Burgundy/Rhone/Provance in 15 days

Old Jan 19th, 2018, 09:20 AM
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Burgundy/Rhone/Provance in 15 days

I'm new to this forum, so I would like to say Hello everyone.

In the beginning of may we are going to France with my wife and one year old son for 15 days. We start our trip in Geneve. We will have a car during this trip.
We love backpacking, but as our son has born, we have to stop traveling around Asia and do something more civilized.
We decide to go to France because we are foodies and wine lovers. We also like to spend time doing outdoor activities like hiking, riding bike. We love small towns and villages and rural areas. We don't like to spend much time in very touristy places (but we like to see them of course). We would like also to visit some vineyards and cultural sites.
We think of visiting three regions Burgundy, Rhone and Provance (but maybe it's too much?).
We would like to find three or four places to sleep (hotels or maybe guesthouses in vineries maybe two/three nights in chateau) and do day trips. We think that it's best idea if we do such trip with one year old child.
The questions are, is it enough time to visit all three regions or should we limit our trip to Burgundy and Rhone?
Which places (villages) are best to stay to visit this regions?
I will make detailed research what to see in this regions in the future, but now I would like to book accommodation.

Any help will be appreciated
M.
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Old Jan 19th, 2018, 11:29 AM
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I'm not sure which region you are calling the "Rhone". The Rhone flows through Provence. The Cote du Rhone is in Provence. Perhaps you mean the area between Lyon & Valence??? This latter area isn't very scenic. Lots of ugly commerce and several nuclear power plants along the Rhone River. If you go a little west into the Ardeche - it is quite scenic, however. We spent 2 weeks in a Gite just outside of Aubenas in 2016 and thoroughly enjoyed our stay there. But that is not an area that many non-French/Belgiums visit (according to our gite proprietor and several restaurant hosts). Maybe that's what you are looking for?? If so - e-mail me and I'll send you the itinerary I wrote for a friend who stayed there in 2016.

Provence & Burgundy are popular areas, of course. We've vacationed for 4 weeks in Burgundy/Beaujolais and 22 weeks in Provence. You could have a very nice vacation with 3-4 nights in Burgundy, 3-4 nights in the Ardeche, and 4-6 nights in Provence. Provence has more stuff to see, IMO. I also have a 35 page itinerary for Provence, & a much shorter one for Burgundy. I've sent my various itineraries to over 6,000 people on Fodors. If you would like a copy, e-mail me at [email protected] & I'll attach them to the reply e-mail. Ask for my Aubenas itinerary if you want it. I get 4-7 requests for itineraries most every day, & sometimes people just state that they want my France itinerary. I have itineraries for about 8 different regions in France.

While we were in the Ardeche, we dined at this hotel/restaurant twice.
Aux Vieux Arceaux - Hôtel Restaurant Ardèche 07 Aubenas
It was very close to our Gite. Best meal of 8 dinners in the region. Perfect "old world charm" and no tourists (except those staying/dining at the hotel/restaurant). It is noted in the Michelin Red Guide for France (we've relied on the Red Guide for dining recommendations over the past 30 years of vacationing in France).

In Provence, I would stay somewhere in the Luberon (Gordes, Roussillon, Menerbes, Bonnieux). St Remy (not in the Luberon) is quite popular, but it is more touristy than the rural Luberon. Of course, popular areas like the Luberon will have it's "famous" hill villages crowded mid-day and on market day - but you can avoid the hoards if you visit early in the AM, or later in the PM. Lots of "bike/walker only" paths in the Luberon.

Stu Dudley
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Old Jan 19th, 2018, 12:04 PM
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It's Provence, not Provance (should help you in internet searches to spell it right).

Stu is right - you don't seem to understand the boundaries between these areas; maps and guidebooks will clear this up.

IMO your approach is backwards. The last thing you should do is book accommodations - AFTER you have determined what is important for you to see. There aren't a lot of ch teaux in Provence, as your research will surely show.

