LyndaKaye

We are leaving next week for our annual European vacation. Last fall I started noticing that my knees were really beginning to hurt me when I walked. Since then I have been to a specialist and will probably have to have knee surgery in the near future. I have had the injections in my knees to no avail. If others suffer from this, what do you do to help the pain? I love Europe, I love to explore, but the pain is getting unbearable. Please help!

nytraveler

Are there specific things that you can avoid - like standing - or stairs?

Most places have elevators of some sort - if you enquire. And my SIL has a shooting stick type of arrangement (with her it's a hip) that she carries like an umbrella - and she sits whenever possible - vs standing.

Also - be sure your shoes ar extra comfy - and avoid uneven pavements - esp cobblestones - where possible (you can often walk in the edge of the stret instead).

And if its a large site you might want to see if they have a scooter or wheelchair available.

Bokhara

My neighbour has had remarkable results from Glucosamine.
Here's a link :www.glucosamine-arthritis.org/

Hope it's some use to you - must be awful not to be able to get around freely.

elaine

Two things I suggest
with doctor's approval, try OTC anti-inflammatory pain killers like Alleve or Advil

The other is, do some internet research on Glucosamine, an herbal supplement.
It was recommended to me about a year ago when I was seeing a physical therapist for another reason. You have to take 1500 mg per day (with food) and you have to be patient for 6-8 weeks.
I have found it to be a tremendous aid in reducing knee pain. I still have some, but I no longer have to try to completely avoid stairs. It won't help you in time for your trip, but it may for the future. In the meantime, pack the Alleve.

Madison

LyndaKaye - Sorry to hear about your knees. I sometimes suffer from lower back pain and what helps me are those heat packs that you apply to your body. I got mine at COSTCO. I cannot remember the name, only know that it comes in a red box. They have them for different parts of the body.

Underhill

Ask your specialist about using a prescription anti-inflammatory drug but be sure to get a companion prescription for something like Tagamet to prevent ulcers. That happened to me after a year of going without the Tagamet and was not a pleasant experience!

Now I'm taking just Tylenol, along with periodic cortisone injections. What kind of injections have you had? There's also something called Supartz, a lubricating fluid for the knee joints that can help--but it's too late for this trip, as there's a series of 5 to 6 injections and then some lag time before they help.

You might also ask your doctor for a Tylenol/narcotic prescription, such as Darvocet, to at least get you through the trip. But remember: no alchol with Tylenon products.

Meanwhile, ask your airline to arrange for wheelchairs from start to finish, and get a folding cane to use when walking; it does help. Swing your legs back and forth while seated and especially before getting up after being seated for a while.

Chicago_Heather

Another vote for Glucosamine - my mom said she couldn't have made it through our trip to Germany and Austria last summer without it.

Grandma

I've had lots of discomfort... but to make a long story short... check to make sure you don't need arch supports. I did physical therapy, Bextra, etc. before I discovered that's what I needed. After getting used to the supports I have very little pain.

crefloors

Sounds like arthritis? My SIL has it very bad. They would not do surgery or knee replacements up until this year because she was too young and they wear out. She is actually just grinding bone on bone. She has been getting some injections of late that have been some relief until she can get the surgery thing workd out. We were in London and Paris in 2002, and we found that she could get on and off the buses ok...just a few steps there, we did use more cabs that we would have otherwise, most of the meto and tube were out for her because of the stairs, her knees just don't bend. It seems that most places we ended up for any length of time did have someplace where she could sit. I won't kid you..it was really difficult for her. I would take off for awhile by myself so I could just walk the neighborhoods because she just simply could not. And yes, I would agree that perhaps some places you might like to spend some time at, like the museums may have wheel chairs available.

DiG

Hi LyndaKaye:

I am so sorry to hear of your knees 'to no avail' situation. When we went to Europe I was in the same place as you are now. Before our trip I had recently received the injections, however, I also had been on a regulated intake of glucosamine. This made the difference in my case.

What helped me?

1. Plane ride

Are you in economy or higher? If higher you can elevate yr legs & will receive top treatment.

If in economy:

Can you get upgraded?

If not, secure an aisle seat to allow your worst knee/leg space to strecth out. Explain to the airlines your plight, I did and they changed our seats.

Before boarding speak privately with a flight attendant about your situation. When I did this the FA made other FA's aware of my situation.

We were preboarded.

I was free to get up - walk around -stretch - etc - as needed without any question. It would appear obvious to other travelers to do this naturally. However, the frequency of getting out of your seat is higher than the average person who is not in pain.

