StuDudley

Last year at this time, I would have stated that a swipe card could be used to pay for just about everything except tickets at a train station & the metro, and some toll roads. But, this past June we encountered a large chain Hyper Marche in the Pas de Calais (north of Paris) which would not take our swipe card. We've charged groceries at perhaps 100-150 other Marches throughout France without any problems. This Hyper Marche had just converted their system to an apparently all-chip system, and although the old swipe machines were still at the check-outs - the clerk said that they did not work, and when we actually tried them with several of our swipe cards - she was correct - they didn't work. On this same trip we found another grocery and a large gas station where our swipe card would not work.

In London this past Sept when we were there for 2 1/2 weeks, we had no problems using our swipe card, except at the Tube station at the machine (no attendant was present who could process our swipe card & the machine did not take cash). In Paris for 1 1/2 weeks this past December, we also did not have any problems using the swipe card, except when purchasing a Navigo at the metro station (it took cash).

Lesson - we had better start looking for a chip/pin card to use in Europe. Deb & xyz123 found a US chip/pin card, but I don't think either of them has used it yet ??? LarryJ said that he has a AE chip/pin card but it would not work in Paris - only a European card would work!!

Stu Dudley

StuDudley

Forgot something.

We've "filled up" our car using an attendant at the "booth" to process our swipe card perhaps 200-250 times in Europe over the past 35 years. Never had any problems - until our trip last June when our swipe card would not work for 2 different large gas stations. Of course, we know that our swipe card won't work at an unattended station where you pay at the pump.

This year should be more revealing about what's happening with the swipe card.

Stu Dudley

Diane

I've travelled to Europe many times and do love the convenience of ATMs, but I too am someone who doesn't even want to think about having to acquire Euro when I get off the plane from the U.S. so I always bring some with me. I get that the exchange rate isn't great, but it makes me comfortable, so I do it.
I'm going to Paris in April and just ordered Euro from my bank, Wells Fargo. They have a minimum of $200 USD to convert. I checked a few other online sites, can't remember the names, and they also had a $200 minimum order. I haven't seen this before, but it's been several years since I've placed an order, so perhaps this minimum requirement has been in place for a while.

Diane

LarryJ

To Diane,

If you often travel in Europe why not use your ATM card just before returning to the USA to get some euros for the start of your next trip. You will certainly get a much better exchange rate then buying euros from your bank at home.

About the chip versus swipe credit cards: if anyone finds an American credit card that works in the Metro/RATP and SNCF ticket machines please let us know. There is more to this than just having a card with a chip instead of magnetic swipe strip. I buy SNCF tickets on-line and have them delivered by post to my home in Paris but I would like the convenience of using the machines to recharge my Navigo and buying SNCF tickets on short notice.

Parisecret

I'm considering applying for this credit card from Chase. Does anyone have any experience with it? It states that it has "smart chip" technology for international travel and has no foreign transaction fees.

https://creditcards.chase.com/credit...lect-card.aspx

Parisecret

BTW, I do have a Capital One credit card and a Capital One ATM card to avoid all foreign transaction fees. I'm just looking for one card available in America that has the Chip and PIN technology so if I'm stuck in an unmanned Metro station with no Euros on me, I won't really be stuck. (Why is the US so slow to catch up, anyway?)

xyz123

Chase has a bunch of cards where they offer the emv chip but they all have annual fees (and high ones at that) and their cards are chip and signature, not chip and pin. There is still a great deal of question whether or not the chase chip and signature cards will work in the automated machines such as the RATP machines and the unattended petrol stations. On other forums, there have been mixed reactions to whether or not one can count on their working. Several of the citibank cards also offer emv chips upon request, again they all have annual fees (like the AA mastercard)....I used one while in London a couple of weeks ago and it does work but the caveat is that all the places I tried it for smnall purchases (it has the obnoxeous 3% foreign transaction fee)and were in places I have always used magnetic strip cards so can't tell you really how good a product it is.

Parisecret

xyz, it looks like you're right.

I've been doing more research, and apparently Chase is being dodgy about it, but travelers in Europe are reporting it does require a signature and, therefore, isn't a true chip and PIN. Obviously won't work for me.

Chase gives some lame advice like, "put in any 4 digits" if asked for a PIN, but I'm not buying it. Too bad. First year fee is waived and I was willing to give it a try, but not anymore.

xyz123

Of course I'm right. I wouldn't have posted if I wasn't right. <g>

This whole thing has been really nutty for a while with arguments galore on a couple of forums I use. It has made no sense for the USA to lag so far behind. Not that chip and pin is necessarily the greatest thing since chopped liver or whatever. The claim from the US banks is that fraud is not as big a problem with the US cards as they are in Europe, that it would be expensive to convert the entire US payments system at this point for a technology that hasn't proved to be all that superior to the magnetic strips and that something better is coming (so of course is Christmas). They're all nonsensical excuses. Hey those countries that use the emv chip and pin issue cards with magnetic strips anyway for use in backward countries that have not moved in the directin of emv (there is only one, you can guess which one it is). There is no reason under the sun for them not to issue the chip and pin hybrid cards that is cards with both a chip and a magnetic strip but they basically don't give a damn. As Stu pointed out, more and more places are no longer taking magnetic strip cards even at manned or womanned check out counters besides the obvious problems with the kiosks. But that doesn't seem to annoy our banks. After all, Chase has figured out they can extract high annual fees for those people who think they need emv cards and then doesn't tell them the cards may be worthless at automatic kiosks anyway..