You haven't mentioned what time of year you are traveling. That can make a huge difference, especially if vineyards are involved.

And when it does come time to book accommodations, we would need to know, in euros, what your nightly budget is.
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Old Jan 19th, 2018, 12:45 PM
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Thx for replay.
Writing "Rhone" i meant Rhone Valley. We think about visiting this region because of it's famous wines (from Cote Rotie south to Avignon).
Visiting such places like Ch teauneuf-du-Pape, Hermitage, Condrieu is a must. Of course, If this region is not attractive, maybe we should do only day trip to visit this places, and not to stay there for a longer period of time.

I know, that I should do research first (I usually do, but we decide for this trip unexpectedly and we start our travel in the beginning of may, so I have only three months left. I see that a lot on people on this forum plan their trips almost year in advance. I'm afraid that most accommodation will be booked when I finish my research. That is why I asked for best places for a base before my research (I'm waiting for delivery of Michelin and Lonely Planet guidebooks).

If we are talking about budget, we would like to spend around 80-100 Euro for a room with breakfast. We can spend more money for 2/3 nights in chateau.

Thanks for help.
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Old Jan 19th, 2018, 12:46 PM
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hello to you too, Kondrah, and Welcome.

Have you travelled much with your one year old? I anticipate the answer is no - after all your son is only 8 months old at the moment, and quite transportable, I suspect. However it's likely that he will change a lot in the next few weeks and by the time he gets to 12 months old, he'll be a lot more mobile. Ironically, this means that travelling with him will get a lot more difficult. My honest advice would be to give very serious consideration to renting one gite for the entirety of your holiday, or possibly two different ones. The advantage of this is that there will be a lot less interference with his routine, and therefore he is likely to be happier than if he is forever moving from one place to another. And if he is happy, you will be happy.

This needn't cramp your style - if you pick the right place you should be able to fill a week or two with lots of activities without the need to move base at all. As Stu says, some people rent gites in the same area for many years. His routes and recommendations are very good and you could do a lot worse than follow his ideas.

Good luck, and i hope you have a great holiday whatever you decide to do.
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Old Jan 19th, 2018, 12:56 PM
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""If we are talking about budget, we would like to spend around 80-100 Euro for a room with breakfast. We can spend more money for 2/3 nights in chateau."

That will be difficult. In France you have to pay for each person in a room, even it it's an infant. No stashing a kid away on a sleep mattress or on the floor or in your bed.

With breakfast is uncommon. It typically costs 6-10 euros per person for a continental breakfast in a hotel.

As I mentioned, you won't be traveling through ch teau/accommodation territory, so forget that. If you can find one, it will likely be very expensive, way beyond the budget you have mentioned
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Old Jan 19th, 2018, 02:26 PM
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>> We think about visiting this region because of it's famous wines (from Cote Rotie south to Avignon).
Visiting such places like Chteauneuf-du-Pape, Hermitage, Condrieu is a must. Of course, If this region is not attractive, maybe we should do only day trip to visit this places<<

In addition to staying in the southern Ardeche near Aubenas for 2 weeks, we also stayed in the northern Ardeche near Lamastre for 2 weeks. Lamastre is directly west of Valence, Hermitage, Condrieu. Not a scenic area. We started a walking tour of Valence - but did not finish, because it wasn't interesting. We also visited one of the wineries - I think it was Chapoutier. They did not offer any tours - only a tasting & purchasing. There was a huge busload of Japanese tourist there while we were visiting.

