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-   -   Best European City for Architecture Students (https://www.fodors.com/community/europe/best-european-city-for-architecture-students-1084876/)

jritch Jan 28th, 2016 05:09 PM

Thanks for everyone's suggestions and help. I am considering for my Fall break in either Lisbon(Sintra)/Oporto, Randstad metro area (Amsterdam(4 days)/Rotterdam(3 days)/Utrecht(2 days), Rome(4 days)/Florence(3 days)/Venice(2 days), Meknes(Volubilis)/Fes, Berlin(4 days)/Dresden(1 day)/(4 days)Prague, Budapest(4 days)/Bratislava(1 day)/Vienna(4 days) or Krakow(4 days)/Warsaw(3 days)/Gdansk(2 days). Is 3 cities too much for one week, should I narrow it down to 2 or one? I am also debating between West and East Europe. West Europe is part of Spain and easy to get to, but East Europe is cheaper. Which of these pairings would have a good mixture of architecture history from multiple periods, easy to navigate/walk and get to, and reasonable in price? Also, I am looking for some good places to go to on my 3 day weekends and I am thinking of cities in Southern France or Italy that are easy to get to from Barcelona and good for 2-3 days, like Nimes, Carcassonne, Perpignan, Naples/Pompeii, or Genoa. If I have enough money I might even stay in Europe for a week or two after my study abroad. I want to make the most out of my study abroad because I heard there is not too much homework, and I don't know when I will be back in Europe. Thanks for everyone's help.

IMDonehere Jan 28th, 2016 06:23 PM

Get a map of Europe and use pin to locate the cities and you will see what you can see in a week.

Peter_S_Aus Jan 28th, 2016 06:55 PM

Consider Venice. The Architecture Biennale is happening from late May to late October, 2016. The Olympics for architects.

It is more intellectual than practical, and this year is curated by a gent who won the Pritzer prize.

Certainly it would be stimulating, and Venice does have relatively new buildings in places, dating from the 1950's.

Google "Carlo Scarpa" for a view of Venice's best known modern architect, and Venice is half an hour by train from Vicenza, home to works by Palladio.

jritch Jan 28th, 2016 07:21 PM

Thanks for that info. I did not know that the Architecture Biennale was happening this year. I will have to stop for at least a day or two to see it. My Fall break will be during that time, either I go to Venice on a weekend, or I can go to Italy for the week. How many days should I stay in Venice? Would two be enough, and then spend 4 in Rome, and 3 in Florence, or should I spend the whole week in Veneto? Also is Venice overrated? I had a friend tell me to avoid Venice or go for only a day because he hated it.

Pepper_von_snoot Jan 28th, 2016 08:00 PM

Is Venice overrated?

Yes, if you are an uneducated clod.

Venice is like heroin. Once you get it into your system it will haunt you for the rest of your life.

You should read John Ruskin's The
Stones of Venice.

Thin

Peter_S_Aus Jan 28th, 2016 08:04 PM

Venice punches way above its weight in cultural terms. A major film festival, Arts and Archi biennales, hosts a major university with School of Architecture, and that's just for starters.

To do the Archi Biennale any sort of justice would take four days. I'm going there im mid-September for 2.5 weeks just for the Biennale - and I'm not an architect.

Venice is worth studying in town planning terms. A fully pedestrianised city, so if you stay there any length of time, you keep on running into people that you know. Virtually no crime, certainly no street crime, but sure, pick pockets are active.

I have spent ten months in Venice, and still find things to excite and amaze me.

kleeblatt Jan 28th, 2016 11:33 PM

Plan the one week and then go spontaneously to the other destinations with students from your course. You will have a much better time if you don't overplan now.

For the one week abroad, go to Berlin and include Dresden and Potsdam.