But at least mc/visa have finally begun admitting they are going to have to adopt emv in the USA within a few years. Perhaps the move by Andrews fcu will begin the migration to it.

StuDudley

My wife worked for Visa for about 10 years. We retired in '99, but she went back to Visa as a part time consultant for the following 8 years after she retired.

About 10 years ago, the chip/pin thing came up, & my wife called the person at Visa who was responsible for that stuff. At that time, Visa was worried that if a US person had a Visa Card that required an entry of a pin, and the US person also had a MC/AE card that did not require a pin - they would pull out the "other" card and use it. Also, merchants would have to have two types of card readers.

Stu Dudley

Michael

<i>merchants would have to have two types of card readers.</i>

The card readers in Europe, as Stu must know, can generally scan either type of card. However, last summer I came across a brand-new scanner that took only the chip--this was not a refusal by an ignorant sales clerk.

Sarastro

<i>Also, merchants would have to have two types of card readers.</i>

Are you serious? Maybe in big tourist markets but most certainly not when you are travelling about the country. If a customer has no EMV or <i>pin and chip</i> credit card and the credit card machine is not set up to accept magnetic strip cards (or the merchant just refuses to accept magnetic strip cards), the merchant simply demands payment in cash and it has happen to me on more than one occasion.

StuDudley

>>Also, merchants would have to have two types of card readers.<<

I was referring to merchants in the US.

I don't think US merchants would be too excited about scrapping all of their readers, and then installing a single reader which would accommodate both swipe cards and chip cards - the latter which they might rarely see anyway.

Michael - the readers at French train station automated ticket dispensers, Paris metro stations automated ticket dispensers, gas pumps, and some toll booths can't accommodate a swipe card. Recently, this "only chip" reader has crept into other services too - as you have experienced.

Stu Dudley

chartley

Whatever happened to the American "can do" attitude? On my desk, for reasons I won't go into, is a card reader. It accepts both chip & pin cards and magnetic stripe cards. It is portable, and accesses the payment service by mobile phone signal. The instructions, however, assume that the vast majority of transactions will be chip & pin.

U.S. stores won't all have to go out and buy new card readers tomorrow. When their current reader gets old and stops working, the new one will the chip & pin feature. Every place in Europe has had to buy a new card reader over the past ten years or so. Why is that impossible in the U.S.?

avalon

You can avoid foreign transaction fees with a Bank of America card if you use specific banks, Barclays in the uK , BNP Parabis ifn France , BNL Italia in Italy. They are lsited on their website. You can also avoid CC foreign fees if you have a Virgin ATlantic or British Airways credit card.

xyz123

chartley...it's not impossible. As a matter of fact, although they're not operational, many US merchants such as Walmart and even the US Postal Service have replaced their terminals recently and almost all have the ability to accept chip and pin although few are operational. It's just one of the silly excuses including the idea fraud is much lower on US credit cards and the telephone lines in the US are more secure that are being used to try to justify the bank's resistance to chip and pin.

Personally, and I know for example travelgourmet disagrees with me, part of it is the American arrogance that things in the USA are always better and the USA cannot show the world they want to be part of the global community. Hence, of course, the USA still clings like about 3 other countries in the world to the Farenheit system of te mperature, a change long overdue (and which wouldn't be all tht costly). And even though the English who originated thesystem of measures have converted most of their weights and measures to metric, the USA still clings to the outmoded English system (although the argument that it owuld be costly to change all the highway signs is a valid one but you have to start somewhere with dual signing). Finally, the USA still clings to costing its treasury literally millions by not getting rid of the $1 bill and finally coming up with a nice thick coin worthy of being a $1 coin.

The reluctance to adopt chip and pin, and to at least begfin issuing hybrid cards good in both systems is further indicative of this attitude despite the inconveniences it causes.

xyz123

One other point on chip and pin and its affect on credit card fraud. With cvhip and pin, transactions must be done out in the open where you see your card at all times. It makes it somewhat more difficult for a dishonest clerk to slide your card through his or her portable card reader and give the informtion to organized crime. This is especially true in restaurants, With chip and pin, they bring the terminal to your table so you can enter the pin. I have become pretty obnoxeous about this. I will no longer give my credit card to a waiter to go into some back room the steal the numbers. I insist on going to the back room with him and boy this sometimes causes a lot of let's call it controversy. Those portable terminals, all of which are capable of doing a magnetic strip transaction too, should be mandated in all USA restaurants.

flpab

on the flip side what do people from Europe do here in the US when the gas pump ask for your zip code?
I bought enough Euro to pay for the apartment in Paris through Bank of America.
We had problems in Edinburgh last Sept using a credit card and my atm card from USAA would not work at all. It was my back up card so was ok but that did not make me happy. I had called and got it for that purpose, as a back up.

DebitNM

If you use a chip and pin card from Europe or Canada here in the US, you will have to go inside to the cashier and they can process the card, inconvenient but not awful. I believe there are no unmanned gas stations here, not that I have ever seen.

DebitNM

Here's the final info: there is a 1% foreign transaction fee but no fee charged by Andrews FCU for foreign transactions and no annual fee. The rep I talked said that the feedback from members [military in Europe] have indicated that the cards works as true CHIP and PIN.

So, I will use my Cap One no fee debit and credit cards where ever possible and this card for unmanned kiosks.

Hope this helps.
Deb