very stoned people sitting around. It's really one of those activities that lends itself well to participating, but not to spectating.

As for the RLD, you really would need to go in the evening when it's at its full glory/seediness. Not sure that I'd opt for a canal cruise in the evening -- you wouldn't see nearly as much, and you'd likely want to stay in the covered part of the boat (because of the cold temps). I'd do the cruis in the day time.

Fortunately, Amsterdam is a very compact city, so it's easy to get from one side of it to the other, either on foot or by public transportation.

As for Paris, do take time out from the Famous Sites Checklist to sit back and enjoy the city. As with most cities, this is best done on foot, stopping regularly at sidewalk cafes to watch the city pass you by.

WallyKringen

Where is your Amsterdam hotel? Reason I'm asking - if you get in that early and the room isn't ready anyway, I suggest you go check in later, and plan on walking around at first, after you stash the bags at the baggage service in the main "Centraal" train station (15 minutes by train from Schiphol airport).

I gotta tell you - as safe and friendly as Amsterdam is overall, around the train station it's a different thing, there are undesirables hanging around. You'll be tired, but watch your stuff, and you should already be pickpocket-proof anyway - these boards and other sources can clue you in - use travel wallets, not wallets in your usual pants pockets, hidden pockets behind regular ones on typical "travel shirts" - that sort of thing. See www.ricksteves.com, www.travelsmith.com, www.magellans.com, www.exofficio.com and so on.

You should walk a lot that first day, so that you get over the drowsiness - your bodies will say "hey, it's four AM - can I go to sleep"? and you'll say - "no, it's almost 11AM, let's go." (But don't nap or you'll never adjust to the time difference - walk, walk, walk...).

Get a really good map and bring a little compass - if you don't know where north and south are, you can get turned around and waste your time, because the canals gradually curve around to form a horseshoe, so there's no grid to keep you straight.

So you step out onto the Station Square (Stationsplein), a bit further out is the street Pr. Hendrikkade, look up the landmark Old Church Oudekerk (worth a look for cultural reasons...), the alleys around there are the red light district. It's safe, especially at that time, and while I don't know how big a kick you'll get out of the windows with the ladies on display, I'd say "to each his or her own", at least you'll have seen it.

Also on the first day, to help you keep awake, you should do a canal boat tour. Lots of choices outside the train station - watch and listen when a boat comes back, if you like the tone of the announcer and the look of the ship, ask a couple of people coming off if they liked it, and go for it. You may want to do another one a day or two later, it's a cool thing to do - basically walking and canal rides are the two good ways of getting around!

While we're on the subject (ahem), there's a very cool and above-board sex museum on the West side of the big main drag Damrak that goes from the station down to the Dam with the King's Palace. It's on an upper floor, and you'll see families and couples wandering through - interesting but not "sleezy". Can't remember the adress, about a third of the way from the station to the Dam?

The Rijksmuseum is under renovation, only a highlight selection is on view, so that will suit you. It's a block or two from the Van Gogh museum, I suggest you do those two on the second day, first thing in the morning after you've had your big Indonesian dinner on the first night, and an early night. Indonesian restaurants are everywhere, ask your hotel for one nearby, then you can walk home and fall into bed.

Other things you can google and decide on when you're there: Tropenmuseum (a whole n'other world under one roof), the Concertgebouw (classical concerts galore, big famous concert hall - the symphony season will still be on in March), the Heineken museum...

Have fun

WK

ira

>We have already purchased open jaw flights into Amsterdam and out of Paris ...<

Enjoy your visit.

luveurop

I would advise going to Versailles on your own. I took a tour once and it was not nearly enough time for a proper visit. I returned another time on another trip and spent the whole day there.

I would advise going to the d'Orsay late afternoon/early evening on a Thursday to avoid crowds.

Same for Louvre, open late Weds and Fri evenings.

Bon voyage!