Potsdam needs one day
Dresden needs one day
Travelling needs two half days (or more)
Berlin needs at least three days

traveller1959 Jan 29th, 2016 12:21 AM

>>Lisbon(Sintra)/Oporto, Randstad metro area (Amsterdam(4 days)/Rotterdam(3 days)/Utrecht(2 days), Rome(4 days)/Florence(3 days)/Venice(2 days), Meknes(Volubilis)/Fes, Berlin(4 days)/Dresden(1 day)/(4 days)Prague, Budapest(4 days)/Bratislava(1 day)/Vienna(4 days) or Krakow(4 days)/Warsaw(3 days)/Gdansk(2 days).<<

For a tourist, I would say, this is too rushed. But for you, it would be a professional trip, so it would be doable, but let's go into a few details:

- Meknes, Volubilis and Fes: You will be flying into Casablanca and Meknes and Volubilis will be on the way to Fes. But allow at least 3, better 4 days in total for Morocco.

- 4 days Berlin and 1 day Dresden. If you are in the area it would be a sin not to visit the Bauhaus in Dessau. The train from Berlin to Dessau is 1:38 and from Dessau to Dresden 2:35.

>>How many days should I stay in Venice? Would two be enough, and then spend 4 in Rome, and 3 in Florence, or should I spend the whole week in Veneto? Also is Venice overrated?<<

In Venice, you need at least one full day for the Biennale exhibits, leaving only one other day for the city itsself. Venice is not overrated at all. For centuries, it belonged to Europe's most powerful cities and, because of its wealth, was a major cradle for arts and architecture. Today, Venice is the largest historical city in Europe. Other cities have their Old Towns which are smaller or larger, but Venice is (almost) completely historical.

And full of art. Practically every church, even the minor ones, has invaluable pieces of art, like paintings from Tintoretto and other great masters. You have to wander through town and you have to ride the vaporetti (public boats) through the canals. You have to visit the Palazzo Ducale, the Duomo and the Scuola Grande di San Rocco.

So, with one day dedicated to the Biennale, you need at least three full days for Venice in order just to scratch the surface.

What else? Most of the cities on your bucket list are attractive from a tourist's view, but from an architects view, others may come into mind. E.g. Como still has the unspoilt hippodamic layout of the ancient Roman city.

When you are in Tuscany, Siena would make an excellent contrast to Firenze. Also visit the small town Monteriggioni - it is practically unchanged from the 13th century (the town serves as a backdrop for quite a few films and video games, including The English Patient, Gladiator, Assassin’s Creed II, Stronghold). San Gimignano is interesting because this medieval town had managed to preserve 14 towers which were a trademark of the medieval Italian city (and which have been demolished in most other cities).

In the Renaissance era, architects tried to plan the "ideal city". One of the best examples of a planned Renaissance city is Urbino. In the Palazzo Ducale you find a painting showing an "ideal city".

Needless to say, most the places I recommended here are UNESCO World Heritage sites.

traveller1959 Jan 29th, 2016 12:33 AM

I forgot: Before you travel, make sure to read the Books of Leonardo Benevolo, especially "The History of the City", "Origins of Modern Town Planning" and "The History of Architecture". They are classics with lots of maps, plans and photos.

For insights into the historical life in Venice as well as in other European cities, I strongly recommend reading Giacomo Casanova: The Story of My Life.

janejohn Jan 29th, 2016 03:37 AM

I was impressed by architecture of Andalusia in Spain. Starting from Seville and then Cordoba, Granada with an amazing Alhambra. It is an stunning mix of north and south, European and Arabic world. It is not modern at all, but it is very unusual and fascinating...
Oh, and also Toledo was quite a shock, but again it is not modern at all.

sandralist Jan 29th, 2016 07:29 AM

If you decide to go to Venice, then you will need more than 2 days make a dent in the biennale and see the other sites of architectural interest (for your purposes, don't miss the Calatrava bridge).

Instead of Rome, I suggest you go to nearby Verona to see the Roman arena there plus Carlo Scarpa's repurposed medieval castle (now the city's art museum)

http://www.bdonline.co.uk/paul-willi...049482.article

From Verona, I would suggest you go to Munich (5 hour train ride) because I think there is more of what you are looking for there than in the rest of Italy. For the most part, Italy has "frozen" its historic centers in time. You will see a lot of exemplary architecture from past centuries, and some very interesting ways in which modern people live inside that "preservation" and re-purpose the historic structures, but most of them have in fact left the historic centers to tourists and live elsewhere. New construction within the historic centers has generally been outlawed for the sake of tourism.