They were kind enough to let me know when my aisle space was going to be blocked for food/beverage service.
The FA also checked on me to see how I was doing, if they could do anything for me.

From my MD I got plastic bags which are designed to be ice packs. The FA's filled them for me as needed to keep the swelling down.

Before the trip I tried several sleeping aides and found one that worked for me, Tylenol PM. After my meal, I took 2 of them, managed to sleep
for almost 2 hours.

It didn't interefere with my injections. Talk to your specialist. Hopefully you can find one that works for you before next week.

I changed seats with my DH and his legs
became my foot rest after my nap.

2. Daytime

I used Tylenol or Motrin, ate well, and drank lots of water!!! with my wine and coffee. It's important to absorb all the pills and nutritional supplements and not harm your stomach.

3. Sightseeing

We used the taxi to go long distances and the bus for shorter distances. This avoided any underground systems which avoided 'lots of stairs'. Yes taxis cost more but gave me more time on my feet during the day.

We would do a short walk of an area or do a self guided tour of a sight. Stop often at a cafe, bench, fountain whatever is handy, and put your feet up and enjoy a local beverage while you're doing so!!!

Forget about what people think. Just put those feet up and do it, and do it often.

4. Take one day at a time.

Often we had a very late lunch which became our dinner meal on certain days. They were actually some of the very best times for us. This provided enough of a break if we wanted to walk some more later in the day. Then we'd have a snack or light meal in evening. These became early to bed nights.

Other days we had a light lunch,
returned to hotel, got completely off the feet, elevated - iced - rested.

Then I rebounded for a lovely evening out.

5. Make a list of the top 3 things you want to do where you're visiting.

Attempt to do them. If it's too much, accept the limitation for now.

We did/saw (1) major thing each day and then took it easy for other parts of the day.

LindaKaye, you said you will probably be having knee surgery in near future.
Remember you will return someday and hopefully you will be pain free.
I had my (L) TKR last summer. My whole world has changed for me for the better.

Good Luck, Best Wishes for a good trip.

Regards,

Di

cmt

If you have been having physical therapy, ask your therapist for advice and suggestions. For advice re taking meds, ask your doctor.

I'd suggest trying to continue some of your p.t. exercises during the trip, to the extent possible without he use of weights or equipment. You can do the various knee bends and leg lifts. Walk around as much as possible on the flight, and during the trip, try to avoid sitting for long periods. Try to avoid squatting or sitting on the floor, because those positions are very hard on the knees. If the pain is severe, I think you probably need to take it very very easy, but still remain mobile, with gentle activity (unless you can cancel) and don't do anything that particularly stresses the knees. Don't do movements that make the pain worse, because if you get a really badly inflamed bursa, you will become incapacitated, even though it is not a "serious" thing. When you sit, try to keep your thighs parallel and don't sit with your legs sdpread apart and your knees bent outward because that stresses the knees. But if it is not too bad, and you'll be doing vigorous walking, be extra careful on the downhill, which puts excessive stress on the knees. Where sturdy shoes or hiking boots--sturdier than you'd ordinarily need if you didn't have knee troubles. Take a hiking pole if you'll be hiking, or a regular cane (available in drug stores in the US) if you won't be hiking. If you'll be taking tour and expect there may be a lot of standing (i.e. without walking) you might consider getting one of those cane-like gizmos that opens to become a tiny stool to sit on. I'm not sure where you get them, because I don't have one. Either take some of those instant ice packs, or take lots of sturdy ziplock baggies and whenever possible, when your knees feel inflamed, try to request ice from restaurants or hotels and ice your knees for a while with a baggie full of ice cubes. Re anti-inflammatory medicines, ask your doctor. And if anything I am saying ehre is inconsistent with what your doctor or physical therapist tells you, obviously you should ignore me.

The above advice is based on my own experience last fall and a combination of my own solutions and advice from my physical therapist. However, I did NOT have torn muscles or any serious structural problem with my knees, so if you do, then my experience may not be relevant to you. My knees started bothering me in late spring 2004 and then in late August 2004 something happened and I couldn't walk or put any pressure on my left leg for a week, and walked only with difficulty the next. Supposedly it was just an extremely inflamed bursa plus a little arthritis. I had physical therapy, which was very helpful, though the injured knee still hurt somewhat. Though I'd improved a lot by six weeks later, I was really not ready to go on my Turkey trip, whioch was going to include a lot of walking and some optional hiking on goat trails and other places with tricky footing. But I didn't want to cancel. The trip started out in Istanbul--plenty of walking, and my first stair climbing since the injury, but no hiking or difficult walking. By the time we got to the places where the walks were on steep paths or rocky goat trails, the muscles around my knees were pretty strong, and I did OK. I found out a few months later, though, that I'd had more than just an inflamed bursa, so several months later had arthroscopic surgery for a badly torn meniscus. Now, eight months after the surgery, I just came back from a trip to some of the national parks in western US where I did relatively easy hiking, with almost no knee problems.