Since 1975, we've lived very close to the Napa/Sonoma wine area. And, of course, we have spent many, many months up there visiting wineries & friends who live in the wine country. Visiting a winery in France is nothing like visiting a winery in Napa/Sonoma. In France, many wineries are closed to visitors on weekends, and also during lunch. Most, perhaps, don't offer any tours - only tastings & sales. And there is some subtle pressure to purchase. If you go into Chateauneuf du Pape, you'll find many "shops" offering tasting & selling - but the wineries are actually elsewhere. We did have a very nice tour & cellar tasting at Beaucastel several years ago. But reservations are necessary. We first tried to do a "walk in", but they were fully booked for tours that week. We returned 3 months later with reservations. They might be closed for tours on weekends.
Château de Beaucastel, Châteauneuf-du-Pape, Rhône, vin, France, Famille Perrin
Click "contact" for info on tours.

Last week I had a "go around" with someone who contacted me (via e-mail) through Fodors and wanted some advice on how to do some winery visiting in Provence. He was arriving in Provence from Paris Sat afternoon & departing Tues morning to go back to Paris. It was a group of 4. I told him that I suspected many wineries would be closed Sat & Sun. He told me that there was a wine festival in Chateauneuf du Pape on that weekend & he could get his "wine fix" at the festival. I responded that they may not be pouring their best Chateauneuf du Pape for the festival. We've visited a few of the wine festivals in the past 30 years we have been vacationing in France - and have always been disappointed with them. I Also pointed out that he was only going to be in rural France/Provence for 2 full days and 2 very partial days. Perhaps there were better ways to spend their time than at a wine festival.

I would suggest that you forget about doing any wine stuff in the Rhone Valley and focus on Burgundy & the Cote du Rhone. There are dozens of places in Beaune open for tasting. Make an appointment at Beaucastel. Also visit Gigondas. One of our favorite Provence restaurants is in Gigondas (same owners as Beaucastel, I believe). We dined there last year (6th visit to the restaurant). Also, there is a co-op in Gigondas where you can taste many excellent wines from the region. Visit the winery in the Dentelles that I mentioned in the itinerary I sent to you.

Stu Dudley
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Old Jan 20th, 2018, 01:59 PM
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Hello,

once more thank you for all advices. I read some itineraries (thx Stu and have such idea:
Geneva -> Gordes (6 nights)
hiking/biking/visiting wineries/St Remy trip/villages trip
Gordes -> Beaune (5 nights)
chateau visit/route des grand crus/Dijon/walking around Beaune/wine tour
Beaune-> Auxerre (3 nights)
Driving around villages/Chabils/other activities?
Auxerre->Geneva (1 night)
Back to home

What do you think about this itinerary? another option is to change Auxerre with St. Remy or Ardache?

M.
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Old Jan 20th, 2018, 03:02 PM
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Your itinerary is fine. I don't know where "home" is for you - but we fly from SFO & it's about a 11 hr flight & 9 hrs in time zones. We like to add a day to the first destination to recover from jet lag & get oriented. There is some overlap in areas between Beaune & Auxerre - so I would add a day in Gordes & subtract one from Auxerre if you need to recover from the flight to Geneva.

I assume you will take the TGV from Geneva city to the Avignon TGV station to get to Gordes.

Stu Dudley
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Old Jan 21st, 2018, 12:17 AM
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We are from Poland, so recovery after flight is no issue. My wife and son will take a fligh to Geneva and i will go there by car (I like driving.
So do you think two nights in Auxerre will be enough? Should we split 6 night in Gordes to Gordes/St Remy? or should we do St Remy as a day trip?
What do you thing about Macconais region?
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Old Jan 21st, 2018, 07:05 AM
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Two nights in Auxerre is just fine if you are also staying in Beaune. Breaking up 6 nights between Gordes & St Remy is OK too if you don't mind the overhead with changing hotels. It will give you some "active village" and "quiet countryside" experiences. We spent 2 weeks in Beaujolais/Maconais about 10 years ago & enjoyed it. But I think your plate is already full. Lots of Chateaux to visit in the Burgundy & Beaujolais region. Lots if wine tasting opportunities there also. I actually think Beaujolais is more scenic than Burgundy. I have a driving itinerary I wrote for a friend about the Beaujolais area. E-mail me & ask for it if you are interested.

Stu Dudley
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