So Munich provides a more interesting present-day example of layers of architectural history in a very liveable modern day city.

Or you could consider Genoa. Italy's most important school of architecture (headed by Renzo Piano) is located in Genoa, and Genoa has the largest unrenovated medieval quarter in all of Europe. But the value of seeing Genoa would be to see the unresolved problems and the bad mistakes that have been made along the way in terms of both urban planning and experiments in modern architecture. If you have an appetite to see the unsuccessful and difficult challenges as well as the success stories, Genoa would be interesting.

If you don't like the idea of Munich or Genoa, both Verona airport and Venice airport have cheap flights to many other European destinations, so you can consider somplace else.

PalenQ Jan 29th, 2016 07:34 AM

If going to those cities listed by train and if under 26 investigate the Eurail Youthpass - which let you hop just about any train anytime in most countries on your list except Italy and Spain. For lots of great info on European trains, passes, etc check these IMO informative sites: www.budgeteuropetravel.com; www.ricksteves.com and www.seat61.com.

Take overnight trains to save daytime travel time and the cost of a night in a hostel or hotel.

jritch Jan 29th, 2016 08:27 AM

Thanks for all of the advice. For my week off I will go to the Architecture Expo for 3 days, Venice sightseeing for 3 days, Vicenza (Palladian Villas like Villa Rotunda)2 days, and Verona for a day trip. On my weekends I will probably take the train to Southern France, Genoa, or fly to Naples/Pompeii. These places are close by and will be cheap to go on the weekends. I will try to be spontaneous as well, and if I stay longer, I will just go where is cheap and easy to go to at the time. I do not want to over plan, but it is a good thing I started because I did not know of the Architecture Biennale until know. Thanks for everyone's input.

IMDonehere Jan 29th, 2016 08:44 AM

Also take a look at cheap-o airlines like Vueling, Easjet and Ryan which would be perfect for a small carry-on. They are like 19th century nuns enforcing the rules, especially the weight of luggage. Some might have flights from BCN but also nearby airports.

Peter_S_Aus Jan 29th, 2016 12:17 PM

For Venice, this might be of help, for a place to stay:


http://www.we-gastameco.com/en/we_crociferi/

Peter_S_Aus Jan 29th, 2016 01:46 PM

jritch, sounds like a good plan. I highly recommend the Palladio museum in Vecenza, and visit it before you visit other Palladio sites. It gives a great understanding of how he worked, has models, drawings, all sorts of data, and is housed in the only urban dwelling that Palladio did.

Vicenza is half an hour from Venice, so an easy day trip. Verona about an hour, and the Castel Vecchio museum in Verona is worth a look. A great example of how a building, an ancient fortress, can be converted into an art gallery. Carlo Scarpa did the job.

There's a pretty spectacular glass house, a couple of years old, at the Botanic Gardens in Padua. Five micro-climates housed in a single building, and both the architecture and climate control, with building automation, might be of interest. Padua is on the train line to Verona.

PalenQ Jan 29th, 2016 01:51 PM

If going to Rome, an architectural feast, and if into modernist art of the 20s and 30s - in Italy called Fascist art I believe - check out EUR just out of central Rome and built under Mussolini as a new city - train stations in Rome, Florence and Venice also sport this sleek modernist look.

https://www.google.com/search?q=EUR+...HfmAAZkQsAQIHg

Peter_S_Aus Jan 30th, 2016 01:34 PM

Tuesday 20th May, we took a day trip to Vicenza. Fast train, taking about 40 minutes, blasting across the Veneto plain at about 100 mph. Last time I went to Vicenza was in mid-December, and the fields were covered in snow, and it was bitterly cold, this time Spring planting in full force, a very different landscape.

Vicenza is, of course, Palladio Centrale. We visited the Teatro Olimpico, walked around the Basilica Palladiana (an older building, the tower dating from the 12th Century, Palladio designed the loggia around the Basilica), the Palladio Museum and the Civic Art Gallery of Palazzo Chiericati, which is near the theatre.