Travelnut

Don't worry about the coffee shops...go in several different ones, they have different 'styles'. You can usually have a beverage, and often an alcoholic one, or an actual coffee. I often stop in to use the internet service (I don't smoke but maybe sometimes I inhale :-" ). Sometimes we pop into "Easy Times" on the canal side of Leidseplein, which is a reggae bar and kind of 'earthy'; they serve beer and liquor as well. Sometimes we sit in the atrium at the Leidseplein "BullDog" cafe so we can have a beer(or wine) and people-watch. This is a chain of coffee shops (as my husband often says, "you won't see that back in the States").

Tim_and_Liz

Thank you all for your tips. I really appreciate all of your posts!! We will definitely wander through the Jordaan when we go to the Anne Frank Huis.
Anyone else?

SAnParis

For both the Anne Frank House & Van Gogh Museum try & be there first thing when they open. Otherwise, you may find yourself spending the better part of the day in line. Leave out the bike tours & Versailles (& the coffee shops), you simply do not have enough time (unless they happen to include some of the other items).

Intrepid1

A few thoughts on A-dam:

You list your arival as 0910..is that by air? If so, you obviously will be getting into the city sometime after that. How are you planning to get into the city (from the airport?) and then to your hotel?

What if anything are you planning to do later THAT day? You might consider fitting some of the possibilities into that later afternoon, e.g., the red light district (which doesn't take that long to see) and perhaps the coffee shop "exploration."

As to the coffee shops..there is no need to EXPLAIN why you are going to go to a coffee shop..and, in fact, there are PLENTY of people on this forum who can tell you exactly what to do if you want to do more than just "observe" (LOL).

Zaanse Scans..get ready to be blasted for even thinking of doing this "too touristy" thing but it isn't any more "touristy" than a lot of other places and it is close by rail and at least there you can actually go into a working windmill..great fun and probably one of the closest working windmills to the city..go for it...

Anne Frank..not sure how crowded it will be in March but I'd plan on getting there early if possible.

Rijksmuseum as you may know is partially closed for renovation and asbestos removal but 400+ of the most well-known works are still on view..you can see the biggies in two hours unless you're like me and sit and stare at your fave forever.

Doubletee

Paris, to my mind and taste, is indeed a place that is best explored by area:

Day 1: Since you're in the neighborhood, start with the Ile-de-la-Cite. Walk around inside Notre-Dame for a spell before walking over to the Ste-Chapelle (and hope for sunshine in order to properly show off those magnificent stained glass windows to perfection). Maybe an early(ish) dinner at a tourist-y place on place St-Michel or a more authentic spot on a neighboring back street. Afterwards, cross back over to Ile-de-la-Cite, taking in the view of a floodlit Notre-Dame. Continue past the cathedral until you get to pont St-Louis and cross over for a nice walk through residential Ile-St-Louis. Return to the Latin Quarter after, for either more exploration of your lovely temporary neighborhood or turn in early.

Day 2: Visit the Eiffel Tower right when it opens and spend some time seeing the view from any of the levels you prefer. The first level is handy for mailing postcards, as the post office there will stamp them with a nifty Tour Eiffel postmark.

Then, get yourselves to the Tourist Office at 127 avenue des Champs-Elysees (9 am - 8 pm) via the Metro. From the Eiffel Tower, walk to the Bir-Hakim Metro station and take Line 6 in the direction of place d'Etoile -- this takes you over the Seine on elevated track, and will provide you a nice view back to the Eiffel Tower before you go underground after the Passy stop. At the tourist office, buy each of you a 3-day museum pass and either inaugurate it at by taking in the view from the top of the Arc de Triomphe, or maybe just grab a bite to eat somewhere nearby (like Vesuvio, a place that serves up perfectly nice pizzas).