FainaAgain

When knees hurt, going down is what hurts the most.

Avoid stairs at any cost!

Take medications, try them here which works the best - Tylenol (acetaminophen), Aleve (naproxen?) or Midol (ibuprophen).

Break up your day. Rest in bed. Rest as often as you can. Time your walks. Take buses. Don't plan your trips. Some days you'll feel better, some worse.

And if you want to carry your own seat, you can search the internet for "seat canes" or "folding chairs". They are in medical supply stores or sport/travel stores respectively.

Grandma

I should not have made my reply sound so simple. I do have arthritis in both knees. Tho I was treated by one of the best orthopedists in NYC (see New York Magazine/s 100 best doctors issue)... somehow my fallen arches were not investigated. Dont' know what's down the road...but for the moment orthotics really do the trick.

PalenqueBob

Lynda: Head to Lourdes! And before you think i'm flippant for saying this i'm in the early stages of your problem and facing the same unsettling thoughts about being able to navigate Europe like i want.

tuscanlifeedit

As a person that has been in a lot of pain, a lot of the time I can tell you that I do every little, as well as every big, thing I can to increase my comfort level, especially when traveling.

Supports, wrappings, meds (over the coutner and perscription), rubs (Jointritis for some parts and Pedocin for the feet), the heat bandages that were mentioned, cold packs, sitting, taxis, etc. etc. I find if I am vigilant, indulgent, careful, serious about keeping as comfortable as I can, then I do much better.

This means that my toiletries and meds kits are bigger than I'd like, but I often couldn't travel at all if they weren't.

I am really sorry to hear about your knee pain and I wish you well.

LLindaC

From another Linda with bad knees- back from an intense hiking trip to Switzerland with no probs. I don't believe in injections; but let's not go there. Good doctor, MRI, find the problems. For me, too many years of marathon runs, gym injuries, etc. I train on a bike and elliptical to strengthen the muscles which support my knees. A really good PT who works with an orthopedic or through a hospital sports clinic should help. But since this trip is here, look at the shoe situation. Wear very good athletic (running/walking) shoes such as New Balance and go to a running store to be fitted with some good orthotics. You don't need a doctor at this point. Do NOT wear flats such as Keds tennis shoes, etc or any other women's flats without a full or partial orthotic. Still, you'll be better off wearing Easy Spirit, Mephisto, etc that are designed for great support and DO NOT succumb to fashion and teeter on heels. Who cares what you wear on your feet? I dragged my hubby into a shoe store and made him get orthotics and put them in all his shoes, and now his knees are 100% better. And we take glucosamine/chondroitin as well. Good luck!

budzilla

Not sure what injections you had, but my mother has this same problem (she has already had both knees operated on) and we are planning a trip in November. Her doctor told her he could give her steroid shots before she leaves. I imagine these are the same cortisone shots someone else mentioned. Not neccessarily the best long-term thing, but in the short-term a way she can walk in more comfort for the week we're in London.

cabovacation

LindaKaye - you have some excellent information from your Fodorite friends.

I just wanted to tell you that when the knee pain finally became excruciating for my husband, he had both knees replaced. Now he walks all over the place with no pain - and he wishes he had done the replacements much earlier! According to his surgeon, if you get it done earlier it is a much faster and less painful deal because there might still be a bit of cartilege left. Although this recovery was extremely fast, imho. (Easy for me to say

cmt

Re the cortisone shots. I did NOT want them. My instincts told me they would not be a good thing, because the pain, unpleasant as it is, serves a useful purpose and makes us hesitate to do things that are especially painful, and those are usually the very things that can further damage the knee when the cartilidge is worn out. Without pain as a warning, I might have blithely gone along doing things that would do damage. Then later I learned from my physical therapist that the coritson injection can weaken the tendons or ligament (forgot which one he said), so I was glad I had opted not to have it.

Underhill

One other suggestion: invest in some Blue Emu cream. Sounds strange, but it can help. And no odor.