If you visit,and are on a Palladio kick, then I'd suggest visiting the Palladio Museum first. The museum is housed inside an urban dwelling, the only such dwelling completed by Palladio in his lifetime. It gives great insight into where Palladio was coming from as an architect, shows drawings that Palladio did when he visited Rome, sketching and measuring architectural details from ancient buildings. There are models of many of his buildings, including the Rotunda. Palladio was an apprentice stone cutter in his youth, and knew a thing or two about stone - also about faking the appearance of stone and marble. He was seen as an economical builder, knowing when to use marble, and when to use plaster with marble dust in it to simulate stone. There is a model of a brick column, showing how wedge shaped bricks, like pizza pieces, were laid to create a circular column, and then rendered with cement, given a couple of coats of plaster, and a fine edifice results.

Palladio wrote "The Four Books of Architecture", first published in 1570, and the books define what is finest in Renaissance architecture. He was able to describe what details should be used in a facade, maybe a square cornice vs. a rounded cornice, depending on how the light and shade was to fall on the wall. From a distance, Palladio's architecture may seem repetitive, but once you get closer to the details, it can be understood on an intellectual level as well. It's no coincidence that the Melbourne Public Library, or antebellum architecture in the USA, show the same influence - somehow Palladio was able to get it just right.

Having wealthy clients would have helped. The loggia around the Basilica is interesting, as Palladio had to design the loggia to accommodate an existing, much older building, and the architectural tricks that he employed to make the design work are evident. All the arches are identical in form and size, but if you look, you can see how the column spacing varies - it's a bit hard to explain. But the fact that building details are more closely spaced at the corners makes the loggia look more solid, more substantial. The corner columns on the Parthenon are more closely spaced than the centre columns, for the same reason.

At the time of building the loggia, Palladio was on a stipend of 7 ducats a month, which was reasonable pay for a celebrity. The loggia cost some 60,000 ducats - or about 700 years salary for a celebrity. A formidable cost - which maybe explains why the loggia took 50 years to complete. A bit like Gaudi's cathedral in Barcelona.

I've never been able to figure how Palladio worked. There are a mass of drawings and documents, proposal drawings, working drawings, set-out plans. Some fairly simple, others beautifully rendered, maybe to convince clients that it was time to go to contract. Palladio's design office must have had a host of draftsmen, but you don't hear about them, in the same way as you don't hear about the drafties in the offices of the Corb, van der Rohe, Phillip Johnston et al. There must have been site clerks, quantity surveyors, quality assurance people, cost control, just like any modern building project, along with specialists knowing about erecting domes, laying drains, sorting foundations. The information is mute on these people, but I would love to know the back story about them.

One trick that was used, to obtain a good finish to brickwork, which can otherwise be a bit rough. Bricks were polished with silica sand and water on a rotating table, to bring them to an exact, uniform size. They could then be laid with fine, about one millimetre, layers of mortar. Polish the wall to remove any laying imperfections and voila, job done. Apply plaster, dress it to look like stone, and you've saved the client a bundle.

Palladio had a thing about the architecture of antiquity, and the Olympic Theatre gave him his chance to build an amphitheatre. Semi-elliptic seating looking down on the stage, a homage to the theatre at Olympia in Greece. The Olympic Academy commissioned the theatre, Palladio designed it, but died a year later, before it could be finished. There are references to the Labours of Hercules in bas-relief above the proscenium arch, maybe a reference to the worth of labour, the work ethic and so on. A good way of getting the message across to a populace that was illiterate. There are niches with statues of the Academy members who funded he job, and they are in good condition, being plaster but always under cover. The faces are of the Members, the more senior members garbed in togas, the more junior as warriors. But look at the statue at the very top left as you face the stage - the body is of a woman, showing breasts, but wearing armour, a Member of the Academy. Someone decided to re-cycle a statue in 1584, hoping it might pass un-noticed.

Behind the seating there are nine niches with statues. The centre statue, the statue in pride of place, is Palladio. Maybe as a way of avoiding controversy as to who should get the prime position.