Properly refreshed, I'd get on the Metro at the George V station along the Champs-Elysees and get off at the Palais Royale-Musee du Louvre stop. Emerge from the station and cross rue de Rivoli. There's a pedestrian passageway that you'll find; to the right you should see a group entrance area -- you can flash your pass and enter the museum this way, rather than through the endless lines at the Pyramide. If both the Mona Lisa and Venus de Milo are on your "must see" list, see 'em first and then select one part of the museum to explore in greater detail. I'd vote for either the Italian paintings in the Grand Gallerie of the Denon wing (after or on your way down to see Mona) or else the exquisite collection of Egyptian art over on one or both floors -- depending on your stamina -- in the Sully Wing. I always tell friends to limit themselves in this way, as this is the best way to avoid museum fatigue.

After that, depending on the time, head for dinner or, if it's still daylight and the weather is fine, relax in the Jardin du Luxembourg not to far west of your hotel. The Luxembourg is a Paris favorite of mine. The people watching alone is astounding.

Day 3. Make this your Versailles day. (I say day, because the palace and gardens combined make for a satisfactory full day.) It's easy to do on your own thanks to the RER trains (which you can pick up right near your hotel at the St-Michel RER station). You'll take a RER-C train in the diretion of Versailles R-G ("Rive-Gauche"). That stop is the final stop on the line, so you won't have to worry about "missing" your stop. Remember, with RER tickets you must keep them on you to enter the station in Paris and exit it in Versailles, and vice versa. Follow the crowds out the station to the right, and then left to Versailles. There are any number of tours to select from once you get to the palace. Special guided tours are extra; if you just want to walk through the public rooms (including the Hall of Mirrors), you're museum pass covers you there, just have yourself directed to the appropriate entrance line for that.

Perhaps after dinner and a good rest at your hotel, the evening could be spent taking the bike ride you made reference to.

Day 4. Take the RER or walk or bus it over to the Musee d'Orsay (again, you have your own special, usually short, line to access the building). You're not too far a walk over to Les Invalides and the tomb of Napoleon (again, your museum pass would pay for this). It's worth a quick peek. Maybe walk off any museum fatigue back over at the Tuileries, on the opposite side of the river from the d'Orsay.

Spend the balance of the day exploring Montmartre before finishing with a nice meal and the restaurant you mentioned.

Fly home the next day.

mijols3

Hi Tim & Liz,
WOuld you mind sharing your rate for the Washington?
I am trying to find a hotel for late March under $150C per night. Thanks, Mij

Tim_and_Liz

Thank you to everyone who replied. We VERY MUCH appreciate all of the time and thought you put in to your long posts! We are going to print this out at comb through it and post again in a few days.
Thanks again!!!


Mij, we are paying 130 Euro a night, including breakfast. We requested a shower; rooms with baths cost additional.
Liz

April

We did both day and night time canal cruises in Amsterdam but the one at night was the most enchanting because of the canal bridge lights. I wouldn't miss it.
We went to a coffeeshop just to email and I'd have to say that was our least charming experience in the Netherlands.

Danna

Tim and Liz

I'm so glad you are going to stay at the Hotel Washington, it's great.

My best new suggestion is to take the train from Schiphol to Amsterdam Zuid-WTC station. I've thought about doing this earlier, now it makes WAY more sense than the train to Central. Only took me four trips, but I figured it out for my visit in May! LOL

From the Zuid-WTC you take tram 5. Get off near or before the Concertgebouw. It should be quicker, easier, and fewer crowds.

I'll think so more about my recommendations for a few days in Amsterdam. My daughter and I will be in Paris for 10 days, but I'm also really looking forward to our 3 days in Amsterdam. I'll look through my memories and post more this weekend. Have a grand time!

sockmonkey75

Hiya! I don't have time to reply to this right now, but it sounds like you two are a lot like my partner and I! We're about the same age as you ... anyways, we've been to both Amsterdam and Paris numerous times over, so if you wanna chat about it at all, feel free to drop me an email!

Au revoir,
Crissy

[email protected]
www.sockmonkey75.blogspot.com

Tim_and_Liz

Thanks for all of your replies. We have revised our itinerary as follows:

AMSTERDAM:
Thursday: Depart for AMS

Friday:
Arrive in AMS at 9:10am; train to Amsterdam Zuid-WTC station (thanks for the tip, Danna!) and tram to Hotel Washington.