Andre Palladio, born 30th November, 1508, died 19th August, 1580. Leaving a most remarkable legacy.

Peter_S_Aus Jan 30th, 2016 01:50 PM

From a visit in 2014.
The Architecture Biennale started last week, multiple yachts lined up along the Riva Schiavoni, yachts that in former times were described as "gin palaces". They've mostly gone now, and the Biennale is pretty quiet. I was wondering if I would enjoy the Biennale, or whether it might be a bit too esoteric for a non-archi, and I've really enjoyed a day at the Arsenale, another at the Giardini, and a day at various other locations around town, with several more to come.

The Korean pavilion. A combined pavilion, operated by both Koreas, north and south. When the pavilion was first proposed, the Biennale folk dictated that, "there's only one pavilion. Get along and get over it". So part of the pavilion hosts pictures of dedicated, well fed, happy tradesmen, constructing with enthusiasm a socialist workers paradise north of the 39th parallel. All the workers wear belts, supported by braces, and broad smiles. By contract, the south side has something to say about the social problems that can be created by architecture.

A similar theme was apparent at the Great Britain (Great Britain is not so much heard, replaced by the ubiquitous U.K.) pavilion, "A Clockwork Jerusalem" being the theme. Taking Blake's poem, applying it to contemporary architecture, with particular reference to the Thamesmead development. Thamesmead, developed in the 1970's. Abandoned as a suitable place for families, providing a place for squatters and heavy metal musos, a backdrop for Stanley Kubric, and demolished a decade or two ago.

Israel, a trio of A0 sized plotters, drawing diagrams in sand.

Germany. Impossible, the chancellors bungalow from Bonn recreated in Venice, along with a three thousand word commentary in 6-point font. A political statement, and I didn't get it. German nihilism maybe.

Italy. A 300 metre long installation in the Corderie in the Arsenal, Venice's longest building, with film, dance, installations, showcasing Italy, and also showcasing some pretty disastrous developments in Italy.

Albania. Paintings of ruins. Except that the ruins are just unfinished, never ever to be finished, buildings.

A full scale construction of one of Le' Corbusier's never-built structures. I've never really "got" Corb's architecture, but seeing a work at full scale makes it approachable.

The Stati Uniti d'America, aka the USA. A great resource - the curators have collected a compendium of work by American architects that have worked outside the USA, displaying it simply as a resource. So, for me, possible to see details of work by Walter Burley Griffin, who laid out our national capital, Canberra, and also designed Newman College at Melbourne University, a building that I know well.

And onto the Elements of Architecture in the central pavilion in the Giardini. Fascinating, looking at a set of architectural features. Floor, wall, window, balcony, stairway, escalator, door, corridor, facade, roof, toilet and so on. Interesting, in that architecture is about assembling elements into a building, but this display de-constructs the set. Rem Koolhaas curated this display, and said about the balcony "Without my parents' balcony, I would not be here. They lived on the 5th floor of a new social democratic walk-up. Born in the last months of the war, a cold but very sunny winter, when everything that could be burned had been burned, I was exposed to the sun, naked, to capture its heat, like a mini solar panel."

Which gave me cause to think.

And an architectural note, not connected to the Biennale. Carlo Scarpa is well known in Venice, Venice's favourite contemporary architect. The Olivetti showroom in the Piazza and the Querini Stampalia foundation are two of my favourite buildings in Venice, both done by Scarpa. A Cuban student of Scarpa designed, and managed the renovations, for the apartment that we are staying in, and submitted the building, plus its documentation, for his final year thesis. Scarpa's architectural handwriting is all over the apartment, not as a copy, more a homage to Scarpa's thought processes.

So, to conclude, in someone else's words, words heard on the street, a member of a little tour group to the tour leader, the accent somewhat south of the Mason-Dixon.

"Monica, we've passed a lot of shops selling masks. What's with the masks?"

bilboburgler Jan 31st, 2016 04:01 AM

"Monica, we've passed a lot of shops selling masks. What's with the masks?"

:-)


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