After lunch, walk around Jordaan district using walking tour in Frommers guidebook. Visit Anne Frank Huis (open until 7pm) and/or take a canal cruise.

Saturday:
Van Gogh Museum at 9:45am

12:30: Mike's Bike Tour "We show you the real Amsterdam. In addition to the sexy, seedy side, we'll also show you the postcard side, and the beautiful countryside. Learn all about the rich history of the most powerful and wealthy European city of the 1600's, how the land was reclaimed from the sea, and much more. We take you through the city, then along the Amstel river into the countryside where you'll see an authentic WINDMILL (don’t forget your camera!) and visit a traditional Cheese Farm and Clog Factory. Yes, you too can finally learn the secrets of making wooden shoes! And just wait till you meet the farmer!
We'll cruise back through the lovely park, and among other interesting sites we'll also show you the famous Paradiso concert venue, the Skinny Bridge, the festive Rembrandtplein and the Leidseplein Square, where we'll enjoy a beer together, and more!"

Evening: Red Light District walk, coffeeshop, ...

Sunday:
Rijksmuseum (open 9am - 6pm)

Heineken Experience (open 10a, - 6pm)

Anne Frank Huis and/or canal cruise if skipped on Friday

PARIS
Monday:
Train Amsterdam to Paris, arriving early afternoon. Check into Hotel St. Jacques

Train to Montmarte; Climb to top of Sacre Coeur (open until 11pm); dinner at Chez les Fondus (open until 2am)

Tuesday:
Paris Segway tour 10:30am-3pm: Eiffel Tower, Napoleon's Tomb, Louvre, Arc de Triomphe, Champs Elysees, Tuileries Gardens, Musee D'Orsay, Ecole Militaire, Les Invalides, Alexander III Bridge, Grand and Petit Palais, Place de la Concorde

Leisurely early dinner

Fat Tire night bike tour 7pm-12am: Notre Dame, Seine cruise, Louvre, Berthillon, Eiffel Tower, Cite and St. Louis islands, Ste. Chapelle, Latin Quarter, Academie Francaise, Pont des Arts, etc.

Wednesday
Climb Eiffel Tower
Lunch at Altitude 95 or Jules Verne??

Train to Arc de Triomphe (if desired after seeing on Tuesday tours)

Train or walk down Champs Elysees to Place de la Concorde, Gardens, to Louvre (open until 9:45pm)

Thursday
Versailles Fat Bike Tour 9:15-5:15

Tim_and_Liz

Whoops.
Thursday
Versailles Fat Tire Bike Tour 9:15-5:15
"Le Chateau de Versailles awaits you in all its grandeur as you return to the time period of the most famous French kings and queens. Allow us to bring you the most famous "house" in the world as few others have experienced it. After meeting at our Paris office we'll ride our bicycles to the nearest RER station for the quick trip to Versailles.

Once at Versailles, we'll first visit the village market to buy baguettes, cheese, ham, wine or whatever you desire for our picnic later in the Chateau's gardens. We will spend most of our day riding through the tree-lined gardens and the average Versailles tourist doesn't realize that they can only visit a small fraction of the gardens on foot. We’ll see it all!"

Evening if desired: Musee D'Orsay open until 9:15pm

Friday
Fly CDG-home in early afternoon



Any comments on this one? Thanks again!
Liz

dovima

Not to overplay the coffee shop thing, but if you are in the Jordaan for a while, find the Paradox (NOT the Paradiso, diff. area and establishment) coffeeshop. It looks and functions like a little neighborhood cafe, except for the additional items on the menu. People drop in, read the newspaper, play a hand of cards with the bartender, meet their friends, etc. It's so matter of fact and low key - no hysteria. Clientele is of various ages and a nice mix of visitors and locals. I always made it a stop whether I was inhaling or not.

Coffeeshop Paradox
Eerste Bloemdwarsstraat 2 (don't even try to pronounce it!)